6-May-2014 - Elder Divination

[helring]

All the gods are effectively immortal, they can only be killed by elder artefacts or very powerful things.

 

The nuance with Tier 2 gods is they are able to abandon their body at will (unlike lower tiers), meaning even if you kill their body they can survive unless they choose to let themselves die or it happens too quickly.

 

Essentially they can be killed, it just has to be quick and completely surprise them so they have no opportunity to leave their body.

 

In terms of the metaphysics line for me it is a simple:

A real god - much like in all modern religions - is a being that is not supposed to have been created by anything. It's the ultimate power and always was as it is.

The not technically a gods - All have a finite creator or ascended from being a mortal being and are simply worshipped as gods because they have so much power.

 

In my head the 'lesser gods' are like you Justin Biebers of Gielinor - they are worshipped and looked up to and perhaps have some greater power by circumstance than people, but ultimately they are just 'normal' and elevated by circumstance. Where as the Elder Gods are comparable to the deities depicted in our religion - they aren't a human they are something beyond us, beyond the universe, the creator and master of all, existence itself is because of them etc.

 

 

But it appears they lay and are born from eggs, and can be born damaged like Mah...are they still gods or just a race of very powerful creatures?

[Saradomin_Mage]

It begs the question of "What created the Elder Gods?"

 

In my head the 'lesser gods' are like you Justin Biebers of Gielinor

This is the most terrifying shit I've ever read.

[Sy_Accursed]

That is indeed a question to be answered - but my stance is just based on the current status quo of our knowledge.

 

Besides it's not like gods having god babies is unheard of - the Titans, Greek gods and Roman gods would all fall on the 'true god' side of the line and they all have children and such-like.

 

I mean if 2 humans have a child its still a human or if a flower asexually reproduces its still a flower, so why couldn't gods breed or asexually reproduce and still be 100% pure god?

[meili]

That is indeed a question to be answered - but my stance is just based on the current status quo of our knowledge.

 

Besides it's not like gods having god babies is unheard of - the Titans, Greek gods and Roman gods would all fall on the 'true god' side of the line and they all have children and such-like.

 

I mean if 2 humans have a child its still a human or if a flower asexually reproduces its still a flower, so why couldn't gods breed or asexually reproduce and still be 100% pure god?

 

 Dang, god babies and Beiber. I'm scared now.

[HunterDexter]

All Elder Gods come from Edda-Mah, Edda-Bik, Edda-Wen, Edda Ful and Edda-Jas, the first generation of Elder Gods. Who created those, well... Guess that's stuff we won't dive into in the near future.

[Wkw]

All Elder Gods come from Edda-Mah, Edda-Bik, Edda-Wen, Edda Ful and Edda-Jas, the first generation of Elder Gods. Who created those, well... Guess that's stuff we won't dive into in the near future.

How do we know that Edda- were the first, and just not the next in a long line of elder gods in a long line of unicerses?

[Alg]

Tip.It: where we argue over the origins of a set of entities whose powers include the ability to tell cause and effect to go [bleep] itself. :mrgreen:

[Sy_Accursed]

 

All Elder Gods come from Edda-Mah, Edda-Bik, Edda-Wen, Edda Ful and Edda-Jas, the first generation of Elder Gods. Who created those, well... Guess that's stuff we won't dive into in the near future.

How do we know that Edda- were the first, and just not the next in a long line of elder gods in a long line of unicerses?

 

As the lore currently stands there was at least 1 universe before ours of which Frenskae was the end point and that Dragonking and at least 1 other species came from.

 

The definition for Edda came from the FAQ about this update which explicitly said it meant first of that name; though of course it is worth noting the presumably the source for the memories is Mah, being as we are siphoning her energy when we obtain them. So we do not know the reliability of her deciding to call them the first of their name, only that this is what she has called them as presumably she knows of none of their species coming before them.

 

Of course we equally do not know that she is referring to OUR Elder gods. It is not implausible that Elder gods have repeating lines - Jas births another Jas and so on and so forth and that Jas Ful Wen Bik and Mah are simply the five surviving lines of the dying species, and that the next generation will lose Mah given her deformity.

[Alg]

Crazy, baseless theory: The EG's endgame will involve restoring Mah in a larger scale version of the Mahjarrat's ritual of rejuvenation.

 

...Apologies for any lore mistakes here, I'm not in a position where I can research it properly.

[Sy_Accursed]

Well as it stands the lore on their end-game is they want to save their dying species and theres an elder halls stuffed full of eggs.

 

So its safe to assume there's a Jas Ful Wen and Bik egg and if their 'saving species' plans and the 'full' part pan out its plausible they'd be a manufactured Mah-esque egg as well as several others.

 

But in terms of actually rejuvenating the existing Mah? I doubt it - they thought she was dead and abandoned her many thousands of years ago now. I mean Gielinor history amounts to ~10k years and that only counts since Guthix arrived and it is the youngest of all the worlds. So we are talking like 100k years+ probably since they abandoned her.

[Wkw]

Crazy, baseless theory: The EG's endgame will involve restoring Mah in a larger scale version of the Mahjarrat's ritual of rejuvenation.

 

...Apologies for any lore mistakes here, I'm not in a position where I can research it properly.

 

I would like to see this..

 

It'd be a real plot twist that Mah was just disabled; stunted. Not born retarded, but still weakened..

And because of that, she wouldn't have been able to leave to another plane because she is just weakened.

 

 

And in a quest, we somehow rejuvenate Mah more than she's ever been, and find out that the potential of the universe and the elder gods is in lesser life, explaining why she actively created life (Zaros, Seren, the Mahajarat).. And that she is a benevolent elder god, like Zaros, and would want to stop her sisters from eating the universe for their babies.

 

DEEEP

[primadog]

Well as it stands the lore on their end-game is they want to save their dying species and theres an elder halls stuffed full of eggs.

 

So its safe to assume there's a Jas Ful Wen and Bik egg and if their 'saving species' plans and the 'full' part pan out its plausible they'd be a manufactured Mah-esque egg as well as several others.

 

But in terms of actually rejuvenating the existing Mah? I doubt it - they thought she was dead and abandoned her many thousands of years ago now. I mean Gielinor history amounts to ~10k years and that only counts since Guthix arrived and it is the youngest of all the worlds. So we are talking like 100k years+ probably since they abandoned her.

 

Dying species seems to be a recurring theme in RuneScape quest lore of the past few years - Mahjarrat, dragon riders, white dragon.  I wonder whether that's intentional or just lazy writing by JaGeX.

[HunterDexter]

Nah, just stealing from other sources.

 

[Sy_Accursed]

 

Well as it stands the lore on their end-game is they want to save their dying species and theres an elder halls stuffed full of eggs.

 

So its safe to assume there's a Jas Ful Wen and Bik egg and if their 'saving species' plans and the 'full' part pan out its plausible they'd be a manufactured Mah-esque egg as well as several others.

 

But in terms of actually rejuvenating the existing Mah? I doubt it - they thought she was dead and abandoned her many thousands of years ago now. I mean Gielinor history amounts to ~10k years and that only counts since Guthix arrived and it is the youngest of all the worlds. So we are talking like 100k years+ probably since they abandoned her.

 

Dying species seems to be a recurring theme in RuneScape quest lore of the past few years - Mahjarrat, dragon riders, white dragon.  I wonder whether that's intentional or just lazy writing by JaGeX.

 

I think it is somewhat mistaken to say it is a current theme.

 

Mahjaratt as a dwindling population with no means of breeding has been established for many many years.

White Dragons as an extinct species has been around ever since 3rd age rewards from treasure trails.

Dragonriders breeding issue has been established for a few years, and they were thought to be extinct here anyway.

 

It's just coincidental that these species and characters feature in recent stories, but they have all been long established.

[strilmus]

 

All Elder Gods come from Edda-Mah, Edda-Bik, Edda-Wen, Edda Ful and Edda-Jas, the first generation of Elder Gods. Who created those, well... Guess that's stuff we won't dive into in the near future.

How do we know that Edda- were the first, and just not the next in a long line of elder gods in a long line of unicerses?

 

are you suggesting that there was a

 

edda-mommy

[Saradomin_Mage]

 

 

All Elder Gods come from Edda-Mah, Edda-Bik, Edda-Wen, Edda Ful and Edda-Jas, the first generation of Elder Gods. Who created those, well... Guess that's stuff we won't dive into in the near future.

How do we know that Edda- were the first, and just not the next in a long line of elder gods in a long line of unicerses?

 

are you suggesting that there was a

 

edda-mommy

 

I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought of that when I first saw the words Edda-Mah.

 

[Omali]

 

 

 

All Elder Gods come from Edda-Mah, Edda-Bik, Edda-Wen, Edda Ful and Edda-Jas, the first generation of Elder Gods. Who created those, well... Guess that's stuff we won't dive into in the near future.

How do we know that Edda- were the first, and just not the next in a long line of elder gods in a long line of unicerses?

 

are you suggesting that there was a

 

edda-mommy

 

I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought of that when I first saw the words Edda-Mah.

 

 

 

Edda-pah was a deadbeat dad and isn't in the picture anymore.