lost my cls

[xpx]

Just wait until batch 2, hopefully you can buy items you lost for a price.

That could be anything from 5-7 months wait :shock: they'd propably rather release it with the dung tweaks, if at all.

[Lugia_Lvl138]

This is the precise reason I will only spec with Excalibur at solo Bandos. Even then, if my Prayer drops to 0, my CLS is risked. Not a big DKer, but I would welfare to the point of CLS protection there too. This is making me feel really nooby about ragequitting over 1.5m + Effigy lost at TDs yesterday.

[Obtaurian]

No matter what your rant is, the Tip.it community will lecture you on how you deserved it.

 

Sucks, Games. :thumbdown:

[ghjkl]

This is the precise reason I will only spec with Excalibur at solo Bandos. Even then, if my Prayer drops to 0, my CLS is risked. Not a big DKer, but I would welfare to the point of CLS protection there too. This is making me feel really nooby about ragequitting over 1.5m + Effigy lost at TDs yesterday.

 

The problem is by welfaring you have more of a chance of being crashed. In these days you have to bring max gear to compete. Jagex needs to make dung rewards actually protect over stuff like bandos.

[Lugia_Lvl138]

This is the precise reason I will only spec with Excalibur at solo Bandos. Even then, if my Prayer drops to 0, my CLS is risked. Not a big DKer, but I would welfare to the point of CLS protection there too. This is making me feel really nooby about ragequitting over 1.5m + Effigy lost at TDs yesterday.

 

The problem is by welfaring you have more of a chance of being crashed. In these days you have to bring max gear to compete. Jagex needs to make dung rewards actually protect over stuff like bandos.

 

O rly? I lost some kills at solo Bandos once to a crasher who had neither Overloads nor Turmoil.

[K4ylan]

Dung is stupid in my opinion.

 

As a skill, if you spend time and money on it, you SHOULD get rewards that are a little more permanent than chaotic weaponry, or at least easier to get should you lose them. No other skill is so minigame-like in this regard.

 

You dont suddenly lose the ability to use ancients if you die while casting ice barrage, and you dont suddenly lose the ability to summon a steel titan if you die with it, yet you will lose pretty much all your work up to level 80 dung should you die with chaotic weaponry, its just lame.

 

And you dont lose the ability to buy a chaotic weapon either, btw. :mellow:

 

the "ability to buy a chaotic weapon" is complete B.S.

 

they could completely remove the explicit level requirement of 80 from the chaotic weapons, but it'd still implicitly be there because you are required to have gotten 200,000 tokens, which means you must have gotten 2,000,000 experience, which means you must have gotten level 80 dungeoneering

 

the "abiltiy to buy a chaotic weapon" is meaningless

 

With ancients, you have the "ability" to cast spells. You don't get the runes though, you still have to earn those. And if you die, you lose those too. I think the reason you need 80 dung to be able to buy it is because they might release new methods of earning tokens, and don't want people to buy it without having at least 80 dunge.

[Sir_Kurity]

With ancients, you have the "ability" to cast spells. You don't get the runes though, you still have to earn those. And if you die, you lose those too. I think the reason you need 80 dung to be able to buy it is because

 

So what.

 

With dung, you get the ability to use a better sword, and you lose it when you die.

 

Fking fail.

 

The only current, accurate analogy towards ancient magics is if you ALWAYS kept the sword, even upon death, but only had to pay for recharges. But right now, its like losing the ability to cast ancients if you die.

 

they might release new methods of earning tokens, and don't want people to buy it without having at least 80 dunge.

 

That may be reasonable, but that still doesnt fix the problem of completely losing all your work up to level 80 just by dieing.

 

Also, until this hypothetical update comes, dung is still more minigame than skill.

[xpx]

Well if it was you losing the ability to cast ancients upon death, would you risk it in places you know you could die....? I didn't think so.

 

Also, it's a quest that gives you the ability to cast ancient spells, which is very much differant than a skill for which you have to do a certain amount of work to buy an item. I agree that it is minigame like, but, guess what? jagex has yet to define a minigame or a skill, so there is really nothing wrong with how it is now if they designed it to be like this.

[MstrMonopoly]

The one thing I always thought was silly is the fact that you don't keep certain items on death... it always seemed arbitrary/unrealistic (by this i mean torso, diary items, etc).

 

One time I lost ~10M at TD's because some dude lured 4 of them on me... I was mad, of course, but I got over it pretty quickly. Now I only risk 2m and only bring as many diamond (e) bolts as I need for the trip.

[Sir_Kurity]

there is really nothing wrong with how it is now if they designed it to be like this.

 

Theres everything wrong with how it is designed.

 

When the chaotic weapon is THE ONLY (and im not exaggerating, its THE ONLY reward from level 80 dungeoneering, assuming you dont buy other items), you SHOULD NOT lose all your work up to level 80 upon death, and not be able to gain it back until you get another 2 mill experience or whatever crazy number it is.

 

No other skill is so... Like this...

 

I dont lose the ability to hit high if i die with strength, the ability to mine if i die while mining, the ability to cast spells if i die with magic, the ability to runecraft if i die while doing that.

 

But should i have the sheer gall to actually try and USE the rewards for dungeoneering, i can and will lose all my work up to level 60/80/whatever if i die.

[Blutters]

No matter what your rant is, the Tip.it community will lecture you on how you deserved it.

 

Sucks, Games. :thumbdown:

Yup... TIF motto: Kick 'em while they're down! It's more efficient.

 

Compare:

AGS, obtainable in a lucky afternoon

CLS, obtainable after about 40 hours, which is 40-80m with consistent methods and untold amounts with boss hunting

I'm going to basically agree with everything Es0torrath has said. The design, well, rather sucks as far as rewards go. I feel that they should have ditched the token system and allowed players to choose between a few comparable options at certain levels. Perhaps they could keep the tokens to buy the rewards you didn't choose, or just allow for another level to allow you to choose again. And, of course, buy replacements for GP.

These level 80 items are not just more valuable than other equipment, they take far longer to get. Anyone with these items is of course going to want to use them where it matters most. It's common sense that they should protect over lower-end gear that just takes luck to get.

 

Anyway, sorry to hear that you lost your CiaLiS, Games. You'll be far less competitive without it... :(

I don't know if they'll ever fix it, but it will probably be too late to help you anyway.

[Dragonlordjl]

Once you have already purcahsed an item, you should be able to buy it back for 1/4 of the tokens you spent obtaining the item. Therefore, chaotic items would cost 50k tokens to replace if you died with them. To balance this, they would always be destroyed if you drop them upon death. Is that a fair compromise?

[Sir_Kurity]

Well i dont know to be honest.

 

Dungeoneering a badly designed skill in general, and i think without a major overhaul it wont ever be really perfect. Because while (as i mentioned) i do think that yes, as a skill, the rewards should be more permanent.

 

But...

 

Should weapons that are among the strongest in the game be easily replaceable upon death?

Should a non combat skill have such sway over combat, both PVP and PVM, should you NEED 80 dungeoneering to compete in high level boss hunting?

If they are easily replacable, should the stats be nerfed? Or should the cost of upkeep be increased? Something that would make normal items like whip still viable to people with high dung?

Should you need dungeoneering to wield the item? Maybe the weapons should be tradeable, and have no dung requirement?

 

Its all well, just strange, and theres no easy solution to any of these problems.

 

Personally, with things like mobilising armies, dungeoneering, as well as some pretty crazy quest requirements for some essential quests currently in place, jagex obviously thinks that minigames, alternate skills, etc should have a large sway on combat, despite being minigames/non combat skills.

 

I personally dont think they should, but at this point, any nerf would make dungeoneering borderline useless.

 

Bah, damn you jagex and your crazy mini-game-skill-thing.

[Articultural]

I agree, Chaotic weapons should have a higher price on death (especially the staff/crossbow), but it's your own fault that you lost it. You knew the risks and yet still chose to take gear that would protect over it, no one is to blame but yourself.

[Omali]

and the same goes to firecape, torso, cw armor etc etc.

 

I think the system is fair enough to elaborate that you shouldn't bring valuables into high risk zones. Complaining about it is even worse.

 

Firecapes and torsos take a fraction of the time chaotic takes. Castle Wars armor is the direct equivalent of rune, at best, which is cheap and readily available. The only time one would use Castle Wars armor in battle is in Castle Wars, which is where you get the real benefits.

 

There is no comparison between those and chaotic equipment.

[Sir_Kurity]

I agree, Chaotic weapons should have a higher price on death (especially the staff/crossbow), but it's your own fault that you lost it. You knew the risks and yet still chose to take gear that would protect over it, no one is to blame but yourself.

 

What? Should i try and actually USE my rewards from dungeoneering, i can lose all my work up to level 80 just by dieing?

 

Sorry, that just doesnt make sense. As i said before, no other skill is like this, and no skill should be like this.

[mister_moocky]

I don't think people understand that what other items you bring are irrelevant. Like accumulators and achievement diary rewards, Dungeoneering rewards are always lost upon death outside of safezones. It's not about items protecting over them, it's one of many terrible ideas that went into Dung.

[Articultural]

^No they're not, gem/coal bags are but Chaotic items appear under your grave & protect over most medium-high levelled items (Barrows helms, rune body/legs, etc).

 

I agree, Chaotic weapons should have a higher price on death (especially the staff/crossbow), but it's your own fault that you lost it. You knew the risks and yet still chose to take gear that would protect over it, no one is to blame but yourself.

 

What? Should i try and actually USE my rewards from dungeoneering, i can lose all my work up to level 80 just by dieing?

 

Sorry, that just doesnt make sense. As i said before, no other skill is like this, and no skill should be like this.

 

You knew the risks when you brought your Chaotic item, it's your fault that you lost it. If you had been paying more attention when the other player tried to lure Prime onto you or not using items that protected over it, you might not have lost it.

[Sir_Kurity]

You knew the risks when you brought your Chaotic item, it's your fault that you lost it. If you had been paying more attention when the other player tried to lure Prime onto you or not using items that protected over it, you might not have lost it.

 

Thats not the point. The point is that the rewards from a skill, say dungeoneering, should be a little more permanent.

 

Its like losing the ability to cast ancients if you die with it. It shouldnt happen. But in dungeoneering's case, it does. You can potentially lose all your work up to level 80 dung just by dieing. No other skill is like that.

 

At the moment dungeoneering is still more of a minigame than a skill. You could effectively rename mobilising armies into a skill and it would be just as much of a skill as dungeoneering is.

[Blutters]

You knew the risks when you brought your Chaotic item, it's your fault that you lost it. If you had been paying more attention when the other player tried to lure Prime onto you or not using items that protected over it, you might not have lost it.

Its like losing the ability to cast ancients if you die with it. It shouldnt happen. But in dungeoneering's case, it does. You can potentially lose all your work up to level 80 dung just by dieing. No other skill is like that.

Although I agree fullheartedly with fixing this issue, I'd like to take a moment to contradict you by bringing up an equally important but longer standing issue which is the fact that if you die while using Ancients, you lose the ability to attack because you lose all of your runes.

 

Anyway, replacements for 10-20k tokens or better protection (TROJAN MAN!!). :thumbup: :thumbup:

 

Oh wow I actually already posted on this thread a long time ago...

[Sir_Kurity]

I'd like to take a moment to contradict you by bringing up an equally important but longer standing issue which is the fact that if you die while using Ancients, you lose the ability to attack because you lose all of your runes.

 

I'm sure your being sarcastic, but getting runes back is easy, getting a CLS takes weeks, months even, dependant on how you train.

[Articultural]

When you get 80 Dungeoneering, you gain the ability to weild a Chaotic weapon, regardless of whether you have one or not. In the same way, 75 Attack you gain the ability to weild a godsword, regardless of whether you have one or not.

 

How hard something is to obtain isn't relevant to how easily you should be able to get it back, as I said before, Chaotic weapons should have a higher value, but they don't. Unless Jagex decides to change their value, there's nothing we can do about it.

[Quyneax]

When you get 80 Dungeoneering, you gain the ability to weild a Chaotic weapon, regardless of whether you have one or not. In the same way, 75 Attack you gain the ability to weild a godsword, regardless of whether you have one or not.

 

Godswords and Chaotic weapons can't be compared. One is obtained by pure cash, the other by gaining dungeoneering xp in a dungeon. You NEED to get 2m xp, by training, to buy a chaotic item. E.G. at level 80 you get the ability to train to level 87 for a CLS. That's like saying you get the ability to make money for a godsword at 75 attack. Or maybe the abilty to get 82 attack at level 75 attack, at which point you'll recieve a gs. Your comparison doesn't make any sense, does it?

 

Now, dungeoneering to level 80 will give you enough tokens to get this sword as well, BUT any xp from lamps, tog, pengs etc. doesn't. To use an earlier example, penging to 75 attack wouldn't give you the ability to use a godsword. Weird, huh? Also, you can't make money for a gs through anything but training attack. It's 25m gp slayer for ya!

 

 

How hard something is to obtain isn't relevant to how easily you should be able to get it back, as I said before,

 

It's true there is no law saying this, but obviously this is not relevant to this discussion. People want easier reobtaining cause it's not there. You say it's not there. Duh. Now if you say it shouldn't be relevant, ok, that's an opinion. But neither are arguments.

 

 

Chaotic weapons should have a higher value, but they don't. Unless Jagex decides to change their value, there's nothing we can do about it.

 

We know, thank you. That's why we dicuss it, otherwise it would've been changed.

[Sir_Kurity]

When you get 80 Dungeoneering, you gain the ability to weild a Chaotic weapon, regardless of whether you have one or not. In the same way, 75 Attack you gain the ability to weild a godsword, regardless of whether you have one or not.

 

You can get a godsword before you get 75 attack.

 

You CANNOT get a chaotic weapon before you get 80 dung, its simply not possible at the moment, you need AT LEAST ~80 dung to get a chaotic weapon.

 

In an godswords case, getting the weapon is not dependant on the skill, in a chaotic weapons cause, getting the weapon IS dependant on the skill, and thus the only reward from dungeoneering is NOT the ability to wear it, but to actually get the item.

 

You might acutally have a point if it were possible to get a CLS without dungeoneering, or if it were tradeable, but at the moment it isnt, and your comparison is very simplistic.

 

This also makes spending XP lamps on dungeoneering borderline useless, because it doesnt give tokens, only XP, and as we all know dungeoneering XP is useless, only the tokens are actually worth anything.

[Sly_Wizard]

Don't take items you're not willing to lose in areas where you might die.