Global Warming

[assassin_696]

 

 

 

 

Naturally, there are certain issues that need to be looked at seriously. The deforestation of certain areas without replanting will only exasebate the situation. The research of alternative energy fuels is important for our sake as much as the planets. And making businesses and industry less polluting is probably good for the sake of our lungs as much as anything.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

the only problem with alternative energy is that it still has to come from somewhere. solar, wind and water are the only "pure" alternative energies, and of the above, none are reliable or abundant enough to provide a sufficent amount of energy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

electric, hydrogen, and other so called "alternative energies," are really just the same things as what we use now, just disguised so liberals can plant this idealistic image in the public's head. where do you think electricity comes from? you have to plug electric cars up to a power source, which is most likely a coal-burning power plant. hydrogen is almost nonexistent in its pure form, and takes a huge amount of energy to extract it from water. again, probably from a coal-burning plant. so maybe we can reduce our dependance on oil by this, but it would only increase coal dependance. ive done a lot of research on alternative energy, and i believe the safest, cleanest, and most effective could possibly be nuclear power. the only problem is packaging, because a minor error or mistake could be devastating to an entire country. but, if done right, and safely, nuclear energy makes a massive amount of power with relatively little waste. BUT, nuclear waste poses another problem.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

basically, any good alternative to the energy we have now is a LONG way and a LOT of money away.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I agree. Hydrogen fuels may emit water vapour only but that's the biggest greenhouse gas of them all. Electric cars really are pathetic. They go no way whatsoever towards solving dependency on fossil fuels yet people who drive them think they're eco-warriors.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Bio fuels are an interesting concept but the amount of crop space required to create a suitable amount would detract from food supplies. Perhaps if by genetically engineering plants we could make photosynthesis just 2% efficient instead of 1.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sadly, no one will ever want to see nuclear power used widespread. You can almost see why unless the safety and security is placed above all else, they really are risky things. Nuclear fusion could be interesting though, if ever developed.

[Kill_Thomas9]

Pfft. It's nothing special. Earth's been cooling and warming for billions of years.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In fact, I'm in the middle of the biggest Ice Storm I've ever been in.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Man's contribution to greenhouse gases is less than 5%. Volcanoes, cow farts, agricultural fields, etc will forever put out much more than we can.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That hole in the ozone layer's been there for thousands of years, too. It's actually smaller than the big CFC scare nowadays.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That 5% part isn't true.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The average household releases a couple hundred TONS of carbon dioxide every year.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Multiply that by several billion, and you have yourself much more than 5%.

[Barihawk]

 

Pfft. It's nothing special. Earth's been cooling and warming for billions of years.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In fact, I'm in the middle of the biggest Ice Storm I've ever been in.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Man's contribution to greenhouse gases is less than 5%. Volcanoes, cow farts, agricultural fields, etc will forever put out much more than we can.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That hole in the ozone layer's been there for thousands of years, too. It's actually smaller than the big CFC scare nowadays.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That 5% part isn't true.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The average household releases a couple hundred TONS of carbon dioxide every year.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Multiply that by several billion, and you have yourself much more than 5%.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The average household has enough foliage, vegetation, and grass to absorb most of the CO2 and convert it to oxygen. There are billions of trees, trillions of blades of grass and countless other plantlife that convert the CO2 to O2.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And your math doesn't even make SENSE.

[Clinic]

While it is true the greenhouse effect (global warming) has always been here, the amount of greenhouse gases has never been anywhere near as high as it is today. Humans consist the majority of the raise in this problem.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The huge population boom in only several generations is a large part of the reason why. More people means more recourses needed. More recourses needed means more recourses used. Forests get chopped down, by that happening we gain more CO2 because trees use CO2.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Forest fires, yes majority of forest fires (let me US as an example) are human caused, mostly accidental or indirectly. You see forest fires normally happen naturally to clear brush and logs and such out of the way (the flammable stuff), but humans don't do it. Yes, we do controlled burns but they often are not enough and in a lot of places the brush is bad enough that they would not be able to control the fire, or a house is nearby and they don't want to risk it. Seeing as such we have been having a lot of bad fires which in turn add more CO2.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Fossil fuels is another problem, maybe the most difficult to cure problem. You see alternatives each as someone has previously said also require energy to make. The thing Bush proposed (sorry I forgot what exactly it was, and no I'm not insulting Bush) about corn something doesn't really work. It requires us to use soil and materials to plant corn, then corn doesn't really replenish the nutrients in the soil so we have to use more things each time. Windmills have downsides too. Every time a windmill spins it creates a little vortex of air being sucked in and such. Every time this happens when birds fly by they get sucked and well, die. The problem with this issue is that there is no real clear solution on fossil fuels.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Moving on to water vapor. Water vapor is another of 4 greenhouse gases. Now we don't directly put most of the water vapor in the troposphere, but we do indirectly. You see by the CO2 alone warms the air, which in turn gets more water vapor. Warm air holds more water vapor then cold. More water vapor in the air, the more that goes up to the troposphere.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

CH4, we don't really do this one that much, it's as I've heard someone say "cows pooting" and such.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The fourth gas is once again, the tailpipe of your car.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wewt first post /flex :-w

[Bauke]

 

Pfft. It's nothing special. Earth's been cooling and warming for billions of years.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In fact, I'm in the middle of the biggest Ice Storm I've ever been in.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Man's contribution to greenhouse gases is less than 5%. Volcanoes, cow farts, agricultural fields, etc will forever put out much more than we can.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That hole in the ozone layer's been there for thousands of years, too. It's actually smaller than the big CFC scare nowadays.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That 5% part isn't true.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The average household releases a couple hundred TONS of carbon dioxide every year.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Multiply that by several billion, and you have yourself much more than 5%.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually it IS true. Man's contribution is very small compared to the total CO2 that's around. There's so many CO2 stored in the oceans, incredible amounts compared to what we exhaust in the air. But, researchers believe that the CO2 pools are very tied. A little desturbance causes large effects. In fact, if the pH values in the oceans changed only for a VERY tiny bit, it would be catastrophic.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Graphs show that a correlation between temperature and CO2 concentration isn't strange to think. Check this one:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you look closely, you see a rise in CO2 before a rise in temperature. Quite a bit of proof if you ask me.

[Rebdragon]

Global warming is real, but CO2 makes up like 300 out of a million of the particles in the air... we should be worrying about the magnetic flip, we're a bit overdue o_O.

[Clinic]

 

 

Pfft. It's nothing special. Earth's been cooling and warming for billions of years.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In fact, I'm in the middle of the biggest Ice Storm I've ever been in.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Man's contribution to greenhouse gases is less than 5%. Volcanoes, cow farts, agricultural fields, etc will forever put out much more than we can.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That hole in the ozone layer's been there for thousands of years, too. It's actually smaller than the big CFC scare nowadays.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That 5% part isn't true.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The average household releases a couple hundred TONS of carbon dioxide every year.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Multiply that by several billion, and you have yourself much more than 5%.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually it IS true. Man's contribution is very small compared to the total CO2 that's around. There's so many CO2 stored in the oceans, incredible amounts compared to what we exhaust in the air. But, researchers believe that the CO2 pools are very tied. A little desturbance causes large effects. In fact, if the pH values in the oceans changed only for a VERY tiny bit, it would be catastrophic.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Graphs show that a correlation between temperature and CO2 concentration isn't strange to think. Check this one:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you look closely, you see a rise in CO2 before a rise in temperature. Quite a bit of proof if you ask me.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you look at the amount of CO2 we have now, you'll notice that the over 200 cities in the USA having record breaking heat in 2006, or was it 2005 and stuff also goes with the CO2 shooting way up in the chart.

[warri0r45]

While it is true the greenhouse effect (global warming) has always been here, the amount of greenhouse gases has never been anywhere near as high as it is today. Humans consist the majority of the raise in this problem.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nature may contribute to greenhouse gas emissions the most, but I have one word for you; deforestation. With less trees on the planet now than there were 100 years ago, the balance has shifted and there are less O2 producers and CO2 absorbers, if you know wat I mean.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hydrogen fuels may emit water vapour only but that's the biggest greenhouse gas of them all.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I just thought i'd clear this up assassin. Hydrogen gas could only (on an industrial level) be derived from water. So if you get it from water and it ends up recombining with O2 to form water, there is no net increase. The sky also has a limit to how much water it can hold, if there is too much, it condenses and rains. In other words, it's not only incredibly clean, but the balance is kept intact, unlike the balance I referred to above.

[Bauke]

 

 

 

Pfft. It's nothing special. Earth's been cooling and warming for billions of years.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In fact, I'm in the middle of the biggest Ice Storm I've ever been in.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Man's contribution to greenhouse gases is less than 5%. Volcanoes, cow farts, agricultural fields, etc will forever put out much more than we can.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That hole in the ozone layer's been there for thousands of years, too. It's actually smaller than the big CFC scare nowadays.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That 5% part isn't true.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The average household releases a couple hundred TONS of carbon dioxide every year.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Multiply that by several billion, and you have yourself much more than 5%.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Actually it IS true. Man's contribution is very small compared to the total CO2 that's around. There's so many CO2 stored in the oceans, incredible amounts compared to what we exhaust in the air. But, researchers believe that the CO2 pools are very tied. A little desturbance causes large effects. In fact, if the pH values in the oceans changed only for a VERY tiny bit, it would be catastrophic.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Graphs show that a correlation between temperature and CO2 concentration isn't strange to think. Check this one:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you look closely, you see a rise in CO2 before a rise in temperature. Quite a bit of proof if you ask me.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you look at the amount of CO2 we have now, you'll notice that the over 200 cities in the USA having record breaking heat in 2006, or was it 2005 and stuff also goes with the CO2 shooting way up in the chart.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, well I didn't deny the effects of CO2, did I? It's proven that greenhouse gasses have something to do with heat, simply because of the way they act, absorbing heat and exhausting it again in all directions.

 

 

 

I just said that the overall effect of man isn't big, but the effects, on the other hand, ARE big.

[MrM2000]

so much liberalism...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

ok i'll tell you the truth,

 

 

 

conservatives have Christianity as their religon it has a few true facts that support it but most of it is faith.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

same goes for "Humans" effects on global warming...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

doesn't it seem egotistic that if something seems wrong "We" must of caused it and nothing else has any effect on it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

also i live in Massachusetts within 100 miles of 2 nuclear power plants and after reading

 

 

 

George Orwells Walk On The Beach i'm really scared :shock:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*In no way do i want to offend anyones religon*

[warri0r45]

 

 

 

also i live in Massachusetts within 100 miles of 2 nuclear power plants and after reading

 

 

 

George Orwells Walk On The Beach i'm really scared :shock:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

These days you shouldn't be worried. The amount of stringency, policy and procedures in place makes nuclear power immensely more safe than in 1986 (the year of the Chernobyl disaster). And just for clarification, I haven't read that book, so my reply is based on an assumption that your concerned for your safety.

[MrM2000]

It's a pretty good book... You should read it

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

also it was published in 1957.... :oops: so maybe some of the facts are off

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

but radiation sickness seems really horible... :ohnoes:

[axeraider70]

(@ this topic)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You mean the whole "Instead of 7 degress Celcius, it's 9?", i think we'll live.

[Barihawk]

While some areas are getting warmer, others are getting colder.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Texas is having record breaking cold spells this year.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

While I believe in a long term warming shift (with an equal cooling shift), I think we can safely say it's not snowing in New York because of El Nino.

[axeraider70]

Which is why it should be called Climate Change. Then again it's still freezing over here in january... so... global cooling? lawl.

[baron8000]

No. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milankovitch_cycles

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Give that man a cookie for bringing up Milankovitch =D> just studied the whole topic in Geography Advanced Level so will be back with a rant in the morning

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Until then on a side note - the electric car - NOT green - where do you think the electricity comes from? In the majority of cases its gas/coal or fossil fuel of some form.

[Barihawk]

 

No. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milankovitch_cycles

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Give that man a cookie for bringing up Milankovitch =D> just studied the whole topic in Geography Advanced Level so will be back with a rant in the morning

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Until then on a side note - the electric car - NOT green - where do you think the electricity comes from? In the majority of cases its gas/coal or fossil fuel of some form.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

They can be rigged to run off of solar power. In addition, in hybrid vehicles the batteries are completely recharged by the heat from the brakes.

[toast647]

Global warming is happening.

 

 

 

Save the penguins!

[Screechingmu]

Which is why it should be called Climate Change. Then again it's still freezing over here in january... so... global cooling? lawl.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I agree with you there, the warming of the water changes the currents in the oceans, causing a shift in precipitation and climate. Which in turn causes warming in some areas and cooling in others.

[pompey_spud]

 

 

 

 

Naturally, there are certain issues that need to be looked at seriously. The deforestation of certain areas without replanting will only exasebate the situation. The research of alternative energy fuels is important for our sake as much as the planets. And making businesses and industry less polluting is probably good for the sake of our lungs as much as anything.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

the only problem with alternative energy is that it still has to come from somewhere. solar, wind and water are the only "pure" alternative energies, and of the above, none are reliable or abundant enough to provide a sufficent amount of energy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

electric, hydrogen, and other so called "alternative energies," are really just the same things as what we use now, just disguised so liberals can plant this idealistic image in the public's head. where do you think electricity comes from? you have to plug electric cars up to a power source, which is most likely a coal-burning power plant. hydrogen is almost nonexistent in its pure form, and takes a huge amount of energy to extract it from water. again, probably from a coal-burning plant. so maybe we can reduce our dependance on oil by this, but it would only increase coal dependance. ive done a lot of research on alternative energy, and i believe the safest, cleanest, and most effective could possibly be nuclear power. the only problem is packaging, because a minor error or mistake could be devastating to an entire country. but, if done right, and safely, nuclear energy makes a massive amount of power with relatively little waste. BUT, nuclear waste poses another problem.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

basically, any good alternative to the energy we have now is a LONG way and a LOT of money away.

 

 

 

Wewt. Ive actually just done a project about renewable energy in Physics. Each pair in my class covered a different type. Me and my mate did solar so i have a bucket load of Solar statistics for you...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

With many jurisdictions now giving tax and rebate incentives, solar electric power can now pay for itself in five to ten years in many places.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The 122 petawatts of sunlight reaching the earth's surface is plentiful compared to the 13 terawatts of average power consumed by humans. Additionally, solar electric generation has the highest power density (global mean of 170 W/m2) among renewable energies.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The amount of solar energy intercepted by the Earth every minute is greater than the amount of energy the world uses in fossil fuels each year.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The energy in the winds that blow across the United States each year could produce more than 16 billion GJ of electricityÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Ã

[Harrington]

The Global Warming "Myth" is just a media spin.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

A recent poll of just under 1000 scientific papers showed that ALL of them, 100% concluded that global warming was definately real.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

A poll of media sources (including newspapers, websites and TV), showed that 53% of all media reports suggest that global warming isn't real.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I believe the scientists. I'm also disgusted at the media for deliberately misleading us just so they can sell a few extra papers and for clearly taking large "donations" from various groups who stand to make loses if we begin tackling our environmental problems.

[pompey_spud]

I disagree Harrington.

 

 

 

From my experience, the Media's spin on the whole thing is that we are destroying the world daily and that we must stop using ANYTHING carbon related NOW or else we'll all drown in horrible ways.

 

 

 

On the contrary, most scientists appear to agree with Me, Bari, and a few others. Sure global warming is happening, but its completely natural, and the 5% of the CO2 in the air we directely put out is a minimal cause of the greenhouse effect. Its gonna happen anyway, so why get all frenzied about it, scaring people into forking out tonnes for (currently) expensive alternative energies.

[baron8000]

 

 

No. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milankovitch_cycles

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Give that man a cookie for bringing up Milankovitch =D> just studied the whole topic in Geography Advanced Level so will be back with a rant in the morning

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Until then on a side note - the electric car - NOT green - where do you think the electricity comes from? In the majority of cases its gas/coal or fossil fuel of some form.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

They can be rigged to run off of solar power. In addition, in hybrid vehicles the batteries are completely recharged by the heat from the brakes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

They can indeed, if they ever will is another matter entirely. Solar panels are unfortunately only 10% efficient - if they were truly efficient then yes problem solved, but until that time we are still in trouble.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Right now onto the other global warming theories.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Milankovitich effect - the so called "wobble" in the earths axis that may create a variation in surface temperature

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ice-Albedo effect - The increase in temperature may, ironically, knock us into an ice age. The gulf stream may stop causing a (short term hopefully) increase in ice coverings, the reflective capacity of ice being higher, more heat is reflected, thus the temperature lowers still, thus more ice - continuing into a positive feedback mechanism.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now a few anti climate change pieces of evidence - The temperature HAS been substantially higher than it is today - we know this through the examination of polar ice cores. Different temperatures create a different oxygen isotope in the atmosphere ranging from low (oxygen ^16) to high (oxygen^18) (apologies if figures are wrong this is all from memory) this atmosphere is frozen as bubbles in ice cores dating back millions of years - so we have proof its been higher.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The worrying fact is, if we look at the swing of temperature from high to low and back again, we are kind of due an ice age - but we don't have it yet.... possibly due to global warming, possibly not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is of course irrelevant, the world is warming be it due to CO2 or not, and we need to prepare for it. This combined with the inevitable running out of fossil fuels...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Personally, I feel the best solution we have at the moment is Nuclear power, renewable energy is unreliable - people can argue its getting better but if it was it would have been implemented - it simply isn't cost effective. Nuclear power can provide cheap(ish) energy with a much lower risk - don't believe the Chernobyl scare stories people.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The only problem being the waste...

[pompey_spud]

 

 

 

Ice-Albedo effect - The increase in temperature may, ironically, knock us into an ice age. The gulf stream may stop causing a (short term hopefully) increase in ice coverings, the reflective capacity of ice being higher, more heat is reflected, thus the temperature lowers still, thus more ice - continuing into a positive feedback mechanism.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now a few anti climate change pieces of evidence - The temperature HAS been substantially higher than it is today - we know this through the examination of polar ice cores. Different temperatures create a different oxygen isotope in the atmosphere ranging from low (oxygen ^16) to high (oxygen^18) (apologies if figures are wrong this is all from memory) this atmosphere is frozen as bubbles in ice cores dating back millions of years - so we have proof its been higher.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The worrying fact is, if we look at the swing of temperature from high to low and back again, we are kind of due an ice age - but we don't have it yet.... possibly due to global warming, possibly not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm sorry, but this is one of the most annoying things about this subject. We are in an ice age now. It is coming to an end. Sure the temperatiure has risen in the last few hundred years, but that doesn't mean we're not in an ice age. We have Polar ice caps : therefore we are in an ice age.

[Agunimon979]

I disagree Harrington.

 

 

 

From my experience, the Media's spin on the whole thing is that we are destroying the world daily and that we must stop using ANYTHING carbon related NOW or else we'll all drown in horrible ways.

 

 

 

On the contrary, most scientists appear to agree with Me, Bari, and a few others. Sure global warming is happening, but its completely natural, and the 5% of the CO2 in the air we directely put out is a minimal cause of the greenhouse effect. Its gonna happen anyway, so why get all frenzied about it, scaring people into forking out tonnes for (currently) expensive alternative energies.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You're right.

 

 

 

Scientists fail to mention in 'studies show' that Global warming is

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1. Natural

 

 

 

2. If its destined to happen, it will, no use trying to stop it. You can slow it down, but that would be useless.

 

 

 

3. Global warming isn't happening already? What exactly do scientists mean by global warming happening? We might think it means that the earth would dry up, but is this true. Could anything happen in the next 40 years? . What makes scientists different from the rest of us? The fact that they can dig into snow? Everyone has a different voice, and arguing about it and trying to stop it will just stall it longer.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dont get me wrong for saying dont stop it. You can try to slow it down. But what do scientists really mean about 'global warming happening'?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Alright, look.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Noone knows how old the earth is. Let's just go back as far as 1 AD. A year after christ's death.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now, from then, there has been 2006 years. In that years, what happened? Cities have burned. Tropical marshes have started appearing, adding tremendous amounts of C02 to the air. Now let's go to 40 years. What could happen? Could we make a renewable energy source? We have, it's solar energy. Scientists fail to mention when fossil fuels are 'destined' to run out at the 'rate' they're going at. If we could install solar energy panels, as said before, it could drastically reduce greenhouse gasses. But, what about now? What's happening now? Forget about the future, what's happening now? Solar panels are being installed. Fossil fuel rates are going down. Not alot, actually barely, but going down. As we all now, smoke, a greenhouse gas, contains, ehh, greenhouse gasses, as smoke is the incomplete burning of a fuel. If we add solar panels, smoke containing CO2 would stop entering the atmosphere at such large rates. But what about us? Companies wouldnt get this because they would get paid less. Complicated problem, eh?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Best to do is let the official scientists figure this out, the ones that don't say "We're all going to die in 40 years. Let's install solar panels."