Rivers Run Red

[Nexaduro]

1) I'm okay with that, I just wish he'd pointed out my error before, I don't expect something out of place I just didn't notice Trithereon's setting.

2) Thank you for clarifying. So a Keen +1 Scythe would cost 8,000, abilities count towards the same cost increase as enhancement bonuses?

3) I'm a Half-Celestial Player Character with a halo capable of slaughtering villages with a weapon that is nearly the most impractical in the world, another universe where some of my peers can break every law of physics and logic. Grim's by the books? Then he should let me use the characteristics I rolled and the abilities I chose as the rules say.

[Retech]

I have made a second character sheet, in the event that Grim insists that the priest class should not be used.

 

I am just somewhat annoyed in that the restriction of classes from that book is not evenly applied to everyone, and that just because Retech is the one switching from cleric to a priest, it must be because he is trying to powergame. Not very concerned though, since being "nerfed" to a cleric is probably justified.

[Earth]

I just punch things to death. I don't understand why this should change. Ever.

[Nexaduro]

Once again, I agree with Retech. Grim's a kickass DM, and I can't say I don't appreciate the freedoms we HAVE been given, but he needs to make it perfectly clear what will and will not be allowed.

 

Also, isn't Ross an Artificer right now? Hasn't he been using it to technobabble custom devices and instantly kill opponents with infinite Magic Missile launchers?

 

EDIT: Earth, don't interject unless you have something to say. We get that you like to hit stuff. You keep saying that.

[Corvus]

1) I'm okay with that, I just wish he'd pointed out my error before, I don't expect something out of place I just didn't notice Trithereon's setting.

2) Thank you for clarifying. So a Keen +1 Scythe would cost 8,000, abilities count towards the same cost increase as enhancement bonuses?

3) I'm a Half-Celestial Player Character with a halo capable of slaughtering villages with a weapon that is nearly the most impractical in the world, another universe where some of my peers can break every law of physics and logic. Grim's by the books? Then he should let me use the characteristics I rolled and the abilities I chose as the rules say.

 

Yeah, a +1 keen Scythe would cost 8000 gold unless it was made out of cold iron which would bump it up to 10000 gold for the enchanting. The price formulas are as follows:

Armor and shield - 1000 * (enhancement bonus + special ability adjustment) ^ 2 + flat rate special abilities

Weapon - 2000 * (enhancement bonus + special ability adjustment) ^ 2 + [2000gp Cold Iron enchantment modifier, first time only]

 

Also, just to stop issues with this in the future: bonus damage dice from Magic weapon special abilities are not modified by critical hits, unless it specifically states that it is modified(such as burst special abilities)

[Earth]

It's my opinion on modifying your characters so close to the first session. This should have been done by now.

[Grim_]

Okay, first off in a response to retech.

 

To be blunt, I've looked over ross's character sheet, and he's not trying to powergame with the class, he just finds it cool. I trust ross enough to think that he will not abuse some of the more powerful parts of the class. You on the other hand seem to try to powergame every system we play in, case in point the hegemony games, you play them as a numbers game rather than a more roleplaying game. With this (And the experiences from the last kingmaker) in mind I can't exactly trust you to not play up to broken points. And yes, ross can cast unlimited spells per day, at least in theory. He does, however need to make increasingly difficult UMD checks to use the item more each day and if he fails the check the item breaks. Coupled with his limited amount of spells and the fact that he can't cast them over level 4 I wouldn't call the artificer broken.

 

On a note towards nex: Check the setting, the gods/ how celestials work change depending upon the setting. Forgotten realms (2nd ed in all of it's horrible horrible glory) is quite different when contrasted to a setting like Golarion which is different from Greyhawk which is different from Eberron. Look through the rules and the fluff for the setting. There's a golaripedia iirc as well, to help with some fluff decisions.

[Nexaduro]

It would happen quicker if our ideas were confirmed the moment they were conceived, but that just doesn't happen, and it shouldn't be expected to.

 

Aside from that, having a Cold Iron Scythe is really tempting... It's made to take out Chaotic Evil Demons, but I speak Sylvan also... A Fey-killing weapon would either go well with that or be inappropriate. Cold Iron also has no legitimate benefit outside of bypassing DR, whereas Mithral and Adamantine are both much more useful. Many DMs seem to houserule Cold Iron as disrupting magic because of its concept, which would be really cool, but however cool it would be Grim might not want to bother.

 

Then again... Double Scythe... How cool would that be?

[Retech]

Hegemony is a numbers game, which is evidenced by the reams and reams of numbers and formulas. It's foolish to not use them. And that game has a goal: to win by establishing Hegemony over everyone else. That's an entirely different situation. And in Space, I was a robot that was obsessed with efficiency and research; that is what robots do.

 

Secondly, I remember that I chose an archer druid for last Kingmaker, and you said that it was suboptimal and that I was screwing myself over. Now that I've gotten more familliar with the rules and building a more effective character, it's powergaming. The fact is that I have not changed my character concept one inch since I began on my own free will, except to remove the ape. The backstory is still: Kobold that wants to become a dragon, which actually fits with the fluff that Paizo published about Kobolds.

 

In my view, there is nothing wrong with making one's character effective. If it doesn't interfere with the roleplay and nothing gets in the way of the fluff, there is no reason to have an effective character that can actually do things.

 

But now that I have made the conversion back to cleric, I am finished changing my character. I have already spent too long working on it, making it so that it can perform everything that I wanted it to do, and adding a spread of unoptimization to make it fit with this low optimization campaign.

 

----

 

Are you sure that I can't have crocodiles though? Constrictor snakes might be a bit much, in terms of their grappling power. At least crocs don't get as much of a bonus from strength and size, but they're more versatile, so I don't have to go around grappling everything.

[Earth]

Id buy a cold iron set of Monk Weaponry, but I don't think i'll ened them...

[Nexaduro]

:rolleyes:

 

Maybe not, Earth. That was what my original character was for; taking on what others couldn't.

 

Now I'll just have my scythe.

[Corvus]

Hegemony is a numbers game, which is evidenced by the reams and reams of numbers and formulas. It's foolish to not use them. And that game has a goal: to win by establishing Hegemony over everyone else. That's an entirely different situation. And in Space, I was a robot that was obsessed with efficiency and research; that is what robots do.

 

Secondly, I remember that I chose an archer druid for last Kingmaker, and you said that it was suboptimal and that I was screwing myself over. Now that I've gotten more familliar with the rules and building a more effective character, it's powergaming. The fact is that I have not changed my character concept one inch since I began on my own free will, except to remove the ape. The backstory is still: Kobold that wants to become a dragon, which actually fits with the fluff that Paizo published about Kobolds.

 

In my view, there is nothing wrong with making one's character effective. If it doesn't interfere with the roleplay and nothing gets in the way of the fluff, there is no reason to have an effective character that can actually do things.

 

But now that I have made the conversion back to cleric, I am finished changing my character. I have already spent too long working on it, making it so that it can perform everything that I wanted it to do, and adding a spread of unoptimization to make it fit with this low optimization campaign.

 

----

 

Are you sure that I can't have crocodiles though? Constrictor snakes might be a bit much, in terms of their grappling power. At least crocs don't get as much of a bonus from strength and size, but they're more versatile, so I don't have to go around grappling everything.

 

Just because you didn't Power game before does not mean that you are not powergaming now, nor does it mean that you should be allowed to make up for the past by doing so. The main reason to not allow Powergaming is not because it prevents you from having fun, but instead it prevents the rest of the group from actually enjoying the game if you are forcing the GM to throw challenges at the party that only you can deal with due to the differences in power and therefore prevent everyone else from being to play their role as they want to. I really hope that you will see reason and decide to stop trying to push the seams of the Gamesystem to their limits as I can tell you that I am just really getting fed up with dealing with this, and I am sure that several others are as well.

 

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The only reason that your only animal companion (the two abilities cannot coexist unless you totally ignore the RAI and go into Hardcore rules lawyering) cannot be a crocodile that I can see is the fact that it does not work for the fluff of taking the feather subdomain

[Nexaduro]

DAMNIT GRIM

 

I've been waiting all day, answer and tell us if there isn't going to be a session on a particular day! Don't just procrastinate about it!

[Grim_]

I'm running it tomorrow. I have to be off the computer at irregular intervals today.

[Nexaduro]

Fair I suppose. Do tell us these things, though.

 

I really have to work on stuff, I held it off all of today because I was waiting for the game and once I start my parents won't let me touch a computer.

[Retech]

With Wyvren's ruling, I've replaced the feather domain with the generic travel domain protection domain, since it's always useful and there is nothing else that fits the flight aspect of being a dragon.

[Nexaduro]

So what is the ruling on my Scythe? Mithral gives me Silver and Mithral DR bypass, Adamantine, obviously, Adamantine DR bypass, but neither seems as likely to be put into use and their extra Hardness doesn't matter that much for a Magic Weapon. Cold Iron can take out Demons and Fey, both of which fit my character better. So does that sound good to you guys?

[Retech]

Can you make it with both? Or do you have three separate scythe. :P

[Nexaduro]

Well, I figure if I want the other two I can just order out for one somewhere along the road... It's also the cheapest, despite first-time enchants having an increased cost.

 

7832, for a Mithral Breastplate and my Scythe... That exceeds what Archi has lent me, can someone else give me a loan or should I just send my Scythe off for an enchant after a few battles and be weaponless for a week?

[Retech]

Well, I'm sure Ross would be willing to enchant it for you once we reach level 5.

 

He gets the crafting feat for that at level 5, I believe.

[Alg]

Well, I figure if I want the other two I can just order out for one somewhere along the road... It's also the cheapest, despite first-time enchants having an increased cost.

 

7832, for a Mithral Breastplate and my Scythe... That exceeds what Archi has lent me, can someone else give me a loan or should I just send my Scythe off for an enchant after a few battles and be weaponless for a week?

I'll loan. Have most of my 6000g left over.

 

..Probably should have found something worth buying :-P

[Nexaduro]

Thankee so very much Mask.

 

I'll be sure to reimburse you.

[Alg]

Well, how much do you need?

Think I'll take another look through the item lists with whatever's left over...

[Retech]

Well, how much do you need?

Think I'll take another look through the item lists with whatever's left over...

 

Well there's always the ability score boosting items, +2 to an ability score for 4000 gp. It seems expensive, but very worth it.

 

What class are you?

[Alg]

Sorcerer. Was going to look for support-based items, but a lot of the things I liked were in a rulebook we're not using according to the site that's posted on the front page.