OrMockHim Posted January 12, 2010 Author Share Posted January 12, 2010 Sorry, but I think I know more than you. Currently, I am in college, on a Video Game design course, which, of course, requires me to have some knowledge of scripting. But yeah, you're completely right, let's just throw money at the problem and it'll go away. Forget how complex scripts are, how they are nearly impossible to detect without Jagex resorting to e-crime through hacking a user's computer. Man, im not in the mood to fight like this :wall: Endgame is, its possible to get rid of bots. Deal with it. :eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eviltom Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Sorry, but I think I know more than you. Currently, I am in college, on a Video Game design course, which, of course, requires me to have some knowledge of scripting. But yeah, you're completely right, let's just throw money at the problem and it'll go away. Forget how complex scripts are, how they are nearly impossible to detect without Jagex resorting to e-crime through hacking a user's computer.yeh i agree There is so many ways to make a bot for a java game they should move away from it. It is also harder to hide the code with java.They should either obfuscate there source better or use a different language I guess. but they do have methods in the client to record mouse clicks so that is a good thing.But they can always be randomised :ohnoes: Endgame is, its possible to get rid of bots. Deal with it.Its harder said than done :mellow: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrMockHim Posted January 12, 2010 Author Share Posted January 12, 2010 Macroers make me so mad i could just... [cabbage] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eviltom Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Macroers make me so mad i could just... [cabbage]Yeh i mean It's meant to be a game :-( not a who is the best competition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiriyama Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Okay, fine, I didn't want to resort to this, but hopefully it'll get the message across. I've previously spoken to P Mods about this, and with her permission, I'm now saying this. To quote one: "It's impossible to eliminate them..They'll always find ways of improving to get around the latest attempts." I was hoping that my knowledge of scripting alone would be enough, however, I've had to bring up a source perhaps you'd listen to. Hell, the reason I know so much about botting is because I had a friend who used them, and went without detection for about a year, because he was smart enough to know how to use them. Denizen of Darkness| PSN= sworddude198 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrMockHim Posted January 12, 2010 Author Share Posted January 12, 2010 Okay, fine, I didn't want to resort to this, but hopefully it'll get the message across. I've previously spoken to P Mods about this, and with her permission, I'm now saying this. To quote one: "It's impossible to eliminate them..They'll always find ways of improving to get around the latest attempts." I was hoping that my knowledge of scripting alone would be enough, however, I've had to bring up a source perhaps you'd listen to. Hell, the reason I know so much about botting is because I had a friend who used them, and went without detection for about a year, because he was smart enough to know how to use them. Hm, i just can't belive bots are unbeatable.. There must be an option, seeing that Jagex has the funds, and probobly the brains to do so.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiriyama Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Okay, you know what..[bleep] this. My friend, who shall remain unnamed botted for over a year on an account. He's still not been caught to my knowledge. I know his technique for not getting caught, it's a simple one, since Jagex DOES NOT know whether a player has a bot running or not, it controls the mouse to perform functions, and in cases, the keyboard. It does not change anything about the game, and for Jagex to detect bots, the users need to be insanely stupid, or they'd have to ILLEGALLY hack into a player's computer. Which, of course, they won't, as it is an e-crime, and they'd have been caught by now. EDIT: That friend of mine did get caught, but he got bored and did something stupid. Denizen of Darkness| PSN= sworddude198 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eviltom Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Okay, fine, I didn't want to resort to this, but hopefully it'll get the message across. I've previously spoken to P Mods about this, and with her permission, I'm now saying this. To quote one: "It's impossible to eliminate them..They'll always find ways of improving to get around the latest attempts." I was hoping that my knowledge of scripting alone would be enough, however, I've had to bring up a source perhaps you'd listen to. Hell, the reason I know so much about botting is because I had a friend who used them, and went without detection for about a year, because he was smart enough to know how to use them. Hm, i just can't belive bots are unbeatable.. There must be an option, seeing that Jagex has the funds, and probobly the brains to do so..but so do the bot dev's its an everlasting cycle. :mellow: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooneb Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 We now are aware of this system of wealth transfer. It''s an easy recognizable pattern if you know it exists, so I would advice anybody who is against unfair advantages to report these people (both bots). The reason we see this happen, is probably because it's a new solution to avoid the trading limitations. The Real world traders claim it's undetectable (which maybe it isn't) and get away with it because Jagex needs time to evaluate the evidence (to avoid innocent people getting banned) Because of lack of evidence to the contrary (no people claiming they got banned using this system) some people believe this and enter the trap. We might expect other similar bot systems in remote area's where valuable items can be picked up like my suspicion about Whiteberries. Automatic detection of bots by Jagex is in a way similar to the detection of computer viruses by virusscan programs. It's all about pattern recognition. An antivirus software sometimes detects new, unknown viruses because they use a similar pattern as existing viruses. However, sometimes the programmers of computerviruses design a new method which doesn't show a similar pattern as the existing viruses. In this case, humans needs to detect the virus manually and report it, so the software can be adapted to detect the new pattern. The same applies to the detection software of bots. It simply cost Jagex time to write new code and if it is written, probably the real world traders already have moved to the next version. It's therefore important to report any sound suspicion of macroing. It helps Jagex detecting new bots a lot quicker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrMockHim Posted January 12, 2010 Author Share Posted January 12, 2010 Okay, fine, I didn't want to resort to this, but hopefully it'll get the message across. I've previously spoken to P Mods about this, and with her permission, I'm now saying this. To quote one: "It's impossible to eliminate them..They'll always find ways of improving to get around the latest attempts." I was hoping that my knowledge of scripting alone would be enough, however, I've had to bring up a source perhaps you'd listen to. Hell, the reason I know so much about botting is because I had a friend who used them, and went without detection for about a year, because he was smart enough to know how to use them. Hm, i just can't belive bots are unbeatable.. There must be an option, seeing that Jagex has the funds, and probobly the brains to do so..but so do the bot dev's its an everlasting cycle. :mellow: Now thats just wrong, Don't tell me an Student has got more funds than Jagex as an corp. They have got more money to upgrade their software than thebotter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiriyama Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 All the programmer has to do is edit his script and it works, or write a new one. Denizen of Darkness| PSN= sworddude198 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooneb Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 And Jagex needs to - analyze the pattern- write code that detects the pattern- check the code doesn't falsely mark innocent players as bot users Must do this for tens mayba hundreds new bots. So detecting a bot is more work as writing a new bot. And if detecting a bot took the same amount of effort, Jagex still loses the war to some, because there are multiple people (10, 100, 1000?) simultaneously writing new bots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pietdepiet Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Of course jagex could, given they have enough money, get rid of all bots. Simply hire an enormous number (this will be a very big number) of employees and let these people chat with all online players. For example you could ask every player a non-standard question at least once a day: no proper response within 5 minutes = ban. This is of course not going to happen or p2p should be very expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrMockHim Posted January 12, 2010 Author Share Posted January 12, 2010 Of course jagex could, given they have enough money, get rid of all bots. Simply hire an enormous number (this will be a very big number) of employees and let these people chat with all online players. For example you could ask every player a non-standard question at least once a day: no proper response within 5 minutes = ban. This is of course not going to happen or p2p should be very expensive. Or you could just make a veery random "random" event. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everyonedies Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Here are some idea on things that could be done:Allow players to spawn monsters to disrupt the macroAllow more things like flowers to be created confusing bots but presenting no challenge to real playersAllow players bring about random events (one per day limit)Allow player mods the ablity to teleport suspected bots to a new random(or holding area) that isnt ever shown to players and gives no reward for completion. (but is complicated enough to be very hard to complete ie. directions on how to leave are written into the walls or floor.(like pick up 2 black keys 1 blue balloon and 7 red balls)Items colored and looking similar to common things bots would pick up. Plus any player sent to this place has their account looked into for suspicious activity. Just a couple ideas on how to deal with bots. http://www.clanhavok.net/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eviltom Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Here are some idea on things that could be done:Allow players to spawn monsters to disrupt the macronot hard for a bot to stop say it was a wcer you would just need to put a if(interaction((what ever the ID is)=true)walk path(random) return.random(100,300) dont ask me how i know also it could be abused say some noob annoyed you you could spawn a monster to kill it lolAllow more things like flowers to be created confusing bots but presenting no challenge to real playerswhy would that confuse the bot? most bots these days are not just colour clickers they inject/reflect the client to get information so this would only work against afew people Allow players bring about random events (one per day limit)Allow player mods the ablity to teleport suspected bots to a new random(or holding area) that isnt ever shown to players and gives no reward for completion. (but is complicated enough to be very hard to complete ie. directions on how to leave are written into the walls or floor.(like pick up 2 black keys 1 blue balloon and 7 red balls)Items colored and looking similar to common things bots would pick up. Plus any player sent to this place has their account looked into for suspicious activity. just like any other random though, bots can solve them. Also because of the way the game is coded each wall set would probably have an different ID therefore not making it much harder to fix than any other randomJust a couple ideas on how to deal with bots.Gratz for trying though.The best way I think would just be to keep re obfuscating the client over and over again so then when they de-ob one version Its been re obfuscated in a different way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neos_Matrix Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 So, why does the bot, drop the snape grass? It makes no sense, unless it was trying to change the market price for snape grass. Barrows Items: 1x Dharok's Platelegs, 1x Veracs's Plateskirt, 1x Dharok's Greataxe, 2x Torag's Platelegs, 1x Akrisae's War Mace, 1x Ahrim's Robeskirt, 3x Akrisae's Robetop, 1x Guthan's Warspear, 1x Akrisae's Robeskirt, 1x Torag's Helm, 2x Verac's Brassard, 1x Karil's Pistol Crossbow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxingmck Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Level 3 has a lot of cash level _ _ picks grass and trades for level 3s cash Level 3 drops and only 2 or 3 appear because of the drop limit repeats Noobs: We pay we sayJaGeX: How much will you pay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UserOnRS Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Maybe they trade unnoted for noted, and the person with unnoted drops it? As a way of transferring money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert_R Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Use a teleport other spell on the bot he just stands there for hours after you do it. I didn't actually try that myself but my friend told me he did it to a hunter bot so idk if it's actually true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glasscube Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Use a teleport other spell on the bot he just stands there for hours after you do it. I didn't actually try that myself but my friend told me he did it to a hunter bot so idk if it's actually true.Depends on the bot they use and the botter themselves. And Here are some idea on things that could be done:Allow players to spawn monsters to disrupt the macroAllow more things like flowers to be created confusing bots but presenting no challenge to real playersAllow players bring about random events (one per day limit)Allow player mods the ablity to teleport suspected bots to a new random(or holding area) that isnt ever shown to players and gives no reward for completion. (but is complicated enough to be very hard to complete ie. directions on how to leave are written into the walls or floor.(like pick up 2 black keys 1 blue balloon and 7 red balls)Items colored and looking similar to common things bots would pick up. Plus any player sent to this place has their account looked into for suspicious activity. Just a couple ideas on how to deal with bots. No random event will ever be complex enough that can beat a bot. Why? Because the bot have access to all the information in the game. All the graphics, the models, the id's for all the items. Help drive change Canada Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cptbaker08 Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Use a teleport other spell on the bot he just stands there for hours after you do it. I didn't actually try that myself but my friend told me he did it to a hunter bot so idk if it's actually true.Thats works, but only if the bot you are casting it on has accept aid on. If they don't have it on then it won't work and the bot will continue to do whatever it does. [hide=Drops]Slayer:Draconic Visage x3, Abyssal Whip x23, Dark Bow x3, Dragon Platelegs x3, Dragon Boots x40, Dragon Plateskirt x4, Shield Left Half x3, Dragon Medium Helms x10GWD:CS: Zamorakian Spear x2, Zamorak Hilt x1, Bandos Chestplate x1, Sara Sword x1DKs: Dragon Hatchet x3 Beserker Ring x1[/hide][hide=Completed Goals]Achieved April 26, 2009Achieved Sept. 15, 2009Achieved Nov. 21, 2009 Jan. 10, 2010 Achieved Mar. 5, 2010[/hide][hide=Goals][/hide] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
010jonathan Posted January 12, 2010 Share Posted January 12, 2010 Use a teleport other spell on the bot he just stands there for hours after you do it. I didn't actually try that myself but my friend told me he did it to a hunter bot so idk if it's actually true.Depends on the bot they use and the botter themselves. And Here are some idea on things that could be done:Allow players to spawn monsters to disrupt the macroAllow more things like flowers to be created confusing bots but presenting no challenge to real playersAllow players bring about random events (one per day limit)Allow player mods the ablity to teleport suspected bots to a new random(or holding area) that isnt ever shown to players and gives no reward for completion. (but is complicated enough to be very hard to complete ie. directions on how to leave are written into the walls or floor.(like pick up 2 black keys 1 blue balloon and 7 red balls)Items colored and looking similar to common things bots would pick up. Plus any player sent to this place has their account looked into for suspicious activity. Just a couple ideas on how to deal with bots. No random event will ever be complex enough that can beat a bot. Why? Because the bot have access to all the information in the game. All the graphics, the models, the id's for all the items.Bots were unable to fulfil the quiz (the one that gives a book of knowledge) event. Also maze events are unable to complete by bots. As long as there's no id but just graphics, randoms are great to stop bots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eviltom Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Bots were unable to fulfil the quiz (the one that gives a book of knowledge) event. Also maze events are unable to complete by bots. As long as there's no id but just graphics, randoms are great to stop bots. :shame: You know nothing There Are ID's for the maze doors and the book of knowledge there are ID's as well have you never de-obbed the client . And randoms wont be able to stop bots there easy to solve. There is no such thing as just graphics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stonewall337 Posted January 13, 2010 Share Posted January 13, 2010 Okay, fine, I didn't want to resort to this, but hopefully it'll get the message across. I've previously spoken to P Mods about this, and with her permission, I'm now saying this. To quote one: "It's impossible to eliminate them..They'll always find ways of improving to get around the latest attempts." I was hoping that my knowledge of scripting alone would be enough, however, I've had to bring up a source perhaps you'd listen to. Hell, the reason I know so much about botting is because I had a friend who used them, and went without detection for about a year, because he was smart enough to know how to use them. Hm, i just can't belive bots are unbeatable.. There must be an option, seeing that Jagex has the funds, and probobly the brains to do so..but so do the bot dev's its an everlasting cycle. :mellow: Now thats just wrong, Don't tell me an Student has got more funds than Jagex as an corp. They have got more money to upgrade their software than thebotter. Sigh.... Think about it. Jagex comes out with a new system to detect bots, and users find a way to beat that system. look at Microsoft. They are constantly updating their system, as people keep on beating it. [hide=Drops]Araxxor Eye x1 Leg pieces x2GWD: 5000 Addy bar Steam B Staff x3 Z Spear x6 Sara. Hilt x2 Bandos Hilt x2 (LS, Solo)SS x6 (1 LS)Tormented Demons: Shard x6 Slice x5 Claws x9 Limbs x3DKS: Archer x21 Warrior x31 Berserker x30 Axe x51[/hide] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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