Policeman Shot Dead

[greenslime89]

BBC News link

 

I couldn't believe it when I heard the news. I hate hearing about death particularly needless, avoidable deaths caused by irrational gun crime.

 

I think that something needs to be done about the gun crime in the world. Not just on a national scale. The whole world needs to co-operate to rid the world of illegal guns. In an ideal situation, we wouldn't need guns, people would not have the urge to shoot a fellow human being, invade another country. But we do. So we need to have guns to defend ourselves as a nation, agreed. But to defend ourselves as individuals? Why? If no one had guns, it would be a level playing field, we wouldn't have people feeling enpowered and able to kill another person with a squeeze of a trigger. Guns make it easier to kill people. It's undeniable. If you take away the means, its harder to do it. So it's logical to assume that taking away guns would reduce gun fatalities.

 

Anyway, that's what this latest shooting brings to my mind. But I'd like to offer my condolences to the victim's family and friends. I'm only hoping that this kind of violence is going to stop soon.

[StrOwez]

I don't like guns or killing ether, but there are good and bad people in this world - the bad do bad things.

[Barihawk]

If you make guns illegal, only the criminals will have guns.

 

 

 

American groups like the ATF are trying to eliminate illegal weapons in the US.

 

 

 

Stop blaming your troubles on metal. The guns don't take blame. The real weapons are the psycho's who get their hands on them. It doesn't matter what tool they use. A wrench is a not a weapon, a gun is not a weapon, a knife is not a weapon, a sock is not a weapon. But the real weapon can use any of these to commit crimes.

[greenslime89]

If you make guns illegal, only the criminals will have guns.

 

 

 

American groups like the ATF are trying to eliminate illegal weapons in the US.

 

 

 

Stop blaming your troubles on metal. The guns don't take blame. The real weapons are the psycho's who get their hands on them. It doesn't matter what tool they use. A wrench is a not a weapon, a gun is not a weapon, a knife is not a weapon, a sock is not a weapon. But the real weapon can use any of these to commit crimes.

 

What? A gun isn't a weapon? That's shocking. That is what it's designed for, not for a game, not for chopping up food, not for wearing on your feet. It is designed to kill living things with ease. That statement is very, very wrong. :x

[Militaris]

A gun is a tool, with a wide range of uses. A few guns are weapons but in most civilised countries these are not freely available to the general public.

[rocketman089]

A gun is a tool, with a wide range of uses.

 

What other use is there other to kill things? And don't say for target practice, that's not a practical use. Im not necessarily anti-gun but that's a bold statement,

[superson]

Target practice is just practicing with fake things so you can be good when you face real people. :x

[Barihawk]

A gun is a tool, with a wide range of uses.

 

What other use is there other to kill things? And don't say for target practice, that's not a practical use. Im not necessarily anti-gun but that's a bold statement,

 

 

 

Hunting, food, survival. Not to mention protection. The gun itself can be quite a tool without even firing a shot.

 

 

 

What I am talking about by "weapon" is in the case of murder.

[rocketman089]

Hunting, food, survival. Not to mention protection. The gun itself can be quite a tool without even firing a shot.

 

 

 

What I am talking about by "weapon" is in the case of murder.

 

Hunting, food, survival... that's killing things. But usually those weapons are made specifically for that purpose, like a 30 ot 6, .44 magnum, or a shotgun. Everything else (assault rifles, most handguns) is designed to kill people.

[Bauke]

Hunting for food? I'm sorry but do you still live in the stone age? Guns are for killing, nothing else.

[jackalope14]

A gun is a tool, with a wide range of uses.

 

What other use is there other to kill things? And don't say for target practice, that's not a practical use. Im not necessarily anti-gun but that's a bold statement,

 

 

 

Why is target practice not practical?

[Gin_and_Tonic]

In theory, everything is a weapon, but its the person in possesion of the item which makes it dangerous.

[1_man_army]

A gun is a tool, with a wide range of uses.

 

What other use is there other to kill things? And don't say for target practice, that's not a practical use. Im not necessarily anti-gun but that's a bold statement,

 

 

 

Why is target practice not practical?

 

 

 

It's has no pratical purpose because there is no end result (such as food to eat or safety) it's purely for practice/entertainment.

 

 

 

 

 

In theory, everything is a weapon, but its the person in possesion of the item which makes it dangerous.

 

 

 

By that rational we should give people grenades & mortars because its people who kill people,right?

[Gin_and_Tonic]

By that rational we should give people grenades & mortars because its people who kill people,right?

 

 

 

What? I really cannot make sense of that :-s

[VOV]

 

By that rational we should give people grenades & mortars because its people who kill people,right?

 

 

 

I will not be satisfied until I have a nuclear warhead or two. In my hands they will only be tools and it would definitely help me sleep at night knowing that I have that kind of protection. 8-)

[1_man_army]

By that rational we should give people grenades & mortars because its people who kill people,right?

 

 

 

What? I really cannot make sense of that :-s

 

 

 

Well it simple, you're saying that guns dont kill people, people kill people. What I'm saying is that grenades & mortars dont kill people either but they are illegal - therefore why are grenades not legal? It's the fundamental flaw I'm exposing in your "...people kill people argument."

[VOV]

By that rational we should give people grenades & mortars because its people who kill people,right?

 

 

 

What? I really cannot make sense of that :-s

 

 

 

Well it simple, you're saying that guns dont kill people, people kill people. What I'm saying is that grenades & mortars dont kill people either but they are illegal - therefore why are grenades not legal? It's the fundamental flaw I'm exposing in your "...people kill people argument."

 

 

 

Well what if a half-blind, half-dumb child saw his father's grenade sitting on the dresser and mistook it for some sort of toy ball and blew himself up with it?

 

 

 

Won't somebody please think of the half-blind, half-dumb children!

[BlueLancer]

Not all advancement is good, guns make it too easy to kill people. At least with a metal blade, killing somebody, especially a completely innocent person, will leave mental scars on the killer.

 

 

 

Shooting somebody accurately from 100m+ away is so distant the killer doesn't care at all if it furthers his goals.

 

 

 

Simple: Make guns less available or make people pass tests to obtain them. Sure, no rule or law in the world will prevent criminals from obtaining them but what about 'ordinary' people who turn 'mad'? Such as in the case of Virginia?

[Tigra00]

A gun is a tool. A grenade is a tool. They're tools of general destruction in one way or another, but they're still tools. It's when the wrong PERSON gets ahold of one of these items that someone dies.

 

 

 

If guns kill people, then I can also blame my pencil for my spelling mistakes. By blaming guns on PEOPLE's problems, you are completely excusing them from responsibilty. Same for video games. "Oh, grand theft auto made me do it.." Oh, then it's okay, we'll just boycott Rockstar Games.

 

 

 

Pfft.

[Barihawk]

A gun is a tool, with a wide range of uses.

 

What other use is there other to kill things? And don't say for target practice, that's not a practical use. Im not necessarily anti-gun but that's a bold statement,

 

 

 

Why is target practice not practical?

 

 

 

It's very practical for those of us who are competition marksmen. I for one have not shot a living thing asides from microorganisms that happened to get between the barrel and the paper.

 

 

 

Hunting for food? I'm sorry but do you still live in the stone age? Guns are for killing, nothing else.

 

 

 

You sir, have obviously never experienced the joy of Venison. Plus, it's a more noble death for a deer to be killed by a predator like me rather than be harvested for food at a deer farm.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

And don't bring illegal guns into this. No, the average Joe has no need for assault rifles and grenades. But rifles and shotguns are used for hunting or recreation. And security shotguns/pistols are for protection.

 

 

 

And BlueLancer: I fully support legislation for mandatory psych testing at the expense of the customer (administered yearly) for gun purchases.

[1_man_army]

A gun is a tool. A grenade is a tool. They're tools of general destruction in one way or another, but they're still tools. It's when the wrong PERSON gets ahold of one of these items that someone dies.

 

 

 

If guns kill people, then I can also blame my pencil for my spelling mistakes. By blaming guns on PEOPLE's problems, you are completely excusing them from responsibilty. Same for video games. "Oh, grand theft auto made me do it.." Oh, then it's okay, we'll just boycott Rockstar Games.

 

 

 

Pfft.

 

 

 

I'm not saying that blaming weapon laws is in any way an excuse for a killer. However, they do facilitate murder just by being available thus helping somebody to kill.

 

 

 

The whole video games issue is an irrelevant argument in this context as that is a discussion of psychology & media impact.

[Tigra00]

I don't like guns much myself...Don't much see the novelty in them, however, I disagree about not needing assault rifles. Those look very fun! :P

 

 

 

Any responsible person can own any type of weapon they want. They know how to use and not use them. It's when you get the jerks and criminals and gerenal douche-bags who own guns that the problems start. Pretty easy to monitor these people and make sure they don't get weapons. Sterotyping, profiling, background checks and a bit tighter laws (like the new no-sell law for people with prior stunts in mental facilities) all work pretty well...Sadly, I'd wager most people you could profile as people who shouldn't own a gun are the biggest darn customers.

 

 

 

If I decide to live in America (probably will move to the Netherlands), I may own an assault rifle someday...Just for fun. They do look like they'd be quite fun to shoot, but as for now, I don't care much for guns and have only fired a .22 rifle a couple times in my whole life. My friend had an AR-15 (bought on the streets for $200, unbelievable, huh?) but I passed on shooting it. I was a bow hunter anyways...More of a challenge. :P

[Tigra00]

A gun is a tool. A grenade is a tool. They're tools of general destruction in one way or another, but they're still tools. It's when the wrong PERSON gets ahold of one of these items that someone dies.

 

 

 

If guns kill people, then I can also blame my pencil for my spelling mistakes. By blaming guns on PEOPLE's problems, you are completely excusing them from responsibilty. Same for video games. "Oh, grand theft auto made me do it.." Oh, then it's okay, we'll just boycott Rockstar Games.

 

 

 

Pfft.

 

 

 

I'm not saying that blaming weapon laws is in any way an excuse for a killer. However, they do facilitate murder just by being available thus helping somebody to kill.

 

 

 

The whole video games issue is an irrelevant argument in this context as that is a discussion of psychology & media impact.

 

 

 

It's not irrelevant. It's comparable. You're saying that guns just being available is enough to blame it on the weapons for deaths. Guess what? Rally to make guns illegal, then. See what happens if it works. It means the only people that will have them is...hmm...CRIMINALS. Ever see a cop without a gun and a criminal with one? Yea, I've seen a dead cop too.

 

 

 

Like I said, I'm not big on guns, but I don't believe they should be restricted. They should be carefully sold, yes, and they are, and it gets more careful all the time, but restricted completely? Yea, no thanks. I'd rather be able to own a weapon to shoot a criminal in the face someday, thanks.

[Flametrooper]

I'm with Barihawk on this one - Don't ban guns. Just regulate them more. That's my opinion.

[1_man_army]

A gun is a tool. A grenade is a tool. They're tools of general destruction in one way or another, but they're still tools. It's when the wrong PERSON gets ahold of one of these items that someone dies.

 

 

 

If guns kill people, then I can also blame my pencil for my spelling mistakes. By blaming guns on PEOPLE's problems, you are completely excusing them from responsibilty. Same for video games. "Oh, grand theft auto made me do it.." Oh, then it's okay, we'll just boycott Rockstar Games.

 

 

 

Pfft.

 

 

 

I'm not saying that blaming weapon laws is in any way an excuse for a killer. However, they do facilitate murder just by being available thus helping somebody to kill.

 

 

 

The whole video games issue is an irrelevant argument in this context as that is a discussion of psychology & media impact.

 

 

 

It's not irrelevant. It's comparable. You're saying that guns just being available is enough to blame it on the weapons for deaths.

 

 

 

Can you physically kill somebody with a computer game? Not unless it's broken into sharp pieces. I'm talking about weapons that are made to kill.

 

 

 

I'm not saying that the availabilty of guns is the sole reason why this officer was killed but it was obviously a vital factor. When anyone is killed by a gun it's just sensible to look at how easily it was for killer to obtain the weapon.

 

 

 

Look we seem to have this same argument every time one of these topics come up so I'm going to leave this now. I understand your perspective on the issue (even if I disagree with it) and I realise that neither of us are going to persude the other to agree with them. So I'm going to let this argument go for the sake of not wasting any more of each others time.