green9090

You're also going to need antipoison.

I think the other part of the problem he was talking about was the fact that the GE doesn't update often enough on incorrectly priced items (see: rares, ely/divine spirit shields).

We've already established that dhide won't help. I was speaking hypothetically, because it definitely is not as hard as he was implying to survive with lowish defense at frosts if you're good.

Construction: buy zombie impling jars, open them. Sell back tradable contents. Take long and curved bones to that guy in dorgesh khan. VERY fast, very expensive construction exp. That's the only non-obvious skill buying I can think of. Others are fairly straightforward. Burn magic logs. Smith addy plates. Plant magic/palm trees. Make overloads. Etc.

As I've said over and over, I know that your main suggestion is to add (undefined) items that can be bought with non GP stuff. This is okay except that it's not really a suggestion because it's SO vague. There's nothing to say. Think of some items and we can have something to talk about. Since you clearly don't know a damn thing about junk trading, I don't know what makes you so qualified to discount the commonly accepted way to solve junk trading once and for all. Go learn simple economics, particularly pertaining to artificial prices (like in the context of government mandated price floors/ceilings) and see how it works out in real life. Then come back and tell me that simple economic concepts don't explain EXACTLY why the GE is failing right now and that fixing it to update faster wouldn't solve everything. If you're completely ignorant of everything about the subject, what the hell makes you think you're qualified to judge anything?

Dude, you're like the stereotypical boss that doesn't understand how his company works but likes to pretend he does. "I want new currencies to fix the rare market, but I don't know how. Somebody figure it out." "That's impossible." "U HAV UR HEAD UP UR ASS </RAGEQUIT>" It doesn't count as a suggestion if you only think of the half that takes no effort or thought and then tell everyone else to fill in the details. You can tell me I have my head up my ass all I want, but YOU are the one making random claims that you can't back up. I can explain exactly why fixing the GE to update more than once every 3 months (seriously, look at the 180 day graph on divine spirit shields. 3. Goddamn. Months.) would fix the market. See, what happens is, Jagex puts in whatever the hell price they feel like when an item comes out. Then, people realize the price is invariably bogus and either offer min or max constantly until the price reaches something stable. The only problem is, divine spirit shields have always been and continue to be extremely sought after items, with people willing to pay over 1 billion coins for one. The GE price being around half that, there's no way anybody wants to trade them there. Since the GE price is perpetually stuck, nobody has any way to buy a divine except by trading with other items with horribly broken prices on the GE to make it somewhat even. There. See what I did? I proposed a solution to a problem, and then I used facts and logic to support my assertion that my idea will actually solve the problem. That is how suggesting things works.

My head is fully wrapped around your very brief suggestion to add more items to buy with tokkull, trading sticks, etc. It's a valid suggestion that is neither interesting nor specific enough to discuss at all. What my head is NOT wrapped around is how you STILL think you can sit here claiming that your idea has a chance at fixing junk trading like this is some sort of selling point, when you yourself apparently have no concept of how that portion of the economy even WORKS. This. Stop it. No, there is not a chance, because trading sticks are completely unrelated to the rares market. As long as you keep pretending it might be, you are not dropping the subject and it's ridiculous to expect that everyone else will.

Looking over your points... you do realize that different currencies with different rewards already exist, right? How is this anything new? Your suggestion is not "add different currencies to the game," it's "make more items to buy with obscure currencies." To which I would say, okay. Kind of a vague suggestion, but I have no problem with that if that really is all you're suggesting. It still will have absolutely nothing to do with rares, so I'm confused why you still seem to think that could be affected at all. I bring that up again because you still haven't admitted that your idea has nothing at all to do with the rares market.

Yes, I'm sure the only thing Jagex cares about when spending money on producing content is making sure that it won't affect the game negatively or positively. Nice, neutral content.

Here's what's happening here. We're pressing you for potential uses for this concept and you're giving us nothing. You don't get to make the claim that new currency MIGHT stop junk trading unless you have some clue how that might happen. I can claim that making imps drop godswords every kill will help the economy, but that doesn't mean nobody is going to call me crazy. Here's my challenge- provide a clear example of how your idea could benefit the game. Right now I've seen absolutely nothing but vague hand waving.

Okay, seriously, if you're not going to provide any sort of explanation for how you plan for this to replace/augment junk trading, stop bringing it up. So far we've got "makes buying things from shops different." As far as it relates to trading between players, nobody would ever do that. You'd trade GP for the other currency for a set exchange rate when you need to use it to buy something off a shop, and that'd be that. No point confusing a trade for a party hat with a bunch of trading sticks that just trade on the exchange anyway. Edit: chuckling at this idea that making 18m is hard.

So, dungeoneering tokens and tokkull? Or am I missing a detail?

Not to be rude, but Jagex's record of telling the truth is much, MUCH lower than solid data's record of telling the truth. The consistency in damage per ball differences in the linked thread is pretty compelling if not conclusive. For a very recent example of Jagex not being trustworthy: they banned a ton of innocent people for abusing a dungeoneering bug, assured the forums that only clearly guilty people are EVER banned, they carefully review bans, etc. A week later, oops, it was a flaw in our auto detect system and we just went ahead and banned tons of players without noticing. So yeah, don't believe anything a gold background tells you unless you have other good reasons to believe it.

I didn't mean remove them from the game, I meant remove them from the discussion because you didn't seem to want to be responsible for this idea dealing with them. Which is fair enough, because it can't. My question, then, is... what WILL it do? In your first post, the only advertised benefit you posted for adding tiered currency is, correct me if I'm wrong, "No longer would players NECESSARILY have to deal with pumpkins and lower rares to purchase higher rares." No other part of the post predicts any sort of specific benefit whatsoever, it's all "but I think different tiered currency could actually help this game a lot," and "coins and currency in general could have and maintain a lot more uses." What help? What uses? In short, I'm curious what the idea actually is.

Okay, so let's take out all those high end low key parts of the market. No rares, no spirit shields, no ultra rare TT items. Wait, what defunct market?

Problem is, it's not that GP is too easy to obtain. Well, I mean, that's PART of the problem. The problem is twofold: -GP is easy enough to obtain that people are willing to pay obscene amounts of it for rares. -The GE is too stupid to let people pay obscene amounts of GP for rares. But see, if we make a new currency and go "you can now trade in 10 GPs for a GP+," then people will still not be able to pay as many GP+ as people are willing to pay for rares. The only way it would work is a situation like GP+ costing 10gp but still only being 1gp GE value, letting people offer more value per GE price and thus balancing rare trades more easily. That would require Jagex either completely falling asleep at the wheel or intentionally opening the door WIDE, WIDE open for RWT, though, so I'm thinking no. Simplest fix is to let the GE do its damn job and update more than once every 3 months on high end items.

I'm not sure I understand correctly, but it seems as though you'd like some form of tiered currency to replace the whole trading rares and risings for other rares and risings thing? How would this work? The reason the rare market exists at all is the stupid, pathetic, worthless price adjustment system for the GE that Jagex refuses to correct, making items worth hundreds of millions less than people are willing to pay (and other "junk" items having the opposite problem of unrealistically high GE prices). Introducing a shiny new kind of money that's directly related to normal gp wouldn't do a thing to stop that. How would the currencies work in a way that wouldn't make them treated just like the money we use now? The idea of having to buy certain items with multiple currencies is interesting. I wouldn't mind if it were implemented well.

No, I don't think there's anywhere in game NOW where that would be a useful tradeoff. It's an interesting thought experiment though, and something to keep in mind in future updates if/when we get another mass cannonable monster like frost dragons without such a distinct stab weakness.

Interesting. Does this mean that a cannon is more accurate with, say, a chaotic maul or longsword simply because of the higher base stats? The cannon presumably wouldn't need to take weapon speed into account, so slower weapons with higher stats would result in higher damage output. On a side note, Soul split flashing basically amounts to invincibility for a monster as weak as frost dragons. It'd be a little more annoying, but for a significant boost in damage per cannonball it could be worth it.

Here is a very interesting study on the effects of ranged bonus on cannon accuracy. With such marked results, I'm wondering if this warrants a rethink of gear when using a cannon. I don't have time for a frost dragon trip right now, but I think next time I go I might ditch my Bandos and wear dragonhide, see if that makes any difference. The cannon does seem to hit a hell of a lot of 0s in my full on melee gear. So what do you guys think? Will this make ranged gear worth it while cannoning for slayer or frost dragons? To what extent (ie: archer's (i) over zerker (i), or just a dhide top and tank gear)? Any experience to share? Anyone with a better understanding of the math behind the combat system want to take a shot at explaining this mathematically?

Making high level the new mid level and then making content for it doesn't count as high level content. That counts as castrating the game and making everyone with the patience to get a real 99 quit.

What I want to see is more untradable skill content. Mine an untradable ore and use it with smithing to offer upgrades to high end armor like dragon and Bandos, making the armor untradable in the process (think imbued rings- improve it and then if you want to sell it take the upgrade off). For example, add some sort of spikes made of some awesome ore that makes Bandos chestplate give +5 to all melee attack and an additional +1 strength. Ditto with crafting and high end mage/range armor, perhaps with hunted and farmed additives. Fletching and woodcutting could improve bows/crossbows with special braces and designs. High level Runecrafters could make catalytic runes that improve spell damage and save inventory space. Updates like these would allow all kinds of customization for truly unique items that you don't see every day, and revitalize skilling while not ruining the existing markets. Tons of possibilities here. Another option that's a little more blunt is something like a quest that requires high skills where you make an awesome piece of equipment from scratch, requiring high gathering and processing skills.

Luckily, with dragon bones as expensive as they are nowadays, this is MUCH less of an issue than it was when some of us were mid level. I used to fletch and alch yew longs for 50gp profit a bow when I was a youngin. Seriously, green dragons are absurdly easy and drop such a tremendous profit per kill. The amount of time that one must train to reach a combat that can reasonably kill green dragons is tiny.

Nope, I knew from the outset that something as low as 72 hunter was bound to be worthless (else they'd have mentioned a higher requirement with 72 as the minimum); doubly so for me, since I already have 99 summoning. Now... I guess I'll wait until November? Disappointing month -.-

HAHAHA oh WOW! As I said earlier in this thread, there are VERY few items in the game that look noobier than an untrimmed cooking/fletching/wc cape on a level 90. That's not the way to get respect, kids. Work on something that will benefit you and the 99s will come.