Syd

Well if someone really wants to play only the free-to-play version of the game, which in my ears sounds just silly, why can't they for example make a small fee to get your account into the hiscores for good? You pay few dollars once and you get your account eternal ticket to the highscores, no matter whether you're free-to-play or pay-to-play. This only concerns accounts who have never bought membership. If you buy membership, you'll get that eternal ticket to hiscores automatically. This should at the same time remove those accounts that are not active anymore. If you really can't pay that few dollars a month to enjoy the full game, then I don't have that much pity on you. Jagex is a company that funds it's servers and employees by the people who pay for their product. If you are not going to pay for the game, why should you have a word on what they do with their product?

And this leads to another point that I wanted to talk about: selling floors. What are your opinions on this? Is it reasonable? Fair? Is selling or buying floors efficient? I'd personally not buy or sell floors even if I could, cause it doesn't feel like a way the skill should be trained.

About time. :thumbup:

88-90 Dungeoneering. Should've dged a bit more. Did few barrows runs, got nothing. In overall, didn't play that much. Double dg xp was fun though. :smile:

How I see it, is that the problem for new generation of players is simply the huge, impossible gap from start to the top. The game has been around for so long, that a new player with no knowledge of the game has pretty much no chances to keep up with the players who have played longer, trained their skills and made their wealth already. Let's face it, huge part of RuneScapes competetive and efficient gameplay is result of hiscores, skillcapes and show off items like rares. Reaching higher end of hiscores is not even possible anymore, as all the highest ranks already have maxed 200m experience, and for new player starting the skill going for 200m experience seems total madness. It will take multiple years to reach even 99s, unless you're really dedicated and fast to learn. The players with already higher levels keep gaining more and more wealth while newer players try to accumulate enough for some mediocre gear and items, while the best gear and most rare items keep going further away from new players grasp. Of course, this doesn't rule out all the players, and I'm not saying someone starting now couldn't someday be a "famous endgame player", but it really rules 99% of other new players out from it. It doesn't either mean that it would stop all new players from starting, but it will definitely stop some. I think we just need more and more content, variation and as said before - better graphics, more interesting quests, more choices and more activities - to give players the more feel of achievement while playing. Instead of having to compete against players who have already played 5-10 years and already maxed everything.

It doesn't exactly mean one would want to gather resources or be afraid of dying, not to like speed running. Definitely if you have never dungeoneered with a team before, you're going to have hard time going with DGS. I'm not saying it wouldn't be possible to learn, but it definitely takes dedication and motivation. Like Tui said, and I respect and understand that opinion, efficient dungeoneers who want to train others to dungeon effectively aswell expect you to do alot of research and learning yourself, by reading guides and having a close look how better dungeoneers do it. Most of us simply don't have that kind of time and dedication, to read alot of guides, learn all the best strategies and keep up to date with new best strategies.

As for Obtaurian said about DGS, I think that the problem for the less experienced players considering DGS is the fact how damn good most of the members there are. I remember when DGS first started before whole clans thing as a friends chat, I used to have alot of fun learning to dungeoneer with them. The reason for it was that there were simply alot of players who were pretty much at the same stage as I was. And we started all getting better as a group and the whole group evolved to a whole new level. Now that I did less and less dungeoneering pretty much everyone in DGS got better than me and the floors started to became stressful. So eventually I just quit and did dungeons with my friends. I still would do it if I simply had enough friends to dungeoneer with. Most often we have to do duo-trio mediums, cause we can't get 5 players together, and even then it's very rare to have enough of us online. That's the whole point of this thread basically. To find players who would like to learn and evolve as a group. Players who still have alot to learn, many mistakes to make and tricks to find. You know, learning all the pieces step by step with a relaxed pace, instead of trying to learn all and everything at once. Trying to jump in with a team who already know pretty much all the fastest ways to dungeoneer, is quite different from that. And in my books, less rewarding.

Ahem, this is exactly the thing that stresses many players who don't have time and dedication to stay up to date with the current standards. Finding out why you are slowing the team and to continuously improve at keeping up the pace. Problem is not only on that, everyone likes to get better at what they do. I do too. Problem is that the groups of efficient dungeoneers I've played with, often tend to have very low patience to stand players who slow down their floors. I do have better things to do on my free time than keep listening how I don't do things right and how I need to learn and learn and learn. That alone wouldn't be too bad, but often it is not someone friendly saying what you're doing wrong. I understand people who want to get fast experience and get annoyed people slowing them down, and my point is I don't want to group up with players who have only one goal - if it's the speed of the floors. Of course this might be very black and white view to the situation, but frankly it's the most common I've ended up in. I do want to learn and get better, but I would like to enjoy the skill aswell. Not feel like going on maximal dedication, determination and attention rates every dungeon I do. It tires me out very fast. I'd prefer 30-40 minute dungeons in a group that goes dungeons on fairly relaxed pace, than doing 15-20 minute dungeons where I feel like I have no idea what's going on and only feel like I'm slowing others down. It does seem I'm not the only one thinking like this either. :grin:

Hmm, last post was over a month ago. I don't think it quite gets the attention I had hoped. :-?

If a topic like this already exist, you could forward me there. However, as this subject seems to be interesting for many, and yields different kind of topics every day, I thought it deserved it's own thread in the General Discussion. Dungeoneering as a skill differs most from all the other skills in the RuneScape. Most obviously as the level cap is 120 instead of 99, it demands a way bigger time investment for anyone interested in the higher level content the skill has to offer. Secondly, it's the only skill in RuneScape that is really designed to be played as a group. However, being member of these forums for years, ever since dungeoneering came out, it has been a topic for multiple different views and discussions about the skill. How to train it? What is the most efficient? Solo or group? 117, 148, 77, friends or a clan? As we currently are having a weekend that offers 2x experience and tokens for dungeoneering, the subject is back on the spotlight. Help & Advice is filled with questions about it, and it seems to be on everybodys lips. It also seems that from all skills it's dungeoneering that divides players into two. People who like it and people who don't. Most often the people who don't like the skill, are the people who don't have that much time or dedication to invest their time into efficient playing. People who don't have friends or a clan to play with, and find dungeoneering with strangers to often be total pain. However, as doing floors with a team offers way greater benefits than soloing, it often turns alot of people away from the skill. So I would like to hear opinions about the skill in overall, and reasons why you like it or why you don't. I would also like to know how you train the skill, or how would you like to train it. I used to learn basics of dungeoneering and a bit more with DGS, but soon after I realised their goals differ from mine. I prefer slower approach to dungeons, and like to do them with my friends with relaxed pace. Which however doesn't mean I would spend my time gathering every resource or making every piece of armour each dungeon. Besides, I do get stressed if I feel I'm slowing someones dungeon, training and experience down, especially in a group who are aiming to finish dungeons as fast as possible and reach as high xp -rates per hour as possible. I understand their point of view, but it's simply not for me. I'm also interested to find out likeminded players, who would like to train the skill with a team, instead of soloing. Players who would like to learn and get better, but who don't have time to invest into adjusting in the groups of best dungeoneers. I personally might be interested in joining, or even founding a group or a clan for players who have the same approach. To have fun and time to relax from your real life activities, without having to stress over a game. With people who have somewhat same point of view and can agree to disagree with people who don't.

I want a worldbearer!! :---)

Yeah, I've been doing few runs of barrows as nothing else of the bonus doesn't really interest me that much (well dungeoneering to some extent but can't be really bothered now), so it only got me wondering. What is the rate to get item from chest considering you kill 6 brothers (leaving one - torag)? And how does the monster killcount actually affect your loot? Is it better to just rush through to kill all the brothers and loot, or should you kill monsters for higher kc? Just curious, thanks. Been ages since I was last barrowing. :blink:

The additional craft and fill of the extra pouch(es) take only couple seconds at most. I see no reason why not to use all pouches you possibly have, when each trip takes around a minute to make anyways. :thumbup:

As you are below 88 or 99 runecrafting, if I were you I would probably just sell the dust. They usually sell for ~19k instant. That is still over 150k per shard, and you don't have to collect all 100 to rake in the cashes. Especially, as you say you're short on cash. :grin:

I actually meant that I've been using SWC most of the time, but sometimes done trips with fire cape. Though I assume the prayer points saved with SWC is better than the few more dps you get with fire cape. :-)

Sorry I was in a bit of a hurry while writing the first post, so let me tell you how do I actually kill them. My gear is following: Neitiznot helm Arcane stream Necklace / Amulet of fury Ahrims robe top Ahrims robe bottom Barrows gloves Dragon boots Staff of light / Chaotic rapier Dragon defender Soul wars cape (occasionally Fire cape) Ring of wealth Inventory: Runes, 2-3 Overloads, 2-3 Prayer renewals, 1 Saradomin brew, 1 Super restore, rest Prayer potions. I'll kill the Glacors that are easily safespottable (either the ones near the fairy ring, or the ones at the middle with the projection of the rocks between them). I'm swapping only staff of light to chaotic rapier and arcane stream necklace as soon as Glacytes spawn. I'll hit enduring glacyte once with fire surge, click behind the rocks while simultaneously changing to rapier and swapping prayers. I've lured the glacytes on safespot at the same speed as I swap my weapons/prayers so I haven't really noticed much of difference between how many kills I get safespotting or not safespotting. Luring only takes 2-3 steps to one direction. I'll finish sapping first, about same time as unstable blows for the first time, kill enduring and often manage to kill unstable before it starts healing. Sometimes I however swap by killing enduring first, unstable as soon as it blows and sapping last. This drains a bit more prayer but in overall the kills are faster. I still usually last about hour per inventory with doing so. And my attention span pretty much last a hour at best. Sometimes I take less supplies, so I have space for the loot ready, because I don't really fancy dropping potions to make space. Surgebox has been under thinking for a while, and I might actually go with it. I don't have all pieces of void, so it would take me about 5 hours of Pest Control to gather the rest of the pieces. Which I don't really look forward to especially if it's not worth it. As I don't have imbued rings, and I'm not either going to get one anytime soon, I don't really fancy swapping row before each kill. Unless it really makes a difference. I'd prefer having only 2-3 (max 4) items to swap at glacyte stages. More and I'll start missing ticks and making mistakes. I'm not going to dungeoneer for another chaotic item either. Preferably fast and easy solutions! I have about 32m to spend on items. Thanks all. Ps. If someone knows where to get some luck to the loot aswell, I'd be glad to hear! :pray: EDIT: I got myself surgebox. Anything else?

Hey, I've killed about 700-800 Glacors so far, and in overall I'm rather decent at doing them. However, I don't have steel titan, unicorn or enchanced excalibur. And I don't really plan on getting any of these anytime soon. (I'm only 81 summoning). I've been living solely on soul split, and I haven't needed other ways of healing at all. I do safespot the glacyte stage. I've been averaging about 40-45 kills per hour. I still plan to safespot the glacytes, as I find it more relaxing than not doing so. Basically, I haven't been using void gear, but plan on doing so. What void pieces should I be using? As I could get deflector, and thereforth remove some piece. I don't have money for virtus though. Thanks

That's what we all hope, don't we, heh. Shame, I'm currently somewhere along 1/800 with the boots.. Octarines 1/~250 seems too good to be true. :---)

Or people could simply pay the membership and enjoy the full game like the rest of us. I don't personally see any problem with them removing free-to-play worlds if it profits the company enough to keep the bots away.

So, as one part of my goals is to complete all tasks and quests, and they also yield nice experience rewards for my main goal (which is maxing, or atleast getting all skills 99, total). And like the old saying I though, good plan is almost half done, I decided to take the good old notepad and start making some calculations. This is the plan that I ended up with, how to most efficiently get my runecrafting and levels up. Also, as things like penguin points, troll invasion and effigies give more experience higher the level is, I thought I should get on with it as soon as possible. However, I realised that if I want to do this, I have to scratch my old plan of never runecrafting, and actually head to the ZMI altar. Actually, I did some ZMI yesterday. It's boring, it's slow but it's needed. Atleast for couple million experience. One reason to calculate things was, that I can avoid rcing any more than I need to. :thumbup: This is how my plan goes: 1. I start by finishing all the rest of the quests I have left. This will yield me nice experience rewards all around in skills, and unlock weapons, gear, items and various places that will help me on the rest of my goal. I should start doing this immediatly. This should also give me about 200,000 runecrafting experience. 2. That would leave me about 800,000-900,000 experience short of 83 runecrafting. This is where the ZMI comes in, and I'll just have to do about 800 runs to reach level 83. Hopefully, I'll get some bonus experience from penguins and troll invasion. Maybe we even get a new quest with experience rewards. 3. As soon as I reach 83 runecrafting, it's time to do Elite Seers diary. Using the experience to (what else) runecrafting. One step closer to 84. 4. Next part is going to be a long stretch, but hopefully I have gained a short lead to this goal while doing the first three, by training slayer and killing Glacors. Not only do I need to do more ZMIng, to get 85 runecrafting, but I also need to get 93 summoning. As soon as I reach these levels, I head to do Elite Ardougne diary. I should be close to 86 runecrafting by now. 5. For the next part, which is Elite Varrock diary, I need to ZMI, penguin, troll invasion to 88 runecrafting and also get 92 firemaking. Firemaking will be done fast either with magic logs and pyrefiend or Jadinko lair. I haven't tried Jadinko lair yet, but I've heard it's very easy and fast experience. 6. Elite Fremmenik diary. First get 89 runecrafting, so I can use experience lamps on runecrafting. By now I hopefully should've gained 88 slayer (from the task to gain summoning earlier on), and then I need to get 91 fishing and 85-87 agility to do the diary. Thank god there are items like wild pies, summer pies and admiral pies. Will save me many hours of grinding. For now atleast. 7. The last stretches. Need to obtain 90 runecrafting, so I can do Elite Falador diary. I will have obtained 90+ fishing already on stage 6, so no other skills are needed. 8. Final diary. Elite Karamja Diary. 91 runecrafting and 95 summoning (slayer, Glacors and what else). 9. And DONE. After this I should be at around 6 million runecrafting experience, and be happy to know that I won't ever have to craft a single rune again. Unless something mysterious happens, and I end up actually liking it. :???: It's a long journey ahead! But like it's said, a journey of thousand miles begins with a single step. Might aswell start now. Stay around for updates to come!

Sorry to hear about your hack! It's hard to understand how you actually ended up being hacked, but it made me even extra cautious now. So I took all possible safemeasures and made my account as "unhackable" as possible. I have no idea how they could hack someone with brute force, but if I get hacked in the future, I have to admit that it's possible. Good luck on your way to recover. Sorry to hear about all those items and wealth you lost. Seems like you earned it all the hard way (runecrafting). :-(

Someone sounds a bit hurt.. :---) On topic, I don't really mind. Seen Woox16's videos before, and must admit he could very well be the "best PVM'er" out there. If he gets a video worth of attention on front page, good for him. Doesn't really make any difference to me. Except that I learned how to do Corporal Beast, watching Woox's videos.. :oops:

You don't need to have exactly "the most efficient" gear, levels and setup to do Glacors rather profitably. I personally don't have void set, unicorn, or steel titan. Soul splitting is not too hard after you figure it out for a while. And Glacors are very easy to safespot while you kill Glacytes, if you think that is too much to handle. Even safespotting the Glacytes, and without void, titan or SoA I can get 40+ kills /hour with relaxed pace. And upto 45+ per hour not safespotting. Of course that is 15-20 short of what people can get with extreme attention, maxed levels and best possible gear, but it still is over 3m geepees per hour in the long run. Not to mention it can be upto 300-400k overall experience per hour (including summoning charms and effigies). So you shouldn't give up yet, unless there are better ways for you to make money, and you don't either need effigies/charms/magic experience. :thumbup: All I wish I was having same loot ratio as Octarine has... :pray:

I guess this level up is worth of it's own update. 99 hitpoints, after 10 years of scaping! Almost missed the picture due to forgetting, but remembered it at last second. I also got 131 combat. :-# So that means first one of my Glacor hunting goals is done. I still have about 1300 Glacors left to kill to reach 99 magic. That should also get me 95 defence (defensive casting) and charms for 88 summoning (unicorns!). It should also yield estimate of 18 effigies, and hopefully about 3-4 pair of boots. I've been quite unlucky so far with 600-700 kills in and only one pair of boots. Not very certain of the ratios, but that (and constant stream of armadyl shards) should yield about 80-100m gp. That will come to an use while maxing prayer. At those levels I should be 133 combat. Should keep me occupied for good few weeks. :^o Ah well, one Glacor and one level at a time. :-P EDIT: Also got 97 magic today. 2 more to go!

I would've rather won the lottery than took that. Nice and ouch at the same time. I mean, what are the chances for that..? :pray: