Recent Triangle Balanced?

[aj926]

I think the recent triangle is fairly balanced, the rangers have what rangers should have, the mages have ancients which isn't all that powerful, and warriors have defenders. (edits and elaborates) Ranging I don't think has ever been a very good dueling skill, but then again how many people do you see maging fire giants or shooting between those greater demon bars with fire wave? Ranging is a wonderful skill in its own right, and almost everyone keeps it equal to its other stats. if it really was that underpowered, why would this be?

 

 

 

Magic has always been what players use against other players. Rarely do you ast magic on a monster. And evn if you look at the triangle as a simple PKing chart, a ranger can still beat it and a warrior can be effectively shot down from a distance. Sure a lucky DDS can kill the common mager, but then again the triangle isn't a definite thing. A warrior can get beaten by a ranger.

 

 

 

Warriors have always been the common way of attacking both players and monsters. Defenders have added to its power... which is fine considering ancients and the rangers ability to run, and fast. Surely it is a bit overpowered, but I'm not one to complain.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think compared to past days, the triangle is fairly balanced.

 

 

 

Wanted to get a few opinions on this.

[game_proffy]

Would be difficult to beat someone wearing Torags, crystal shield and alike. But I agree.

 

 

 

The reason magic is only used cw and pking (occasionally on monsters) is because it's so expensive to use combat magic. While alchemy pays for itself, NONE other spells do! (except for when barrowing, of course :D)

 

 

 

Ranging, in this case, is much cheaper. No matter how many complaints one hears about the crystal bow prices, it is AT LEAST 10 times cheaper to use that even the regular fire wave. I'm not even talking of Blood and Ice barraging.

[CampbellMC]

Well I think in F2P the triangle is a bit weak on the mage side, but this is about p2p so I'll comment on that.

 

 

 

In P2P now, it is not uncommon to see a melee/mage hybrid, this is because with even 85 mage (and blitz) you can still hit on full dhides and mage pray something near 1 in 5 times. If a ranger goes against a meleer in P2P, all they do is bring out a dagger and special you to death, the damage from arrows at 99 range, potted and praying can only MAX at 25. A person with 80 str can do that with a dagger. The only thing that rangers can do now is become a Ranger/Mage hybrid and prey on the melee/mage hybrids.

 

 

 

Therefore I do not see the Combat Triangle as a triangle anymore, but more of a straight line in which mage is in the middle, mages can be beat pretty easily if they are only maging, but if any side beats them then they become stronger then either of the sides.

 

 

 

Melee------------>Mage<-------------Ranger

[Dork]

As far as pking goes, the triangle has always been balanced.

 

A true mage has always beaten a true melee

 

A true melee has always beaten a true ranger

 

A true ranger has always beaten a true mage

 

 

 

What I mean by true is;

 

Mage: Robes, entangles/freeze, damage spell

 

Melee: Rune/low mage defence, high range defence armour, strong weapon

 

Range: Hides/high mage defence armour, strong arrows

 

 

 

However because no one ever pks as one combat style solely, the triangle doesn't work. Hybriding is what pkers are made of now (even a melee wearing hides is effectively hybriding), and for that reason, a true triangle can't exist. It's no one's fault that this is the way it is, people have just learnt to adapt.

 

 

 

That's how I see it anyway :P

[Dragondan_Ro]

hmm well it is not so because that means a guy with 1 range should be able to kill someone with same range as his combat a guy with 54 range nad fulll guthans (friend of mine) i took a fight with him and used crystal bow and i won lol only 81 range so how can a lvl 81 ranger kill a guy with 54 range and full guthans with dragon sq?

[Kenshinjapan]

Well I think in F2P the triangle is a bit weak on the mage side, but this is about p2p so I'll comment on that.

 

 

 

In P2P now, it is not uncommon to see a melee/mage hybrid, this is because with even 85 mage (and blitz) you can still hit on full dhides and mage pray something near 1 in 5 times. If a ranger goes against a meleer in P2P, all they do is bring out a dagger and special you to death, the damage from arrows at 99 range, potted and praying can only MAX at 25. A person with 80 str can do that with a dagger. The only thing that rangers can do now is become a Ranger/Mage hybrid and prey on the melee/mage hybrids.

 

 

 

Therefore I do not see the Combat Triangle as a triangle anymore, but more of a straight line in which mage is in the middle, mages can be beat pretty easily if they are only maging, but if any side beats them then they become stronger then either of the sides.

 

 

 

Melee------------>Mage<-------------Ranger

 

 

 

true about f2p mage vs. full rune. A few days ago , I was hitting 16's while he was hitting 8s...

[zuomimiez]

As an archer (91 ranged. Almost ranged based) I've noticed that range really owns with the new prayers. Short + rune arrows + hides + torag helm offers a cheap set that owns the warriors that r the same comb lvl than I am. Dds is the only thing that may give warriors an advantage as archer can't eat fast enough to heal.

 

 

 

Anyway those rune arrows potted with pray can cause some serious damage even through torag full.

 

 

 

Shields should give more range def than they do now and hides should give melee penalties to balance the triangle.

[Freshwacka]

As an archer (91 ranged. Almost ranged based) I've noticed that range really owns with the new prayers. Short + rune arrows + hides + torag helm offers a cheap set that owns the warriors that r the same comb lvl than I am. Dds is the only thing that may give warriors an advantage as archer can't eat fast enough to heal.

 

 

 

Anyway those rune arrows potted with pray can cause some serious damage even through torag full.

 

 

 

Shields should give more range def than they do now and hides should give melee penalties to balance the triangle.

 

 

 

Range is UNDERPOWERED. The warriors you're fighting must have had low range levels.

[xarikadox]

Would be difficult to beat someone wearing Torags, crystal shield and alike. But I agree.

 

 

 

The reason magic is only used cw and pking (occasionally on monsters) is because it's so expensive to use combat magic. While alchemy pays for itself, NONE other spells do! (except for when barrowing, of course :D)

 

 

 

Ranging, in this case, is much cheaper. No matter how many complaints one hears about the crystal bow prices, it is AT LEAST 10 times cheaper to use that even the regular fire wave. I'm not even talking of Blood and Ice barraging.

 

 

 

I don't call 180k a bow, or 72 gp a shot expensive. Sure, it takes money to get there, but once you actually reach that price it's pretty damn cheap... fire BOLTS cost more than that.

[Dork]

As an archer (91 ranged. Almost ranged based) I've noticed that range really owns with the new prayers. Short + rune arrows + hides + torag helm offers a cheap set that owns the warriors that r the same comb lvl than I am. Dds is the only thing that may give warriors an advantage as archer can't eat fast enough to heal.

 

 

 

Anyway those rune arrows potted with pray can cause some serious damage even through torag full.

 

 

 

Shields should give more range def than they do now and hides should give melee penalties to balance the triangle.

 

 

 

Range is UNDERPOWERED. The warriors you're fighting must have had low range levels.

 

 

 

Someone's range level has no impact on their range defence.. o.O And no, range is not underpowered, the triangle is as follows Range > Mage > Melee > Range, which is exactly how it is. But when you take into account the fact that most people hybrid, it's impossible to have a true triangle, refer to my previous post.

[moopymitchell182]

Just because you can't hit constant 30's with ranged, doesn't mean it's underpowered. It's great vs npcs. Not ever form of combat is going to be suitable for use in pvp.

[Krampell]

oo sweet

[Nenga]

the triangle never became unbalanced, people say lunar made it un balanced but it's an addition on magic, people were preparing for a whole new system. It was an addition not a new skill!!!

 

 

 

it never became un balanced, so of corse it's balanced.

[Dazzuh]

I agree, i personally think the combat triangle is the most fair its been since i started (September 2002)

[Baemnt13]

I STRONGLY disagree with some of the people who think range is underpowered.

 

Even before the new range prayers, us rangers had RAPID, in which we hit much, much faster than our mage/melee counterparts...

 

Comparing a Rune Scimitar with a Maple short bow/addy arrows on my pure ranger... The hit ratio is probably 3:5...

 

For every 3 times the rune scimitar hits, my maple shortbow hits 5 times...

 

 

 

So, that isn't underpowered in my honest opinion.

[moopymitchell182]

I STRONGLY disagree with some of the people who think range is underpowered.

 

Even before the new range prayers, us rangers had RAPID, in which we hit much, much faster than our mage/melee counterparts...

 

Comparing a Rune Scimitar with a Maple short bow/addy arrows on my pure ranger... The hit ratio is probably 3:5...

 

For every 3 times the rune scimitar hits, my maple shortbow hits 5 times...

 

 

 

So, that isn't underpowered in my honest opinion.

*High five* You are much ftw.

[Tenpowers]

I STRONGLY disagree with some of the people who think range is underpowered.

 

Even before the new range prayers, us rangers had RAPID, in which we hit much, much faster than our mage/melee counterparts...

 

Comparing a Rune Scimitar with a Maple short bow/addy arrows on my pure ranger... The hit ratio is probably 3:5...

 

For every 3 times the rune scimitar hits, my maple shortbow hits 5 times...

 

 

 

So, that isn't underpowered in my honest opinion.

 

 

 

QFT

 

 

 

Rangers may hit low but they hit very often very fast. \

[InkofDeath]

Well considering i have been pking for four years(not bragging, just trying to give a better opinion to reduce nay flame i may recieve), i think imo if you hybrid pk you bascially can kill a non-hybrider, very quickly and effeicently.

 

 

 

However if we talk about a solo-combat pker vs another solo-combat pker, i would like to think that after awhile if you have a very high range(75+-80+), the opponents defence bonuses do not seem to matter at all very much. I also think that once your attack level hits around 80+ the oppositions defence bonuses doesn't matter much either. The only one i cannot firgure out is magic, people say that a high magic level allows you to hit more often, which i think is true, hitting 0s is better then not hitting and splashing, higher magic will probaly make your magic hit less splashing, but doesn't mean you still will hit more or less 0s.

 

 

 

As for weapons, if you take every single special out of a weapon, waht are you left with?i bet the fastest attacking weapon would be the best, assuming dscimmie and abby whip for melee, msb for rangers, possibly karils, crossbows highly unlikely...magic probaly they would stick with anceints. Now add in the speical for msb, dds, any others and then it all comes down to strategy, if you have a dds and a lunar majick friend, and your opponent has only a dds, your chance's are greatly higher, but you can still die to a 30-30spec when you've speced once, or a msb you can spec twice and hit high for sure, meaning a deadly combonation. For magic it's just stun and hit, basically(not including dds because of solo-combat pking, to the triangle) Having no freind is a great disadvantage and magic alone would be very unuseful combat, which leaves range and melee, both are equal and defence bonuses don't matter, so defence level would come in. then timing for a special would come in, also random hitting and your timing on eating, potting, natural hp regain rate, prayer.

 

 

 

I guess what i am saying is if you use the triangle you are doomed, the triangle is inaccurate, because everything is random(not totally but close to randomness, computors, ugh)and the skill and technique. The combat triangle imo is based on if we were robots and we did everything at a certain number, and we're made up of so many rules and everything, but we're humans so we don't follow rules but our own, hence teleing and not teleing arguement. If we were robots the triangle maybe correct, but we're humans and humans are flawed, so the triangle is flawed. The triangle isn't correct, its called coincidence, when you see something spectaular or unexplainable you thinks its a phenonanon(spelling), super natural, and you relate what is very easily explained as a super natural event when its not, we thnk the triangle works, when it works in our favour, how many times does the triangle work in our favour? we only keep track of when it does work in our favour, so i am pretty sure it doesn't work in our favour 10x as muxh as it does in our favour. Yes you may still get the kill, but were you praying, safeing, more food, better food, pots drain rate, max hit, weapon and armour, special, all those would increase our chances of the trinagle worng in our favour and breaking the rules of the triangle.

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure back in 2003 the triangle did have some truth, but today with all the updates that truth was killed quicker then a 99str+31prayer kills a lvl 10hper.

 

 

 

Jagex did a good job though, theoritically the traingle should work out that way, but it doesn't, the triangle is on a thread worn out by hundreds of years, and it barely connects the triangle let alone hold it in place, that other equations can shake this thread and boom no more triangle.

 

 

 

happy thoughts

[Bludragon124]

Range is not underpowered. Rangers hit fast and often, even faster than abby whip/d scim/dds or the like. Oftentimes if you are a high level ranger with prayer and potion, you can hit several times in a row with a very high hit. In my opinion, range is an essential combat form, and effective against other players, if you use it right.

 

 

 

The Blumeister

[l33thunt3r]

Without "honor", a mage could probably beat ANYBODY. Since range can only hit so far, a mager could have on the MAXIMUM mage bonus and cast Ice/Blood Barrage at a far distance, and would eventually kill the ranger/melee'er.

 

 

 

A melee'er needs STRENGTH, which is about all that helps (and quests, a whip, proper equipment). With that, he can hit 40+, which is amazing for anything.

 

 

 

Rangers can range, smite, use range pray, and vengeance. A good ranger owns really well with that. 20+'s with range, and a lucky vengeance + special can bring anybody down.

 

 

 

Yep.

[djo0]

Crazy...I never thought htat people would think that the combat triangle is actually balanced. I think I agree that the traingle is pretty fair. Mages are a bit overpowered in members, and melee is probibly the best for f2p, but range really does hit fast and consistantly, if not extremely high.

[aj926]

Just because you can't hit constant 30's with ranged, doesn't mean it's underpowered. It's great vs npcs. Not ever form of combat is going to be suitable for use in pvp.

 

 

 

Exactly the point I was stressing.

[aj926]

Well considering i have been pking for four years(not bragging, just trying to give a better opinion to reduce nay flame i may recieve), i think imo if you hybrid pk you bascially can kill a non-hybrider, very quickly and effeicently.

 

 

 

However if we talk about a solo-combat pker vs another solo-combat pker, i would like to think that after awhile if you have a very high range(75+-80+), the opponents defence bonuses do not seem to matter at all very much. I also think that once your attack level hits around 80+ the oppositions defence bonuses doesn't matter much either. The only one i cannot firgure out is magic, people say that a high magic level allows you to hit more often, which i think is true, hitting 0s is better then not hitting and splashing, higher magic will probaly make your magic hit less splashing, but doesn't mean you still will hit more or less 0s.

 

 

 

As for weapons, if you take every single special out of a weapon, waht are you left with?i bet the fastest attacking weapon would be the best, assuming dscimmie and abby whip for melee, msb for rangers, possibly karils, crossbows highly unlikely...magic probaly they would stick with anceints. Now add in the speical for msb, dds, any others and then it all comes down to strategy, if you have a dds and a lunar majick friend, and your opponent has only a dds, your chance's are greatly higher, but you can still die to a 30-30spec when you've speced once, or a msb you can spec twice and hit high for sure, meaning a deadly combonation. For magic it's just stun and hit, basically(not including dds because of solo-combat pking, to the triangle) Having no freind is a great disadvantage and magic alone would be very unuseful combat, which leaves range and melee, both are equal and defence bonuses don't matter, so defence level would come in. then timing for a special would come in, also random hitting and your timing on eating, potting, natural hp regain rate, prayer.

 

 

 

I guess what i am saying is if you use the triangle you are doomed, the triangle is inaccurate, because everything is random(not totally but close to randomness, computors, ugh)and the skill and technique. The combat triangle imo is based on if we were robots and we did everything at a certain number, and we're made up of so many rules and everything, but we're humans so we don't follow rules but our own, hence teleing and not teleing arguement. If we were robots the triangle maybe correct, but we're humans and humans are flawed, so the triangle is flawed. The triangle isn't correct, its called coincidence, when you see something spectaular or unexplainable you thinks its a phenonanon(spelling), super natural, and you relate what is very easily explained as a super natural event when its not, we thnk the triangle works, when it works in our favour, how many times does the triangle work in our favour? we only keep track of when it does work in our favour, so i am pretty sure it doesn't work in our favour 10x as muxh as it does in our favour. Yes you may still get the kill, but were you praying, safeing, more food, better food, pots drain rate, max hit, weapon and armour, special, all those would increase our chances of the trinagle worng in our favour and breaking the rules of the triangle.

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure back in 2003 the triangle did have some truth, but today with all the updates that truth was killed quicker then a 99str+31prayer kills a lvl 10hper.

 

 

 

Jagex did a good job though, theoritically the traingle should work out that way, but it doesn't, the triangle is on a thread worn out by hundreds of years, and it barely connects the triangle let alone hold it in place, that other equations can shake this thread and boom no more triangle.

 

 

 

happy thoughts

 

 

 

I agree.

 

 

 

How many people honestly bring one form of combat nowadays?

 

 

 

Its all about slapping on 40K d hide and protecting your whip over and over....

[InkofDeath]

todays pking no longer consists of fun filled entertainment of who can out match or out straegies your opponent, sadly there's hardly nayone left who sees it that way, its all full of profit pkers, jagex implemented smite and boom profit pking emerged.

 

 

 

Jagex probaly thought that pking would be a very succesful and a nice fun way to entertain and make friends, so they made the triangle on those basises, then jagex created a few certain prayers, and armour and other things i will not say to increase more profit pkers, and jagex deluted the original pker. Killing their triangle very very badly.

 

 

 

:ohnoes: