A national identification number or National Identity/Insurance Card number is used by the governments of many countries as a means of tracking their citizens, permanent residents, and temporary residents for the purposes of work, taxation, government benefits, health care, and other governmentally-related functions. Sometimes, the number will appear on an identity card issued by a country.

 

In the United States we have a social security number, however there is no centralized system that links it to everything else like a National Identity Number would.

 

I personally think it would be good, especially for limiting illegal aliens who are a drain on resources. As part of the social contract the government needs to know that the people it is providing services for are actually citizens. A National ID could help centralize this sort of information. For example in order to register at a public highschool or get instate tuition in college a person could be required to present their national ID, same with getting treated at a hospital, or even obtaining a driving licence.

 

What do people think about United States adopting such a system? Do people in other countries find it to be successful or limiting? What do other Americans think?

limiting illegal aliens who are a drain on resources.

 

register at a public highschool

 

instate tuition in college

 

getting treated at a hospital

 

obtaining a driving licence.

 

:wall:

 

They already need a SS number for a lot of those, what makes this ID any different?

Correct me if I'm wrong but you don't need an SS number for highschool registration, lowered tuition or hospital visits. The difference is mainly centralization and limiting benefits illegal aliens would receive from the state.

US Government rule of thumb:

Anything you let them mess with, they'll f- up.

Correct me if I'm wrong but you don't need an SS number for highschool registration, lowered tuition or hospital visits.

As I said, a lot of those you do. Government grants require SS numbers, and medical insurance you need SS numbers.

 

 

An educated workforce is the best capital this country can easily afford and we're throwing it away over petty physical differences.

Let me make it clear, I'm not against immigrants, I love them. I just think all immigrants should go through the same process to get into the country. But that's a bit offtopic...

 

Grants don't require SS numbers in California anymore. Neither does highschool. Hospitals are required to treat people without insurance, they mainly just need an ID. It has actually become an issue with hospitals running out of funds and shutting down due to having to treat so many people without insurance.

Let me make it clear, I'm not against immigrants, I love them. I just think all immigrants should go through the same process to get into the country. But that's a bit offtopic...

Its not off-topic, its relevant. The points of a National ID is for (1) Identifying you and (2) Proving your citizenship. Thus it is very relevant.

 

This National ID will do nothing but fuel more anti-immigration propaganda. The benefit is a more centralized system, but I don't understand why we can't do that with Social security already.

You are aware in order to obtain a drivers license most states (if not all post 9/11) require you have a social security number to get one? Your profile says located in Jordan....so not too sure if you do know

To get instate tuition - thees numerous ways for American citizens to beat the system as is - all you need is proof at place of residence usually (NC is 3-4 years) and a letter from the owner of the house if it's not yours.

From a logistics standpoint centralization is almost always a good idea. Working for the government myself (albeit municipal) decentralization creates huge logistical problems.

I know that China has this system, and we all know American's opinions on China...

 

In all seriousness, theres plenty ways to identify someone, not neccessarily a national ID system is needed.

I hate centralisation and love anonymity, so I dislike the sound of this immensely. Especially since as time goes on you'll be using it for more and more things.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong but you don't need an SS number for highschool registration, lowered tuition or hospital visits. The difference is mainly centralization and limiting benefits illegal aliens would receive from the state.

These ones would be so because minors go to highschool, and because foreigners can also receive healthcare.

I hate centralisation and love anonymity

 

If you love anonymity, why do you have a link to your facebook page in your signature?

I hate centralisation and love anonymity

 

If you love anonymity, why do you have a link to your facebook page in your signature?

 

Because big whoop. No one cares if he has a facebook or not and even then it doesn't help anyone anyway. And you can set that stuff to be private, so it's a moot point.

Because a private facebook account is totally synonymous with anonymity :rolleyes:

Because a private facebook account is totally synonymous with anonymity :rolleyes:

Except this is entirely a moot point seeing how it's anonymity from the government and they've got better things to worry about unless otherwise noted, which is a mess within itself. So end this line of thought.

He loves relative anonymity from the government? Anyway, I find a national ID number somewhat repulsive, but see the clear benefits it has.

 

I don't see how it would dissuade illegal immigrants. Rather, for the US, creating and rolling out a nation identification system would be almost imposible DUE to the sheer amount of illegal immigrants. They would still be pouring into US by the droves, and just because you identify someone does not mean it will stop them leaving, or stop more from coming back in. I find, rather, that you wouldn't exactly be able to identify these illegal aliens anymore than right now. Sure, there would be a big void where a half of California is supposed to go, but whether the US would chase these guys down anymore than they do already is doubtful.

I hate centralisation and love anonymity

 

If you love anonymity, why do you have a link to your facebook page in your signature?

Just because I love anonymity doesn't mean I always wish to be anonymous. Choice is something that people should always have access too.

Discovering that the US's Social Security Number system isn't centralised amuses me. Basically, you're telling me that it's broken to the point that you need to start over. That's going to cost a lot, but it's pretty important that you have that system in place for taxation purposes.

 

Isn't it a bit of a delusion that people think that they can get away with being anonymous from their own government? If the system allowed for that, how could you make sure people are taxed fairly?

It's delusional that people think they are anonymous from their own government.

With the way Nifflin is making it sound, you'd need that ID to pretty much do anything. Why I need to say to the government "Hey, I've been to the hospital because I injured myself and just got given some pain killers that are sold over the counter and anyone can get." is beyond me.

It's delusional that people think they are anonymous from their own government.

This guy seemed to be pretty successful at it.

Sounds expensive.

 

No thanks.

Sounds expensive.

 

No thanks.

 

 

Economic problems really are not much of an issue in this case because, put simply, such IDs already exist. The only difference is that as it stands today there are 51 different issuing organizations rather then just 1. Indeed, it would likely be cheaper to have just one identification system due to economies of scale yielding substantial efficiencies in the administration of the program.

 

 

It's delusional that people think they are anonymous from their own government.

This guy seemed to be pretty successful at it.

 

He was also a certified genius with a degree from Harvard and a PhD from Michigan, in addition to substantial resources. Hardly a practical example to follow for 99.9% of the country.

Sounds expensive.

 

No thanks.

 

 

Economic problems really are not much of an issue in this case because, put simply, such IDs already exist. The only difference is that as it stands today there are 51 different issuing organizations rather then just 1. Indeed, it would likely be cheaper to have just one identification system due to economies of scale yielding substantial efficiencies in the administration of the program.

While economies of scale would probably play a significant factor, the insane amount of paperwork and bureaucracy needed to traverse federal and the various state requirements would probably also cause many problems. I'm not qualified to say which factor will overpower the other by any means, but considering the size and complexity of legal structures in America it's not an insignificant factor.

It's delusional that people think they are anonymous from their own government.

This guy seemed to be pretty successful at it.

 

Then again, he also basically went insane from having a PhD in mathematics that quickly.