langer

what I don't understand is that as far as I can remember, we never had weekly updates. Sure there were news with players gallery and letters, but no new content weekly. Are you ranting about less updates or no weekly updates?

Yeah I was definitely going in another direction when we started arguying about the fun-profit debate when I realised we were not debating the same concept. Jagex definitely need to make both their games fun in order to generate profit. The way I see it: F2P needs to be fun enough to attract new players and P2P needs to be even more fun to lure F2Pers in getting memberships.

What is the achievement if you train inefficiently? You find it unfair that there are people who don't want to train with second rate items? If you value achievement by the time spent, it's your choice. My view on the subject is : more time = you are not doing it the right (best) way.

Indeed, for now though, credit cards are the easiest and fastest way to get members.

Yeah don't worry, I tried both ways to trian farming, I know what you mean. It's currently even more expensive than 15k payment (25 coconuts @ 1.1k each these days). I was just pointing out it was a buyable skill, but more in the range that construction can be bought (at a huge loss).

Thing is I like asking question a lot, I wouldn't mind getting flamed after asking for evidence like the OP did. It would just re-inforce my opinion on the matter. Religions are indeed touchy matters, seems you can't discuss them rationally.

Removing credit card payment would be a bad business decision. It seems that Jagew are continuously improving their bot detection system, but the botters always seem to find new ways. The goldfarmers issue would not have been solved though.

Well, it is better. I used to have the opposite feeling as you though. I always wanted to see what was on the other side of the door leading to taverly and thieving farmers was something I was eager to try. Let me tell you those were the first things I tried when I became members because I had been exposed to these teasers for so long (meh...4 months).

I agree with you All, except farming is a buyable. Sure you can view it like RC when you only do herbs run and mid lvls trees and fruit trees, but you can only get in the high gear when going for the high profile seeds.

So one occurence is enough proof to make a statement?

I guess I didn't explained myself properly. The first priority of any business is to make a profit or at least break even. In the case of Jagex, they have to make a fun game in order to make a profit. In fact, reading back some of your posts, I think I misunderstand what you mean when you say fun > profit in relation to Jagex. Especially since you mentionned that in the same post when mentionning they removed the P2P teasers from F2P. Just an aside there, do you find the game more fun because they removed those teasers?

Something special is usually something that is rare or unique. Some skills capes are not so special anymore because there are so many players with those running around. I used to view the fire cape as something special, not anymore because I see a lot of players running around with them. Sure getting a 99 is an achievement, it does not means it is special though. And to Bauke suggesting 99 cooking requires about the same time/effort as 70 RC...I have to agree with this.

What's the use in making a fun game if you end up bankrupt? I mean profit should be the priority #1, once your company makes a profit, then you have the freedom to explore different avenues.

I have to admit that I have no idea why they did that. These teasers provided lots of question from new players and sparked interest in the paying game. I have to admit I'm kinda puzzled by that move. I'm also pretty sure that profit, in any private business, is more important than fun. Once you are in the green though, fun becomes an option. I see no viable business with company having a fun view of things when they are in the red.

I agree with you. But from a business point of view, there's no denying that F2P is mainly there to attract customers.

This OP asked for evidence... is that flaming? Considering that the flame war started after he asked according to him... He may be more guilty of baiting it. If the discussion was going well before he entered, what did he think he would accomplish by saying that out of the blue? What's the point of a discussion if you can't ask question? I know freedom of speech is not a high priority in a lot of religion, call me foolish or whatever, but I do believe in it.

Don't worry, you'll find out in the future that it's not only younger kids that lie about their age...

This OP asked for evidence... is that flaming?

There you go: Have you read this "outliers" book for a communications class? I think ethnicity and demographics can determine what are the chances for successes and failures but successes and failures are determined by someone's point of view and are not absolute. I have absolutely no knowledge in litigation so that brings my post to an end. Nice read, especially since I played hockey and was near the date cut so I was amongst the youngest. In Quebec though, the dates are different : october 1st.

Ever since summoning came out : Fruit bat for skilling and t-bird for slayer.

Ahhhh finally on agreement!!! Been nice debating back and forth with you.

So far I've gotten 3 zaros statuette from about 100 hours of PVP (EP gathering and kills). I wouldn't call this easy, as I could have generated more GP through green dragon hunting. Inflation is bound to happen in this game as at least 25% of skills are creating GP. Sure it wasn't perfect on release but this is getting there.

Well it was caused by players, just not every player. I said it many times, it looks like Jagex was urged to make these changes, when you have major credit cards company saying "get your game straight or else we stop doing business with you", you have to react quickly. The thing about 26k/76k is still not that self explanatory. It's not perfect, but in my opinion, it's getting there. You have the option to pk, but you have to earn your kill first and you have the option to skill to get your earnings later. The sitters/EP earners are the real problem in my opinion and once you stop gaining EP when not gaining xp, that will certainly make it slightly better. We get that Jagex made hasty updates in december 2007, can we get over it someday? You can pk in edge lvl 1-3 nowadays without having to be in a clan. I'll be there to watch your fights while gaining EP through bolt enchanting with my magic brawlers.

@ Allisgreat Could you clear this up for me... Are you ranting about Jagex taking their sweet time fixing the whole mess (RWT ---> changing of the wild + trade limits --- 1 year later PVP implemented) or are you suggesting that they haven't fixed it yet? I would agree with you on the first point, but definitely disagree with you on the second. I believe RS is better off nowadays without goldfarmers and bots to battle at green and blue dragons, fishing guild and magic trees. I killed 2K blue dragons at one point in 2007 battling with gold farmers along the way, hopping to find suitable worlds and ending half killing the ones I could to scare away the Gfarmers away.

It's all about perspective, I'm an atheist and I could say that all mention of gods is offensive to me. I wouldn't because I actually enjoy seeing religious people trying to convert me.