Tip.It Adverts Discussion

[topper4125]

 

It's not like Jagex is going to take over Poland if they do this.

 

nah... Just content on fansites.. using the 'removal from the safe list' as their weapon of choice. And if the sites don't bend to the will of Jagex, they'll be removed, which sends a clear message to the user base of Runescape: "This site is not as safe as we thought, we removed them, and will not go into to details of WHY we removed them, you'll have to take their word for it".

[PoorLepRecon]

I'm completely on Tip.it's side here and agree that as long as Jagex's demands aren't over the top we should try to stay on the safe list, but let's travel back to WWII if I may and have a little talk about history. At the beginning of the pre-WWII period Neville Chamberlain was the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom. Chamberlain is best known for his appeasement policy when it came to Hitler. This is a quote from Wikipedia:

In Europe, Germany and Italy were becoming bolder. In March 1938, Germany annexed Austria, again provoking little response from other European powers. Encouraged, Hitler began pressing German claims on the Sudetenland, an area of Czechoslovakia with a predominantly ethnic German population; France and Britain conceded this territory to him, against the wishes of the Czechoslovak government, in exchange for a promise of no further territorial demands. Soon after that, however, Germany and Italy forced Czechoslovakia to cede additional territory to Hungary and Poland. In March 1939, Germany invaded the remainder of Czechoslovakia and subsequently split it into the German Protectorate of Bohemia and Moravia and the pro-German client state, the Slovak Republic.

The idea of appeasement was that Britain and France gave Hitler anything he wanted, within in reason, with the hope that each demand would be his last. After Prime Minister Chamberlain signed the Munich Agreement in 1938, conceding the Sudetenland region of Czechoslovakia to Nazi Germany, he returned to Britain with news that war had been averted and that the Sudetenland would be Hitler's last request. Obviously Hitler wasn't satisfied with just the Sudetenland, and later took the rest of Czechoslovakia and then Poland before Britain reacted.

 

Now I'm not comparing Jagex to Hitler, or even saying their intentions are bad in their request, but you have to wonder when they will decide they have enough control. At first to get on the safe list you had to remove gold advertisements, which was totally reasonable (they are against the game rules), but now they also want competitor ads removed. The questions here are, is Jagex justified in demanding even more control then they had and whether this will be Jagex's last demand if we continue the historically flawed policy of appeasement.

 

This also goes to show you that even the new and improved and "open" Jagex led by MMG can still be the money hungry tyrant it was in years past.

 

Godwin's Law

 

 

 

There are some interesting arguments on both sides, but I still say that Jagex is overstepping their bounds.

[strilmus]

Okay I wasn't going to bring Godwin's law up cause I was trying to be polite but sure whatever cite things on the internet to appear funny. Haha. Yeah. I get it. You are cool.

 

I think we all agree that Jagex is just being idiotic about this.

 

But nobody's ever really respected their filters or their outlawing of what is "safe" and what isn't. Don't think this really changes anything....

 

As it is we don't NEED to be on the list, but it seems we don't need the other advertising too, so on the whole, it's a tradeoff that doesn't hurt.

 

Principles and common sense are both good things to have.

[Den]

I think they might be doing this because of some random jagex visit to a fansite on the safe list, then seeing a gold selling ad.

They then bring this up and decide that they should move fansite ads to the ads by jagex so this event doesnt happen more from safe sites.

 

Now I also dont have to see those desperate evony ads poping up from time to time either, so I have no problem with this as long as it doesnt effect the income. :P

[calcarb]

If you visit a fan site of whoever is your favourite band/artist do you expect them to promote other good bands/artists? No.

 

But you would expect the band/artist to endorse your site.

 

Jagex should visit us more openly in the forums, but also be prepared for negative talk about them. No one is perfect and everyone can learn by constructive criticism.

 

Come on Jagex where are you?

[obfuscator]

I knew someone was going to make the Hitler comparison lmao.

 

Oh well, best course of action is to appease them now, but have the "gtfo bat" ready for their next request.

[SupaDavis]

If jagex OPENLY visited us. And OPENLY accepted criticism, I would completely be fine with this change.

 

Though the "re-launch" of the support thread :/

[Beaumonde]

Whoa whoa wait what Hitler?!

I knew someone was going to make the Hitler comparison lmao.

When I read the first two pages and found no Hitler reference I knew I had to act.

 

Godwin's Law

That was much funnier before it was on Reddit and everyone figured out what it was.

 

</Off Topic>

 

After thinking about it I think Jagex should just delete the safe list, if they aren't going to actually support the sites on the safe list then what is the point of a their half-hearted endorsement.

[Zaaps1]

Eh, whatever Jagex thinks I guess :s

[topper4125]

From the new and less improved fansite list:

 

The website owner(s) focus solely on the game they are supporting.

 

Can someone again explain to me how they aren't trying to control content? With your support of ArenaScape (IE Links on your nav bar), I'm surprised you reached the level of Gold... according to this, you should be silver at best.

 

... the list is all about control.. nothing else.

[Latinoking]

Do they really threat to mute/ban people if a player types a fansite from not the not "safe" list under the cover that they are trying to protect users of RuneScape? That's sad. Sorry, I've been away for a while.

 

I guess this change is fine, but Jagex really has always had controlling issues and this is just them showing them off again. To be honest their site of "safe sites" is stupid. We the users on the forum and browsers of the site already know the site is safe. Who gives a hoot if Jagex says otherwise.

 

I hope for not every "little thing," Tip.It adheres to every demand that Jagex Ltd. in the future might impose just to remain on the "safe" list. While I might not play World of Warcraft or something popular along those lines if Jagex were to ask to remove the thread(s), I hope Tip.it makes the right decision.

[topper4125]

@ Latinoking

its been in the rules for as long as can remember that you can't mention other websites on their forums, or in game (including fansites). The relaxing of the rules to include fansites, is nice, but the restrictions and limits they put in are just ridicules, and I feel they are asking too much from sites.

 

I remember once (years ago) I was having a discussion on the Official forums about some interesting way to get easy Crafting XP. I said that I read it on a fansite, and someone asked me which one. I said "I can't mention the name since its against the rules. when it comes to the name, I don't even think I'm allowed to give you a TIP about IT.

 

A jMod replied: That was very creative.

 

The post was not hidden/deleted.

[Latinoking]

@ Latinoking

its been in the rules for as long as can remember that you can't mention other websites on their forums, or in game (including fansites). The relaxing of the rules to include fansites, is nice, but the restrictions and limits they put in are just ridicules, and I feel they are asking too much from sites.

 

I remember once (years ago) I was having a discussion on the Official forums about some interesting way to get easy Crafting XP. I said that I read it on a fansite, and someone asked me which one. I said "I can't mention the name since its against the rules. when it comes to the name, I don't even think I'm allowed to give you a TIP about IT.

 

A jMod replied: That was very creative.

 

The post was not hidden/deleted.

 

Oh, I know that they for quite some time that they didn't want people going to/mentioning/suggesting to others fansites for guides, ingame history, updates etc. so they "improved" their website' knowledge base. But I was reading through the thread and someone mention how another fansite also was approach by Jagex and they refuse to compile with Jagex's orders and now their website name is censored ingame. I'm guessing that this is recent, as now if you're on the safe list...you're website name isn't censor. That's just plain dumb. You have to be on the "safe list" to not be censored now? Cool...

[Den]

Its free AND its an mmorpg! :o

 

*goes and plays*

 

Picture:

[hide][/hide]

 

Its just the irony in it all that amuses me. :P

[guano3]

Jagex are not gamers and don't share the love of games like we do. It is a sad day for tip.it because now jagex owns it.

[Laikrob]

Jagex are not gamers and don't share the love of games like we do. It is a sad day for tip.it because now jagex owns it.

Incorrect in several ways.

The company was created by gamers, and many members of the staff play the game - also on regular accounts for fun.

 

This is nothing more than an agreement that can be opted out of at any given time, it is not a legally binding contract that has sold our souls to a company.

I suggest that you read the whole topic so that you get a better understanding of what this is really about. :)

[guano3]

Jagex are not gamers and don't share the love of games like we do. It is a sad day for tip.it because now jagex owns it.

Incorrect in several ways.

The company was created by gamers, and many members of the staff play the game - also on regular accounts for fun.

 

This is nothing more than an agreement that can be opted out of at any given time, it is not a legally binding contract that has sold our souls to a company.

I suggest that you read the whole topic so that you get a better understanding of what this is really about. :)

 

It is a legally binding contract for 1 year i believe that will be renewed. and u are disagreeing with me that jagex don't like games. they are threatened by other games and they are under the impression that we players only like runescape and not any other games. i disagree! i play about 20 games regularly and runescape is one of them. this is because i am a gamer. jagex fail to see this. they are controlling tipit like a government can control the press.

 

when i said jagex owns it i didnt mean they own the domain name or the hosting. of course not! jagex dont want to trouble themselves with annoying stuff like that. they just want the advertising revenue, control of information with the ease of shooting an email, and they want to spread animosity in the gaming community. i worked at Lego where we were working on the new lego mmorpg and we played CoD every day and even other games. because we love games. and we'd be happy to talk about games because we're gamers. jagex gives the impression that they feel their game can only succeed using under-handed cheap dirty tricks like censorship rather than a good product.

 

jagex litereally forced tip.it into this so i cant blame tip.it for succumbing to the pressure. it shocked me when jagex put Tip.it in their "gold" section of recognized fansites. Any sane person can know that tip.it should be in platinum level. but i know why they put tip.it in gold and not platinum. they wanted to force tip.it to sign this advertising deal. now watch, in couple days they will move tip.it to platinum. the recognized fansite list is their way to force fansites to fall under their direct control.

[Cowman_133]

It is a legally binding contract for 1 year i believe that will be renewed.

 

What? There is no legally binding contract involved here.

 

when i said jagex owns it i didnt mean they own the domain name or the hosting. of course not! jagex dont want to trouble themselves with annoying stuff like that. they just want the advertising revenue, control of information with the ease of shooting an email, and they want to spread animosity in the gaming community.

 

There is zero revenue going to Jagex as a result of this... all we have done here is removed GoogleAds and any gaming-related advertisements from our rotation. That's it. They do not control our content in any way, nor will they ever.

 

i worked at Lego where we were working on the new lego mmorpg and we played CoD every day and even other games. because we love games. and we'd be happy to talk about games because we're gamers.

 

Many Jagex Mods state they are gamers as well - maybe they don't state exactly which games they play but to work on a game like RuneScape you really have to have that passion for gaming.

 

jagex litereally forced tip.it into this so i cant blame tip.it for succumbing to the pressure. it shocked me when jagex put Tip.it in their "gold" section of recognized fansites. Any sane person can know that tip.it should be in platinum level. but i know why they put tip.it in gold and not platinum. they wanted to force tip.it to sign this advertising deal. now watch, in couple days they will move tip.it to platinum. the recognized fansite list is their way to force fansites to fall under their direct control.

 

The reasoning for this move was explicitly to regain the Platinum level, as Mod Hohbein posted on the forums not too long ago. I think you are confused with the Advertising Deal that Jagex has offered to a few fansites - we did not sign up for that in this advertising change. All we did was remove gaming related advertisements on our own accord, as well as the GoogleAds service from our rotation. We still maintain control over our advertisements.

 

I hope I've cleared up some of your feelings on the matter.

[Skull]

Jagex are not gamers and don't share the love of games like we do. It is a sad day for tip.it because now jagex owns it.

Incorrect in several ways.

The company was created by gamers, and many members of the staff play the game - also on regular accounts for fun.

 

This is nothing more than an agreement that can be opted out of at any given time, it is not a legally binding contract that has sold our souls to a company.

I suggest that you read the whole topic so that you get a better understanding of what this is really about. :)

 

It is a legally binding contract for 1 year i believe that will be renewed. and u are disagreeing with me that jagex don't like games. they are threatened by other games and they are under the impression that we players only like runescape and not any other games. i disagree! i play about 20 games regularly and runescape is one of them. this is because i am a gamer. jagex fail to see this. they are controlling tipit like a government can control the press.

 

when i said jagex owns it i didnt mean they own the domain name or the hosting. of course not! jagex dont want to trouble themselves with annoying stuff like that. they just want the advertising revenue, control of information with the ease of shooting an email, and they want to spread animosity in the gaming community. i worked at Lego where we were working on the new lego mmorpg and we played CoD every day and even other games. because we love games. and we'd be happy to talk about games because we're gamers. jagex gives the impression that they feel their game can only succeed using under-handed cheap dirty tricks like censorship rather than a good product.

 

jagex litereally forced tip.it into this so i cant blame tip.it for succumbing to the pressure. it shocked me when jagex put Tip.it in their "gold" section of recognized fansites. Any sane person can know that tip.it should be in platinum level. but i know why they put tip.it in gold and not platinum. they wanted to force tip.it to sign this advertising deal. now watch, in couple days they will move tip.it to platinum. the recognized fansite list is their way to force fansites to fall under their direct control.

That goes into my list of top 10 most incorrect posts of all times. Not that I actually have such a list. I should make one though.

[Sir_Squab]

this is why i like tip.it... your not all about the paycheck like zybez is... ive actualy started boycotting zybez every chance i get because a few years ago(yes i still holding them on it even though its been about 3 years) i got a virus from one of their ads... i reported it to w13... good ol' jerk of an admin / owner and his response was equivalent to "to bad so sad i got paid i dont care" he real words were "we need the ads to support the site" but y'know you give your users a virus and they wont come back.

 

then you got the issue of jagex dropping their support... w13 got all mad because he wanted more money... jagex was willing to give ads that support the site plenty... he got a better offer so decided to decline jagex and be greedy... no mroe support for them.

 

BUT tip.it on the other hand isnt all about the paycheck...in fact here you are asking us to get rid of ads that shouldnt be allowed... your want to make sure you are supported with jagex... i tip my hat to you guys for that

 

 

Your comments would make sense if fansites were run for profit. But they aren't. Yeah, people want/need money from adds and stuff, but that's because they cost money to maintain you know....

 

Frankly, I dislike this idea of Jagex trying to force fansites to not advertise for other games..... Nor do I like the fact that if you don't comply with this, Jagex censors the fansite name in-game....(From what I know.)

[topper4125]

I'm wondering why Jagex doesn't try it in the real world... something like this:

 

TO: Rob Walton Chairman of Wal-Mart

 

First off we here at Jagex would like to thank you for your continued support of our game by selling our Membership cards on your store racks.

 

However, it has come to our attention that next to our cards are other memberships to various silly little games. This simply cannot be tolerated. As you know, if people even view those "Other Cards" they might not ever come to your store (let alone Runescape) ever again!

 

We are hereby REQUIRING that you stop carrying those other cards, they do nothing but hurt the reputation of Wal-Mart as a whole, and deep down, you know this to be true.

 

While we are on this subject, lets talk about other things you can do to not only improve our overall market value, but yours as well, here's a few other forms of entertainment you should get rid of:

 

Playstation 3's, xbox's, Wii's, Gameboys, PSP's... you know what this will take WAY too long, just get rid of your entire electronic entertainment department.

 

Add to this list: Camping equipment, exercise equipment, the entire Toy Department, Movies and Books (For books, just burn them in the parking lot. I'm sure you can find a video of it somewhere on line... oh wait, viewing videos... not good.. that's a form or entertainment that we have no control over. Scratch that, just get some gasoline, a match, and make it up as you go. YAY for Firemaking XP! :) )

 

Now bear in mind, we aren't trying to control content. We just want to be sure that your stores are safe to visit. Its all about safety!

 

And any place that condones the existence of other games isn't safe, except us (RS, FunOrb, AOG). But *WE* are the ONLY entity on the face of the earth that could possibly handle the struggles of a multi-game universe. Trust us, its brutal.

 

Failure to do so will result in us dropping walmart to something less than Platinum on our "Safe Places" to shop.

 

Thanks for your time.

Jagex

[Laikrob]

That could have been funny if you had done it right.

[topper4125]

That could have been funny if you had done it right.

 

I would hope that anytime a group of people try to control another group, or business, or website, it would NOT be tolerated (or considered funny).

[obfuscator]

That could have been funny if you had done it right.

 

I would hope that anytime a group of people try to control another group, or business, or website, it would NOT be tolerated (or considered funny).

While I agree with you that I think it is an unreasonable demand of Jagex to try to control advertizing, look at the positive side - getting on Jagex's "Platinum list", however biased or unrealistic that list will be - probably is far worth the advertizing and exposure that tip.it gets, compared to the small sacrifice of some ad changing.

 

Once again, I have full confidence in the admins to put their foot down if Jagex demands the Polish corridor.

[RpgGamer]

I know I'm late to this party, but I think it's wrong of Jagex to "buy out" the competitors' advertisement space. This is the internet, not a big buisness breeding ground! Who do they think they are, Microsoft?