Tip.It Times Presents: The Good, The Bad and the...

[mrmookie]

This intense kind of whinery is really starting to irritate me with Runescape. Every time there is a rule change that irritates somebody - they whine, they never quit, but they moan constantly. I really think that people need to realise that Jagex is a private company, nothing more, with absolutely no obligation whatsoever to their customers other than providing the services they say they will provide.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Remeber that Terms and Conditions you clicked past so quickly whilst signing up? That was the one that told you that Runescape and your account is the property of Jagex and they can make any change they like, whenever they like - It is very much Jagex's baby and will always remain so - to think that they will ever change is foolish.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The comment about bandwidth, onec again it is Jagex's bandwidth, they can do whatever they like with it, and if they feel that it is being misused they are entirely within their rights to change how it is used - i.e. the banning of stat sigs - whilst simultaneously having no obligation to provide an alternative, it was not part of what Jagex said they would provide and as such they can ban it at any time.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

"1) Jagex is trying to have too much control. I see nothing wrong with SwiftSwitch". This is again wrong, Jagex has and always will have complete control, there may be nothing wrong with SwiftSwitch in your eyes true, but there is something wrong with it in Jagex's and its their opinion that matters.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well if there is somthing wrong in their eyes why dont they tell us so we can change and make compramises?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The forums - has nothing to do with the bill of rights, the freedom of speech acts or the Human rights acts - all these state is that nobody can stop you sayin it yourself - Jagex is only stopping you using its privately owned forums for it - a perfectly legal right.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

while this is true we should still be able to communicate with eachother our feelings

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It is very much in vogue at the moment it seems to slander Jagex, this is wrong, that is wrong, all helped by the annonymity of the internet and in some cases I believe a need to look big or rebellious, how many of the complainers stop playing RS? How many actually stop playing as a result? Very few. These issues are evidently not enough to stop people paying for RS so it is a simple case of like it, or lump it - that is the nature of capitilism, business and tertiary industry - if you dont like it, get out, or stop moaning - if RS ever stopped being fun or interesting for me (due to updates or other) I would stop paying; its the only power you have, get used to it.

[mrmookie]

I agree with most points in this article, so good job :P

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I just have to say that new players only stay new for a short time, but experienced players stay experienced...also most players are experienced so it makes no sence to target the new comers.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

About the World switchers....although i love being able to go straight to my world without the annoying "detail select" and "pick a world" i can see why Jagex doesn't like Worldswitchers.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

he is totaly willing to make everything legal aslong as JaGeX will tell him so (maybe go through some ads or somthing), how can he fix somthing if he doesnt know its wrong?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Although swiftswitch and other popular world switchers have an added featre that disallows you to go straight to world 2 when its full, not all switchers have this. meaning if you are not using a switcher its very very difficult for other players to get in using the conventanal world select page. Thus giving an "unfair" advantage to certain players.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Strider removed this when he was asked/told.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Rambles~

[nikoli40]

Pretty good article, I enjoyed it =p

[goosey134]

i wouldn't be surpried if even part of this article is pulle, though i completly agree with whats being said

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And whats with all these dang quests, they can't update a skill somehow so they go right ahead and make 200000 freakin more useless quests where you gain 1k an 1k theiving experience , goody gum drops thanks jagex rewarding me 1k xp and 1k gp after spending 1 and a half hours and fight swarms of people to do this quest! no wonder this game is of such high quality

[D. V. Devnull]

And whats with all these dang quests, they can't update a skill somehow so they go right ahead and make 200000 freakin more useless quests where you gain 1k an 1k theiving experience , goody gum drops thanks jagex rewarding me 1k xp and 1k gp after spending 1 and a half hours and fight swarms of people to do this quest! no wonder this game is of such high quality

 

 

 

You've pointed out something very nicely here. Quality is degrading in part because of the fact that more cheap and small things are being put in, and old issues are not being cleaned up first. It really is looking like Jagex wishes to ignore the problems, even though they say otherwise. :?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Like I said before, and it is time to say it again...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think RS will die before they fix their mistakes! :cry:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Personally, I don't like this possibility, but this is what it is looking like. :(

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Mr. Devnull

[goosey134]

"Instead of cooperating with the fansites and third-party developers, Jagex has once again apparently decided to go it alone.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I have no idea what's behind these rule changes, but I think there's some wrong-headed thinking going on at Jagex Towers. I suspect they saw the loss in revenue caused by the bandwidth demand of the dynamic sig servers, and the potential loss in revenue caused by third-party users not clicking on all the advertising-bearing pages and came up with a "solution" that covered all the bases."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I just want to say 2 things:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1: OMG YOU ARE WHINING THAT JAGEX DOESN'T WANT TO COLLABORATE WITH YOU AGAIN!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

and

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2:Jagex needs to make money just like any other company, they probably do make a lot more by forcing you to click on pages with advertisements to switch worlds, but what would you rather they do? up the cost of membership? you have to realise they only pull in 5 bucks a month from maybe a million people TOPS. Look at WoW they pull in 25 bucks a month from 7 million people....You have no buisness sense whatso-ever

 

 

 

This , this is funny, ok. Do you have ANY idea the kind of money that the smallest add may or may not bring in? Heres an idea for you, for 1 commercial gatoraid paid crosby 90 MILLION DOLLARS thats right 90 mill for that cheesy fruity 5 second appearence when he throws his stick on the great big pile of sticks runescape adds wouldn't bring in that much but still.

 

 

 

And there a gaint difference between runescape and WoW for instance Wows graphics don't suck runescape do, WoW qualtity game runescape , sure isn't that high a quality... If they charged 15$ to play runescape i would litterally laugh my rear end off ...right before i clicked the exit button .

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Look at WoWs expences , look at runescapes...in the same ballpark? you better beleive not. 2 hugely different games you can't compare them

[dan2012]

hmm... seems like there's a few rants going on here - i read the first page, can't be bothered with the other 5 cuz it seems people are arguing a lot, so apologies if any of this has been said already.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

i enjoyed the article and i do agree with the points being made. i myself had put in a request to jagex with the in-game forums a while back mentioning a few annoying conversations that were not really needed, i can't remember them now but the one that sticks in my mind is Ned in Draynor. I completed Dragon Slayer about 2 years ago, yet my character still asks him about Crandor and how he tied two turtles together using the hair off his back to escape from the island after his ship was marooned. all i wanted was to buy some rope of him... a right-click option would be much appreciated.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

and in regards to the various rants (and i notice someone compared RS to WoW) - at the end of the day, it's only a game. you don't have to play it, if you feel it's becoming too boring and censored, play something else. i have played both WoW and RS and i think WoW is over-rated for the price you pay per month, i did a free month trial and got bored after a week, but that's just me.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

for ÃÆââ¬Å¡Ãâã3.20 a month can we really complain? i guess so if there's enough of us, but as long as the money keeps coming in then they're not bothered. i just get on with my levels and enjoy myself, leave all the corporate dealings to Jagex, i'll still burn my logs and cut my trees as normal, whether they put out more updates or not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

EDIT: small useless quests are still fun, plus Jagex use them to open up more quests in the future - look at Mort'ton for example, small little quests eventually elading to bigger and better things. they know what they're doing.

[mattpkranger]

That wasn't a bad article, maybe it could've done with a bit more literary articulation, but it sparked debate and that, in my mind, is its primary function.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What I am miffed about however, is that Did you know... about Shantay Pass and Port Sarim. That was my ace-in-the-hole for impressing people!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That actually quite a nifty little trick, little known among free players because of the fact that few of us (them now) actually bother to go to Shantay more than once, simply because there is nothing to do there!

[Makoto_the_Phoenix]

It was an okay article, but I'd have preferred more research on the Dynamic Signature clause.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In their current state, they are indeed illegal, but most dynamic signature makers are working on legal revisions to them. I believe that Draynor's working on a new version of theirs and RuneWeb recently pulled theirs off the site until they're compliant. I don't think a ban of these dynamic signatures when they are compliant would help, since they are one of the few ways that fansites can attract others to their site, but that's my opinion.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

While a lot of the other things that have been said in this article -- the game seems to be aimed at younger players -- may be true, evidence is only subjective there. What you may believe is good for the younger or inexperienced players, you may or may not know that a select handful of higher leveled players are benefiting from.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's still an okay article.

[Duke_Kaleb]

I agree with Jagex on their stance on wilderness luring. A warning pops up on the screen and it automatically stops you from following someone when you are to close to the wilderness. So technically you will always know about the wilderness and its' dangers.

[zander459]

What I take to be one of the themes of The Editor's article is that Jagex has its priorities wrong with respect to updates and changes to the game. (The Editor says: "Maybe I'm just being a grumpy old you-know-what right now, but it seems to me that for every improvement in the game, we're getting at least as many ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¹Ãâdis-improvements.ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢ Perhaps I need to find myself a game which functions as intended, because I can't see Jagex moving away from their current course.")

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I couldnÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t agree more.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jagex seems to believe that people leave Runescape more out of BOREDOM than out of FRUSTRATION. Said another way, Jagex believes that it will keep people interested in the game by rapidly introducing new quests, new sets of clothing, new treasure trail items, etc., and it conversely believes that it should place a lower priority on updating the actual gameplay engine and features, because failure to update the gameplay engine leads to relatively less attrition than failure to ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬Åkeep people interestedÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâÃ

[SoR38TRIGGER]

well if you dont like to play because of that pick a new RPG game, i suggest oblivion or something -.-

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[D. V. Devnull]

well if you dont like to play because of that pick a new RPG game, i suggest oblivion or something -.-

 

 

 

And what exactly are you trying to do? Get rid of RS players? :x

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Remember, under most cases, "One less RS player = One less Tip.It Forum user" ... :? ... I therefore have to assume that you are attempting to destroy this place as well, which I personally am intolerant of. ...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

***DV smashes SoR38TRIGGER straight into the floor with the side of a Rune Scimitar...***

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Mr. Devnull

[Makoto_the_Phoenix]

 

 

 

I think the answer is that ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Ãâ per the recent article in the Wall Street Journal ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Ãâ Jagex is very focused on the 10-15 year old market, and has started to see Runescape as more of a chat vehicle for pre-teens, with gameplay being secondary, than a real MMORPG where the gameplay is the central focus. Therefore, IÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢m afraid that these issues arenÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t even on anyoneÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s agenda at Jagex to fix, which is a shame. As good as Runescape is, it could be much better and could attract a much larger paying audience.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Since when did you acquire Jagex's agenda? I really wish people wouldn't be so pessimistic about certain things when it comes to game updates...

[zander459]

I don't pretent to have Jagex's agenda, but did you read the Wall Street Journal Article? It should give you some insight as to what Jagex has in mind.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And, when its been years and basic game flaws have still not been fixed, I don't think it is being "pessimistic" to point this out. At the worst, its being "realistic."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The several people who have said above that various posters who have issues with the way the game works and is being updated (including, I presume, The Editor of Tip.It) should "find another game to play" aren't adding anything meaningful to the discussion. I think everyone is aware that we always have an option to switch games - I know that numerous high level and longtime players on my friends list are aware of this option, since I have lost them to other games in the last year. I would have preferred to keep these friends, but they got frustrated and quit, for some of the reasons I stated above.

[goretint]

First, I wont restate the already good, well thought out point on both sides. It's nice to see an intelligent disagreement for once. (You know who you are).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

As an "Old-School" gamer, coming from games like Warcraft2Battle.net, where the focus was on skill, and other online and offline RPG's that required some actual thought, the last year in Runescape has been disappointment after disappointment.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'll use my "main" as an example. Two years ago when i started playing this game, I saw, early on, a level 100 in Edgeville while mining coal. I was very impressed at the time and have since then made it a major goal to get to 100 combat while also training the skills I need to support that goal (fishing, cooking, herblore etc..) I recently hit 100 combat, and I didn't even bother messaging the people on my list about it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What does that have to do with anything? Simply this: the Game, as it stands now requires little skill or thought. It doesn't even require much time. I've been called a noob because it took me 2 years to get 100 combat and my almost flat 80's is seen as a joke (one more defence and 5 range to go) by players who have spent 2 months at pest control and have triple digit combat levels but very low totals and no knowledge of the game. Add to that the many updates making it easier/less time consuming to train or acquire materials(new thieving mini game and tower of life for Ex.) and it's obvious the focus of Jagex is lazy younger players.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The problem is, making a game for players that young does not create loyalty to the game. I would be willing to risk that as much as they have seen an increase in new members, they have seen a fairly balanced decrease. Young kids get bored and leave. If they aren't challenged and can attain high levels immediately they will soon leave. And, frankly, the dumbing down/removing risk/ hand-holding/"family friendly" approach makes stupid, ignorant players with no respect for each other.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jagex may not be obligated to listen to their players, but without the players (and happy, loyal players most importantly) they don't exist. Period. I'm finding it harder to defend this Game that I've put so much time into to people who tell me that other games are far better.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

One last random point.. I agree with the gameplay issue. As much as I like to see updates, if Jagex said on their main page that for the next month or two there would be no updates because they were doing a massive overhaul of the game engine/coding and re-evaluating the rules I would stand and applaud instead of complaining. I'll leave that to the 10 year olds.

[D. V. Devnull]

goretint, you have pointed out a :? true-but-funny :lol: thing... Those 10-year-olds would complain over a lack of updates, and when they complained, they would reveal who they are. :P ...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I wonder, just how many accounts would Jagex have to ban and delete because there are people under age 13 using them? :-k ... Anyone have an estimate?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Mr. Devnull

[jimjimson]

Last year I was 14 and I complained when lunar diplomacy came out. That doesn't mean I was 10. Don't jump to conclusions so fast.

[zander459]

A stable world is a happy world, and all the updates, coupled with the whipsawing on the various rules, have given Runescape an air of instability. (ThereÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s a new quest out today, by the way. Enjoy!)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I would certainly support a slowing down of the introduction of new quest, items and minigames in favor of Jagex allocating resources to fixing old issues. After all, itÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s hard for me to pat Jagex on the back for constantly introducing new things to the game when they havenÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t yet fixed very basic gameplay issues that have existed for years. In addition to the things discussed above, I find myself wondering things like:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1. When I hit someone with ice barrage, and it obviously and visibly turns them into an ice cube, why are they sometimes able to keep running or walking toward me like some angry ice cube of death? I mean, are they frozen or not? They sure look frozen, so why is the game acting like my spell splashed? You can see examples of this all over the web in videos. What gives?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2. When I am fighting some monsters (Moss Giants, for example), and standing several blocks away from the visible reach of their clubs, why do I get ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬ÅhitÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâÃ

[D. V. Devnull]

Even further on that matter, I personally think that the younger ones should appreciate the older ones, allow more room for us older ones, and not constantly force us older ones to "bend and give in" to the younger ones. Trust me on this, us older ones are envious of the younger ones' energy and such, but the younger ones need to understand that we older ones find "instant gratification" to be a hollow and meaningless thing. We like some 'meat' in our storylines. Compressing whole quests into a 20 square by 20 square location is not us older ones' idea of a "good quest". We older ones like something where we have to wander a nice distance and learn the landscape. We know the younger ones all have shorter attention spans, but they will only develop longer ones if they're pinned with situations that require it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Excuse me now while I take a rest from the constant 'disambiguations' and 'generalizations'... It makes my head spin. :( ... (They need to add some more emotes to the forum options, too. I can't find my emote this time! ...)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Mr. Devnull

[goretint]

Last year I was 14 and I complained when lunar diplomacy came out. That doesn't mean I was 10. Don't jump to conclusions so fast.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

My final comment, "I'll leave that to the 10 year olds" wasn't meant to be taken literally. It's common in editorial style comments to end with a "parting shot", a bit of humor that reflects the general idea of the body of the comment. It wasn't a generalization, saying that all 10 year olds complain and all complainers are 10 year olds. Think of it as a reflection on the general consensus of the posts that it's 10 year olds who are the problem. :wink:

[whodey]

I have decided that RS players are in general the whiniest people on earth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The game is jagex's to develop. With the ever increasing numbers of subscribers, it is clear that they are succeeding in attracting and keeping ever larger numbers of players. They are never going to keep 100% of players happy. Many of the minor rants in this thread never bother me. (For example, those complaing about start up music - doesn't your comuter have a mute button?)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The fact that they want to enforce a rule about not wasting jagex's bandwidth is a problem for some of you? That is outrageous. Anyone who wants to set up a mirror server and pay for all the bandwidth to host the sig files is more than welcome to. Unless you want to pay for it yourself, what gives you the right to complain that someone else doens't want to.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Remember people, Jagex is made up of people. People who's jobs and families depend on Jagex making money. Jagex has an obligation to provide for those people first.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Some of your arguments are like saying "I don't understand why Coca-Cola doesn't give all people who drink Coke free Coke, then people would like it more."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's a business people. If you don't like it, don't play. I have been playing now for only about 15 months, and every day, there are new challenges for me. If I get bored with it, I'll stop playing, and stop paying.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Frankly, I am amazed at the overall quality and features in a game that is available to play for free, and the p2p version for $5 a month is truly a wonder. Stop complaining about trivial little items.

[zander459]

I don't see how anyone on this thread has been "whiney."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If I've been going to a restaurant I like for years, but they have failed to maintain the place appropriately and are now using stained tablecloths, broken plates and bent silverware, but instead have been spending their money putting new and expensive art on the wall, I don't think it would be "whiney" to suggest to them that they have their priorities wrong. To me, I would hope that the restaurant would find some constructive criticism preferable to their customers just writing the restaurant off and never going again. I think this is one point The Editor was trying to make in the article.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Your attitude is essentially pessimistic. Under your theory, there are just two options: accept things as they are, or quit. There is, of course, a third option, which is to speak up and make suggestions that could improve our lot as players. Of course, a private business may do as it pleases, but smart businesses listen to their customers.

[Ginger_Warrior]

Whodey... there's so many flaws in that argument.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You're right, more people are joining up to RS everyday. Unfortunetely for Jagex, the rate at which people are leaving is also rising, and it's not just that. Organised protests are starting to occur. There was one today, in World 69, organised on the Official RS forums, about SS. This is an MMORPG for Christ's sake, not real life! Have you ever heard of a protest on an online RPG game? Go to the rants forum - there's fury there, not whining!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Secondly, you're right. Jagex doesn't have to listen to us. In the same way that Next doesn't have to know what clothing trends are "in", in the same way that HMV doesn't have to monitor what kind of music is "hot", and in the same way Nintendo doesn't have to pay attention to what its target audience wants. But can you imagine if they didn't? They'd be dead within a few years... if Jagex wants to avoid a similar fate, then they have to start paying attention to what the majority of players want!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There is huge confrontation of interests in terms of what low-levels want (more, easy updates) and what older players want (less, high-quality and difficult updates). Jagex is siding with the low-levels, yet it still has a 13+ age limit. People are under the impression this game is for older people, yet Jagex make updates aimed at 10 year olds, and not enough of them to keep the low-levels happy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So far Jagex is entirely succeeding in alienating near enough everyone against them, and if it doesn't make its mind up soon, the protests of the future will make The Editor look like a nursary nurse for writing this article.

[King_Peter18]

Ah..this argument is really really stupid.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Your right, JaGeX can do what ever they please with Runescape. Which would you rather have, players that don't voice their opinions when an update comes out with (Kiddie show character name here) and just quit because of it? Or players that have constructive critisism and rant about it and suggest a fix.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Us here do not just say "It Stinks I didn't like it, fix it. " We say "It Stinks and I didn't like it, but you could do it like this."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The latter is what we are doing. We aren't sitting here talking with our fingers just pointlessly saying this is not good JaGeX you figure out a way to fix it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

We do that, they just don't listen. I stopped posting rants because I might as well just try to scream through sound proof glass. Point being, JaGeX has not listened to us, neither do I see them ever going to listen to us. The only way they will change anything is if Andrew Or Paul catch wind of it. The rest is a buerocratic mess. Its easy to figure out.