homer205

I'm going to tentatively wade into this debate, I haven't read all of the thread but I've seen most of it (about 75%). I don't check it regularly enough to see the posts that were deleted but I'll just say that as it's impossible to determine/prove unless you have screenshots (which you wouldn't be able to post anyway) so arguments on that point should cease. Going to start off with my view on the meaning of efficiency, per dictionary.com: accomplishment of or ability to accomplish a job with a minimum expenditure of time and effort. To me, if I am enjoying something then it requires little effort (regardless of actual clicking/attention involved) as my enjoyment makes me forget/disregard the effort. People also tend to associate time with effort, this means that if they have a task (generally a skill or making money) which they don't want to complete then they have 4 options: 1. Don't train that skill/gather money. 2. Find the fastest (generally deemed boring or expensive) way to achieve their goal. 3. Use a slow, (generally deemed enjoyable) way to reach their goal. 4. Find a middle ground between options 2 and 3. Of this, options 2, 3 and 4 can be considered efficient, though different people will dicsover what option they prefer on their own. Option 1 can't be considered efficient since nothing has been achieved. Not_trolling touched on the weighing up of which option to take when he spoke about taking a boring path which had 5 times the xp/h of an enjoyable one. Jr responded by saying he would take option 4, sometimes however, there is no middle ground and a choice has to be made, the resentment (on both sides) of those that choose differently seems to be part of the argument on this thread, after all, people tend not to like being disagreed with. As I previously mentioned, sometimes option 4 doesn't exist, likewise, sometimes people do not enjoy any methods of training a skill, in this case they either don't train it or choose the fastest method. As there was obviously a reason why the goal was set, people choose to take the fast option (since they don't enjoy either option, effort can be considered equal) in this case, being efficient isn't fun. If however, any of the options which result in the completion of the goal are chosen, and the fastest method which is enjoyable is chosen, then that method can be considered efficient. Finding the correct personal balance between the effort caused through actual attention/clicking and effort caused by the boredom/enjoyment (in enjoyments case it would be negative effort) is what each person needs to do for each goal in order to be efficient. Because we can't determine via a forum which activities people find enjoyable (unless they take the time to specifiy which few do) people disregard enjoyment when responding to help and advice topics. Those that don't and give options which prioritises what they enjoy (assuming it will be the same as the op) tend to give poor advice (unless their enjoyed method happens to be the best, when it's not you get the advice like picking flax/cutting trees for cash). One thing that seems to be forgotten when people describe no lifing/extremely attention requiring methods as not being what is meant by efficiency, for some people they can be (if that's their goal) and thus they enjoy that, this shouldn't be disregarded or else you're basically doing what jr is complaining about in regards to the majority (of posters in this thread) view of his training methods except about methods which result in higher output. I hope that's enough to warrant a reply as I feel I've put forward my views on the topic sufficiently for the time being. In regards to the flaming which has gone on in this thread, both sides are guilty, while I personally don't have a side (you're all quite entertaining really). Not going to go back through the whole thread to do this (which is a shame really, because there's some great hypocrisy if you search for it, but it'd take too long). To jr: Sixfoot didn't say that the moderators had made a mistake, he merely said that it can happen. This is implication, if you argue against it then you are legitimising it. In this case you have to accept that all parties can do this (which has happened in response to your posts such as "your point?" and asking for mature arguments). I believe Vulxai summed this up quite well: Also you need to stop using multiple people disagreeing with you as a point in your favour, you can't just assume that they are working together judging by the times I've seen grimy and obtaurian online I'd doubt it anyway). To the pro efficiency group (there's too many of you for me to bother attributing posts indivdually, if it doesn't apply to you then disregard it): While many of you seem to be frustrated that your posts are being ignored despite providing legitimate discussion, rather than flaming, why not quote your original post in order for it to be part of your new post so it can be replied to rather than than you being accused of flaming. If you add a summary then it should theoretically be understood by those willing to put in a reasonable amount of time reading/comprehending it (unless they're stupid or the post is deliberately confusing). Alternately you could ask which points there is confusion over, allowing you to explain them and get the discussion you wanted in the next reply. I think this post has gone on long enough and hope to get some responses.

As S U O M I hasn't really started slayer yet and it's expected that he's going to run into cashflow issues when he starts with buyables, would he be better off using his tokens to recharge chaotic rapiers? As I understand it dungeoneering is fast xp at high levels so would he really need to spend his tokens on experience when it could be faster to get the experience through dungeoneering which might save him money making time later on? I don't know the exact costs/gp rates he gets so maybe someone with knowledge of this could better speculate as to his plan? Keeping on with S U O M I for the moment, people seem to think top players are offering runecrafting assistance with their daily allotment. He's been offering his herblore level, or was before anyway. Perhaps trying to conserve money in the future?

I tend to agree with Shelby except for the part about making the cc invite only. If you'e wanting to get people to join then forcing them to get invited is going to be too much of a hassle for most to bother with. You can always get rid of unwanted influences when they appear and this way you aren't restricting any potential members. Other than the stickied thread for advertising clanchats and putting information about it in your signature I can't think of any advertising ideas.

Just to expand on what to bind, the primal and promethium weapons mentioned require 99 and 90 attack respectively which I see is a little outside of your stats. The best you can use right now is katagon which is tier 8 (out of a possible 11). As you can't make this yet (need higher mining/smithing) the best weapons you can realistically get are argonite (tier 7). To get this you should start a complexity 1 dungeon, at these levels you get given weapons, armour, staves, bows and runes based on your levels in respective stats, for you I think this should be argonite. Weapon is the most important thing to bind first, monsters in daemonheim are very weak to certain attack styles, this leads some people to choose a spear as it can use all styles (it can also be poisoned). If you're going to use a 2 hander in the long term then it's advised to customise your ring as a berserker style. This will increase the percentage of damage done when using agressive attack mode (spears don't have this option). You can only change your ring customization once however so I recommend waiting before you decide. Whether you want to bind arrows or runes is up to you, runes are generally more useful but also easier to make. The ammunition bind is separate from other item binding (you can have one of each at any level) When you get to level 50 you can bind two items. Most people will choose to bind the best metal platebody that they can use/access. Going back to complexity 1 is a good way to get the platebody quickly. The main exception to binding a platebody second is if you get a shadow silk hood. This item prevents all humanoid (except for mages and bosses) from seeing you. Meaning you can run past them if you want to, mages will cast a spell temporarily preventing this from working however. It is still considered to be worth it as the second bind however, especially if you start to do team dungeons. The hood is dropped only by night spiders so if you see any of these kill them. I'm assuming you know how prestige works so I won't explain that unless you say that you don't.

Three of the stats I really want at 99 in one month. Impressive and jealous now.

He means the cape you gt for completing mage arena (miniquest) it has +10 to magic atack and defence. You'll need to kill a boss for it and maybe charge a godspell (can't remember) neither should be too hard at your level. Here's the link to Tip It's guide http://www.tip.it/runescape/?page=mage_arena.htm I can't believe I forgot to suggest it, apart from the initial time/runes spent doing the quest you can get a new cape or change to a different god's cape at any time (just go back to where you originally get it).

Broad tipped bolts are 18 higher ranged strength than mithril and equal to addy bolts, they're only 1 gp more expensive than mith bolts. Mystic is a cheap alternative ahrims as you need very little mage bonus as the melee brothers all have low magic and are wearing their armour which has negative defensive bonuses. I highly recommend bringing a dds or enhanced excalibur so that you can use up your special bar. Getting your range to level 70 allowing you to use black dragonhide will help. A farseer helm has the same magic attack bonus as ahrims hood while being slightly cheaper and doesn't degrade (about 2-5 worse in melee defences though). While a little more expensive, if you want to get guthans then you can go to the tunnels to heal off the monsters there, the danger to this is that you accientally spawn a brother when you open a door, don't do it when you're in ko range and you'll be fine though and it could allow you to do more runs per trip. While not really equipment related, the quests in search/aid of the myreque and having a kharyll (canifis, found on the ancient spellbook) portal in your house can help you get there much faster.

Damn that's impressive. I clicked half expecting to see someone trolling with a level 29 stat, glad I had a look though.

He meant pick one of those three as a 4th bind, not to have them both bound.

Just to expand on the rushing him with melee, heres a video of it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_jrav_qbXw

World 117, although with so many dungeons going on at the same time it's reportedly laggy, also many people complain about the people you find there. I've only personally done one dungeon there so I can't really comment on those aspects however.

Would I be able to do TDs with the following stats? 95 attack/strength 94 defence 96 hp 88 range 91 magic 92 prayer 83 summoning 83 herblore I know that unicorn is important but would I be able to make up for it with soul split, or if flashing isn't possible, extra food/shorter trips? I'm not looking to be especially efficient, just get some decent cash. Which familliar should I use at my current summoning level? I only just got 83 so it'll be a long time to 88. Any other advice for something I've forgotten to ask would also be appreciated. Thanks.

Also Nomad's requiem isn't that long (assuming you don't keep dieing to Nomad)

This sadly does seem to be turning into an efficiency based thread. Anyway, my story (sorry no picture): Ran past a guy in lord Iowerth's camp safespotting and ranging elves (the level 108 ones) nothing wrong with that, except he as wearing full rune to do it in. I stopped and explained briefly that he'd be better taking his armour off is he didn't have any range gear. Come back from my clue ~5 minutes later and there he is, still ranging in full rune from a safespot.

A couple of things you might want to add, the first ranked in the new skills. I know that the person for summoning is a tifer and he took a highscores picture. A couple of the larger bugs are when the top floor of the slayer tower briefly became the wilderness after an unrelated update and the barbarian assault glitch which allowed runes to be smuggled out. Here's a video of that by tainted ones, they used to specialise in glitches but they tended to get banned. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wMYd68fxPTU There's also a few more glitches on that guys channel. This was a great read, I'm impressed and thanks.

I've been reading on here a lot that the sgs is outdated and thats made me think that perhaps I should sell it. I do have a couple of questions as to what to replace it with and what to do with the money? As I intend to continue slaying what should I replace the healing with? I have bunyip, b2p and guthans, is it worth doing the diary for enhanced excalibur? 200 lifepoints of healing doesn't seem like much for the entire special bar. Any other healing items I should get? If I do sell then what should I do with the cash? In the equipment department I have guthans, karils, whip, dfs and fury. Skill wise I have 99 farming banked so please don't suggest that. I have 47m in he bank and would like to retain at 10-20m of this as a precaution so if I sell the sgs then I should have around 70-80m to spend. My stats are below. Hope someone can help with what to spend the money on or whether I should keep the sgs? Edit: Thanks for the advice. I've put in an offer for 8k dragons bones and to sell my sgs and dfs. I'll put in an offer for the rest of the bones once they sell then save them untill the bonus xp weekend. I've got enough golds and crimsons banked for 79 summoning although now I doubt I have enough for the shards and secondarys. The extreme potions look to be ou of my reach for the moment but I'll keep them in mind. Edit 2: Just read that the bonus xp weekend doesn't stack with gilded altar, what about ectofunctus?

Only when you collect, all rewards aren't calculated until you get them. This means you can change your workers directly before you collect and you'll get the appropriate amount of whatever you just told them to get.

I don't know if any of you looked at his stats but that account isn't ranked for anything so I'm guessing he can't do most of those sugestions if it's that account. The only thing you can really do to lessen the cost of the runes themselves is to make them using runecrafting. You may also want to make use of a caged/weak monster (there's a monk of zamorak locked away in varrock palace), put on melee armour to reduce magic accuracy and cast the curse spells (the ones that use body runes). The armour will make you splash your spells, allowing them to be recast on the same monster. Because the curse spells don't deal damage anyway you won't be losing xp from the damage you're not hitting. Body runes are also cheap (5gp each)

Thanks for the advice and the link. Thats cleared up everything except what I should put in my offhand slot which I'm still looking information on.

I'm hoping for some help before fighting Nomad. Specifically: Defender/Dfs/Unholy book, which would be best for the shield slot? Which weapon should I take for special, I have sgs and ds or should I borrow bgs/d claws? Diamond bolts (e) or ruby (e) for ranging? Should I be ranging as my primary attack or only when frozen? If it's my primary attack then should I use void instead of karils? If it's not then should I use whip or sgs? I see kyatt pouches are recommended after I use all of my beat of burden, why? Surely there are better fighting familliars. Can someone please help?

Once you get 30 then go to the crafting guild, just north of the cow pen. multiple willow trees, one spot where you can get at two trees without moving and 27 spots in a row along the fenceline, look for rocks near the transport symbol and start there. Grand exchange, fist of guthix and draynor are all good and falador east is ok if you're wanting to burn logs you've banked. Can't really help with oaks woodcutting/burning spots sorry. Once you get your level a bit over the logs you're burning then you won't have to do the animation of lighting the logs if you click quickly after one another, the exception is the first log in the inventory as this always gets the animation, even at 99 with normal logs.

Could someone please explain to me how the reset button for dungeoneering affects your prestige and when the best time to reset (if there is one) in order to get the highest experience possible. I'm kind of getting sick of level 40s getting more xp per dungeon when I do most of the stuff and they have death penalties. I hope someone can help, thanks.

I second slayer as a good training method as added combat levels always help and it's decent cash becoming good cash once you get into the higher levels. I recommend edgeville or zanaris master for you. Some quests you should do for rewards are: Smoking kills - points reward for slayer tasks Cold war - adds more penguins to the distraction and diversion Eadgar's ruse - trollheim tele Watchtower-watchtower tele Fairy tale part 1 and 2 - magic secateurs and fairy rings, you don't need the farming and herblore requirements for part 2 to get fairy rings access Fremminik trials/isle - some xp and access to fremminik areas Throne of Miscellania/Royal trouble - access to a kingdom which will get resources for you at a low price The grand tree/tree gnome village - acess to the gnome gliders and spirit trees In search of the myreque/in aid of the myreque - shortcut to barrows and bank near it King's ransom - piety/chivalry prayers Recipe for disaster - better and better gloves the more you do Start mournings end part 1 - acess to letya/letya teleport crystals For quest experience amounts use this guide: http://www.tip.it/runescape/index.php?page=quest_experience_guide.htm Not sure which quests you've done so I just put in a few I thought would be useful, assumed you've done some though. I'd also advise you get 70 range for black dragonhide as it comes in handy often and hat you avoid construction and summoning untill you've got good equipment and money saved as they both cost a lot of money.

Thanks and nice sig. Now just wondering about dungeoneering xp rates.

Hey they there, I recently returned after a break and was wanting some help with leveling dungeoneering quickly. I'm currently f2p but considering getting members. At the moment I'm just interested in getting experience quickly if there's a xp/items trade off. My second question is about the clan chats, I used to use lady heinous but that isn't in use anymore and I was hoping someone could point me to her new name/the clan chat where most of those people now are. Hope you can help, thanks.