Makoto_the_Phoenix

Figures, always the one person that likes to insult when he discusses. :roll: I wasn't aware I flew off any handle. I simply gave my opinion, to only be flamed by you. No, I didn't say I expected it to be free. I simply said I was disgusted that they have to go down to tricks of offering incentives like that to get more money. Like said, it's my opinion they do it for the money - not for our security. Seems like they're hitting 2 birds with one stone... but are they really? That's my opinion, and if you don't like it... well SORRY buddy! :lol: :lol: :lol: It's not that I'm flaming you for your opinion. In fact, I gave you three counter points to it, but you instantly go for the flame bait. That's typical, I suppose. But let me reply to this post in earnest. You implied in an earlier post (the post I responded to) that you resented the idea you would be paying for it: Whereas on the other hand, I adamantly disagree with your opinion. They're not doing this for money, they're doing this to keep players secure. Deploying a security solution like this is NOT cheap, okay? $20 for that kind of security, honestly, it's a bargain - you're not into the kind of stuff I am (Computer Science), so you wouldn't know, but consider that to get something like that to guarantee peace of mind with confidential data, it would cost between $80 and $200. Again, it's not that I'm flaming you for your opinion. It's just grossly misinformed.

Uh... Clearly Jagex can tell exactly who lost money and at what time because they were able to do it on Exile's account. It'll still be wasting a lot of Jagex's time. I'll agree with this. You could imagine that the logs for every player that makes a request would be tedious to check (it probably couldn't be automated), and with the amount of bogus requests, it would get frustrating, so in an effort to be fair, they'd just deny everyone that. If you don't believe that Jagex's logs are huge: Consider that they exist for every single player. Of course they're categorized by the last action we did, but checking that over a period of 2 hours to 3 months would slow a lot of stuff up, anyway.

Here's my stance. First, it's not a real RTS - they even said so themselves. All that's involved is your ten units against thirty other units, and I'm not quite sure how people warped that to be an RTS anyway. With that out of the way, let's go through this. Conflict: This map I feel is the generic tutorial to the entire overlay. It teachers you the "Mobilizing Armies Triangle", in which Goblin > Elf > Dwarf > Goblin, etc. This lets the player also get the feel for the map, special spots, and exploring. That being said, there's not a lot of variety with this - kill them all, or be killed. No real benefits to being the first to draw blood, either, and the last remaining survivor could have fresh troops at the ready, anyway. {Rating: 7/10} Siege: The concept of this map is actually rather fun, but I would much rather have some visual indication as to how much damage that catapult is doing. It's intuitive as far as a castle siege is, but it's definitely lacking. {Rating: 6/10} Hoard: Tied with my favorite map. The objective is straightforward, and using the triangle in this map proves to be far more effective. It's also a map that I've observed where the Distractor has an actual use. I don't much like the terrain of the map (the volcano could be a little lower), and if there's a sleeping dragon guarding this treasure, why isn't going crazy when we take it? {Rating: 8/10} Rescue: Tied with my favorite map. The idea is to save all the TzHaar you can, and if you're inclined, take some of your rivals'. Another map in which the Distractor has a use; distract the rival's base, sneak in with a fast unit, take as many TzHaar as you can get your grubby lil' hands on, and get the hell out of Dodge. The triangle doesn't have much real use here; it's mostly about being as quick as possible. {Rating: 9/10} Overall: I'm very, very pleased with this piece of content. It gets rid of the junk that you make while Skilling, while giving you an actual use for it (and not creating cash out of thin air at the same time). The rewards, I hear, get better with rank, but I can't comment on that until we see the highest level rewards, anyway. I do have the complaint that units don't have the ability to just attack something automatically when their own comrades are in jeopardy, and at the lower levels, exploring does little but reduce your combat strength. It would be nicer if the special units we enlisted could be countered or parried in some fashion, or if they did more damage in special conditions (i.e. Chompa bomb doing more damage depending on how many units it hits at once). {Rating: 9/10}

No.

Perhaps that's how it would work. When I read "dongle", it usually referred to something that physically hung off of your PC. If it did work the other way, depending on how many possible connections, I'm not 100% sure that we'd keep getting numbers for us to use. I mean, 1 billion logins sounds nice, but unlimited is better...

I think Imageshack was hacked. I'll be taking mine down now...

Yes, that's the point. To make getting this dongle more appealing, they're offering you more bank space, in return. At least, it's on the table. It might be unneeded in your eyes, but you do not speak for everyone here. Besides, paying $10 or $20 for that kind of security is a bargain. Advice: If you hop to the defense of something, it's best you know what you're on about, as well. He may have not seen the correlation between bank space and this USB device, but I've spelled it out - it's an incentive. Don't make it out to be something which it isn't, since that'll make you look foolish. That's why it's optional, and that's why it would all but eliminate hacking. Hackers may be able to get your PIN and your password, but they would have to be very, very close to get your USB dongle. It doesn't rule out the possibility of being hacked, but it cuts it down extensively. You'd be able to argue this better if we knew the actual details for it. Chances are that it would work rather simplistically, in that it doesn't matter what OS is running it (probably written in Java) - all it would need would be to connect to the Jagex servers, affirm security, and so forth and so on. No drawback there, really. The idea is that you shouldn't be playing there anyway, because of the amount of viruses/keyloggers already present in the systems... What world do you live in that security costs nothing? Again, it's an option. And if you choose this option, believe me - you'll make room. I have 3 USB ports on my laptop, and at any given time, I use up to two of them. If I went with the dongle (which I probably will), then I'd make room for them, and still would only be using...2 USB ports. Exactly. This isn't any different than forgetting your password or PIN, or even your house keys. If you forget/lose that information, you have to convince someone that you're entitled to access that data. Best advice, if you do go with this option, is that you just don't lose it. Are you trying to tell me that you don't know how to keep things hidden and secure? I'm starting to get tired of everyone insulting people that don't know account security. Just because they don't know how to keep passwords secure does not mean that they do not have "half a brain". It means that they don't fully understand the ramifications of it. This idea is actually a nice one, and it would go far enough to keep accounts secure, since the concern for RWT now is keeping other people off of your account. This is a brilliant way to do it, provided that the keys were unique to that particular login session - it'd mean that even with the key, if they didn't have the device, they couldn't RWT. Brave2, go back and think about this one for a bit. Do some research on physical research devices, and look into the benefits of it. Sure, it's one more thing to enter into a login, but consider that it's a way to ensure that your account is virtually impregnable. It's a trade-off between convenience and security, and everything that's secure ain't convenient. Online children's game=/=multi-billion dollar company And I strongly disagree with them giving out bank spaces. Things like this start small. RS has its problems but at the core it is a great game because of its accessibility and cost. If Jagex starts releasing more thinks like this if I were you I would quit and start paying for another game. That being said I'm not buying one because I don't search the internet for porn and download every random move file I find. Seriously going to quit over an optional dongle? Why not save yourself the trouble and leave now? Although I somewhat agree with you on the bank space thing; it's an incentive, but I wouldn't know how well it would work out. Lastly, before I wrap up, the incentive is simply on the table. It's not written in stone. In fact, none of this is. So try not to make too much a fuss about it. I have more faith in TIF than what I'm seeing.

If you don't get it, how can it be clear...hmm. Might want to work on that one. To translate it for you - they have enough faith in the system that they would be willing to offer everyone that partook in it (Free, Member) some extra bank space. That's all it is. To be honest, most players don't use all of their bank space anyway, and those that are on Free usually manage their space with extreme fervor anyway, so at best, this is an incentive for those that go along with the program. Are you trying to troll or did you seriously not understand what he was saying? He *doesn't get* what Jagex's bs logic was, and it was *clear* that they are offering free bankspace for another reason (to entice more people to buy their dongle). More bank space != ability to keep more wealth because of increased security. (If you didn't know already, != means "is not equal to") No, it wasn't a troll. You'd have seen that had you read the rest of my reply. I don't know what the fuss is about, even if they did offer increased bank space - it's an incentive. Nothing more. Do you not know what an incentive is? Because it doesn't seem like you do.

If you don't get it, how can it be clear...hmm. Might want to work on that one. To translate it for you - they have enough faith in the system that they would be willing to offer everyone that partook in it (Free, Member) some extra bank space. That's all it is. To be honest, most players don't use all of their bank space anyway, and those that are on Free usually manage their space with extreme fervor anyway, so at best, this is an incentive for those that go along with the program.

I'll be honest - when I read the news article, I thought it was an April Fools' joke, 3 or so months late. But then I thought about it, and I think that such a system would be rather helpful, for those of us that are technically paranoid. To begin with, it would be possible to play at public terminals which are very insecure, and it would also guarantee that Player X really belonged to Patrik. However, I don't like the idea in principle. It's definitely a step in the right direction, but you have to stop and think about this - have we really come to the point where we have to secure data with 2/3 of the Security Triangle* in RuneScape? Remember - it's optional. I know you mentioned that. But, for the technically inclined/hyper paranoid, slower access to data to ensure its security is often times a healthy trade-off. This would also help if some higher level, well known player's account was compromised somehow. To be honest, I might give this system a look; if I don't like it, I should be able to turn it off. It'd be an exercise in cryptography to see how well it works, too. *[This refers to three things about you to keep information secure - something you have, something you know, and something you are. In English, this means a security dongle (USB device or something else), a password/PIN number, and biometrics information, be it fingerprints or retina scans.] [EDIT] 1) How is it disgusting to see that Jagex cares enough about their customers' data to offer this service? 2) Did you honestly believe that it would be free? 3) It's an idea they're tossing around - if you wanted to use the dongle, you get a boost in bank space. If you don't, you're fine. But I don't know anyone that has used all 496 spaces of bank space anyway. Dark_Lord, perhaps you should look more into security practices before flying off the handle about stuff you just don't understand.

I have no real reason to leave my machine on, unless I torrent a DVD ISO of Linux, be it Fedora, Ubuntu, etc. Otherwise, I always turn my PC off.

That was funny. Best troll I've seen so far. Although I haven't seen many. Still funny. :P

It doesn't seem like they're going to support 64-bit systems anytime in the near, foreseeable future, so I'll steer clear of this one as well. Linux provides what I need out of an OS anyway, but it will mix things up a bit if Google became an actual OS contender.

What Mod Mat K said was professional, and indeed sincere. He made a mistake in reading the information and he apologized for his actions. What more do you want the man to do? He can't give the player back his money, since he can't violate company policy. I'd say that we should just back off of him, since he's done what he could.

I don't see how you got 261 years. You assumed that every player that logged on tried it out and that each one played it all day long. Each person at Jagex is looking for glitches while testing and the players are simply enjoying the game. With that in mind, the chance of players finding glitches becomes less. To put it in more realistic terms, let's say that 30,000 players tried it for 2 hours each today. It comes out to under 7 years. Still more than Jagex can do, but not some gigantic number either. This is most likely true. Not every player wants to spend 17 hours at one spot all day, when they could be outside, catching butterfli-I MEAN going to the mall, etc. The numbers are probably way off - it's more realistic that 40 or 50,000 players had tested the content for one or two hours a piece, which puts it between 4 and 11.5 years. But you see the point - it's substantially way more testing than Jagex could do in a two month period. This is why the game is frequently patched - it fixes issues that they couldn't catch. This is understandable and quite typical of any major project that comes up.

It shouldn't matter what a player chooses to carry around. There is absolutely no reason glitches like this should make it into the game, let alone the outright rude response by the mod. Who says it only happens on logging out? Might lose items if you lag out, which increasingly frequently has been caused by servers lagging. Its way more than an oops, we pay them to develop the game, so we shouldn't be paying for a half-assed and not well tested product. I'm replying to both of these quotes, since they cover pretty much the same thing. There are what, 400 people working at Jagex, right? I'll be nice and say that their QA team is about 15 percent of that, which is 60 people. Let's determine that for the last two months (63 days, for simplicity), the minigame was in its almost-final state, and that all 60 people tested it for 5 hours a day, in that work-week for those two months. This would mean that 60 people had a total of 45 days to test the game, for 5 hours a day. This equates to roughly 13,500 hours of test-time with a single piece of content - which equates to about a year and a half. Now here's where it gets interesting. The idea behind Quality Assurance is that you can test every single permutation of a particular piece of content, and 60 people can't cover the possibilities of 10,000 people, let alone 1 million or more. Also consider that this content has been out for almost a day - in the neighborhood of 17 hours - and since we can safely assume that more than 135,000 players have been trying this content out, within just 17 hours, this minigame has had over 2.29 million hours of test time, which equates to roughly 261 years! It's not that QA isn't doing its job properly. It's just that we as the community have the ability to test it for a substantially longer amount of time. Hopefully they'll resolve the bug. Yea, its the fact that he CANT carry around 350 mill thats the problem. It SHOULD be a safe minigame. Doesn't matter - you don't need that much cash, and if you want to use it, there's a bank nearby with which you can store your items. Players should be cautious with new content at all times, and assume the worst - that's why I went ahead and banked full Dragon before participating. It's dangerous, and of course, you don't need 350M in cash to view a tutorial. He really should have kept it in his bank. I know it's unlikely, but I'd hope Jagex returns it.

They're broken at the moment.

Definitely agree here, although the balance of the teams is supposed to nullify that out, it's more or less one big DD/Camp session. Not cool. Not cool at all.

I have more to gain from talking to players than I have to lose, but I'll occasionally keep to myself if I'm trying to rush through something; only have on average 7 hours every week to play, and I like to get as much out of it as I can. Yes, for those that have done the math, that means I play a grand total of 1 hour a day, on average. That ain't a lot of time. I also think that the guy you dealt with was a bit of a jerk. Ignore him and move on. It's much, much simpler that way. If you don't want to get bored, or are interested in some conversation (not necessarily stimulating), try some of the more popular clan chats out there. You can usually find a decent conversation and it makes the time fly by.

Whoever said is totally clueless. Java's biggest GOAL was to be cross-platform. In fact, I play RS on my linux box on occasion. :-) I lol'd so hard. Only thing I play RS on nowadays is my Linux box (laptop & tower). :P

Tip.it has its own IRC chat room, which in effect, is plenty - you don't need Vent/Skype if you have an IRC server.

Easiest rule of thumb: It doesn't bother me, and I don't need to know about it. You have fun, but please don't be surprised if the person who they claim to be turns out to be something totally different.

@Brave New World: It was a pretty good article. It reminded me of the few weeks that I was able to beta test the new, exciting game (me not getting members until May of RS2's release year). I had to live off of snapshots and rumblings from Members before I could experience the real deal though. It was definitely an exciting time. @Third Party Communication: There's a lot of things that I agree with here, namely using other applications to reply to other players in real-time (I used to use IRC a lot), and I never did really view them as breaking rules. However, there are a lot of things to be taken with a grain of salt with applications such as Skype, IRC, and especially Ventrillo - unscrupulous administrators can take an innocent person's IP address and wreck all sorts of havoc on them. Again, I agree with the fundamental point of the article, and it's fine that players use these applications to communicate with others. So long as players assume and are prepared for the risks of doing such.

The trade limits are fine. Their [seemingly] unintentional side-effect was to keep players from drop-trading from their accounts, which was nice in and of itself. We've all gotten used to them by now, it's been a very long time since they were implemented. They might be a slight inconvenience here and there, but that doesn't mean that they should be abolished outright.

I definitely agree. As a student Computer Scientist, those that talk of limitations of software just don't know what they're on about. Now, there might be things that just aren't possible to do, but those limitations can always be overcome in time.