sees_all1

gl, wrists.

When will these idiots learn? I think Jagex needs to make the bug abuse rules more clear to people, feature it more prominently in the log in screen. I hope Jagex drops the banhammer on these cheaters.

If you don't know the seed of a random number generator, it might as well be random. Even if you do know the seed, it might as well be random. Also, I called it a "script" but in reality it'd be programmed in java, and java's RNG is pretty decent... I hear they use it in some mmorpg or something....

I submit that while players are not bound by classes (and should not be, as it was never intended to be bound by classes), there should definitely be three unique combat styles (as originally intended). The combat styles should be unique like rock, paper, scissors. Each one should have a distinct advantage against one, and a weakness against another. That is to say, three people maxed in each of their respective classes should have exactly the same chance of beating their counterpart - i.e. 90% of the time the melee will beat a range, 90% of the time the range will beat a mage, and 90% of the time the mage will beat the melee. I do not see this, especially when some styles gain advantage when hybriding, and others are disadvantaged. That is why I say the triangle is flawed, and that is why I say it needs to be completely overhauled.

Not cheaper than botting however... I disagree. Bots get banned for botting, human players don't. It takes time to complete tutorial island, it takes time to raise the bot's level to something sufficient enough that it makes money. Human players may be slower, but they don't get banned as easily. However, that is neither here nor there. This is a forum, not a blog. Also, I'd like to translate that for everyone else: Let this thread die.

If they did log the time between bumps wouldn't they be able to easily tell you are using a program? And lol at invasion of privacy and what not. Doubt they'd even notice though considering there are hundreds of threads on RSOF No. I don't want to go into too much detail of how to write "undetectable" macro software, but having a randomly generated component to it would make it exactly like having the thread opened in a different window or tab, and then periodically bumping it (as you remember).

no, it isn't. But as far as detection, I'm speculating that it would be near impossible for them to log anything other than time in between bumps. And if they did log something other than time in between bumps (for instance, mouse locations or processes running), it would be a gross invasion of privacy, and getting banned would/should be the least of my concerns.

Would it be against the rules to write a script which bumps (your own) RSOF thread every 10-20 minutes? I understand that macroing in game is strictly against the rules, but this isn't in game? Let me know what you think. Also, if it makes a difference, this is the thread I'd like to bump: 74-75-317-60364416

Take a macro, super broad based view of Runescape. There are two sets of things: items and currency. When the amount of items increases against currency, there is deflation. When the amount of currency increases against items, there is inflation. When someone buries bones, there is inflation (less items, so currency increases against items). When someone cuts logs, there is deflation (more items, so items increase against currency). When someone gets a money drop, there is inflation (more currency, so items decrease against currency). When someone buys from an NPC, there is deflation (less currency, so currency decreases against items). Taking a macro view, it doesn't matter the variety of items (i.e. jagex introduces a new sword as a drop, makes no difference to the whole), or the variety of currency (statues vs. gp). The tricky part about this is that its impossible for anyone except Jagex to know the total count of each, items and currency. Let me repeat - it's nearly impossible to measure true inflation without ALL data. However, people have put together "baskets" of items to keep track of the price level. These basket's price level will be indirectly related to the current inflation level (current preferences and demands are more directly related), but are used anyway. When jagex introduces a new item, the "basket" changes, but inflation doesn't.

I talked to the new NPC's, there were no indications that they were "p2p only". I'm guessing the area is new skill related.

On one particular update, jagex changed the interface of the game. Then, all the bots that were "dumb" clickers clicked that area that had no button... It then flagged Jagex because no human player would ever click blank areas repeatedly, making the same mistake over and over... Anyhow, the only way to truly wipe runescape of bots is to make the game virtually unplayable. Or, Jagex could monitor the services running in the background of a user's computer. Its the entire botting programming base vs. Jagex in this. If you developed your own botting software, made it robust, and shared it with no one, it might be near impossible to detect. Its once it gets out to the general idiots that they get caught....

I don't get it... You claim that when manipulators pick an object (buying out that item? - meaning they are the demand), the supply increase? If you mean that hicking up prices encourages player to skill to get that item to sell it at premium prices is increasing supply, then you are right. But claiming that manipulators are creating the supply, you are wrong, it's the law of supply and demand that is adjusting to the new prices. As for the GE update timing, I have no opinion on that matter. I chose my language very carefully. The statement "supply increases" in economics means that the entire supply curve shifts right. The statement "the quantity supplied increases" in economics means that the supply curve hasn't changed, but the point on the supply curve has changed. Manipulators are increasing the demand (shifting the demand curve right), which in turn moves the (temporary) equilibrium to a higher price.

The quantity supplied increases because of the common, everyday 'scaper. They look at the prices of various items, and decide what they want to do to skill, or make money. For instance: I want GP. I am willing to woodcut, mine, or fish for items; to sell on the GE for GP. I look at the prices for coal, lobsters, and yews. I notice that lobsters are the best deal (they are being manipulated?), so I fish for lobs, sell them on the GE, rinse and repeat. Two days later, I still want GP. I notice that coal is the best deal. I mine coal, sell it on the GE, rinse and repeat. This is happening everyday by millions of 'scapers. When an item on the grand exchange becomes a "good deal" for suppliers, more people supply it to make money. The supply curve doesn't change when manipulators pick the item (it does temporarily when they dump), but the quantity supplies changes. I'm not exactly clear what you're trying to say here. People don't have to be "good at economics" to realize the best way to make money. Also, if all the masses understood basic economic principals, there probably would be manipulators, or monopolies, etc.

[idiot] No, you should just pay the $5 a month so you can use your F2P skill world. [/idiot] I think a skill minimum world might serve everyone better: must have a minimum of 50 or 60 in each skill (F2P skills for F2P, all skills for P2P) to log in. That way its more applicable to each circumstance. When the new skill comes out, they could waive that requirement (for just the new skill) until 2 or 3 months afterward.

Counter argument: RWT As it is right now, its *more* difficult to get a character's EP up. If every world had a PvP area, one could find an obscure location and AFK for a few hours. Which is to say, you could pay people to fight a mock battle, die, and get a drop. The amount you receive isn't a perfect 1M, but they could guarantee drops until you get whatever value you paid for. In the current system, you have to worry about people pile jumping you... you get a kill, and they start attacking you before you get a chance to loot it. In the proposed system, people would be scarce enough that it isn't a major concern. tldr; - Easier EP, Easier RWT due to scarcity of others.

So address my 5 issues...

From an economic standpoint, Manipulators DO NOT MODIFY SUPPLY. In fact, when Manipulators pick an object, and it starts to rise in price, the quantity supplied increases. That's right, more of that item enter into the game! The fact that the GE doesn't update prices fast enough is a rant in itself, and should be separated from manipulators. enough of my mini econ-naziness. If you objectively look at what manipulators do collectively, you should thank them. The idea of "OMFG I CANT BUY ITEM X BECAUSE OF MANIPULATORS" is one for whiny brats. Imagine a young person screaming at the top of their lungs "BUT I WANT IT NOW!!!!". That's what people sound like when they rant about manipulators. "I saved up my moneys for months, until I was ready to buy that GS, only to find that clan x was manipulating them, now I can't afford it because they bought all of them out." Right... months to buy a GS, and when you're ready to buy you can't afford it. Can't you wait like, 4 days? Then, not only will it have crashed, it'll also be a good deal, saving you millions anyway! If you notice a manipulating clan has picked a certain item, messing with it over and over, you can PROFIT OFF THEM! You have to buy and sell the item out of phase... when they dump (and the item falls below equilibrium), you sweep. When they grab, you give. I've done this with silver ore... I bought 10M in silver ore when a clan was dumping, and I sold it back to a different clan when they were buying out. I made 4M by just messing with the manipulators....

There is still the problem of: 1) Getting rid of Junk 2) Free experience in crafting, prayer, construction, magic 3) Real World Trading 4) Buying items on Margin (in real life, this led to the Great Depression) 5) Hyper-Inflation due to an increase in demand Explain to me how you could prevent the following scenarios: 1) Player has 10M worth of junk in the bank. Player takes out a 10M loan, and blows it somehow (staking, PVP, etc.) Bank takes his 10M worth of junk, even though its street value is only 1M. Player consumes 10M of stuff in runescape when they should only have consumed 1M. 2) Player has 10M worth of bones in the bank. Player takes out 10M loan, and buys 10M worth of bones. Player then gets 20M worth experience in prayer, and has nothing to give back to the bank. 3) Botters / RWTers offer to buy all junk at GE value (10x more than street value). The do this by having macro'd junk of their own, and taking out loans equal to their amount of junk (GP they can freely trade away). 4) Player has 50M in items, takes out a loan to buy a shiny GS. Next day Jagex introduces the mega-god-sword, which makes all GS obsolete. GS's quickly drop to 1M street value over night, then 1M GE value, and Player, who was relatively wealthy before, loses EVERYTHING. 5) In all of the scenarios, items are leaving the game and GPs are entering the game. This means A HUGE INCREASE IN PRICE LEVELS (hyper inflation) for virtually no reason, and with no way to stabilize.

And look at the mess the real world economy is in now - it all gets back to banks lending money. Also, banks don't necessarily require collateral to loan money. Look at college loans. I can take out a loan for $40k to pay for my college expenses each and every year, with virtually no money or possessions to my name, and banks will grant it to me. I can go into $200k debt, not graduate college, and have to default. It will hurt me in the future to - there is only one of me, so that's the extent I can screw up the bank. Runescape, I can create 1000 accounts, and abandon each one of them. There's no place for loans in runescape.

I'm strongly against bank loans in runescape. The average 'scaper has no idea about how the current real world financial system works, and the implications of adding in loans to a game. Giving players the ability to arbitrarily create money will cause inflation. I'm not sure how much you intend for the banks to loan out, but anything less than a million is near meaningless, and anything more than a million per player causes extreme and arbitrary inflation. Look, starting from a new F2P account, I was able to legitly make 1 million GP within 48 hours of account creation. Making money in runescape is EASY. Besides, what's the penalty for not paying your loan back? If its item removal then that's more inflation, or a convenient way to rid an account of junk (say hello to rwt?)

I had to go with cabbage... http://www.youtube.c...h?v=VpkvdmZT1KA

F2P doesn't need any better armor. It's hard enough to hit through rune with a rune weapon already. +1 F2P Mage needs an update more than F2P Melee. Instead of worrying about Melee vs. Melee interactions, we need to worry more about Mage vs. Melee.

Oh right, I did it in about 45 minutes... my bad. :P I actually didn't mind buying 70 crafting... I bought a bunch of uncut sapphires and then cut all of them... 1350 xp every time you bank, ~200k xp/hour. Also, I had a huge cash pile (55M), and if you don't spend your GPs you're wasting them. I did mind buying 70 prayer. Its ~10x slower than sapphires, and costs ~10x more. So unfair!

9

Actually, I think we can thank the Merchants and Price Manipulators for helping stem inflation. Think about it: Do these individuals that like to sit on huge cash piles really ever spend all of their GP? Its the same as, I buy a rare, never to sell it again. There is now one less rare on the market. I'd like you all to read this article: http://www.slate.com/id/2110817/ People with large cash piles that use it to grow larger cash piles are actually good for the game in the long run.