Nifflin

I would wear Proselyte Top and Verac's Skirt as your top and bottom, Glory, Dragon Defender, Berserker Ring, and Fire Cape/Obsidian Cape/Skill Cape. that except fire/SW/ardy 3 capes Oops, forgot about the SW and Ardougne 3 Cape. Considering prayer bonus has diminishing returns while strength bonus does not, you are better off with: Soul wars cape, fighters torso, veracs skirt.

Inventory isn't as important as having someone take you down and do a run or two with you to show you the lures and what to do in different situations and bless you if you happen to die. The inventory will come with time, the skills need to be learned however before you can do tds effectivly. Here is my setup + inventory though. Setup: Void range helm Elite Void Top Elite Void Bottom Snakeskin Boots Fury Unholy book Void Gloves Ring of Life ( as you're starting out, once you get the hang of it go for imbued dragonstone or archers) Soul Wars Cape Rune Crossbow (Chaotic if you have) 500 Rune bolts (note, if you have a void shield it is better to use that and barrows gloves, then unholy book and void gloves) (note number two, I tend to want to emphasize range bonus over melee bonus as I feel that I spend more time ranging them and it is slower) Inventory: Void Melee Helm Darklight Whip (or if you have, a chaotic, not sure which is best for this though) Spec weapon (more about this below) Unicorn pouch 300 unicorn scrolls Super Restore Overloads x4 Sara Brew x6 (decrease this as you get better, starting off you will take more damage) Sapphire lantern (make a boatload of these one day then just drop them when you get down there for drops) Rest prayer potions Now about your spec weapon, you can take EEE, claws, dragon hally or Korsais. Generally you should have enough healing from your unicorn + brews so EEE isn't needed. Claws only help when they are vulnerable to melee and easier to damage anyways, hally is just a cheaper claws, and Korsais is cool because if you manage to spec high enough, the TD will swap to mage pray and give you another round attacking with melee. It's up to you, I would take EEE as you're starting off and once you get better at prayer swapping move to hally or Korsais. I personally use Korsais but I know that claws probably give faster kills.

-95 Prayer -96 Summoning -85 Dungoneering -90+ Slayer -99 Fishing -90+ Smithing -90+ Magic -99 Attack -99 Strength This will get me to 130+ combat too. Also if the new boss releases the new best slayer gear I'll be wanting that. If they are good, new drops could change my goals substantially. Seems like a lot but I'm getting pretty close to most of these goals.

There were no fictionals this week...which one are you referring to? For the second article: your logic is sound and I agree with your points, but I'd rather developer time was spent developing new content instead of rewriting content most people are done with at level 90. No matter how blatant it is, my vote would always be to move on. I read the first article, saw the title of the second and quickly replied and went for some yummy tea. I'm reading it now, sorry for the miscommunication.

For the economic roller coaster article, it seems a bit redundant. If someone was interested in it they would clearly know most of what you told them for themselves, if they don't then chances are they aren't interested and reading it won't benefit them. Even the second to last paragraph, the only actual analysis of the entire article, was shallow and obvious. I love the Times but articles like that really annoy me to no end. The second article is good, I agree that Camelot doesn't fit. Romeo and Juliet never threw me off and I like how they made a sort of parody of it at times, however the Camelot storyline is from a time when Runescape was different. That being said and though an update would be welcome, there are so many unfinished storylines in the game, I would prefer to see developer time go into finishing off all quests and areas (elves) rather then refurbishing existing content.

Or, things could get more expensive in 3 months and you end out losing money. Plus if he doesnt have ovls/turm he'd need them for efficient frost dragon killing. So I don't really believe just hoarding money is the efficient thing. Well then you clearly lack basic math skills, I did some basic graphs of flipping profits, just to try and find the formula that me and Zaaps1 were looking for, once you start flipping with 600m+ you are looking at 12m profit per flip with a 2% increase each flip. If you keep spending money on skills as you get it you will ultimately take longer. The real profits don't come from doing frost drags, they come from the flipping towards the end. For it to work however, you need to be patient enough to hold on to all your money until the end otherwise it's just going to take longer. Things may get more expensive but by the time he has 930m he will be making 19m every flip cycle which means he will be able to catch up to any price increases within a day or two. This is all assuming only making 2% per flip, good flippers make 4-5%. In that case at 930m he would make 38m every flip cycle. Your method would mean he could never get there because he would be constantly spending money on skills and making less then a million each flip cycle. Really, your method would take longer no matter how you try and spin it. Also, I accounted for the fact that he has neither overloads nor extremes in my calculations, that's why frost dragons are 3m/h in my calculations. Realistically they could be even higher for him. The key is to have a yak which I believe he has. Most of the kills are from the cannon anyways. My three month estimate is very conservative, with good flipping it could be done in two months. While I'd agree that he should put off other buyables, really, im not suggesting 99 Herby AND Pray right off the bat. He should get 95 Prayer and 91 Herblore and stop training them until he has a huge influx of cash. And also I love how you instantly assume that ALL flips will be successful absolutely always. At least the 3.5m gp/hr at DK's is 100% certain, with flipping you could make an epic fail or an update could come that wtfpwns your cash pile. Also, once you get up to the really high initial investments, GE limits come into play. It's one thing to insult me and say your way is 100% better, but TBFH I haven't flipped a thing in my life and I have all my buyables all but done. I would be careful giving merching advice. You could end up screwing up the person more than they are. Yes, hence why I was very conservative in my estimates, good flippers make up to 4% each flip, the statistics I gave him were assuming only 2% each flip. This allows for him to fail some flips and allows for a learning curve. Just because you have all your buyables done doesn't make your advice better, my advice will have them all done much quicker which is what I'm guessing OP is looking for. With flipping there are epic fails and wtfpwn update profits. But what really rakes in the cash is consistantly flipping twice a day for around 2-4%. It's easy and doable. Since you admit you have no experience with it then there isn't any reason for you to criticize. It's not hard, it took me about a week or two to figure it out, learn to read GE graphs, learn about the different items, ect. Honestly I explained before that I added a margin for error in my estimations, it's up to you to read my posts and comprehend that.

Stock up on law staffs.

I would advise not to worry about 95 prayer, and to only get 87 herblore as you can boost with a greensman (m) and do the logging trick to make enough potions for slaying.

I STILL have? That's not much time in my opinion, lol. Out of the things you suggested, what I have left to obtain are the extremes, the rapier, and the turmoil :o. Quit a bit of gp I'll have to spend. I think I can afford it, though. Extremes are relatively cheap, and they will speed up slayer a lot. The difference between peity and turmoil isn't as bit as the one between supers and extremes.

What are your slayer and summoning levels? How far are you from a yak? I'm awfully sorry. You made this post as I was typing my other one. You can look me up. My username is "Brink". I am 93 slayer and 83 summoning. How about while you get 85 dugoneering you farm herbs and flip to make enough for extremes, then keep slaying until you have enough for 96 summoning. By that time if you keep flipping you should be getting along very well and frost dragons will supplement your income nicely.

What are your slayer and summoning levels? How far are you from a yak?

Or, things could get more expensive in 3 months and you end out losing money. Plus if he doesnt have ovls/turm he'd need them for efficient frost dragon killing. So I don't really believe just hoarding money is the efficient thing. Well then you clearly lack basic math skills, I did some basic graphs of flipping profits, just to try and find the formula that me and Zaaps1 were looking for, once you start flipping with 600m+ you are looking at 12m profit per flip with a 2% increase each flip. If you keep spending money on skills as you get it you will ultimately take longer. The real profits don't come from doing frost drags, they come from the flipping towards the end. For it to work however, you need to be patient enough to hold on to all your money until the end otherwise it's just going to take longer. Things may get more expensive but by the time he has 930m he will be making 19m every flip cycle which means he will be able to catch up to any price increases within a day or two. This is all assuming only making 2% per flip, good flippers make 4-5%. In that case at 930m he would make 38m every flip cycle. Your method would mean he could never get there because he would be constantly spending money on skills and making less then a million each flip cycle. Really, your method would take longer no matter how you try and spin it. Also, I accounted for the fact that he has neither overloads nor extremes in my calculations, that's why frost dragons are 3m/h in my calculations. Realistically they could be even higher for him. The key is to have a yak which I believe he has. Most of the kills are from the cannon anyways. My three month estimate is very conservative, with good flipping it could be done in two months.

If you want the flipping method to work, the key is to get all the cash in one go. Because of that, IHasChicken's advice wouldn't work with my method. Especially when he says to always do herblore. Since flipping is a percentage increase in cash, the bigger your cashpile the faster it will go. If you take breaks from flipping and spend what you make then it will take much longer then three months to make the money, not counting the break time.

http://services.runescape.com/m=itemdb_rs/results.ws?query=gold&price=all&members= The first few items should give you some ideas. As a note, what you're suggesting is very inefficient, however if you feel compelled to waste time (and money) crafting your gold bars, then according to the prices in that link gold bracelets profit the most.

It's more effective for one person to keep track of it all. Also in a good team the strategy favors having a centralized keyer. This is due to gating and how it vastly speeds up a floor.

DFS is useless especially considering you have access to super anti fires. I thought you decided on fury, tassets and berserker. What happened to that, it sounded good.

I think I can give you a ballpark estimate that if you flip twice daily for 2% profits each time and make 6m doing frost dragons also daily, getting the money your looking for won't take more then three months playing three hours per day. This is assuming you are starting from zero cash. The trick is that since the flipping profits are exponential to always keep enough money to flip and not actually spend it on skills until you have enough for all of your skills. This is very much an estimation as me and Zaaps1 (mostly Zaaps1 actually) have yet to find a formula for this. But really, yea it's doable, you just need to persevere and have patience with the flipping.

No randoms in the GDW dungeon, it's pretty fun to go down there with one of every god item and watch teams fight while alching. It's a different type of scenic. Also, deamonehiem in the waiting area is random free and calm on a lot of worlds. Just my experience, I use soul wars because it is easy to do farm runs.

Like RSW44 said, there are 13 confirmed drops. Even if each one has a 1/250 drop rate, isn't that the same as 1/20 chance to get an item? That's really high even if it's like 2 kills per hour. No, that's a 1/250 chance to get ONE of the thirteen items. Just because there are more items to get as drops doesn't increase or decrease the rarity of them. But it increases the likelihood of getting A drop on any given kill.

Charms get lootshared though, and they're untradeable. I'm looking forward to the quest and the wolf. I'll kill him many times before the end of the month to stockpile some gloves. Thats what I was thinking too, while everyone is focused on this Zaros boss I want to stockpile as many gloves as I can for slayer. The dwarf quest looks fun too, I hope it has some nice requirements. Remember the first quest of the year last year? They tend to like starting off with a bang. Making this untradeable would be a double edged sword. After everyone had gotten all the items and placeholders for the the boss would be empty. It's better to encourage competition, it's part of what boss hunting is all about. Lower levels win too because now they can go to bandos while the maxed players move on.

That's just you, the rest of us call them Kree, Krill, Graar and Zil. Shorter and more accurate. kthnxbai, next please?

Well I do have a formula that's more accurate now, but you're not going to like it. Here it goes: Assuming a=your initial cashpile, b=percent profit from flipping (1.02 if you want to keep to the previous example), c=profit per cycle (outside of flipping, to keep it simple, lets say from 2 hours of frost drags), n=number of cycles you're looking at. ab^n + cb^(n-1) + cb^(n-2) + cb^(n-3) ... + cb^(n-n) I believe this takes into account that you will not use your first frost dragon profit to flip, as well. So for example, if we work in the millions, a=1 (1m initial money), b=1.02, c=6 (6m profit per flip). Now if we take n=4: (1)(1.02)^4 + (6)(1.02)^3 + (6)(1.02)^2 + (6)(1.02)^1 + (6)(1.02)^0 = 25.8 (25.8m total cashpile at the end). Note that last term simplifies down to just +6, because you get the profit from those 2 hours of frost dragons, but not from flipping it. As you can see, this formula gets crazy tedious with a lot of cycles. So how do you find n if given the end profit then? This shows the end profit if you know the number of cycles you plan on doing but in terms of knowing how long it would take to in OPs case, get 930m, can it help? Still, very interesting and saving none the less, I'll for sure use this if I ever need to plan out any long term moneymaking. Hmm, to my knowledge, I don't actually think there is a way outside of guessing and checking. Perhaps there's a way to simplify the equation I gave down that I just don't know about. If there is, you could probably go off that. I guess you could do it inaccurately to get a ballpark value, then plug in from there. Once school get's back in session I'll go to my trig teacher about this. Thanks for your help though, it's really interesting. I feel a bit bad for hijacking this guys thread.

Well I do have a formula that's more accurate now, but you're not going to like it. Here it goes: Assuming a=your initial cashpile, b=percent profit from flipping (1.02 if you want to keep to the previous example), c=profit per cycle (outside of flipping, to keep it simple, lets say from 2 hours of frost drags), n=number of cycles you're looking at. ab^n + cb^(n-1) + cb^(n-2) + cb^(n-3) ... + cb^(n-n) I believe this takes into account that you will not use your first frost dragon profit to flip, as well. So for example, if we work in the millions, a=1 (1m initial money), b=1.02, c=6 (6m profit per flip). Now if we take n=4: (1)(1.02)^4 + (6)(1.02)^3 + (6)(1.02)^2 + (6)(1.02)^1 + (6)(1.02)^0 = 25.8 (25.8m total cashpile at the end). Note that last term simplifies down to just +6, because you get the profit from those 2 hours of frost dragons, but not from flipping it. As you can see, this formula gets crazy tedious with a lot of cycles. So how do you find n if given the end profit then? This shows the end profit if you know the number of cycles you plan on doing but in terms of knowing how long it would take to in OPs case, get 930m, can it help? Still, very interesting and saving none the less, I'll for sure use this if I ever need to plan out any long term moneymaking.

My friend, efficiency takes into account time, gp, and experience. Tell that to all the well known efficiency guide makers where efficiency is purely classed as the fastest xp possible; which is a valid point since being efficient is about being fast, not necessarily cost effective. It is very, very different then that. Efficiency is always cost effective, usually being cost effective means being fast, but not always. The thing is being efficient vary's from person to person, it is a balance between your maximum income, the exp/hour of a method and the cost of a method. If you really want to understand this please, please PM me sometime and I would love to take the time to explain it. I don't want to derail this thread too badly. The biggest efficiency guide maker is Grimy Bunyip, once you understand his spreadsheets you will understand what it means to be efficient. On topic: The best way to make cash is through flipping and doing moneymakers, if you make 2% of your cash pile per day, which is low, as well as do frost dragons for 2 hours, which bring in about 6m, again a low estimate, I believe the formula for your money gains over time are as follows: y = 6x times 1.02^x Edit: realized my formula is wrong, anyone care to help me with a correct one? I suck at math. :???::( The important thing is not to moneymake then spend then moneymake and spend, but to make all the money you will ever need then to spend it all. This way the compounding factor from flipping will help cut down on a boatload of time. I'll give the formula a shot. Assumptions: You use the money you get at Frost Dragons in your flipping. You can hold a consistent profit flipping. Also, the first flip you do, you will not use profits from frost dragons (since you haven't killed them yet!) to buy your initial items, but I am going to assume this is negligible over the long run. Basic exponential growth equation would be ab^t. a is your initial cashpile, b is the percent increase, t is the number of times you flip AND kill 2 hours of frosts. So I'm not 100% sure if this is accurate, but it makes sense to me: (a+600000)(1.02)^t. Now if you kill 2 hours of frosts and get in 1 flip per day, you can sub t to be the number of days you will be doing this. a is still your initial cashpile. Of course, this does not take in farming or MTK into account. But going off the above assumption of t=1 day, if you can calculate your average profit of farming, MTK, etc on a PER DAY basis, you could add it to the (a+6000000) quantity. And obviously, if you can do better than 2% flips per day, change the 1.02 quantity. Thanks a bunch, that is exactly what I was looking for. What happens to it if you flip twice a day? Your calculator murders you. :P Honestly speaking, I have no idea. I guess it depends on whether or not you keep the pace with Frost Dragons each time you flip. So if each time you flip, you kill 2 hours of frosts, you could simply have t = 1/2 day, in other words, take the amount of days you plan on doing this and just double the number. Then if you want to add farming + MTK into the mix, you'd have to calculate how much you make on average from each between your flips. This gets difficult with MTK, however, which is why the below scenario is probably more accurate. If you're willing to sacrifice accuracy for ease, however, you can go ahead and just halve the MTK profit/day value and throw that in. Otherwise, you would probably have to break it down into separate instances. So calculate normally, then switch to just a(1.02), then switch back and keep doing that. EDIT: Hold on, I just realized if you plug in numbers into the original equation, it doesn't work out. Try a= 100000 and t=4 and you'll see what I mean. I'll think about it and post back. Sounds cool, I want to save this in my calculator so I can tell people like this OP exactly how long it will take them to get the money they desire.

I want to remind everyone how they said that damage soaking was going to change the defense skill or something to blow it all out of proportion, I doubt this armour will be represent a break from the status quo unless it's strength bonus surpasses that of Bandos amour or new things are released which require health over 99. It's like how Bandos is better for slayer then Torags even though Torags gives more survivabillity. I'll wait to see if there is a strength bonus before going nuts. Also, before you say it will have a strength bonus because it would be stupid if it didn't, lets remember this is Jagex we are taking about. We waited years for the dragon plate only for it to be ornamental. Edit: Perhaps the market changes for Bandos versus Torva will resemble what happened when Bandos came out and replaced Barrows. Barrows didn't crash too hard in the long run, did it?