Ex-Professional Gamer's view of the "Scrub"

[T. Skill]

I haven't posted here in awhile, mostly just a lot of forum reading, but I thought this was worthy of a post.

 

I was linked to an interesting article written by an ex-professional Street Fighter player who discussed the term "scrub" (noob in RuneScape) and to whom it actually applies. I have many opinions about this article myself but I'd rather not leave you guys with an essay. What are your feelings on this article?

 

"A scrub is a player who is handicapped by self-imposed rules that the game knows nothing about. A scrub does not play to win."

 

Here is the article link: http://www.sirlin.net/ptw-book/intermediates-guide.html

 

P.S. I apologize in advance if this article has been posted before, I tried to search for it... but that doesn't always work so well. Enjoy.

[Utopia]

I really didn't bother to read the whole article, but a noob/scrub is all about opinion.

[Content]

Glad that's cleared up, now I can sleep at night.

[Bloodstain]

I really didn't bother to read the whole article, but a noob/scrub is all about opinion.

 

Feel the same way, also why should I care what an "Ex-professional" gamer cares? How is what he says more correct than what any other gamer says? Also why should I care what a made up insult means?

[T. Skill]

Yeah, I don't really care that he's an "ex-professional" either. I just that it was nice to see a different point of view. Especially when you consider how many people follow "un-written rules" (especially in PvP, god forbid you eat at over half health -.-).

 

However this type of thinking could apply to other aspects of the game. For example people who don't take advantage of all of their resources and limit themselves to a certain play style, and then flame others for not doing the same.

[Ginger_Warrior]

He's competed at the highest level, won tournaments, and almost definitely learned how to counter the supposedly 'cheap' unplayable tactics the scrubs are whining about, or else learned to use them himself better than everyone else.

 

You haven't - that's why you're losing.

 

Simple.

[Assume Nothing]

Ah, the response to the Wilderness argument about Scrub mentally. It's just one of the annoyances of playing RS, this mentally exists everywhere and the arguments for these self imposed rules are usually pretty weak.

 

Classic example: Dragon Claw haters

[green9090]

This is an excellent exploration of the people who play for "fun" and refuse to really understand what's going on around them. People who simply won't listen when they're told that they're training inefficiently (like someone who collects all their herbs and makes different potions with all of them), or use a CLS because "it hits higher." They're not really having more fun than anyone else, they're just refusing to think about their actions (or maybe aren't smart enough to understand how), and look down on people who try to optimize their time.

[Danqazmlp]

Yes, let's compare a 1v1 fighting game with an MMO with 20+ different skills, various PVM, PVP and non combat aspects. That comparison will work well :rolleyes:

 

They cannot be accurately compared because the reasons for playing them are often very different, especially at the level this guy seems to want to talk about.

[green9090]

Yes, let's compare a 1v1 fighting game with an MMO with 20+ different skills, various PVM, PVP and non combat aspects. That comparison will work well :rolleyes:

 

They cannot be accurately compared because the reasons for playing them are often very different, especially at the level this guy seems to want to talk about.

The comparison works quite well- are you thinking about what you're doing, or locking certain techniques away from yourself arbitrarily? "Cheap" Street Fighter tactics are analogous to math and logic in regards to how you play RS. To reach any sort of competence, you need to shed ideas about collecting all your own stuff and choosing weapons because they're pretty and think about optimization.

[Danqazmlp]

In a fighting game which he is talking about there is 1 goal, 1 aim, to win. Thinking anything other, as he says, is limiting. That is the aim of that game.

 

Runescape and most MMO's on the other hand do not have that. They are built on freedom to do what you want without aims. Because of this, you are free to play however you want with whatever mentality you find most fun. There is no outright winning or losing, only your own personal enjoyment.

[Myu]

And since most seem to assume that this is all about fighting, it's not. When you take noobs in RS, it means all types of noobs. That's too broad to put an exact definition on.

 

There is one deciding factor in RS, and it's time. You could view it as a game of efficiency where those who don't take the fast route(the right route) are noobs. In which case you lose sight of the fun factor, which is the biggest reason RS exists. And fun is not quantifiable as it's relative to every person and all the different activities in the game. So in a sense, you could draw the conclusion that there are no nooobs because there is no right way.

[The_Gabe]

I thought this was a topic about Scrubs and got sad.

[glasscube]

Don't think scrub really applies to Runescape as there really isn't much of a skill ceiling.

 

Sure, you can be more efficient than someone else but that doesn't make you inherently more skillful than someone else. I always viewed scrubs as someone who acted/pretended to be professional, but really had no idea what they were doing. People who acted cocky and arrogant.

 

Always viewed it differently from being a newb.

[green9090]

Don't think scrub really applies to Runescape as there really isn't much of a skill ceiling.

 

Sure, you can be more efficient than someone else but that doesn't make you inherently more skillful than someone else. I always viewed scrubs as someone who acted/pretended to be professional, but really had no idea what they were doing. People who acted cocky and arrogant.

 

Always viewed it differently from being a newb.

There is a difference- a noob makes armor in dungeoneering because they haven't realized it's useless yet. A scrub makes armor in dungeoneering because damn it they want to and no efficiency nerd is going to tell them what to do no matter how many "facts" they throw at them.

[Danqazmlp]

Don't think scrub really applies to Runescape as there really isn't much of a skill ceiling.

 

Sure, you can be more efficient than someone else but that doesn't make you inherently more skillful than someone else. I always viewed scrubs as someone who acted/pretended to be professional, but really had no idea what they were doing. People who acted cocky and arrogant.

 

Always viewed it differently from being a newb.

There is a difference- a noob makes armor in dungeoneering because they haven't realized it's useless yet. A scrub makes armor in dungeoneering because damn it they want to and no efficiency nerd is going to tell them what to do no matter how many "facts" they throw at them.

 

*newb

 

Even in dungeoneering there is no imposed goal or aim. In a fighting game, there is win or lose, nothing else. In runescape, there is a lot more, even in dungeoneering, a player does not have to go 100% to the best exp, they can do what they want. A scrub is somebody who would be trying to attain one thing yet would not listen to the best way to do it. What you describe is not that, what you describe is somebody playing the game in a different way from you.

 

Runescape is too diverse to simply label people in one way.

[Greedy]

Yes, let's compare a 1v1 fighting game with an MMO with 20+ different skills, various PVM, PVP and non combat aspects. That comparison will work well :rolleyes:

 

They cannot be accurately compared because the reasons for playing them are often very different, especially at the level this guy seems to want to talk about.

O yes you can compare. It is the way how to play the game; want to play how the developers intented it has to be played or to play not. The scrub in Street Fighter would probably profession all moves to be allround, the PK'er works on only one efficient tactic for one favorite fighter. In RuneScape this works the same, buyable skills are specific the area to look at; the do-it-yourselvers (self supporting) could be called as the scrub. They buy nothing, they collect all ingredients them self to level their skills. This is by far the cheapest way to play in RuneScape, but no shortcuts to level faster. The "maxer" goes for fastest xp per hour possible and don't care about the wide variation of summoning scrolls, magic spells or potions at all. Same for monsters hunters + skillers who gain their wealth by actually playing the game versus the professional merchanters who never leaves the market area and stand there bragging their partyhats.

 

Do you want to explore the game? Or do you prefer to exell in one niche of this game? Pure PK'ers and merchanters choose the "winners" option. They don't care about the Confucian 'road to the goal'. Just search for Confucianism and specific Taoism in Wikipedia, because this discussion is in fact about Taoism.

 

I dare to call myself a "scrub". I never bought 1 bone for prayer from players of Grand Exchange in 5 years. I just collect them by killing monsters or picked them up as left behind items from other players.

[pulli23]

I haven't posted here in awhile, mostly just a lot of forum reading, but I thought this was worthy of a post.

 

I was linked to an interesting article written by an ex-professional Street Fighter player who discussed the term "scrub" (noob in RuneScape) and to whom it actually applies. I have many opinions about this article myself but I'd rather not leave you guys with an essay. What are your feelings on this article?

 

"A scrub is a player who is handicapped by self-imposed rules that the game knows nothing about. A scrub does not play to win."

 

Here is the article link: http://www.sirlin.net/ptw-book/intermediates-guide.html

 

P.S. I apologize in advance if this article has been posted before, I tried to search for it... but that doesn't always work so well. Enjoy.

Uhm "professional player" is such a stupid term.. It is a self-proclaimed professionalism. Anyone who gives himself that name is just full of himself.

[green9090]

I haven't posted here in awhile, mostly just a lot of forum reading, but I thought this was worthy of a post.

 

I was linked to an interesting article written by an ex-professional Street Fighter player who discussed the term "scrub" (noob in RuneScape) and to whom it actually applies. I have many opinions about this article myself but I'd rather not leave you guys with an essay. What are your feelings on this article?

 

"A scrub is a player who is handicapped by self-imposed rules that the game knows nothing about. A scrub does not play to win."

 

Here is the article link: http://www.sirlin.net/ptw-book/intermediates-guide.html

 

P.S. I apologize in advance if this article has been posted before, I tried to search for it... but that doesn't always work so well. Enjoy.

Uhm "professional player" is such a stupid term.. It is a self-proclaimed professionalism. Anyone who gives himself that name is just full of himself.

Professional gaming means you game for a living- he earned money from competing in tournaments. It's not a pretentious label, it's what his job was called.

[Bladewing]

Even in dungeoneering there is no imposed goal or aim.

 

don't die, kill the boss, and get your xp and tokens

[SixFootOne]

Even in dungeoneering there is no imposed goal or aim.

 

don't die, kill the boss, and get your xp and tokens

 

Well not everyone plays solely for those reasons. For example trying to earn every dungeoneering title, trying to earn a specific item from a boss or slayer creature, end the game with the most cash, playing for the enjoyment of figuring out a dungeon and the challenge of killing a boss, trying to earn xp for a specific skill (smithing, mining, fishing, or even combat xp), finishing a dungeon before a friend does.

[green9090]

Even in dungeoneering there is no imposed goal or aim.

 

don't die, kill the boss, and get your xp and tokens

 

Well not everyone plays solely for those reasons. For example trying to earn every dungeoneering title, trying to earn a specific item from a boss or slayer creature, end the game with the most cash, playing for the enjoyment of figuring out a dungeon and the challenge of killing a boss, trying to earn xp for a specific skill (smithing, mining, fishing, or even combat xp), finishing a dungeon before a friend does.

And some people play fighting games to do all the moves and enjoy the graphics.

 

The fact is, most people going into Daemonheim have the goal of earning dungeoneering exp, and some of them have decided to do it poorly just because "that's the way it's meant to be played" or some rubbish.

[Bloodstain]

 

The fact is, most people going into Daemonheim have the goal of earning dungeoneering exp, and some of them have decided to do it poorly just because "that's the way it's meant to be played" or some rubbish.

 

You seem like your main goal in RS is to max out and get as much exp as efficiently as possible, which is fine. But that's not everyone's goal, hell I've been playing over 5 years and I'm just about to get my first 99. I just never cared about xp or getting high stats, I did whatever was fun the day I logged in regardless of how efficient it was. Different play styles, different goals

[T. Skill]

 

The fact is, most people going into Daemonheim have the goal of earning dungeoneering exp, and some of them have decided to do it poorly just because "that's the way it's meant to be played" or some rubbish.

 

You seem like your main goal in RS is to max out and get as much exp as efficiently as possible, which is fine. But that's not everyone's goal, hell I've been playing over 5 years and I'm just about to get my first 99. I just never cared about xp or getting high stats, I did whatever was fun the day I logged in regardless of how efficient it was. Different play styles, different goals

 

Which is why RuneScape is so appealing to a diverse audience. There's so much you can do which is awesome.

 

However as was said before, many people choose to fit into different "niches" in that diversity. And a small minority of those people (to which this topic would apply to) choose to claim that others are "doing it wrong".

[NukeMarine]

Yes, let's compare a 1v1 fighting game with an MMO with 20+ different skills, various PVM, PVP and non combat aspects. That comparison will work well :rolleyes:

 

They cannot be accurately compared because the reasons for playing them are often very different, especially at the level this guy seems to want to talk about.

 

It's easy to find that mentality in RS. Try putting on protection prayers and read all the pkers complain about it. Same can be said about complaints on teleporting, potions, safing, etc. It's basically saying don't do stuff that makes it harder for me to kill you and easier for you to kill me. Oh yeah, what's the opinion on Castle War flag holders? Players that just deliver minimum amount of kills in Pest Control? Buying skills? It's people who think others should play the game how they play, even though there's nothing in the games code that enforces that opinion.

 

Now, complaining about the game allowing such tactics is not being a scrub. Unlike Street Fighter, Runescape will change its rules based on player feedback. Perhaps if you have lots of players following "honor rules", then that's a hint that such a rule should be mandatory via a change in the game's program. However, until that change comes about, if you're not using every advantage offered within the rules then you're not really playing to win. I might teleport while skulled during a fight, but I still feel such action should be prohibited or have some type of retribution attached.