Do you believe in God?

[Guest crazed]

Syberblade,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

While I respect that you believe in the bible's interpretation of god, many of us don't. There are many other monotheistic religions out there (I personally am a Jew), all of which believe in god, though not necessarily the Christian bible's interpretation of god.

[syberbladex]

Syberblade,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

While I respect that you believe in the bible's interpretation of god, many of us don't. There are many other monotheistic religions out there (I personally am a Jew), all of which believe in god, though not necessarily the Christian bible's interpretation of god.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i respect that entirely i'm just stating my personal opinon as i said early and yes i forgot about the many translations of the Bible also. my apoligies (yes my spelling still sucks :P )

[Ankh]

As I look at the question it is very difficult to say

 

 

 

WHAT god do u mean

 

 

 

just the christian god

 

 

 

the islamic

 

 

 

the roman ones

 

 

 

the greek ones

 

 

 

the egyptian ones

 

 

 

the german ones

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

there are so many gods through history

 

 

 

first make that clear to me

[expertgamer]

i'm sick and tired of people posting who have no idea what they're talking about. Here is my main reason

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1) for all the people who say they believe in God and that he is their ruler need to read the Bible. According to the Bible when God created the universe as we know it he created man. Before man creation God was in heaven with his angels. it states in the Bible that the angels were created for one sole purpose..to serve God. That means that they have no free will and are the eqvialant (sorry my spellings horrible) of puppets. However humans have a choice of whether or not to serve and believe in God. Also for people who say they would believe in God but they don't want anyone telling them what to do should also read the Bible.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you have any disagreements with this for any reason i respect your opinon but don't start flaming me.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also if you can't tell already yes i do believe in God.

 

 

 

actually they weren't puppets, they were created to serve, but still had a will of their own. that's what happened with satan and the giants.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

for me, after a bunch of research, the conflict isn't between christians and atheists, it's between christians and muslims.

[Death_By_Pod]

I do believe in god.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I can't think of another rational explanation for how the universe, creatures and humans were created.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I know, people site the big bang theory, but where did that stuff come from? Where did space come from?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also, humans were created with many necesary mechanisms for survival.

 

 

 

Take food for an example... Why does a big mac taste so much better than my mom's boca burgers? Because it has more fat and calories, two things very necessary for survival. What if humans didn't get hungry? We wouldn't have a drive to eat. What if people didn't feel pain? We would do stupid things to injure/kill ourselves that aren't good for us in the long run.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Humans were created with all these things plus many more, and I don't see how science creates these mechanisms.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Finally, I can't see an emptiness after death. What is nothingness? What happens? I believe there is a god after life.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The reason why you canÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t comprehend where the universe came from etc. is because humans canÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t understand things levels above or below them.

 

 

 

We understand things on the atomic level (classical physics - projectile motion, wind resistance, energy to mass ratio etc) but we can only guess at what is on the sub-atomic level (atom/quantum, GRW theories) and the macro-atomic level (Big-bang, many world interpretations). Like the same way we can not visualise 4 dimensions (since we live in 3 space dimensions). For example; if you were an atom and could ask yourself what the big picture was you would only be able to respond with what you are doing (I.e. flying around space or stuck next to another atom in a bond), do you really understand that you are a person or part of the earth? Would you know what each of the particles that make you would in turn be made of?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Darwinism explains why we need to eat a lot of high energy food and the need to feel pain. We enjoy fatty foods because we never know when we will be eating next (much like an animal catching his prey. It may never know when the next catch will be). The same reason why need feel pain; so we can prevent the pain from killing us. These are left overs from Darwinism (survival of the fittest), when we actually had to hunt and run away from predators. We didn't just magically appear on earth, we had to fight our way up the food chain and evolve and learn new tactics.

 

 

 

You may say itÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s a load of crock but that's most likely because you misunderstood it. Science didn't create these things, the environment did.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What happens after death? Well it wonÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t be going to heaven because that breaks the second law of thermodynamics in every single way. "the entropy of the universe increases during any spontaneous process", you were using a person as the system in this law, death would mean you have reached the upper limit of entropy and would mean nothing is possible after due to the fact that your energy is spread out evenly so it prevents any reactions from happening (as your consciousness is made up of energy which will fail to entropy when you are dead).

 

 

 

What will happen? Most likely your body will lose all of its energy and break back down in to the earth. But you already know that so why do you ask what will happen after death?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry to sound rather grim but thatÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s what our lives revolve around.

[ppGalleon]

No

[insane]

I'm currently reading The Case for a Creator by 'Lee Strobel'. He is a very successful journalist for the Chicago Tribune I believe; anyways, he goes around interviewing incredibly successful scientists (with credentials btw) on scientific proof for God and against evolution.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It turns out that about twenty years ago, atheism would be most supported by science, but more and more science is found to be proving theism most true.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's a very interesting read.

[Seiferoth]

 

 

 

What happens after death? Well it wonÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t be going to heaven because that breaks the second law of thermodynamics in every single way. "the entropy of the universe increases during any spontaneous process", you were using a person as the system in this law, death would mean you have reached the upper limit of entropy and would mean nothing is possible after due to the fact that your energy is spread out evenly so it prevents any reactions from happening (as your consciousness is made up of energy which will fail to entropy when you are dead).

 

 

 

What will happen? Most likely your body will lose all of its energy and break back down in to the earth. But you already know that so why do you ask what will happen after death?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry to sound rather grim but thatÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s what our lives revolve around.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-agrees with that random guy-

[insane]

 

 

 

 

What happens after death? Well it wonÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t be going to heaven because that breaks the second law of thermodynamics in every single way. "the entropy of the universe increases during any spontaneous process", you were using a person as the system in this law, death would mean you have reached the upper limit of entropy and would mean nothing is possible after due to the fact that your energy is spread out evenly so it prevents any reactions from happening (as your consciousness is made up of energy which will fail to entropy when you are dead).

 

 

 

What will happen? Most likely your body will lose all of its energy and break back down in to the earth. But you already know that so why do you ask what will happen after death?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry to sound rather grim but thatÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s what our lives revolve around.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-agrees with that random guy-

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wouldn't you think if God existed he would be able to get around physical laws?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also - if the matter + energy in the universe has always existed (which as to be true if God doesn't exist, because nothing can come from nothing), then that would be breaking Thermodynamic laws as well - one of them states that given enough time, all matter will break down into its smallest particles.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Surely eternity is a long enough time for it to break down if matter has always existed. I'm looking around and... guess what? It hasn't happened. This = violation of thermodynamic laws.

[HugATree]

Naw... I was going to take a couple of his/her responses first.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Basically it boils down to that without the existence of a God to set the moral standard - there is no moral standard.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Some may say that there's moral safety in numbers, but the Nazi's were a numerous people that believed exterminating Jews was morally correct, or a moral obligation.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What is your moral standard based on if there is no God to set it?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And the moral standard of a follower of God comes down to what your God tells you to do, this is why religious extremists can kill people without remose. It comes down to getting your seat in heaven.

[HugATree]

 

 

 

 

 

What happens after death? Well it wonÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t be going to heaven because that breaks the second law of thermodynamics in every single way. "the entropy of the universe increases during any spontaneous process", you were using a person as the system in this law, death would mean you have reached the upper limit of entropy and would mean nothing is possible after due to the fact that your energy is spread out evenly so it prevents any reactions from happening (as your consciousness is made up of energy which will fail to entropy when you are dead).

 

 

 

What will happen? Most likely your body will lose all of its energy and break back down in to the earth. But you already know that so why do you ask what will happen after death?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry to sound rather grim but thatÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s what our lives revolve around.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-agrees with that random guy-

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wouldn't you think if God existed he would be able to get around physical laws?

 

 

 

 

 

 

So can the tooth fairy, easter bunny and santa.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also - if the matter + energy in the universe has always existed (which as to be true if God doesn't exist, because nothing can come from nothing), then that would be breaking Thermodynamic laws as well - one of them states that given enough time, all matter will break down into its smallest particles.

 

 

 

 

 

 

And this is whats happening.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Surely eternity is a long enough time for it to break down if matter has always existed. I'm looking around and... guess what? It hasn't happened. This = violation of thermodynamic laws.

 

 

 

I don't think matter has been around for eternity, and matter is being recycled by using energy, it is happening unless in your world things don't decay.

[Smokie]

Hurray! Let me a be a radical fanaticist and say right now!!!!! :::

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There is a point where science and religion meet. On that day, everyone will believe. However, humans look for science for every answer, in the hope they can find the Truth behind everything which passes them today. Yet there is only one Truth. God.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Heheheheheheh. I do believe in God, and I hold strongly to my religion, yet I'm not Christian, so I do not believe that I should force other people to become part of my religion, (I know not all of the 20,000+ divisions of Christianity do this, sorry to the 19,998 that don't :wink:) and I don't slap science in the face by saying scientists are meddling with God's creation (for those of you unfamiliar with Christianity, the Catholic Church was, and my still is, a good example of this)...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But why should it matter, eh? I'm not Christian. In fact, I have mostly forsaken my religion altogether. I hold strongly to the belief that there is only one God, and people choose to see him (I won't capitalize it thank you :P) differently, and understand the Truth [read up on your Gandhi :wink:] in different ways (Quran, Bible, Vedas, Torah.. and all the distinctive religions).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That's my opinion. But, as humans, we WILL question, there is no doubt, and we WILL conceive our own answers, true or false only the future will tell. Just remember, there is a point when science and religion meet. When that day comes, all will realize.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Fanaticism all the way w00t w00t! :D

[Death_By_Pod]

 

 

 

 

 

What happens after death? Well it wonÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t be going to heaven because that breaks the second law of thermodynamics in every single way. "the entropy of the universe increases during any spontaneous process", you were using a person as the system in this law, death would mean you have reached the upper limit of entropy and would mean nothing is possible after due to the fact that your energy is spread out evenly so it prevents any reactions from happening (as your consciousness is made up of energy which will fail to entropy when you are dead).

 

 

 

What will happen? Most likely your body will lose all of its energy and break back down in to the earth. But you already know that so why do you ask what will happen after death?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry to sound rather grim but thatÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s what our lives revolve around.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-agrees with that random guy-

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wouldn't you think if God existed he would be able to get around physical laws?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also - if the matter + energy in the universe has always existed (which as to be true if God doesn't exist, because nothing can come from nothing), then that would be breaking Thermodynamic laws as well - one of them states that given enough time, all matter will break down into its smallest particles.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Surely eternity is a long enough time for it to break down if matter has always existed. I'm looking around and... guess what? It hasn't happened. This = violation of thermodynamic laws.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If god could get around physical laws then why has it not been made apparent to us? We have many things that record possible laws being broken and you thing that by some chance we would have accidentally picked up on it happening? If you want to become completely ignorant and say itÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s actions do not leave any physical impact in the universe then god will eventually kill us from a heat death (as godÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s interactions will increase the amount of energy in the universe [although godÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s actions itself may not be counted, as you said can bypass the laws]. He has to interact with the particles some how and when he does he increases the total energy of the universe eventually heating us up and killing everything).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Matter has only been in existence for billions of years not eternity. We can do many things to work this out (Age of elements, age of stars etc). The law is not broken as you know the sun is working (spreading out its energy across the universe), stars are dying and we radiate heat from our bodies.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You say that we came out of nothing, which for most people seems reasonable but as I said earlier we donÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t understand things in the macro-atomic and sub-atomic levels due to our way of perception. Decades ago physicists discouraged people from taking up the profession because they believed it to be a complete science (but as you know they were completely wrong) but now we are now learning things that we havenÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t thought imaginable. This was all done through more abstract thinking (Atom [quantum] theory would send most non-scientists crazy just at the thought). For all you know the universe could be a quantum fluctuation of the macro-atomic (one level above the universe) level. It is shown that quantum fluctuations occur in vacuums (where ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬ÅnothingÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâÃ

[Death_By_Pod]

 

 

 

There is a point where science and religion meet. On that day, everyone will believe. However, humans look for science for every answer, in the hope they can find the Truth behind everything which passes them today. Yet there is only one Truth. God.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hehe well there will always be people who will disbelief the truth no matter what is said. People just have the mindset of what they learn was the truth, and when the real truth comes out they automatically claim it as a lie (the real truth not= my truth) :lol:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I donÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t think this is a debate about ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬ÅgodÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâÃ

[BlueLancer]

Hurray! Let me a be a radical fanaticist and say right now!!!!! :::

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There is a point where science and religion meet. On that day, everyone will believe. However, humans look for science for every answer, in the hope they can find the Truth behind everything which passes them today. Yet there is only one Truth. God.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Heheheheheheh. I do believe in God, and I hold strongly to my religion, yet I'm not Christian, so I do not believe that I should force other people to become part of my religion, (I know not all of the 20,000+ divisions of Christianity do this, sorry to the 19,998 that don't :wink:) and I don't slap science in the face by saying scientists are meddling with God's creation (for those of you unfamiliar with Christianity, the Catholic Church was, and my still is, a good example of this)...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But why should it matter, eh? I'm not Christian. In fact, I have mostly forsaken my religion altogether. I hold strongly to the belief that there is only one God, and people choose to see him (I won't capitalize it thank you :P) differently, and understand the Truth [read up on your Gandhi :wink:] in different ways (Quran, Bible, Vedas, Torah.. and all the distinctive religions).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That's my opinion. But, as humans, we WILL question, there is no doubt, and we WILL conceive our own answers, true or false only the future will tell. Just remember, there is a point when science and religion meet. When that day comes, all will realize.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Fanaticism all the way w00t w00t! :D

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Awesome, that's exactly how I think. Good to see I'm not the only person to think that God isn't a barbaric cave-man that is angry if you don't please him and you'll be sent in a lake of fire if you don't. That being the highest form of intelligence in the whole universum? Umm, yeah..

[ppGalleon]

I think Death_By_Pod sums this up pretty well.

[Astralinre]

e[/b]ath_By_Pod"]

 

 

 

You say that we came out of nothing, which for most people seems reasonable but as I said earlier we donÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t understand things in the macro-atomic and sub-atomic levels due to our way of perception. Decades ago physicists discouraged people from taking up the profession because they believed it to be a complete science (but as you know they were completely wrong) but now we are now learning things that we havenÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t thought imaginable. This was all done through more abstract thinking (Atom [quantum] theory would send most non-scientists crazy just at the thought). For all you know the universe could be a quantum fluctuation of the macro-atomic (one level above the universe) level. It is shown that quantum fluctuations occur in vacuums (where ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬ÅnothingÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâÃ

[HugATree]

 

 

 

That said, I think this debate is coming to its close. I'll leave the debating to the rest of you, if you wish to continue, but remember that we can prove nothing of God; we can only have faith that He does or doesn't exist.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Astralinre

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you think thats the only choices, then you live in a small world.

[StyIez]

Yes.

[Quazerain]

to tell u the truth i don't really know if I believe in god/gods

[Smokie]

 

 

 

 

That said, I think this debate is coming to its close. I'll leave the debating to the rest of you, if you wish to continue, but remember that we can prove nothing of God; we can only have faith that He does or doesn't exist.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Astralinre

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you think thats the only choices, then you live in a small world.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

He seems to be very faith oriented, and from his grammar I'm going to have to assume he's Christian. I wouldn't say he lives in a small world, it's just that the point has been reached where this is more of a debate about the Christian faith (as someone previously said) and about the mutually agreed fact that humans are incapable of comprehending anything to a higher level.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What's been said has been said. Someone start up a new issue so we can debate more :P

[insane]

If matter has only been around for billions of years, where did it come from?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There is a problem with your 'quantum vacuum'. When most people think of a vacuum, they think of absoultely nothing. The problem is, a quantum vacuum is a sea of fluctuating energy - certainly not nothing.

 

 

 

So in a sense you're just pushing back the creation a bit, you still have to show how this quantum vacuum came out of nothing.

 

 

 

(Paraphrased from William Lane Craig, PhD, ThD)

[Multani]

If matter has only been around for billions of years, where did it come from?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The big bang. Based on my current understanding of the theories in play, there are two scientific explanations for the big bang. First, an infinite cycle of contraction and expansion in the universe, big bangs followed by big crunches, for an infinite amount of time. Of course, recent reasearch has shown that the universe is not only expanding, it is accelerating, which damages this first conjecture to say the least.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Second, if you can stomach string theory, there is a derivitive theory, membrane theory, or M-theory. To simplify greatly, there are string membranes existing in parallel with our own. If these membranes were moving in a wave form, and were to strike one another, a MASSIVE amount of energy would be transfered to the point of collision. This could easily have supplied the required amounts of energy, and by e=mc^2, matter, to initiate the big bang.

[Usara]

Its funny how its impossible to contest both sides since both are theories, thanks people, you all pushed me into a state where I dont believe in religion or science :D .

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Why guess at what you cannot see?

[insane]

 

If matter has only been around for billions of years, where did it come from?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The big bang. Based on my current understanding of the theories in play, there are two scientific explanations for the big bang. First, an infinite cycle of contraction and expansion in the universe, big bangs followed by big crunches, for an infinite amount of time. Of course, recent reasearch has shown that the universe is not only expanding, it is accelerating, which damages this first conjecture to say the least.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Second, if you can stomach string theory, there is a derivitive theory, membrane theory, or M-theory. To simplify greatly, there are string membranes existing in parallel with our own. If these membranes were moving in a wave form, and were to strike one another, a MASSIVE amount of energy would be transfered to the point of collision. This could easily have supplied the required amounts of energy, and by e=mc^2, matter, to initiate the big bang.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The string theory has pretty much zero physical proof. It's basically a theory created for the sole purpose of taking God out of the equation. So far, it's done a pretty crappy job.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

As for the Big Bang, it merely supports God's existence. I am quite familiar with it, I was writing as an expansion to an earlier argument I thought unfit to quote ;).