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10/29/13 - RuneScape Close To Eradicating Gold Farming


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#41
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TBH, what was the big problem with RWT in the first place? The fact that it went into someone else's wallet?

People can, and have always, bought their way to the top. Jagex now endorses it, so long as it's done through them. But why?

What was sooo broken about the economy that Jagex had to poke their nose in and officially support RWT? What has been fixed in the economy since Bonds' release?

I've known dozens and dozens of players who have RWTed using a third-party. Some buying only a few M, others buying and selling a few B. When it came to a company, none of them were scammed. None of them lost their credit information. They are a company, a business, and they have a reputation to uphold. After-all, a reputation is the main attraction for a RWT company.

So, what's changed since Bonds were released except for the pocket the money goes into?

Interesting viewpoint.  This reads as if you support RWT as it was, it wasn't a problem because nobody you knew got scammed, and you have a problem because Jagex gets the money instead.  I would have thought the benefits of doing this in-house would have been obvious.  I'm also more than a little suprised that a forum mod on a fansite would publicly air a pro-rwt (as it was) viewpoint.



#42
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You can have a personal opinion of something and still hold it separate from doing your duties that seem to conflict with it. Additionally, it's less of a positive statement and more of a "everything that Jagex said about the bonds update has been fabricated nonsense."

Most people don't have a problem with Jagex selling bonds. And while they understandably can't just say, "We wanted a piece of the pie to bolster our profits since you guys don't seem to care" it's still a little frustrating to the average player regardless of what your stance on RWTing is.

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#43
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This reads as if you support RWT as it was, it wasn't a problem because nobody you knew got scammed, and you have a problem because Jagex gets the money instead.  I would have thought the benefits of doing this in-house would have been obvious.

Whether or not I support third-party RWT is irrelevant. I'm not a lemming of Jagex just because my name is written in green. I have my own views, as does each member of our staff. However, I keep my RuneScape life, what ever it may entail, separate from the work I do here on Tip.It and it doesn't in any way affect the job that I do, as Kim pointed out.
 

I would have thought the benefits of doing this in-house would have been obvious.

I'd like to focus on this. What exactly are the benefits? A higher cost? "Safety"?

Think of it from an average-Joe standpoint. My name's now Ben. I'm tired of having dry Nex runs and could do with an extra 100M. I can either pay $80.00 and get it from Jagex; having to go through the hassle of selling Bonds and buying them one at a time, or I can get a cash stack of 100M in 15 minutes from a reliable third-party for $32.00. What benefits did I miss out on?

I'm Ben. I don't give a damn who gets my money; I got the same product for half the price.



I'm sorry, but these benefits apparently aren't at all obvious to me. As for my other questions, they still stand.

Aiel mentioned buying gold through a third-party to be "immoral". Why? Prior to Bonds, you'd have answered with, "Because it's cheating. People are using the IRL wealth to buy their way through the game, making it unfair for everyone else, which is against the ToS." Now that Jagex supports buying your way to the top, what's so immoral about it?

As I said before, I see Bonds opening people's eyes to RWT. People who otherwise wouldn't have thought about it are now thinking, "Hmmm. I can buy some gold and get a Nex set." Then they Google and/or talk to friends and... "I can get GP for 50% off at Website_X!"

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#44
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One of the advantages of it being done in house is that I can now get some of the solomon's stuff that I really couldn't afford previously. Anyone who wasn't willing to break the ToS before was completely unable to benefit. This isn't a moral argument, I just feel more parties benefit from this system than from the previous goldselling. Another benefit of course is that its still against the ToS. You can spend $80 and get it through Jagex free and clear, or you can spend $32 and risk your account. Before there was only one real way to get that 100m when buying it. I'd also prefer that the people making the money are the ones making the game instead of some random 3rd party, but thats more of a preference than anything else.

 

I don't think that many people buying gold before really wanted to risk their accounts, but they had no other options. I could see people willing to pay more for a way to obtain it without risking a banning. Also, while you're right that most of these companies probably wouldn't risk their "reputation" there are probably also some shadier sites out there.


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#45
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I could see people willing to pay a bit more for some extra level of safety. But double? Seems a bit excessive when they were getting away with it fine just weeks ago. I just can't picture it. If Bonds somehow reached a decent $/M, even remotely close to third-parties, then absolutely. The ratio is just too terrible and unless something changes, I don't see Bonds rising. :(.

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#46
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Really, Jagex needs to start cracking down on those still buying from gold sellers. remove the gold bought, a bit of their stats and maybe a week or two ban every time. Don't need to perm ban them, just need enough to show that they'll consistently get nothing for that $80. While the goldfarmer gp may be cheaper, if Jagex could actually show that there's no way to benefit from it then I could see bonds being successful. Otherwise I understand your point that it is a major difference, however I don't think bonds ever could compete with gold farmers prices, so the only thing really to do that won't wreck the game even worse is to hammer in on the account safety part of it.


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#47
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I'd imagine cracking down in-game on gold buyers is the next phase of their scheme.

Give people a chance to go legit, then crack down on those who don't.


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#48
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I can imagine the main bond customers are people to young that don't understand what RWT and Gold farming is.



#49
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I think if you're old enough to have access to payment for bonds you're old enough to understand what RWT is. Whether they actually know it is another matter.

#50
Lord Zophar
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I can imagine the main bond customers are people to young that don't understand what RWT and Gold farming is.

That makes no sense.

 

First of all, "young kids" won't have access to unlimited funds unless they steal Daddy's credit card, which opens up an entirely separate can of worms.

 

Next, what does understanding what RWT is have to do with whether or not someone buys bonds? They don't know Gold Farmers exist, or otherwise they would use them? Is that what you're implying?

 

 

I will give you MY rationale for buying Bonds:

 

I've got a job that pays me very well, and soon I am not going to have much time to play. I want to enjoy the benefits of having t80 and t90 gear, and while I do MH every day it is just not fast enough. I could research which sites are legit and illegally buy gold for much cheaper, but you know what? Gold sellers obtain their gold by forcing people to "play" RS for very long hours in sweatshops while paying them next to nothing. That isn't someone I want to give my money to. And besides, I have been playing RS off-and-on since 2001. I don't want to risk being banned, and I also don't mind supporting the company that created a game which has brought me enjoyment for more than 10 years. Even if I disagree with many of the decisions Jagex has made and continues to make, I am still grateful to be able to enjoy RS.


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#51
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I cannot wait until Mod MMGs RuneFest and end of year speaches.



#52
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reminds me of governments applauding their anti-drug policies saying that each new policy is that much closer to finally eradicating drugs from existance!



#53
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reminds me of governments applauding their anti-drug policies saying that each new policy is that much closer to finally eradicating drugs from existance!

I guess that makes Jagex's recent moves equivalent to governments decriminalizing and regulating drugs to stamp out black market drugs which has worked fairly well IRL from the reports I've heard. Whether the same concept would hold for RS remains to be seen but I seem to recall someone saying that it worked in another game.



#54
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You can have a personal opinion of something and still hold it separate from doing your duties that seem to conflict with it. Additionally, it's less of a positive statement and more of a "everything that Jagex said about the bonds update has been fabricated nonsense."

Most people don't have a problem with Jagex selling bonds. And while they understandably can't just say, "We wanted a piece of the pie to bolster our profits since you guys don't seem to care" it's still a little frustrating to the average player regardless of what your stance on RWTing is.

 

It is exactly what Jagex would do if they legitimately wanted to stop gold farming for the long-term health of the game. I don't see the fabricated nonsense.



#55
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Whether or not I support third-party RWT is irrelevant. I'm not a lemming of Jagex just because my name is written in green. I have my own views, as does each member of our staff. However, I keep my RuneScape life, what ever it may entail, separate from the work I do here on Tip.It and it doesn't in any way affect the job that I do, as Kim pointed out.

 

Nobody has said you have to support or even agree with decisions Jagex makes.  I don't.  You do seem to condone RWT outside of the scope of Jagex and whether you disagree with their stance or not it is still firmly against the rules of the game.  What you say in private is your business.  Publicly, you're speaking under your moderator banner for a fansite that is not supposed to encourage any type of play against the rules.  When someone in your position says it, you're giving players excuses to think it's ok to do it.  Correct me if I'm wrong and publicly say that it's bad to buy gold from traders outside of the game environment.

 

You see no benefits at all by actually giving the money to Jagex :rolleyes: .  Most of my answer to that is summed up very well with the post below by Everto. Who makes the game? Who updates it and keeps people interested in it for some many years?  The benefits that aren't obvious to you are that we keep the game, the cash made goes into the company that makes the game so we as a gaming community benefit from continuous development.  Jagex have the right to do what they do and they can charge what they want.  Players should vote with their cancelled accounts or refrain from buying any in-game features if they don't agree with it, not look for reasons to circumvent the game rules and dilute its integrity.  We've seen what that does, an example being the high scores.

 

On the subject of immorality, Everto's example of sweatshops is one aspect of it.  We don't know where the rest of the money goes either.  Organised crime? Funding terrorism perhaps? Who knows. I know I might be a minority on this last aspect but I was also brought up to think that cheating by breaking rules was a form of immorality too.

 

I've got a job that pays me very well, and soon I am not going to have much time to play. I want to enjoy the benefits of having t80 and t90 gear, and while I do MH every day it is just not fast enough. I could research which sites are legit and illegally buy gold for much cheaper, but you know what? Gold sellers obtain their gold by forcing people to "play" RS for very long hours in sweatshops while paying them next to nothing. That isn't someone I want to give my money to. And besides, I have been playing RS off-and-on since 2001. I don't want to risk being banned, and I also don't mind supporting the company that created a game which has brought me enjoyment for more than 10 years. Even if I disagree with many of the decisions Jagex has made and continues to make, I am still grateful to be able to enjoy RS.



#56
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Whether or not I support third-party RWT is irrelevant. I'm not a lemming of Jagex just because my name is written in green. I have my own views, as does each member of our staff. However, I keep my RuneScape life, what ever it may entail, separate from the work I do here on Tip.It and it doesn't in any way affect the job that I do, as Kim pointed out.

 

Nobody has said you have to support or even agree with decisions Jagex makes.  I don't.  You do seem to condone RWT outside of the scope of Jagex and whether you disagree with their stance or not it is still firmly against the rules of the game.  What you say in private is your business.  Publicly, you're speaking under your moderator banner for a fansite that is not supposed to encourage any type of play against the rules.  When someone in your position says it, you're giving players excuses to think it's ok to do it.  Correct me if I'm wrong and publicly say that it's bad to buy gold from traders outside of the game environment.

 

You see no benefits at all by actually giving the money to Jagex :rolleyes: .  Most of my answer to that is summed up very well with the post below by Everto. Who makes the game? Who updates it and keeps people interested in it for some many years?  The benefits that aren't obvious to you are that we keep the game, the cash made goes into the company that makes the game so we as a gaming community benefit from continuous development.  Jagex have the right to do what they do and they can charge what they want.  Players should vote with their cancelled accounts or refrain from buying any in-game features if they don't agree with it, not look for reasons to circumvent the game rules and dilute its integrity.  We've seen what that does, an example being the high scores.

 

On the subject of immorality, Everto's example of sweatshops is one aspect of it.  We don't know where the rest of the money goes either.  Organised crime? Funding terrorism perhaps? Who knows. I know I might be a minority on this last aspect but I was also brought up to think that cheating by breaking rules was a form of immorality too.

 

Breaking rules is not inherently immoral. And I don't know why you'd have sweatshop workers collecting gold when it would be way cheaper to just run bots. 


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#57
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Because it's not always more efficient to run bots.

Bots can screw up or be unable to do the task, especially since botwatch got better lately.

Plus even if it is done with bots there still a sweatshop behind it usually, just instead of 1 user to 1 system doing actions its 1 user to several systems making sure the bots aren't messing up and replacing those that do.

 

There is a very well publicised MASSIVE business out in China etc. of sweatshop gold farming on various online games; it's why some big name games just outright block players for those regions and even on rs players in recent months have had trouble with auto-bans if they live out that way.


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#58
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I'm not sure goldfarming sweatshops are that bad relative to other sweatshops anyway (working with computers is inherently less dangerous then working with manufacturing equipment).


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#59
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I'm not sure goldfarming sweatshops are that bad relative to other sweatshops anyway (working with computers is inherently less dangerous then working with manufacturing equipment).

According to http://www.theguardi...net-gaming-scam it's not always as clear as that.



#60
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I want to know how they target the problem of god farming in game. Surely they trade all trades in the game. IT must be clear when people are buying gold, strangers just handing over large sums of coins. I assume they are tackling both sides of the problems, but I don't see why more isn't done in game to prevent third party RWT. 


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