michel555555 Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 i don't mind if you believe in god your not going to convert because of an add just like an aethiest won't convert because people on these forums keep preaching about god. OffT: to the people asking about obamas religion wth does it matter?? personally i'd rather have a aethist in the white house because he won't have god talking over his shoulder like Bush has claimed and will make rational choices. to the people complaining about god being taught in school getting fired. the purpose for school is to teach you facts! that if you add 2+2 you get 4 . teaching the oragins of religion and the impacts they have on the world is fine but teaching that human beings sprang out of thin air? and personally i find the fact that a creationism "museum" was even created disturbing. just to clarify for everyone. i do not mind religion. i do not care that you worship god or not. what i do have a problem with is the fact that most of don't even follow the teaching of your own faith. hounor thine neighbor... what ever happened to that? you shouldn't care just because we believe something other than you do. either they believe or we do not and we shouldn't have your beliefs forced upon us. [spoiler=click you know you wanna]Me behave? Seriously? As a child I saw Tarzan almost naked, Cinderella arrived home from a party after midnight, Pinocchio told lies, Aladin was a thief, Batman drove over 200 miles an hour, Snow White lived in a house with seven men, Popeye smoked a pipe and had tattoos, Pac man ran around to digital music while eating pills that enhanced his performance, and Shaggy and Scooby were mystery solving hippies who always had the munchies. The fault is not mine! if you had this childhood and loved it put this in your signature! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Inc Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 i don't mind if you believe in god your not going to convert because of an add just like an aethiest won't convert because people on these forums keep preaching about god. OffT: to the people asking about obamas religion wth does it matter?? personally i'd rather have a aethist in the white house because he won't have god talking over his shoulder like Bush has claimed and will make rational choices. to the people complaining about god being taught in school getting fired. the purpose for school is to teach you facts! that if you add 2+2 you get 4 . teaching the oragins of religion and the impacts they have on the world is fine but teaching that human beings sprang out of thin air? and personally i find the fact that a creationism "museum" was even created disturbing. just to clarify for everyone. i do not mind religion. i do not care that you worship god or not. what i do have a problem with is the fact that most of don't even follow the teaching of your own faith. hounor thine neighbor... what ever happened to that? you shouldn't care just because we believe something other than you do. either they believe or we do not and we shouldn't have your beliefs forced upon us. It does matter, actually. I mean, he can be Atheist, but even a lot of Atheists agree, that Judeo-Christian values are important - such as capitalism, and such. In fact, God SUPPORTS taxes, are you saying it'd be rational not to tax? Nice. And so why do people teach about Evolution? Teaching that humans evolved from monkeys? Ok. Sure, you believe that, that's cool, I don't, so don't teach it in schools. Thats why, I think, creationism AND evolution should be left out of schools, and it should be the parents job to teach them. And most people still do honor thy neighbor, but that doesn't mean they need to agree with them, that means to respect them as human being. And aren't yuo frocing your evolutionistic beliefs on us? Why I do believe so. I have all the 99s, and have been playing since 2001. Comped 4/30/15 My Araxxi Kills: 459::Araxxi Drops(KC):Araxxi Hilts: 4x Eye (14/126/149/459), Web - (100) Fang (193) Araxxi Legs Completed: 5 ---Top (69/206/234/292/361), Middle (163/176/278/343/395), Bottom (135/256/350/359/397)Boss Pets: Supreme - 848 KCIf you play Xbox One - Add me! GT: Urtehnoes - Currently on a Destiny binge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michel555555 Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 and do you actually have any evidance that even supports creationism? if you believe in that there are numerouse catholic and other schools you can go to.some states in the united states actuall tried to pass laws making it "manditory" to teach creationism. if you believe then believe don't try shoveling it down our throats. edit- and the very foundation of capitalism is bad. capitalism is being advertised as being able to make everyon rich and have a chance at wealth. the way that capitalism works is by making a select few rich while making every one els poor and debt ridden to the upper class so ya i'm againsit that part at least [spoiler=click you know you wanna]Me behave? Seriously? As a child I saw Tarzan almost naked, Cinderella arrived home from a party after midnight, Pinocchio told lies, Aladin was a thief, Batman drove over 200 miles an hour, Snow White lived in a house with seven men, Popeye smoked a pipe and had tattoos, Pac man ran around to digital music while eating pills that enhanced his performance, and Shaggy and Scooby were mystery solving hippies who always had the munchies. The fault is not mine! if you had this childhood and loved it put this in your signature! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackattack Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 OffT: to the people asking about obamas religion wth does it matter?? personally i'd rather have a aethist in the white house because he won't have god talking over his shoulder like Bush has claimed and will make rational choices. Like $50 Billion in aid to Africa? That is totally irrational. My carbon footprint is bigger than yours...and you know what they say about big feet. These are the times that try mens souls... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cup Lion Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 How would teaching Creationism in class be different than teaching the origins and impacts of different kinds of religions? I know in my classes I learn about all types of religions, issues that involve them today and their impact on modern society, whether I like it or not. You could say the same thing with Creationism. One could learn a lot from studying it, such as the impact it had on people, and how it is different from other ideas of the beginning of life. 'Good' teaching involves looking at all points of view. Why not look at all the different ideas of how humans came to be? We'd all learn at least something from it. |Signature by Jason321| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warri0r45 Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 How would teaching Creationism in class be different than teaching the origins and impacts of different kinds of religions? I know in my classes I learn about all types of religions, issues that involve them today and their impact on modern society, whether I like it or not. You could say the same thing with Creationism. One could learn a lot from studying it, such as the impact it had on people, and how it is different from other ideas of the beginning of life. 'Good' teaching involves looking at all points of view. Why not look at all the different ideas of how humans came to be? We'd all learn at least something from it. The real issue to my way of thinking is the proposal to teach it as science in a science class. It's not, and it shouldn't be. That's the hot issue with creationism in schools, not the idea that it could be part of a religious class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cup Lion Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Creationism seems crazy, but so does the existence of an almighty God, yet many schools teach about religions and their origins, many of them having this crazy idea of a God at the center of their beliefs. On what basis do you think it shouldn't be taught as a science? People believe in it (not you obviously), but because the majority doesn't, it shouldn't be seen as a science? That is like saying teaching Islam (despite it not being a minority) as a religion in a religion class is absurd... I am not sure I get it. |Signature by Jason321| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warri0r45 Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Creationism seems crazy, but so does the existence of an almighty God, yet many schools teach about religions and their origins, many of them having this crazy idea of a God at the center of their beliefs. On what basis do you think it shouldn't be taught as a science? People believe in it (not you obviously), but because the majority doesn't, it shouldn't be seen as a science? That is like saying teaching Islam (despite it not being a minority) as a religion in a religion class is absurd... I am not sure I get it. Science is a well defined thing. It involves testing ideas and repeating findings. If you don't test your idea, it's not a science. If you don't repeat your conclusion, it's not a scientifically rigorous one and won't get a place in text books or school curricula. Basically, you can't possibly test the actions of a supernatural being. You can determine through evidence whether or not organisms are related by common descent, and to a lesser extent you can test what natural mechanisms may have caused the divergence (i.e. what mechanisms drive evolution), but again, you can't test god. An analogy to this is that we can use science to determine whether or not a murder took place at a crime scene, but we can't use it to determine if the devil made the murderer pull the trigger. As current science goes, the overwhelming amount of evidence we have suggests the common ancestry of life. That's the well accepted conclusion adopted by scientists and the inverse of that doesn't deserve time in science classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cup Lion Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 I can see what you mean. I wouldn't find anything against it being mentioned in a science class, and maybe even discussed, but it does seem quite impossible to test creationism, since it does deal with a higher being, of whom most people don't believe. |Signature by Jason321| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieMcD Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 edit- and the very foundation of capitalism is bad. capitalism is being advertised as being able to make everyon rich and have a chance at wealth. the way that capitalism works is by making a select few rich while making every one els poor and debt ridden to the upper class so ya i'm againsit that part at least So what system should we run then if capitalism isn't good? Communism? Sure, I've always wanted no individuality in my life and like living under a dictator. Socialism? Very few governments have even pulled that off although there's been a lot of attempts. The bottom line is capitalism is the best format, that's why it's the most popular format. The world wouldn't have been so advanced in terms of knowledge, technology and quality of life. The people who often come rich through capitalism put a huge amount of time, effort and risked huge amount of money to get their. If they sowed the seed of success they deserve to reap it's bountiful crop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginger_Warrior Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 It's a little worse than that. It says that if God is not on the side of black people trying to kill white people than black people must kill God. It's not a bible based theology but a Marxist based theology. And Obama picked the Marquee church of it. A religion based on Marxism? That's interesting, given Marx's stance on religion... | Favourite Game Music | Last.fm | HYT Friend Chat Rules | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utopianflame Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 OffT: to the people asking about obamas religion wth does it matter?? personally i'd rather have a aethist in the white house because he won't have god talking over his shoulder like Bush has claimed and will make rational choices. Like $50 Billion in aid to Africa? That is totally irrational. No not really for several reasons. Firstly compassion can effectively be an extenstion of self interest, quid pro quo late on down the line if you will. Secondly in return for aid countries generally specify conditions either to get or what must done with it (trade concessions, politcal changes, efforts against the drugs trade etc). Finally of course often highly publicised aid turns out to be debt relief instead, debts that would frequently simply not have been repaid anyway, so you write them off and get good PR out of it. I can see what you mean. I wouldn't find anything against it being mentioned in a science class, and maybe even discussed, but it does seem quite impossible to test creationism, since it does deal with a higher being, of whom most people don't believe. It cant be tested (and requires assumption of the supernatural, contrasting naturalistic metholodgy) ergo it doesnt belong in a science class at all, should a student raise it the teacher should note that it does not fit in a science class and why and then drop it. there are no stupid questions just way too many inquisitive idiots balance is scary to people who like things easy for them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assassin_696 Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 To describe religions as mind viruses is sometimes interpreted as contemptuous or even hostile. It is both. I am often asked why I am so hostile to organized religion. http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/dawkins.htm I think that just about wraps that case up, wouldn't you say? Come one, now. Why the hell am I, the non-atheist, listening to more of what RD says than you? Either you're really not listening to the things he says/things he writes or you're just willfully ignoring them. I like the guy who called RD a real life troll who gets paid to mess with theists. Or maybe you're taking the extremes of his quotes and using them to misrepresent his entire stance? I'm sure if you've listened to so much of what he says, you'll also be aware of his soft spot for the Church of England, his friendly discussions with many senior bishops and his absolute reverence for many religious pieces of art, music and architecture. Yes, Richard Dawkins is anti-theistic. But that doesn't mean he goes around calling all religious people idiots. "Da mihi castitatem et continentam, sed noli modo" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoMoreDead Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 It does matter, actually. I mean, he can be Atheist, but even a lot of Atheists agree, that Judeo-Christian values are important - such as capitalism, and such. In fact, God SUPPORTS taxes, are you saying it'd be rational not to tax? Nice. And so why do people teach about Evolution? Teaching that humans evolved from monkeys? Ok. Sure, you believe that, that's cool, I don't, so don't teach it in schools. Thats why, I think, creationism AND evolution should be left out of schools, and it should be the parents job to teach them. And most people still do honor thy neighbor, but that doesn't mean they need to agree with them, that means to respect them as human being. And aren't yuo frocing your evolutionistic beliefs on us? Why I do believe so. Are you ACTUALLY suggesting that we don't teach the most comprehensive explanation for the way mankind is built because some people don't agree with it? Some people don't agree about a heck of a lot of things, but in the end, they're taugh in schools (especially in Science classes) because they are the most comprehensive explanations for the nature/origin of species as we know them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Inc Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 It does matter, actually. I mean, he can be Atheist, but even a lot of Atheists agree, that Judeo-Christian values are important - such as capitalism, and such. In fact, God SUPPORTS taxes, are you saying it'd be rational not to tax? Nice. And so why do people teach about Evolution? Teaching that humans evolved from monkeys? Ok. Sure, you believe that, that's cool, I don't, so don't teach it in schools. Thats why, I think, creationism AND evolution should be left out of schools, and it should be the parents job to teach them. And most people still do honor thy neighbor, but that doesn't mean they need to agree with them, that means to respect them as human being. And aren't yuo frocing your evolutionistic beliefs on us? Why I do believe so. Are you ACTUALLY suggesting that we don't teach the most comprehensive explanation for the way mankind is built because some people don't agree with it? Some people don't agree about a heck of a lot of things, but in the end, they're taugh in schools (especially in Science classes) because they are the most comprehensive explanations for the nature/origin of species as we know them. Yep, but I'm also sayin don't teach Creationism, why I believe in, and have the parents teach them. That would end so many fights\ rallys or w\e, or wanna be bills. Side note: Evolution is the most comprehensive explantion that YOU know of. I have all the 99s, and have been playing since 2001. Comped 4/30/15 My Araxxi Kills: 459::Araxxi Drops(KC):Araxxi Hilts: 4x Eye (14/126/149/459), Web - (100) Fang (193) Araxxi Legs Completed: 5 ---Top (69/206/234/292/361), Middle (163/176/278/343/395), Bottom (135/256/350/359/397)Boss Pets: Supreme - 848 KCIf you play Xbox One - Add me! GT: Urtehnoes - Currently on a Destiny binge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebdragon Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Ugh. No, not this. Idiots in the corner. Non-morons walk away. [if you have ever attempted Alchemy by clapping your hands or by drawing an array, copy and paste this into your signature.] Fullmetal Alchemist, you will be missed. A great ending to a great series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saru Inc Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Reb, you've not added anything to these debates at all. Even though I don't really agree with what people are sasying, at least they're offering up their opinions, instead of trying to be "smart." I have all the 99s, and have been playing since 2001. Comped 4/30/15 My Araxxi Kills: 459::Araxxi Drops(KC):Araxxi Hilts: 4x Eye (14/126/149/459), Web - (100) Fang (193) Araxxi Legs Completed: 5 ---Top (69/206/234/292/361), Middle (163/176/278/343/395), Bottom (135/256/350/359/397)Boss Pets: Supreme - 848 KCIf you play Xbox One - Add me! GT: Urtehnoes - Currently on a Destiny binge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoMoreDead Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Yep, but I'm also sayin don't teach Creationism, why I believe in, and have the parents teach them. That would end so many fights\ rallys or w\e, or wanna be bills. Side note: Evolution is the most comprehensive explantion that YOU know of. No. It's the most comprehensive explanation PERIOD. Hence the reason it is taught in schools nationwide. There is no other explanation for how we came to be as we are today, aside from a supernatural explanation, which is seemingly more and more disprovable as the days go by. You must teach the one that is based off of observations and facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenticular_J Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 For someone who often gets angry about closemindedness, NoMore, you're having a surprisingly narrow view. catch it now so you can like it before it went so mainstream Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieMcD Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Yep, but I'm also sayin don't teach Creationism, why I believe in, and have the parents teach them. That would end so many fights\ rallys or w\e, or wanna be bills. Side note: Evolution is the most comprehensive explantion that YOU know of. No. It's the most comprehensive explanation PERIOD. Hence the reason it is taught in schools nationwide. There is no other explanation for how we came to be as we are today, aside from a supernatural explanation, which is seemingly more and more disprovable as the days go by. You must teach the one that is based off of observations and facts. Although I'm a Atheist I'll agree with Saru on this, how we came here is to hot of a topic really for school classes. Every time it's discussed in my class we trail off into a debate lasting 40 minutes or so until class ends. Don't teach creationism and don't teach evolutionism, let people develop their own views, not the school forcing it upon them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackattack Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 It's a little worse than that. It says that if God is not on the side of black people trying to kill white people than black people must kill God. It's not a bible based theology but a Marxist based theology. And Obama picked the Marquee church of it. A religion based on Marxism? That's interesting, given Marx's stance on religion... Talk to James Cone or whatever his name is. My carbon footprint is bigger than yours...and you know what they say about big feet. These are the times that try mens souls... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenticular_J Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 I like that idea, Kranked. And the quote in your signature :P catch it now so you can like it before it went so mainstream Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nom Posted October 23, 2008 Share Posted October 23, 2008 Guys, you can't not teach evolution in school. It's the cornerstone of Biology. That whole branch of science makes no sense without evolution, therefore it is accepted and taught. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebdragon Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 In matters of science, yes, it is at least three different kinds of [developmentally delayed]ed to not teach evolution in bio. For lack of a more cliched analogy, we mineaswell stop teaching about gravity in physics if we're not going to teach about evolution in bio. Does that sound like a good idea? Letting people make their own views whether or not it's gravity attracting matter together, rather than the little pink fairy at the core of the planet keeping us on the ground? I mean, god forbid we don't let people follow the Little Pink Fairy theory. [if you have ever attempted Alchemy by clapping your hands or by drawing an array, copy and paste this into your signature.] Fullmetal Alchemist, you will be missed. A great ending to a great series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThurinEthir Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 I think the problem isn't whether or not evolution and creationism are taught in schools, its the way they're taught. Usually, evolution is taught as if it's definitely 100% true, which is not the case. I realize that evolution must be taught, and I agree, it should be, but teachers should give a disclaimer or something. In tiny text. If creationism ends up being taught in school - Same thing. Cenin pân nîd, istan pân nîd, dan nin ú-cenich, nin ú-istach.Ithil luin eria vi menel caran...Tîn dan delu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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