TheAncient

how restricted are the topic assignments? i.e. how much freedom do we get in picking what to write?

i would estimate 30 at best

not always, sometimes good pker's just feel trollish and kill people for fun lol anyway i like the idea of totally dangerous wildy. there's nothing in rs that is threatening anymore and i like that there might be a place where i can actually die and lose things. makes the wildy feel more adventurous. i think jagex will relocate most of the skiller-related things outside the wild well enough.

Yeah this can be true for a lot of PKers but i don't think it's fair to disregard the large legitimate pkers (and stakers but that's a whole other story) back in the day. clans actually meant something

this really depends on if your keyer is good at maintaining GGS location at relevant locations imo also i think pro dgers are very reluctant to accept any form of skilling, when in fact there's quite a few skills which you can do near-lossless

I agree with this, but it really depends on the person... certain people go beyond a level of acceptable ignorance and most people don't. but like you said, i intended for this post really to only be for people who like fast dungs. I agree - that's why I wanted to see if there's room for this, even in "pro dg'ers" speed mentality. which there is, i think. being able to tank and destroy a merc more or less solo cause you're strongpotted and have an extra prayer pot is really nice. it's a good feeling. who doesn't like hitting 600+? i just think there are better ways to getting these abilities as fast as possibile without sacrificing the overall smoothness of the dungeon. But just to bring up an example - to REALLY help out your team, don't food hog! So many people wait around for a monster to die just so that they can loot the food after it dies. this doesn't make sense if you don't need food. if you're not keying, and have an armor plate, you really only need like 2 food at any given time. heck, i even do fine in some monos without food cause i soulsplit flick. if you don't have a plate, 4-5 food should do. leave food on the ground for your teammates after a monser dies. this saves you time because you can directly kill other monsters without having to wait for the death animation - being efficient - and saves your teammates from dying - being relaxed.

It's really not stressful - it IS fun - when dungs are going well and everyone knows what they're supposed to do. I don't even DG for a reason - i have no DG target, i have all the chaotics i really need/want - but I still do it anyway for fun. Running sub 20 minute floors or soloing a boss etc. or otherwise being good in a dung is probably the most fun skilling you can have.

I can empathize with this. It's really that with certain people there comes a point where discussion is pretty futile - taking the time to reason it out with these people is often unproductive. so it's become habit just to disregard these people. often, reasonable posters that deserve a thorough explanation get brushed off in this manner. As with bossy dg leaders, yes - they're not very well liked, but at the end of the day it's the most direct way of letting people know whether or not their DG strategies work or not. i am a pretty bossy keyer on w148 because people don't listen to me; if they do listen, i wouldn't be mean to them. it's not a very good leadership style but dg is not the type of environment that allows for gentle coaxing. yeah, this sums it up well once you play with a good team and good keyers you come to expect a certain amount of effort and RESPONSIVENESS on everyone's part, and it's really frustrating when this doesn't happen.

i mean still, if a nonkeyer can solo and find a few denks to save the keyer like 20 seconds it's more than worth it. let alone gate a new branching path so that the keyer doesn't have to gate it and bring ggs there himself. You're talking about w117 and yet saying this? I once did this.. And had to talk to the keyer to drop his ggs (instead of key, I knew there was like 1/4th dungeon behind the door) for at least 3 minutes.... Never going to do that again. Besides fishing takes what? 1 second a fish? That's faster food than any other method. i havent been on 117 in forever, i guess more 148 fishing is at least 5-6 seconds a fish if you account for cooking and fishing time properly doing gd's prevents a lot of damage for other teammates, speeds up the floor, gives you lots of food from drops, lets food drops be distributed evenly so there's less waste... list goes on. doing gd's well is a positive feedback loop - you do gd's well, so you get less damage and get more food so you can do more gd's well, etc etc. doing gd's poorly makes you get more damage and less food so you can't do as many gd's.

i mean still, if a nonkeyer can solo and find a few denks to save the keyer like 20 seconds it's more than worth it. let alone gate a new branching path so that the keyer doesn't have to gate it and bring ggs there himself. probably true but what's the hurt in trying :P discussion is healthy

it really depends. i can understand your line of reasoning, but experience says otherwise. but in cases where there's a lot of skill doors you can do, or if you're at a gd which you're specialized against (e.g. you have csb and there's a lot of warriors, or you have hex and there's a lot of mages), it's definitely worth it to solo. or if you're near a denk there's no point in bringing the whole team over to you just so that you can reach a dead end and then have to tele back. also in 90% of cases on w117/148 people run out of food when soloing because they fail at praying, stand around, or don't use gatestones properly. in addition 100+ dgers usually have plate, in which case you basically don't need food for 80% of rooms. teamwork is basically nonexistent in dg if you don't already know the existing methodology (i.e. listening to keyer>running keys/paths you have gated>soloing specialized puzzles>GD's>gating and exploring doors>skilling etc)... on 148/117 you're with randoms every time so it's hard to establish any real rapport or team strategy; everyone is doing their own thing.

lol. 45min+ dungs ftw, i guess? anyway yeah, lol at the skilling suggested so far... Sseli, did you honestly expect to get innovative ideas from people on this forum whom you haven't already consulted? well yeah, i only talk to my perm team about dg lol. there are a lot of good dg'ers here, why not consult them? if there's any way to make dging more optimal than it's worth talking about it. idk, i'd do this but with a farm patch (i still think cooking/fishing is a waste); but smithing the bars is SO slow so i don't think it's worth it. plus it's much better to use patches that you're already at (in GD's) than have to HT every time wat

lol. 45min+ dungs ftw, i guess? anyway yeah, lol at the skilling suggested so far...

Skilling has always been looked down upon by pro dungeoneers. In general, skilling slows down a team by slowing down response times to GD's. This causes teammates to waste prayer and food, possibly die, and slows down the time it takes to finish a GD. One huge reason why W148 and W117 are so slow is because when everyone runs out of food, people just stand around and do basically nothing for fear of death. A lot of the rewards from skilling - mainly food - can come from drops from GD monsters. This is why fishing and cooking are almost never worth the time. However, there is still room for skilling during a dungeon, albeit a very small role. In the first ~10 minutes of a floor, if there's only one way to go and it's not a GD (i.e. a slow puzzle door or something) and your gate is free, this leaves a golden opportunity for a few seconds of skilling. Once the floor becomes more complicated, time is MUCH better spent gating other doors and helping the keyer. So, I raise question 1: What skills do you think are worth doing, in these brief moments of skilling time? My perm team and I talked about this and we agreed on the following: Making cosmics/laws if you're out of them > Mining/making ragers > (making melee pots/farming, hunting/crafting armor IF you have a hex, looting coin piles / thieving chests for altar money) >NOTHING else is worth doing, except maybe like fishing if there's like ABSOLUTELY nothing to do. Question 2: How can you optimize skilling so that it takes the least time possible? GD's take a much higher priority than any skilling, so if there are any outsanding GD's whatever skilling you're doing should be dropped ASAP so that you can go to the GD. This is problematic because skilling often takes time, and it's annoying to be interrupted in the middle of skilling. Therefore, if you are to skill, you will have to optimize it such that you can minimize these interruptions. One important way to speed up skilling processes is to gate skilling locations. Early on when everything is close to home, there is less of a need for members of the team to gate doors for the keyer. In these cases, gates are better placed mainly at home teleport. This allows you access to all of the skilling materials at base much quicker, since home teleport takes at least 5 seconds to fully activate, and you must be out of combat. Gates can also be placed at farming patches or ore. Let's take for example farming and potionmaking. There are a lot of ways this system can be optimized. For one, if there are any water runes at the start table, they can be picked up. Along with astrals and a fire staff (which anyone with a CSB should have), you can use these to cast humidify, filling all water filled vials. AFAIK this takes at most 2 game ticks for all vials at once, which is MUCH faster than the 4-5 game ticks per vial at the water source at home. The smuggler should also be gated immediately after making cosmics. This way, any additional money (~13K) found after the first 1-2 GD's can immediately be used to buy a lycopus potion, 2 vials, 2-3 claws, and 1 red moss. If you are low on laws/cosmics, gating HT also lets you make more law/cosmics with any additional ess you find in the first few GD's. Once a GD is found with a farming patch, the lycopus should be planted right as the GD starts so that it'll be finished growing as you are done with the GD. Then, in the 2-3 seconds of downtime between GD's, strong melees and unf lycs can be made. Unf winter's grips should also be made, if you pick up any. This way, if any pot doors come up (in particular, gatherer's, naturalists, or artisan; survivalist requires whiskey which you can also pick up), the relevant pot can basically be instantly made. In addition, you'll have 1 strong melee for yourself and hopefully 1-2 you can share with teammates (one unf lycopus should always be kept in the inventory in case of a skill door). I've had moderate success with this method. It takes a lot of discipline not to skill during GD's, though. But I've very consistently been getting berserker whenever I do this, suggesting the time investment may be worth it. I also get berserker a lot normally though so it's hard to say. It's really nice though that any skill door is basically not a problem for teams I'm on since I can make the pot in 2-3 seconds when it takes someone else at least 30 seconds.

After 375 Dks with nothing but an archer ring, I think this is a nice christmas reward :)

bandits are verygood xp for low attention if you want fastest possible xp you can consider armoured zombies but idk if you can do them at your stats

selection bias; you are more likely to pay attention to people who spam voted. the vast majority of people who voted in the first poll probably only voted once, with a smaller proportion of people voting a lot of times

i think it would be fair to say that prayer prices are dictated a large amount by dag bone and frost bone drops as well 95/92 prayer is like 50x as useful as bandos. bandos is nice, but VERY overrated. it might crash for a few days but in the long run i see its price being stable. most likely the update will lead to deflation but we can only speculate. my advice would be to start saving and training for prayer now. the advantage in waiting for deflation to occur is marginal.

a reasonably fun and profitable way of training is to train through slayer. if you really want combat levels fast, i'd advise doing bandits because you can basically last forever there and need to pay little attention. at some pt get 85 dg and do frost dragons for money

you could get EEKS if you wanted but yeah youre at the point where you can start using toks for recharge :)

like i said, if you have a lot of food drops or if you can SS a lot you might get into situations where during the duration of one brew you've healed close to 120 LP, which might be true at dk's. i.e. one brew both heals me 64 LP and lasts me long enough so that i can gain an additional 60 LP via SS or food drops. hard to say though but div will definitely be better for pvp, bandos, arma. worse than defender for td's lol

solo rex is another alternative but youll get crashed a lot ive gotten like... near 10m xp there i'd say

yes definitely. makes a HUGE difference for killrate sorry for misquoting :S also on div/ely: div is basically 15% prayer points for additional 12.5% damage red so if you can pack more than ~120 hp/slot ely is better <--- this is true when a lot of your hp comes from ss or if you get lots of food drops (dks mostly)

Isn't farseer useless after you have arcane? As well as Eagle eye to the spectral in almost all situations? I honestly disagree with your shield rankings. I'd put it at CKS>EEKS>FKS eeks>spec in rangevmage cks>eeks>spec in rangevrange spec>eeks in arma spec>eeks if you melee arc>fks but in general a mage-boosting shield is better than the other two if you have like 150m randomly to throw away though, go for arc/spec. but since dg tokens are so easy to get i prefer fks/eeks idk, for shields it really depends on your playstyle unlike weapons where rapier is just... useful everywhere. cks>fks>eeks makes sense for the average bandos/MH/slayer type, but fks>cks>eeks for pvpers