Why can't F2P have...?

[Psycho_Robot]

I would have to disagree with that, Kalafai. If we, as F2P, were to get a P2P skill, it would make more sense for it to be fletching (arrows at least) since we can already make our own runes for combat (for strikes at least) and our own melee weapons. So why not range?

I agree. Members would benefit from a lot of things being made F2P, contrary to what the OMG NO PAY NO PLAY crowd might say.

[langer]

Give them things which only P2P can make, so we can make money off things like fletching yew shorts for f2p.

 

Personally, I would love for all armored boots up to rune be given to F2P. It would make nech tasks decent again, as I believe the price would land around 150k-200k for a pair.

 

This wouldn't be a bad idea, much like treasure trails.

[Youmu]

Speaking of the P2Pers...

 

Why would they be so stubborn to F2P? Giving things to F2P won't hurt. Here are some of the responses that the typical P2Pers make, and my replies to them:

"You don't pay!" It's called "advertisements".

"Giving things will make prices crash!" They will rise actually, since F2Pers give demand for the products more than supply.

"No pay, no play!" Who cares? Paying does not make you special. I also play on weekends only, so paying would just be a waste.

"F2P should not get updates!" Even though F2P is updated at a regular pace, P2P will still have everything there is to offer. So saying that F2P shouldn't get updates is pointless.

 

Of course, I may have missed some other responses, but here are the most commonly used ones.

[wcingisbad]

Is there any actual reason for this entire thread? F2P don't get stuff because they don't pay, no point asking why when the answer is in the first post.

 

 

 

Some F2Pers like to dream of a better game, some of us P2Pers like to remind them it's already out there.

 

If this thread didn't exist, the P2P trolls in these boards (like Dzihouchan) would have to take their trolling elsewhere.

[langer]

Speaking of the P2Pers...

 

Why would they be so stubborn to F2P? Giving things to F2P won't hurt. Here are some of the responses that the typical P2Pers make, and my replies to them:

"You don't pay!" It's called "advertisements".

"Giving things will make prices crash!" They will rise actually, since F2Pers give demand for the products more than supply.

"No pay, no play!" Who cares? Paying does not make you special. I also play on weekends only, so paying would just be a waste.

"F2P should not get updates!" Even though F2P is updated at a regular pace, P2P will still have everything there is to offer. So saying that F2P shouldn't get updates is pointless.

 

Of course, I may have missed some other responses, but here are the most commonly used ones.

 

Still, it's true that you don't pay. I'm P2P and I'm still bombarded by advertisments everytime I go to the RS homepage.

As for the no pay, no play comments about "who cares", Well Jagex cares. If everyone had access to the full game without paying, they would sure go bankrupt very quickly.

[langer]

Is there any actual reason for this entire thread? F2P don't get stuff because they don't pay, no point asking why when the answer is in the first post.

 

 

 

Some F2Pers like to dream of a better game, some of us P2Pers like to remind them it's already out there.

 

If this thread didn't exist, the P2P trolls in these boards (like Dzihouchan) would have to take their trolling elsewhere.

 

I see this thread as a kid's wish list for christmas. It's actually one of my favorite thread along with the ban and mute sticky.

[Youmu]

Speaking of the P2Pers...

 

Why would they be so stubborn to F2P? Giving things to F2P won't hurt. Here are some of the responses that the typical P2Pers make, and my replies to them:

"You don't pay!" It's called "advertisements".

"Giving things will make prices crash!" They will rise actually, since F2Pers give demand for the products more than supply.

"No pay, no play!" Who cares? Paying does not make you special. I also play on weekends only, so paying would just be a waste.

"F2P should not get updates!" Even though F2P is updated at a regular pace, P2P will still have everything there is to offer. So saying that F2P shouldn't get updates is pointless.

 

Of course, I may have missed some other responses, but here are the most commonly used ones.

 

Still, it's true that you don't pay. I'm P2P and I'm still bombarded by advertisments everytime I go to the RS homepage.

As for the no pay, no play comments about "who cares", Well Jagex cares. If everyone had access to the full game without paying, they would sure go bankrupt very quickly.

Still, "We don't pay!" is not a good reason as to why F2P should not get updates.

 

I also know that with no P2P, Jagex would go bankrupt, but saying that "either stop playing or start paying" is very silly. Seriously, we F2Pers are players too. There's a reason why there's the Top 250 F2P Skill Total List, and with no F2P means that Jagex has just lost over 6 million players (and even more as P2Pers membership expires).

 

And I shall say this again: Even though F2P is updated frequently, P2P will still have everything there is to offer, therefore it is still very worth it to go P2P.

 

RSOFers (and most P2Pers in general) don't understand this fact.

 

By the way, you just double posted. Just telling ya.

[langer]

F2P should get updates...at exactly the same pace they have been getting over the last 5 years. I'm fine with that.

 

The stop playing or start paying argument is often used towards F2Pers that feel their game is getting boring. It's mostly just an advice. The reason why there is an unnoficial top 250 F2P is because top F2Pers want to shine under the spotlight. I don't know who tells you that you are not players, it's pretty obvious F2Pers are players. F2P is not gonna go anytime soon, this has absolutely nothing to do with this argument.

 

It is indeed very worth it to go P2P especially compared to F2P.

 

I could use the same generalisation towards F2Pers regarding the fact that they don't understand how a business works. Give too much for free and your customers will not be inclined to pay. Give not enough and they won't be inclined to test the paying version. I think Jagex balances their updates pretty well.

 

I indeed double posted, burn me on top of the highest mountain.

[Youmu]

F2P should get updates...at exactly the same pace they have been getting over the last 5 years. I'm fine with that.

 

The stop playing or start paying argument is often used towards F2Pers that feel their game is getting boring. It's mostly just an advice. The reason why there is an unnoficial top 250 F2P is because top F2Pers want to shine under the spotlight. I don't know who tells you that you are not players, it's pretty obvious F2Pers are players. F2P is not gonna go anytime soon, this has absolutely nothing to do with this argument.

 

It is indeed very worth it to go P2P especially compared to F2P.

 

I could use the same generalisation towards F2Pers regarding the fact that they don't understand how a business works. Give too much for free and your customers will not be inclined to pay. Give not enough and they won't be inclined to test the paying version. I think Jagex balances their updates pretty well.

 

I indeed double posted, burn me on top of the highest mountain.

Hang on, I didn't say that F2P should get as much updates as P2P should! If there are too many updates in F2P, it will all be very confusing for most, especially when people like me do not play as often as others. I think they should stay updating at the exact same pace, it's just that there are a few pieces missing from the puzzle. This is why most F2Pers ask for specific stuff, and not just things like "moar whips pl0x?".

 

I ask for bank space, because the current amount of items I have is 70, more than the 68 bank space we have now. I would have even more if I bothered to get stuff such as shade robes and the muddy key, and I have yet to get zombie gloves.

 

Skillcapes are demanded, because, no matter what, a 99 is a 99, and the purpose of them is to show off that you have a 99 in that skill. You earn the cape, not pay for it. That defeats the purpose.

 

I never thought that F2P was boring, in fact it's really good right now. If it really were, I wouldn't even be playing right now. The reason why I could not pay is because that I do not play as often as the most of you, and paying would essentially be a waste if I did. If I can play more, then I would most definitely go P2P and enjoy Runescape even more.

 

And yes, I have heard people that say "F2P does not contribute". *Points to Jaffy1 in the skillcapes debate*

[langer]

I agree with everything you pointed out except maybe the skillscape part but let me explain why first.

 

On a personnal basis, I have no problem with F2P getting the 99 capes if they are toned down in terms of stats. These are currently the 2 second best melee cape in the game if you have them trimmed. I wouldn't mind if a F2P skill cape add + 5 def and + 2 pray instead of the current +9 with +4 pray.

 

On the business side of the argument (Jagex point of view that I can only guess at), giving high end-game rewards to free players only encourage the behavior to not suscribe to the full game. Anyone with enough XP to get a 99 in F2P will most likely never subscribe to members. Why would Jagex reward those who do not contribute financially to their game? I know you will point out that they contribute by "viewing" ads... It's been establish in this thread or the F2P skillcapes thread that the marginal contribution by F2P player is about 25 times less than an actual paying member.

 

F2P should get updates, some are more a priority than others. Combat triangle and bank space are indeed things that should be on the table.

[Youmu]

I agree with everything you pointed out except maybe the skillscape part but let me explain why first.

 

On a personnal basis, I have no problem with F2P getting the 99 capes if they are toned down in terms of stats. These are currently the 2 second best melee cape in the game if you have them trimmed. I wouldn't mind if a F2P skill cape add + 5 def and + 2 pray instead of the current +9 with +4 pray.

 

On the business side of the argument (Jagex point of view that I can only guess at), giving high end-game rewards to free players only encourage the behavior to not suscribe to the full game. Anyone with enough XP to get a 99 in F2P will most likely never subscribe to members. Why would Jagex reward those who do not contribute financially to their game? I know you will point out that they contribute by "viewing" ads... It's been establish in this thread or the F2P skillcapes thread that the marginal contribution by F2P player is about 25 times less than an actual paying member.

 

F2P should get updates, some are more a priority than others. Combat triangle and bank space are indeed things that should be on the table.

Still, P2P has all the skills, and F2P only has 15. It's a silly idea to say that if someone got a 99 in F2P they will never become members, because members will still have everything. People will still subscribe no matter what. Jagex established that they will put more commitment to the free game as well.

 

I agree with the stats being toned down, btw.

[Dirkmetal]

I agree with everything you pointed out except maybe the skillscape part but let me explain why first.

 

On a personnal basis, I have no problem with F2P getting the 99 capes if they are toned down in terms of stats. These are currently the 2 second best melee cape in the game if you have them trimmed. I wouldn't mind if a F2P skill cape add + 5 def and + 2 pray instead of the current +9 with +4 pray.

 

On the business side of the argument (Jagex point of view that I can only guess at), giving high end-game rewards to free players only encourage the behavior to not suscribe to the full game. Anyone with enough XP to get a 99 in F2P will most likely never subscribe to members. Why would Jagex reward those who do not contribute financially to their game? I know you will point out that they contribute by "viewing" ads... It's been establish in this thread or the F2P skillcapes thread that the marginal contribution by F2P player is about 25 times less than an actual paying member.

 

F2P should get updates, some are more a priority than others. Combat triangle and bank space are indeed things that should be on the table.

Still, P2P has all the skills, and F2P only has 15. It's a silly idea to say that if someone got a 99 in F2P they will never become members, because members will still have everything. People will still subscribe no matter what. Jagex established that they will put more commitment to the free game as well.

 

I agree with the stats being toned down, btw.

But one Trimmed skill cape is no different then 15 or 20 skill capes. It's still an endgame defense item.

[langer]

Well, I never said that no F2Per with 99 skills will ever subscribe. I just said I was less likely than someone that invested that much time in the half game will switch to the full game. My question is : why should Jagex reward these specific players?

 

Of course it wouldn't stop people from subscribing, but it would give F2Pers a goal to reach...thus giving them less incentive to subscribe. It's purely an economial question.

[unkn0wnwarrior]

I still disagree with the bank space part. We were given 8 with the GE, which doesn't include the spaces saved from "setting" our armors (another 6 for 1 of set of each group, I think?). I don't think it should be a priority update. We haven't really gotten much in the line of new items since then. If they add new items while balancing mage at higher levels, then I will see a need for the bank space. Until then, we don't really need more.

[Youmu]

Well, I never said that no F2Per with 99 skills will ever subscribe. I just said I was less likely than someone that invested that much time in the half game will switch to the full game. My question is : why should Jagex reward these specific players?

 

Of course it wouldn't stop people from subscribing, but it would give F2Pers a goal to reach...thus giving them less incentive to subscribe. It's purely an economial question.

Some people like to play F2P more than P2P. It's their decision, they shouldn't get pressured into playing the members' game. This was the reason of why gnomecopters were removed - it persuades F2Pers to go P2P even though circumstances prevent them from doing so.

 

Also, maxing out F2P is a very difficult accomplishment. Only 8 players have done it so far, although #9 is coming close. I think Jagex should also add something for maxing out F2P respectively, because of their dedication towards the free game.

 

Just because giving F2P a goal to reach does not mean that it gives less incentive for them to subscribe. There are more quests, achievement diaries, areas, monsters, and so on and on in P2P. When they completed that F2P goal, maybe then they will get members to experience those things. P2P is clearly superior to F2P in terms of content.

 

By the way, I personally do not really care for a skillcape. However, F2Pers should still get it as it shows that they got a 99 there. Quick chat is an okay indication... but I rather just wear the cape so I don't have to say it.

[langer]

I think it would not be in Jagex' best financial interests to keep F2Pers interested too much in the free game. It has nothing to do with the difficulty of getting a 99 over the P2P way, it's purely a financial question. An incentive is not the same thing as pressure to subscribe, you seem to mix those together.

 

I'm gonna speculate here and tell you how I think Jagex sees F2P.

 

- It's a game they offer for free to attract people into subscribing to the full game thus gaining them more money to invest in whatever projects they have. The more they offer for free (especially at higher levels) the more F2Pers will have an incentive to remain F2P and to reach their personnal goals.

 

As for rewards to maxed out F2Pers, they invited the top 5 to visit their facility recently, talk about reward!

[Youmu]

I think it would not be in Jagex' best financial interests to keep F2Pers interested too much in the free game. It has nothing to do with the difficulty of getting a 99 over the P2P way, it's purely a financial question. An incentive is not the same thing as pressure to subscribe, you seem to mix those together.

 

I'm gonna speculate here and tell you how I think Jagex sees F2P.

 

- It's a game they offer for free to attract people into subscribing to the full game thus gaining them more money to invest in whatever projects they have. The more they offer for free (especially at higher levels) the more F2Pers will have an incentive to remain F2P and to reach their personnal goals.

 

As for rewards to maxed out F2Pers, they invited the top 5 to visit their facility recently, talk about reward!

But didn't Jagex said in one of the Updates (the Mod MMG one) that F2P is not a demo, rather, a part of the complete game?

 

I don't really think Jagex intended F2P to be something that lures people to play P2P. If they did think that, then gnomecopters would still be here.

[langer]

What a corporation says is not always what it thinks. That is an unwritten rule of business. They have to tell their customers what they want to hear. In reality, F2P acts like a giant demo, or at least a very exhaustive trial game. Granted een calling it a demo is not the proper way to describe it because of the lenght you can go playing this game without paying.

 

If F2P is not intended to "lure" people to P2P, then what is it intended for? Making a game to please people? As friendly as Jagex are, one of their objective is to make money, that is how all corporations work. Of course their goal is to get the most players possible to subscribe.

 

I have no idea why they removed gnomecopters, it was a great way to show non-members some stuff they could already see extensively on youtube.

[Youmu]

What a corporation says is not always what it thinks. That is an unwritten rule of business. They have to tell their customers what they want to hear. In reality, F2P acts like a giant demo, or at least a very exhaustive trial game. Granted een calling it a demo is not the proper way to describe it because of the lenght you can go playing this game without paying.

 

If F2P is not intended to "lure" people to P2P, then what is it intended for? Making a game to please people? As friendly as Jagex are, one of their objective is to make money, that is how all corporations work. Of course their goal is to get the most players possible to subscribe.

 

I have no idea why they removed gnomecopters, it was a great way to show non-members some stuff they could already see extensively on youtube.

If F2P really were a demo, then this is a really good one, since it is an unlimited trial, and it has pretty good stuff. It lacks in quests, achievement diaries, areas, real bosses (not revs), and a plethora of other stuff, but that's why there is P2P.

 

Jagex is trying to "lure" people to go P2P, while at the same time, making a F2P game to please people that cannot go P2P, for whatever reasons. They care about updating F2P as well as their main priority, P2P. If Jagex only sees F2P as a demo, then after RS2, F2P won't ever get updated. Ever.

[langer]

Yes agreed on both parts. They need to maintain F2P updated to keep a player base and so the free game remains attractive to new players. So far, it worked pretty well.

[NJE03]

 

If F2P is not intended to "lure" people to P2P, then what is it intended for? Making a game to please people? As friendly as Jagex are, one of their objective is to make money, that is how all corporations work. Of course their goal is to get the most players possible to subscribe.

 

Are you aware that when Runescape was first released there was no P2P?

 

I have never heard of a demo containing years and years worth of potential playability.

[Kimberly]

Personally, I'd like to see f2p get wilderness capes also. I'm not a clan person, but some friends are. And they always mention how it would be so much better having battles in f2p with other clans, if they had the capes also.

 

F2P'ers can access the wilderness capes, they're tradeable non-member items :D

[Psycho_Robot]

Personally, I'd like to see f2p get wilderness capes also. I'm not a clan person, but some friends are. And they always mention how it would be so much better having battles in f2p with other clans, if they had the capes also.

 

F2P'ers can access the wilderness capes, they're tradeable non-member items :D

They weren't when that post was made :wink:

[langer]

 

If F2P is not intended to "lure" people to P2P, then what is it intended for? Making a game to please people? As friendly as Jagex are, one of their objective is to make money, that is how all corporations work. Of course their goal is to get the most players possible to subscribe.

 

Are you aware that when Runescape was first released there was no P2P?

 

I have never heard of a demo containing years and years worth of potential playability.

 

Yes I'm aware of that fact. The internet business has changed a lot since then. The game wouldn't have grown this far without P2P.

 

The potential playability is what makes the F2P game that much unique, though I still maintain that its purpose is about the same as a demo, even though it is way much more than a standard trial game or demo.

[Youmu]

If Jagex wants to give F2P a new skill, they should just hand us over Fletching. In my opinion, this is the only skill that really needs to be in F2P. They should let us fletch arrows up to adamant, and bows up to maple.

 

I don't think F2P needs a totally new skill, that new skill can just go to members.