Soma2035

I think you made a whole bunch of high level arrows. One person stands there and takes them, gives them to player 2, who deposits them, and player 1 takes them again and so on. You don't lose points from previous rounds for scoring negative, so if you play to games, each person gets a turn at making massive amounts of points. What you do with millions of points beats me. Since I don't really care for the points as long as I make 20-30k per game (since I now have excess), I normally find a level 3 spot to make myself a prayer pot, summoning pouch and a few summon scrolls. Then I get myself a level 4 spot and make armour and weapons for people and myself. I try to defend skillers, but since everyone has ancients (like cw :wall: ), I normally end up in tactical retreat (ie run back to the nearest safe place I can find). If I stay at a level 4 spot I sometimes make some extra sets of armour for the base, but most of what I do is make food (I can't make any stackable l4 items). If I decide to skill for the game, I go find a level 3 spot and make arrows and/or runes. When I fight, I normall end up in mage hat and bottom with a platebody and l4 scim and staff. After reading this I might go to range armour and a dagger. If the enemy team blockades our base and I end up in there, I deposit everything I have, turn on smite and the prayer for +15% attack, run out and start punching/theiving. When I am about to die I switch to retribution (I can hit at least 13 max doing that). I have actualy killed with retribution. It was a melee guy, retribution hit 3 when I died killing him. I have noticed the smart mages have food making it near immpossible to get their runes solo (need mass theiving and pray they cant do a multi attack ice spell). Well, since it seems to be fixed already, how it used to be done was: Two people would work together to quickly amass a pile of runes or arrows. Let's just say 10K Cataclysmic runes for the sake of this example. Player 1 would deposit. Player 2 would retrieve them. Player 1 would gain 40K, Player 2 would lose 40K. Player 2 could then give to Player 1, who would deposit for another 40K. They would repeat this until Player 1 had millions of points, and Player 2 had negative millions. However: 1) Negative points aren't cumulative. If you end the game with -10M, your score for purchasing tools and armor is unaffected. 2) You could leave the game, or teleport out of the game, or ask the mystic to take you out of the game, to negate these negative points. Anyways, if the rumors are wrong and it's not fixed, don't do it. Jagex has threatened to ban anyone abusing it. Also, don't be surprised if you see a 5M score once again. It won't surprise me at all, seeing as Jagex left one huge hole in their fix.

Umm.... it requires one more person. And maybe a few extra clicks... like 5.

Cosplaying makes you stupid? Wow. What does Halloween make you? \ Cosplaying happens for many games, not just WoW. And as much as I dislike WoW, I feel people who like WoW more than Runescape are entitled their opinion, every bit as much as I'm entitled to mine.

/facepalm. /headdesk /headstalagmite Someone please tell me that's not true... :wall: :wall: :wall: [hide=Reason]I made a thread yesterday discussing this issue on RSOF. I suggested a combination of no giving things with negative points, and a cap on how many negative points you can have. Someone asked why it was necessary to cap negative points, and I think I explained fairly well why, considering I couldn't explain anything relevant to it. Anyways, if you don't cap negative points, it might slow it down, but you can still easily score 2M+ per game. And even though I have no interest in doing so, if this is really Jagex's "fix", I think we'll have to wait a whole 3 days before someone figures out what I already know, and starts posting pictures of several million points earned in a single game again. :wall: :wall: :wall:[/hide]

I kill them. Edit: Oh yea. I also take and sell their runes, arrows, and armor.

I just scored 178k in a single game, without any dubious methods. Probably the easiest way to score high is: Get 80 Mining, Woodcutting, Hunter, and Fishing. Preferably at least 2 of them. Get 80 Runecrafting, or 80 Fletching and 60 Runecrafting. Get 80 Summoning. Once you start the game, talk to the mystic and ask him to 'show clay'. That'll reveal what spots are available. Find a level 5 you can harvest. Get a class1 Clay. Turn it into a tool to match any class 3 gathering spots. Get a class 3 tool matching the level 5. Get a level 5 clay, and then upgrade your tool. Get a full load of clay. Make a Pouch + 2 sets of scrolls. Make the rest into cataclysmic runes / arrows, give it to the beast, and have it deposit. Then go harvest a full inven (including filling up the familiar). Turn into runes / arrows, give to beast, have it deposit. Rinse and repeat for the rest of the game. If you run out of level 5 resource, go to a level 4 resource of the same type, and make Cataclysmic runes. Each clay = 75 for harvesting, 75 for crafting, 4 per rune * 75 runes = 300 for depositing, adds to 450 points per clay. You should be able to get past 50k very easily with this.

PKing can be seen is a "Larger" and "More Fun" on F2P. - There are more people who PK F2P (All those F2P PKers who don't have a choice of P2P, and P2P who prefer F2P PvP) - There's a better developed meta-game, and it's more easily enforced (Since the max hit is a whopping 30 or so, it's fairly easy to just leave if you don't want to fight. No ancient, teleport block, snare, or entangle helps too.) - The amount you risk to have optimal gear is lower. If you're only PKing for fun, you can be using the "best" equipment at only a 300k or so risk. Many skills also don't really change much. Mining, for example. Other than powermining granite, and a few rune rocks here and there in completely out of the way places, mining doesn't see much benefit from switching to P2P. Smithing doesn't see much benefit either, since hardly anyone makes arrow tips / dart tips / spears / hastas / silly things like that anyways. Blast Furnace is alright, but training it the old fashioned way is just as fast. Cooking is usually just one more dish of every type. The food is better, yes, but the skill is pretty much the same.

i have been waiting for that for ever, lets hope it stays that way It was fixed the day after the update. ;) No it wasn't. You don't wield both at the same time, you wield a scimitar, then transform it into a bow from the equipment menu. It stays equipped, as does your shield.

Uhh, I just play normally. My boring strategy is just to collect stuff... I can net easily up to 100k points per game that way. My more fun strategy which I've been doing more and more can net anywhere from 40k to 150k per game. Sometimes more. I had it up to over 600k on the first day just fighting too... And it sounds like you could, at least, that's what the Jagex Mod is threatening. It's kind of silly though, how are you going to check who's been using it? You can't go by points saved. Some people who used it never got over 500k points an attempt and stopped after 1.5M (One of my friends told me he could only manage that much...). Some people earned several million points (Like me) legit already. Since high scores aren't saved, and most of the time people aren't reporting this, it's going to be hard to distinguish who was using it and who was not.

How is it? It's a design mistake: not a bug at all.. And people who use design mistakes to their advantage are clever not stupid at all! - Just do it yourself till Jagex designs the game a bit different! (ie: trading stuff to someone would let that person loose points as if he took it from the home base). Other than that: what's the point in points? Really 240k is needed for the whole set, you can only buy 1 morphic tool/game so a standard 20k/game is nice. And without bug abusing earning 80k is easily: so only 240/60 = 4 games are needed for a full set.. An average day gives this easily! That said: the rewards are lame and waaay to easy to get: they look kewl, but since they're so easy there's no "ooooh" feeling for it anymore already. Everyone just can get it! Well, On one hand, Jagex has stated they're treating it as a bug. On the other, Jagex doesn't read their own rules. This is nowhere close to being an actual bug... I found a simpler example to differentiate bug from design flaw. Does anyone else remember the infinite store stock update? Bug - Jagex makes a typo, and Raw Sharks are 48 GP each. Design Flaw - Jagex puts Raw Sharks at 480 GP each without realizing it would completely destroy the market. The first is a bug. They intended to tell the game "480" and accidentally listed it at 48. The second is NOT a bug. They didn't intend for the market to collapse, but they DID intentionally tell the computer to list it at that price. Since the software was fine, it's not a bug. This case definitely falls into the latter category. Negative points, withdrawing items at a cost, depositing items at a cost, and being able to give items for free are all intentionally included features. While they didn't anticipate it would be abused this way, that doesn't make it a bug. In either case, it's all moot, since Jagex can ban you for anything. Hell, they can fairly ban you for saying "hi" since their T&C requires you to acknowledge that they're reserving that right. So it wouldn't be a good idea to continue doing it anyhow. Also, I wonder just how many points these people have... I've gotten millions of points without using it. I wonder if someone's found the cap on points already. :D

Actually that way would not get you even near millions. I think it's best for me to not talk about it since it is considered as bug abuse though technically there's no bug exploited. Just a loophole. Rest assured that it will get fixed very soon. Apart from a few bugs and glitches, I enjoy this minigame. However it is definitely not a game for skillers and pkers. First of all, no xp is given to skills. Also, as said above, high levels are self sufficients and don't need low level skillers to help them. And the rewards are very bad. Though the melee set is same as rune and it's easily obtainable in a game or 2. I already found the other thing... I think. I haven't tested since I don't particularly care for the rewards, but I corrected myself above already.

It's like dart speed then? Wow... Which is why if it got out of SC, it would be ridiculous. +168 attack, +75 strength, and faster than whip? Add in defender, and you have CB slayer on steroids disguised as a wimpy little dagger.

The dagger is faster than scimitar. And normal daggers as well. It's also a stabbing weapon.

Just in case anyone cares.

Okay so I was wrong before. There is a better method to get points. This is just from what I've learned, I haven't personally tried this. I'm also not certain whether it's considered a bug or not so I won't post the exact method. However, here's some interesting facts. - For someone to have those millions of points, someone else has to have almost the same point value... but negative. - Taking items from the tables costs you some points, but putting them back gives you the same amount. - Cataclysmic Runes, Arrows Class 4, and Arrows Class 5 cost you a TON of points to take and put back, because the "take item" option makes you take the whole stack. Anyhow, if you can figure it out from that, enjoy. I don't particularly care for using this since I have more than enough points from just playing the game last night, and the rewards aren't that spectacular. Use it at your own risk.

Morphic ---> 62% Volatile ---> 85% (not sure) 1) Pickaxe and hatchet require smithing. I don't know about the other tools, because I'm 80+ in most other skills used in this game. 2) Staves probably use crafting. Robes appear to be magic, but I'm not certain. 3) It varies, no one is really sure yet.

That has to be fake, there is just no way its possible to get 4.7m points in one game. Compared to that, my highest score isnt very big. :P (image) Oh and I entered a game when i was over the fence (climbing over) I ended up inside this swarm. If i tried to move, it said "You cant reach that." Had to log in and out. :lol: When i logged in, I was inside our teams base. :? (image) What's sad is, I know exactly how to score that many points. Setup: - Get as many people with level 80 harvesting skills as possible. - Find enough people to start a clan match against you, who agree to not touch the level 5 resources. - Reset the map until you have at least two class 5 resources that everyone can harvest. Getting the high score: - The person getting the high score gets a familiar + scrolls. - The other players on his team collect level 5 clay, make into arrows, and give to him. Each clay = 15 arrows, which at class 5, is 300 points per clay. - The other team collects level 4 clay, makes into cataclysmic runes. They run over with NOTHING but the runes in their inventory, and allow the person getting the high score to steal their runes. - The player getting the highscore deposits all the runes + arrows and asks the familiar to deposit.[stats][/stats]

The dagger is faster than normal dragon daggers. Normal speed "tiers" go sort of like this: Fastest (7) - Darts, Knives Very Fast (6) - Scimitars, Daggers, Swords, Shortbow Fast (5) - Longswords, Maces, Throwing Axes Medium (4) - Battleaxes, Warhammers, Longbows Slow (3) - 2H Swords, Granite Mauls, Very Slow (2) - Ogre Bow Slowest (1) - Dark Bow These are the values taken from the KB, and accurate, to my knowledge. There are exceptions to each of course, and rapid attack mode isn't factored. The new dagger seems to be in the "Fastest" category. It's the same speed as knives / darts on accurate mode. And no, allowing the use of these tools outside of the game would be ridiculous - Warhammer C5: +338 Crush Attack, +75 Strength. Can you even imagine this thing at waterfiends? Dagger C5: +168 Stab Attack, +75 Strength. It's already easy enough to hit CB with Zamorakian spear, which isn't even 100 stab attack. This almost doubles the stab attacks, mantains a decent strength, and hits even faster? Staff C5: I can see how you think it would be fun to change the max magic attack bonus on a weapon from under +30 to +225... but no. Just no. Those are the three main offenders. While the other items are also decent, these 3 are absurdly strong. The bow does have an incredible attack bonus of over 200, but it's limited by lack of special. Even with its fairly high hits, it's not quite enough to overshadow the rune crossbow and dark bow, both with fairly good attack bonus, and hitting higher.

[hide=Wall of Text][/hide] Woot, another Snake...r. Soma, I skimmed your post, but I see you didn't with mine. I said that stages with hazards are allowed... but in a tourney of this size + no CP system in place, it's not unreasonable to say that there is no need for all stages. Battlefield, Final Destination, Smashville, Yoshi's Island, Castle Siege, Delfino Plaza, Lylat Cruise, Pokemon Stadium (Melee) should be the playable stages. For example, Corneria has extremely small edges, meaning that it's extremely easy to kill with Snake/GaW and other chars with nice up-kills. I'm pretty sure some chars can 1hk0 Jiggly consistantly... Sure, if you lose, you should be allowed a counterpick. Hazards are definetely not the only criteria for a ban neither, obviously. We didn't deny that, but that's not the point we're debating on ATM. If we were, we would be discussing * Stage hazards * Edges * Unfair advantages And much, much more, but we don't even have enough intelligent posters anyways. Or, ones who have a pure SWF view, nor do we really need them. Why can't we just simplify it and just allow for Neutral stages? Seriously, all this is unneeded really, this is not a real tournament with no lag, a counterpick character/stage, etc. And seriously, Soma, you've been coming here and bashing us for having tournament each and every time. Sure, it's not as active as before, but I don't see why we shouldn't be allowed to do a tourney, or even looked down because of it. It's not like we're forcing people to play. However, we could do a league. We'd put me top, mano second, etc etc and then we'll keep shaping it to better form the skill, more than a tourney could. I don't know, a league seems like a good idea, and is more competetive and adds a less luck factor (eg Crazy running into Me first, and he loses to Ginger in losers because Ginger fought Mano although Crazy is clearly superior than last place...[Not saying you're worse, Crazy. Just an example]) Also, a league is much more constant and gives people more reason to play, and this is a pretty small community so it is extremely easy to manage. I'm in favor of this idea > tournament. \ :thumbup: :thumbsup: [/hide] If you think I'm bashing you for making a tournament, I think you misinterpreted my post. I'm bashing you for bashing each other. This tournament has already died down, and it's small enough already. Do you really have to make it smaller by arguing with each other more? New people who come and voice their opinions get beaten down. And even worse, they get beat down, the majority of the time, for the wrong reason. I did read your post. And my post wasn't aimed at yours, it was aimed at people who said "Pmg it's too random so it's not good!!!" You are already down to a dozen or less people. I just found it absurd that when someone was interested in joining, he was flamed... by people who were even farther from the truth than he was. Look at Ikeforever's post. I just find it silly to divide an already tiny group, over a debate, when the majority side is presenting incorrect arguments. Now if you think that's how this should be run, fine. That's just my 2 cents on the issue, feel free to ignore it.

You know, I really don't see why you guys bother having tournaments anymore. It was fun maybe the first time, but now there are less than 10 people who are even interested in it. You want to use official tournament rules, but you don't get those right either... Also, RayOxide does raise some valid points, some that are acknowledged by the smash community. Here are the standard tournament rules as far as stage picks go: Neutral (Pretty much every tournament will allow these as the initial stage): Battlefield, Final Destination, Smashville, Yoshi's Island Neutral / Counterpick (Tournaments usually place these stages in one category or another): Castle Siege, Delfino Plaza, Halberd, Lylat Cruise, Pokemon Stadium (Melee) Counterpick (The loser of the previous match can select one of these stages, or the neutral ones): Brinstar (Melee), Corneria (Melee), Distant Planet, Frigate Orpheon, Green Hill Zone, Jungle Japes (Melee), Luigi's Mansion, Norfair, Picto Chat, Pirate Ship, Pokemon Stadium 2, Rainbow Cruise (Melee), Yoshi's Island (Melee) Counterpick . Banned (Tournaments place these either under counterpick or banned): Green Greens (Melee), Mario Circuit, Onett (Melee), Port Town Aero Dive, Skyworld So... my point? I bolded the ones that have hazards, or major stage modifications. Note that Yoshi's Island, despite having a life saving blob thing, is actually a NEUTRAL stage. Halberd, despite the claw that attacks with little to no warning, and the cursor - beam, is considered either Neutral or Counterpick depending on the tournament. Look at the counterpicks, many of them have obvious hazards. Why? Stages aren't always banned for Hazards. For example, Hyrule Temple (Melee) is BANNED. It has NO hazards, it has no changing parts. It's simply too large. The same applies to NPC. Tournaments don't ban NPC because of the Chimera. If the Chimera was the only fault, it would probably be a tournament legal stage. RayOxide is right, from a tournament perspective. A good player will never get caught by the Chimera if you put him alone on the stage. He'll only ever be hit by the Chimera because of his opponent's actions, be it pressuring him in that direction, or actively swinging him that way. Look at Picto Chat, with numerous powerful hazards. Frigate Orpheon with it's "hey let's go upside down and gimp all recoveries" is a counter pick. Corneria with the berserk Arwings is a counterpick. Brinstar and Norfair are both counterpicks despite the lava, and in Norfair's case, the lava streams and walls. The thing with tournament rules is that you seem to be trying to establish your own set. That's pretty stupid, considering you don't really have a community of players. You have maybe half a dozen players. Do you really need to divide this number further by fighting over setting up your own tournament rules?

No this is the right place because it is below 5 days until the event happens. (i'm assuming the post is meaning tonight.) No i does not it has NO discussian vaule... :wall: I've reread your post thrice, and it still makes no sense... :wall:

Too busy with Disgaea DS. :

Just because it's been out a while doesn't mean the bubble won't burst. Party hats were basically a bubble market, and look what's happening to them at the moment. They've been out since near the dawn of Runescape, and they're discontinued! Yeah 3a has decent stats, but not the best. And more are coming into the game, however slowly. Party hats were not a bubble market. Party hats collapsed due to several reasons: 1) Money didn't flow as quickly anymore. Without staking and PKing, it was unlikely for someone to go from 50M to 500M overnight. Even more so without unbalanced trades. A lot of people who buy party hats do so because they already earned everything else they want, or they suddenly find themselves in so much money they don't know what to do with a major chunk of it. 2) With the 3K trade limitations, buying and selling multiple party hats a day is just pointless. Most people expected to profit or lose 500k or more on each trade. This is hardly possible with those 3k limits. Even after the expansion to 30k this seemed pretty meaningless. 3) The bar has been "raised" as far as equipment goes. It's almost like a cycle. People generally choose armor/weapons/skills over rares with no other value. For example, I spent money on my cannon + rune armor + glory amulet before I finally realized that my 10M was excessive, and bought a party hat. Only, back then your items were rune, dragon, and glories. Now, they are Godswords, Bandos, Armadyl, etc. Back when the party hat market peaked, the top of the line items were whip and barrows, and they had pretty much reached a stable, and fairly low point. If you had 150M cash, and you already had your barrows and whip, if you didn't want to train skills, your only other choice is party hats / other rare items / don't spend it. Anyhow, the party hat market won't crash forever. They've lost a substantial portion of their market, but their supply will fall as well. I've already seen people PK with party hats. People also alch them, or quit RS with them, etc. Eventually, it will probably reach the point at which people will want them again, but that might take a while. Masks, on the other hand, have honestly been showing signs of crashing for days. When everyone and their mother has 10+ masks, no one wears them, and no one's trying to buy them, but everyone's asking 10m+, you have problems. I have yet to understand why they ever reached such a high price. They're ridiculously ugly. I managed to get a couple off the GE. One of them I promptly gave to my brother at GE price so he could sell off his 4M summoning junk and 1M other PvP drops junk. The other I was holding in case one of my friends / clannmates needed it. Ended up selling it before it plummeted. :wall: I don't think 3rd age will go the same way. People treat 3rd age very differently from animal masks. On one hand, you have people gathering 10+ animal masks to hopefully trade for something more valuable, like an elyssian spirit shield, or 3rd age armor. On the other, you have people who want to earn a full 3rd age set (melee, magic, and ranged). Other people who just want an individual set. Right now, people are collecting 3rd age for collection's sake. People were collecting masks for the sake of junk trading. That is the problem. 3rd age will decline in value, but it will be gradual, alongside more and more of them coming into the game, and more and more other collectibles entering the game.

You say it has to be an error in the software, and indeed that's what it says in the rules. But the wording of the rule itself is vague. Does "errors which you find in our software" refer exclusively to literal lines of code that are messed up? Or could it encompass a broader realm of errors, both human and technical? I think its the latter. This is an oversight on Jagex's part. They did not foresee that rangers would be able to use the ditch in such a manner, and did not remove a feature that they should have. You're being very rigid in your definition of "bug". You seem to think that Jagex forgetting to take something out that they should does not qualify. If this is your problem with the whole argument, then very well! Replace the word "bug" with the phrase "abuse of game mechanics to obtain unfair advantages" and maybe that will satiate you? Yes, that would satiate me. But as I pointed out in that very post, "Abuse of Game Mechanics to obtain unfair advantages" aren't always changed. Why? Because the unfair advantage HAS TO BE GAMEBREAKING. If an advantage isn't gamebreaking, that is, everyone can use it somewhat, it doesn't drastically alter anything, and there's an easy way to avoid it, then Jagex hasn't, and shouldn't, waste time changing it. As pointed out, did you think that Jagex forsaw people getting smited out, realizing it, dropping their item, returning, and retrieving it? Don't you think that's unfair? Well, this is fairly easy to avoid. PK farther from areas where they can retrieve their items, or kill them before they drop it. Everyone can do it, it's not ridiculously overpowering, and there are numerous ways to avoid it. The same is the case here. Yes, it's probably an abuse of game mechanics. But that is what emergent gameplay, by definition, is. Using game features in a way that they weren't meant to be used. And that's what most MMORPGs are built on. Look at hybrids who wear dragonhide while using melee weapons. Do you think Jagex intended that? Obviously not, since their manual specifically states their negative defense against magic as a weakness. Yet they haven't changed it, because there are plenty of ways around it, and limitations on it. The same is true here. This "abuse" is easily avoided AND countered. In fact, there's MULTIPLE ways to counter it. Magical attacks, ranged attacks, team mate to catch them on the other side, luring them deeper by hiding behind a tree or building to block their attacks. It's also a very insignificant portion of the pking area.

Because as rudimentary my knowledge of java programming is, I do know the basics of creating game objects. As to your second argument, Madmanpur3 has already addressed this what, five times? Just because Jagex did not intend for it to be used in this fashion doesn't make it a bug. A bug, as Jagex themselves have defined it in their rules, is an ERROR IN THE SOFTWARE. Go read it yourself if you don't believe me. Overlooking something that's useful to players is an example of emergent gameplay. Not bug abuse. They meant for this ditch to be attacked over, it should be obvious to anyone with even the slightest programming knowledge. Whether they meant it to be an obstacle for rangers to abuse or not is irrelevant, because it is not a bug. Now, Jagex has changed things before that were gamebreaking. But as I've proved to you, this isn't. Bugs: - Being able to teleport out of Barbarian Assault and keep blood runes you took. - Being able to PK in Falador in the old wilderness after the release of POHs. - Being able to duplicate valuable items with the party chest. Emergent Gameplay that has been changed: - Logging out to remove Teleport Block. - Hiring alchers at MTA to help you quickly train magic when you could trade inside. - Trapping Commander Zilyana in the corner of her room. - Using the Wild to Non Wild attack clause to quickly train range (1.4m+ per hour) Emergent Gameplay that HASN'T been changed: - Dropping your items so you can return and grab them if you're about to die. - Using Dragon Spears alongside Ice Barrage to move a victim into multi. There's just a few examples. Now you're saying that an unexpected safespot is so ridiculously gamebreaking that it has to be fixed? If so, you really need to lurk more, and understand what gamebreaking actually means, as far as Runescape goes. Something that can be countered easily (Ranged or magical attacks, PKing in other spots), and is nothing new (Cow pens have the same effect in lumbridge. Fences and Gates usually have some similar abuse here and there) is really not gamebreaking enough to warrant a fix, or the bother of creating multiple copies of the RS map with minor differences.