Is God real post your thoughts!

[redserpent4]

Some people's eyes are shut tightly to not let any light in. Some are scared shut, some stubbornly.

 

Well that or i believe i can explain from a scientific basis everything that you use God to explain.

 

 

 

Personally I don't think that it should really matter if God is a literal being or just an idea. The important thing is the message which religion mostly preaches which is the importance of acceptance and love for your fellow man. Unfortunately it can't be claimed that having God in someone's life really does this. Some christians are still racist, some muslims will still cry "behead the infidel" and many atheists are worse.

 

 

 

Religion gives a common banner for like minded people to gather under and a reason for violent people to excuse their violence, it doesn't cause trouble or prevent it.

 

 

 

In all i think religion should be a good thing because most religions extoll the virtues of acceptance and tolerance but some religious people choose to manipulate their perception of their religion to excuse their actions. So no i don't think God is a real being, but i think what God stands for is as valid and important as it is possible for anything to be.

[venomai]

Well here is my view (Note that I said my view. I don't want to speak for any other Christians).

 

 

 

I believe that God created us all for some reason. I don't know the reason; nobody does except God. This is all like a big "playground", and he's looking over us. I don't want you to get the idea that he's a kid with a magnifying glass pointed at an anthill called Earth, which I'm sure some of you thought of. He's just overseeing things. He has the power to intervene, of course. But he chooses not to. He does not interfere with our free will. He wants us to figure things out on our own. Of course, He'll give us nudges here and there in the right direction, but he won't reveal his metaphorical "shut down" button to us. No, he wants us to make our own.

 

 

 

It's not that he's an evil, maniacal kid on the anthill. God cringes at the things that go on in this world. God wants things to be perfect, and he has the power to make it so. But again, he wants us to do it on our own free will.

 

 

 

Hope that addressed what you were talking about.

 

Sure, but you never answered my questions. :P

 

 

 

He has the power to intevene and save millions of lives and end years of suffering, yet he chooses not to. Is it our free will to die a horrible death of torture and pain?

 

For the victims of the Holocaust, there was almost no free will that God could have interfered with.

 

 

 

You skipped that part; some people don't want to believe in God, some people just don't.

 

Sorry, I thought you were implying something else. :)

 

 

 

Let's say God does shutdown Hitler if he starts doing evil things. Is that a good or bad thing? It can be argued either way.

 

Just like the Holocaust can be argued either way? Some people see it as a good thing and others don't. :?

 

Although there are some "good" aspects that came out of Hitler's reign, I would say that the millions of deaths, years of suffering and other "bad" aspects far outweigh the "good". Feel free to take me up on it, though.

 

 

 

And eventually Hitler did die. Did he not die soon enough? Should he have died before he even had a chance to do evil things? Where is the line? Are we even able to comprehend when someone's time is? Some argue for the death penalty, others against it. Who is right?

 

He died, as will everyone else in this world, but he died only after a massive reign of destruction. Many would say that he did not die soon enough, while others would say that he died too soon.

 

 

 

The real question is: should one person die to save millions more? Or should that one person live, and the millions others die? These are decisions that God should have made, as God giveth and God taketh away. Yet God decided to let one person live, while millions of others died.

 

 

 

Anyways, neither of you answered my original question. Would you push the button? Furthermore, when your God makes that decision, would you want Him to push the button?

[RayOxide]

My view is that

 

 

 

If God were real, what created God?

 

If God were real, why did God create all of the sins, instead of stopping it?

[unorclan]

If God were real, what created God?

 

Your thinking to much in a physical sense - God didn't need to be created, he is an all-powerful forever existant spirtual being, nothing that needs to be made.

 

 

 

 

If God were real, why did God create all of the sins, instead of stopping it?

 

God didn't create sin - man did by disobeying God and by disobeying God we call it sin. If God stopped it all would we have a choice? No! So with no choice of right or wrong we would be like programmed robots doing whatever God wanted us to do.

 

I think everyone agree's we'd like a choice in what we want to do.

[unorclan]

 

I think the argument here is that God, being omniscient, knew the exact results of creating Hitler, founders of the KKK, etc. Essentially, the argument is that God turns a blind eye to the horrors and suffering that exists on Earth. He has the power to smite evil at any time and save lives and make people happier, yet he chooses not to.

 

 

 

The life of a man that of a blink of an eye compared to enternity - agreed?

 

So, you say he turns a blind eye to the suffering of the world? What you do not realize is that Matthew 5:2-12 clearly states that all those who mourn, and are naked, and starving, and pursucuted are those who shall revieve the greatest rewards of Heaven for enternity. So why should suffering for a blink of an eye matter to a land of paradise for enternity?

 

 

 

For example -- say you create extremely intelligent robots for a living. Each robot is equipped with a "Shut Down" button that only you hold. Now, say a few of these robots "turned evil" and began to kill innocent lives and makes others suffer. Would you press the button to stop the robots-gone-bad? Or would you let them destroy innocent lives simply because the robots have made that choice? You, as the creator, are ultimately responsible for the robots.

 

The suffering of the world is a perfect example that GOD EXIST. What if I said that the Holocaust was great and that it needed to happen and that I totally supported it)which I dont, just using an example). I'd be flamed to death and have loads of haters here. But in another part of the world how many people would agree with me? Some would, not many, because its the Holocaust, but some people out there would agree with me.

 

So who is right? You or me? How do we decide whats right and wrong? Our parents? Yeah well my parents agree the Holocaust was great and needed to be done. So, still who is right? How do we decide which one of us is right? Majority rules? Okay, lets say the majority of the population in wherever you live agrees that the Holocaust was wrong therefore thats thats. But say lots of people from another country move into wherever you live and over years and years the majority rules to favor my opinion of the Holocaust. What now?

 

There is an overall standard, an overall moral. But where did it come from? Did it evolve over time that somehow man knows whats right and wrong? But how does right and wrong exist? What decides what is wrong and what decides what is right? Man? But man is always changing and arguing and debating, so something had to set this in the begining of time. What was it?

 

I believe the answer to that question is....GOD.

 

 

 

I wrote this in a hurry, and I know how you post Venomai, your going to grab a every little detail and blow it out of proportion and then critisize me about it and assume things I never said- but atleast I'm trying.

[venomai]

If God stopped it all would we have a choice? No! So with no choice of right or wrong we would be like programmed robots doing whatever God wanted us to do.

 

I think everyone agree's we'd like a choice in what we want to do.

 

Yes, we all want free will -- but sometimes God can give us that when other humans inhibit it from us. Unfortunately, God never seems to give us that free will, especially in times where it's most needed.

 

 

 

Take World War Two, for example. Did the victims of the Holocaust have free will in the camps as they were being tortured and killed? Did the millions of drafted soldiers have free will with their lives? Did the millions of citizens forced to work in horrible conditions to support the war have free will?

 

 

 

Or how about those suffering in Darfur? Or the millions dying every year from hunger? Or the people who contract fatal diseases and viruses at such a young age? Or the people who die unexpectedly in accidents? Or the people who are raped and murdered?

 

 

 

If God really wanted us to have free will, then he would interfere to give us exactly that.

 

 

 

If God wants the world to be a better place, then why doesn't he come down and help us out? Imagine how much more united we would be if God came down and proved to us that there was only one true belief. It has nothing to do with free will -- above I've shown that in many cases God interfering can actually give us more free will.

 

 

 

And yes, God did create this. He, being omniscient, knew exactly what was to happen when he created humans, yet he created us anyways.

 

 

 

EDIT:

 

 

 

So with no choice of right or wrong we would be like programmed robots doing whatever God wanted us to do.

 

I have two questions:

 

 

 

1. You say the choice of right or wrong is what makes you "human" (ie: not a robot). But you can only choose "right", for choosing "wrong" (such as murder) will send you to Hell. So, if your goal is to get to Heaven (or Hell, for that matter) then you only have one choice. Wouldn't that make you a programmed robot? :-k

 

 

 

2. How does Heaven work with free will?

[warri0r45]

If God were real, what created God?

 

Your thinking to much in a physical sense - God didn't need to be created, he is an all-powerful forever existant spirtual being, nothing that needs to be made.

 

 

 

Unorclan,

 

 

 

Some people may have a hard time believing that god required no creation in much the same way that people have a hard time believing that the universe required no creation. The curiosities of some will never cease them from questioning 'why is the universe here rather than not', in much the same way as questioning 'why is god here rather than not'? In this sense I think the human mind demands a beginning for everything at the hands of something else, be it a natural force or some supernatural cause. For the unbeliever, the buck stopping at a supernatural god merely pushes the frame back to question where this god or higher level of being came from. For the believer, this consideration may not apply.

 

 

 

Some, such as me, might question where god came from. For those that don't believe in god, such as me, believing that he must have always existed is often uncompelling nor does wanting that proposition to be true make it so.

 

 

 

What if those embryonic leg buds having been slowly evolving over the past 10,000 years so eventually they can evolve into land mammals. You are only assuming that the embryonic leg buds are leftovers from land mammals.

 

 

 

This still has nothing to do with the topic.

 

 

 

I don't even want to bother with you any more. You consistantly either ignore critical parts of my posts or argue against things I never said.

[unorclan]

Take World War Two, for example. Did the victims of the Holocaust have free will in the camps as they were being tortured and killed? Did the millions of drafted soldiers have free will with their lives? Did the millions of citizens forced to work in horrible conditions to support the war have free?

 

 

 

Or how about those suffering in Darfur? Or the millions dying every year from hunger? Or the people who contract fatal diseases and viruses at such a young age? Or the people who die unexpectedly in accidents? Or the people who are raped and murdered?

 

 

 

As I said in my earlier post lets take for example that I actually support all these things that happened and lets imagine I participated in these events. Oh, but then in the middle of the Holocaust God came down and rendered me useless to do what I wanted to do forcing me to do what everyone else thought was "right". Now is that free will? No, I don't think it is. You must not understand what free will is. It's be able to choice to do what you think is right and wrong - not free yourself from bondage or torture.

 

 

 

If God wants the world to be a better place, then why doesn't he come down and help us out? Imagine how much more united we would be if there was only one true belief.

 

It says in the Bible that we should speak the same thing and be of the same mind....and you say the world would be so much better if we all we're able to do this. I agree. But is it free will when God interferes forcing everyone to do this? NO.

 

 

 

It has nothing to do with free will -- in fact I think I've shown that in many cases God interfering can actually give us more free will.

 

Actually, no you haven't convinced anybody but yourself.

[venomai]

You must not understand what free will is. It's be able to choice to do what you think is right and wrong - not free yourself from bondage or torture.

 

I perfectly understand free will, and it certainly does apply to all of the examples that I gave.

 

 

 

Definition of free will:

 

the power of making free choices unconstrained by external agencies

 

 

 

Wikipedia says:

 

The question of free will is whether, and in what sense, rational agents exercise control over their actions and decisions.

 

 

 

But is it free will when God interferes forcing everyone to do this? NO.

 

No force is necessary. One day, God comes down, says hello for a few days, lets scientists grab a bit of him as evidence and then he retreats back to Heaven.

 

 

 

Nobody would be forced into believing God, much like nobody is being forced into believing in the Big Bang or Evolution. The world will be presented with the facts, and then each individual will have the free will to decide whether or not they believe the evidence.

 

 

 

It has nothing to do with free will -- in fact I think I've shown that in many cases God interfering can actually give us more free will.

 

Actually, no you haven't convinced anybody but yourself.

 

Well, 'tis a shame. :

 

 

 

PS: See my last posts edit... :o

[unorclan]

You must not understand what free will is. It's be able to choice to do what you think is right and wrong - not free yourself from bondage or torture.

 

I perfectly understand free will, and it certainly does apply to all of the examples that I gave.

 

 

 

Definition of free will:

 

the power of making free choices unconstrained by external agencies

 

 

 

Wikipedia says:

 

The question of free will is whether, and in what sense, rational agents exercise control over their actions and decisions.

 

 

 

Man changes the free will of another man, not God. If God came down and forced the "bad guys" to stop forcing other people from having a free will - will those "bad guys" have a free will to do as they please? I think not.

 

 

 

No force is necessary. One day, God comes down, says hello for a few days, lets scientists grab a bit of him as evidence and then he retreats back to Heaven.

 

Good idea, and I believe they called him Jesus didn't they? God is spiritual, not physical, so scientist couldn't grab a "piece" of him anyways...

 

 

 

Nobody would be forced into believing God, much like nobody is being forced into believing in the Big Bang or Evolution. The world will be presented with the facts, and then each individual will have the free will to decide whether or not they believe the evidence.

 

Yep, so, how does this change anything? The Bible presents the facts and people believe what they want to believe and the world is the way it is.

 

 

 

PS. See my post (the very last post) on the other page. Page 34 i believe

[venomai]

Man changes the free will of another man, not God.

 

You've got that right. :? God hasn't done anything to help us get more free will at all.

 

 

 

If God came down and forced the "bad guys" to stop forcing other people from having a free will - will those "bad guys" have a free will to do as they please? I think not.

 

If God removes the free will from the Nazis responsible for the Holocaust, then he will not only be saving millions upon millions of lives, but he will also be giving those millions of people more free will. The resulting "net" free will, so to say, will be far more than it previously was -- there will be an "increase" in free will across the world.

 

 

 

Good idea, and I believe they called him Jesus didn't they? God is spiritual, not physical, so scientist couldn't grab a "piece" of him anyways...

 

Your post is a little confusing. In one breath you imply that God is Jesus, and in the next breath you say God is not a physical being (although Jesus clearly was).

 

 

 

God may be a spiritual and divine being, yet the Bible shows that he can communicate and even co-exist with humans (see Genesis 1).

 

 

 

Jesus, as claimed by the Bible, is the Eternal Son of God, is he not?

 

 

 

And wouldn't the 21st century have been a more appropriate time to materialize, considering our large scientific wealth of knowledge and documentation?

 

 

 

I'm not asking for God's DNA or fingerprints. However, some sort of concrete, objective and "scientific" evidence that God exists is all that's needed to unite much of the world into a single belief.

 

 

 

Yep, so, how does this change anything? The Bible presents the facts and people believe what they want to believe and the world is the way it is.

 

But the Bible is not proof enough to many, as most would say it does not present the facts. Rather, it presents various stories and testimonies that may or may not be factual.

 

 

 

The Bible does not present the facts in the same way that, say, evolution presents the facts.

[venomai]

The life of a man that of a blink of an eye compared to enternity - agreed?

 

So, you say he turns a blind eye to the suffering of the world? What you do not realize is that Matthew 5:2-12 clearly states that all those who mourn, and are naked, and starving, and pursucuted are those who shall revieve the greatest rewards of Heaven for enternity. So why should suffering for a blink of an eye matter to a land of paradise for enternity?

 

The reason it matters is because we only get one physical life on Earth. Sure, it may feel like a blink of an eye compared to eternity, but that is no reason for God to do nothing to the suffering that occurs on Earth.

 

 

 

I suppose it's rather unfortunate that many of these people who suffer do not follow the Christian religion and are therefore not going to Heaven. :( I think that is perhaps the most important reason that God should help those who suffer.

 

 

 

The suffering of the world is a perfect example that GOD EXIST. What if I said that the Holocaust was great and that it needed to happen and that I totally supported it)which I dont, just using an example). I'd be flamed to death and have loads of haters here. But in another part of the world how many people would agree with me? Some would, not many, because its the Holocaust, but some people out there would agree with me.

 

So who is right? You or me? How do we decide whats right and wrong? Our parents? Yeah well my parents agree the Holocaust was great and needed to be done. So, still who is right? How do we decide which one of us is right? Majority rules? Okay, lets say the majority of the population in wherever you live agrees that the Holocaust was wrong therefore thats thats. But say lots of people from another country move into wherever you live and over years and years the majority rules to favor my opinion of the Holocaust. What now?

 

There is an overall standard, an overall moral. But where did it come from? Did it evolve over time that somehow man knows whats right and wrong? But how does right and wrong exist? What decides what is wrong and what decides what is right? Man? But man is always changing and arguing and debating, so something had to set this in the begining of time. What was it?

 

I believe the answer to that question is....GOD.

 

I agree that it's almost impossible to define "right" and "wrong" when it comes to personal opinions, but I don't see how that is relavent to God's existence.

 

 

 

Why does "right" and "wrong" need to be set? It is always changing, as you said. These concepts were never defined at the beginning of time, they simply adapted and grew with the rest of humanity.

 

 

 

Saying that God is the answer to those questions is no different from saying that Allah or the Flying Spaghetti Monster is the answer.

[unorclan]

You've got that right. :? God hasn't done anything to help us get more free will at all.

 

Have you not read anything that i've said? Maybe free will isn't the right words....free choice between right and wrong - not freedom from physical bondage.

 

 

 

If God removes the free will from the Nazis responsible for the Holocaust, then he will not only be saving millions upon millions of lives, but he will also be giving those millions of people more free will. The resulting "net" free will, so to say, will be far more than it previously was -- there will be an "increase" in free will across the world.

 

But by removing their free will he will of lied and God cannot lie. He set a promise in the begining of time and cannot break it.

 

 

 

Your post is a little confusing. In one breath you imply that God is Jesus, and in the next breath you say God is not a physical being (although Jesus clearly was).

 

Yes, God sent is son down to live on this earth as a man so he could die, the perfect sacrafice, for the forgiveness of sins.

 

 

 

God may be a spiritual and divine being, yet the Bible shows that he can communicate and even co-exist with humans (see Genesis 1).

 

Yes, that was at the begining of time. Then Man and Woman sinned and God and man we're separated by that sin. Man and Woman decided to do wrong and God cannot co-existed with sin. It's not in his nature.

 

 

 

Jesus, as claimed by the Bible, is the Eternal Son of God, is he not?

 

He is.

 

 

 

And wouldn't the 21st century have been a more appropriate time to materialize, considering our large scientific wealth of knowledge and documentation?

 

Loads of people didn't believe him back then - they wouldn't believe him now. And say we all believed it and it worked out like you say....in 2,000 years from now when they have even MORE scientific knowledge someone like you would be making the same arguement - why doesn't God come down NOW?

 

 

 

I'm not asking for God's DNA or fingerprints. However, some sort of concrete, objective and "scientific" evidence that God exists is all that's needed to unite much of the world into a single belief.

 

There is such a thing, I'm not one smart enough to know and remember all of it, but I've gone to classes that have concrete evidence that the Bible is true and that God exists.

 

 

 

But the Bible is not proof enough to many, as most would say it does not present the facts. Rather, it presents various stories and testimonies that may or may not be factual.

 

Because people arn't interested enough, they don't care to listen to both sides or study hard to find the truth. They find it easier to accept something else.

 

 

 

The Bible does not present the facts in the same way that, say, evolution presents the facts.

 

Evolution presents barely any FACTS - just theories and assumptions.

[Plectrum]

I'm not asking for God's DNA or fingerprints. However, some sort of concrete, objective and "scientific" evidence that God exists is all that's needed to unite much of the world into a single belief.

Was Frankenstein's monster not proof that Frankenstein existed? Are the pastries and breads in the store not proof of a baker?

 

 

 

I don't know about you but I have to see the bakers, just so I know for a fact that the bread didn't evolve from a single cell wheat seed.

[Satenza]

 

If God removes the free will from the Nazis responsible for the Holocaust, then he will not only be saving millions upon millions of lives, but he will also be giving those millions of people more free will. The resulting "net" free will, so to say, will be far more than it previously was -- there will be an "increase" in free will across the world.

 

But by removing their free will he will of lied and God cannot lie. He set a promise in the begining of time and cannot break it.

 

 

 

Yes he can, unless you are suggesting that God is bound by the laws of logic? Why can he not break a promise and at the same time not have lied. If you say he must live within the laws of logic then why do you say that God is not subject to the laws of causation? Why are you firstly limiting Gods abilities to negotiate reason and by doing so why are you picking and choosing what logical laws he must abide by?

 

 

 

God may be a spiritual and divine being, yet the Bible shows that he can communicate and even co-exist with humans (see Genesis 1).

 

Yes, that was at the begining of time. Then Man and Woman sinned and God and man we're separated by that sin. Man and Woman decided to do wrong and God cannot co-existed with sin. It's not in his nature.

 

 

 

So God can not communicate with us now because to do so he will co-exist with sin? Did he not co-exist with sin when he placed a sinful snake into the garden of eden to tempt man? Does he not always co-exist with his creation? Did he not co-exist with sin when his son was sent down to the earth?

 

 

 

I'm not asking for God's DNA or fingerprints. However, some sort of concrete, objective and "scientific" evidence that God exists is all that's needed to unite much of the world into a single belief.

 

There is such a thing, I'm not one smart enough to know and remember all of it, but I've gone to classes that have concrete evidence that the Bible is true and that God exists.

 

 

 

How convinient.

 

 

 

The Bible does not present the facts in the same way that, say, evolution presents the facts.

 

Evolution presents barely any FACTS - just theories and assumptions.

 

 

 

Learn the scientific method.

[venomai]

I'm not asking for God's DNA or fingerprints. However, some sort of concrete, objective and "scientific" evidence that God exists is all that's needed to unite much of the world into a single belief.

Was Frankenstein's monster not proof that Frankenstein existed? Are the pastries and breads in the store not proof of a baker?

 

 

 

I don't know about you but I have to see the bakers, just so I know for a fact that the bread didn't evolve from a single cell wheat seed.

 

Yes, I have to see God to believe that this is all his creation, just like you have to see the baker to believe that the pastries and breads are his creation.

 

 

 

So I'll assume you've seen God. What was He like? :)

[sonerohi]

I think each and every religion has a bit of the truth about whatever higher powers there are out there and if we open up to every religion we can find the true super religion.

[assassin_696]

I'm not asking for God's DNA or fingerprints. However, some sort of concrete, objective and "scientific" evidence that God exists is all that's needed to unite much of the world into a single belief.

 

There is such a thing, I'm not one smart enough to know and remember all of it, but I've gone to classes that have concrete evidence that the Bible is true and that God exists.

 

 

 

That's utter rubbish.

[Rebdragon]

I think each and every religion has a bit of the truth about whatever higher powers there are out there and if we open up to every religion we can find the true super religion.

 

Look at many Eastern world religions, such as Confucianism, Buddhism, Zen, Taoism, Jainism, Sikhism and even Shinto [to an extent]. They attest to no knowledge of a higher power. You just going to ignore them and just go with the half a dozen that do?

[unorclan]

Yes he can, unless you are suggesting that God is bound by the laws of logic? Why can he not break a promise and at the same time not have lied. If you say he must live within the laws of logic then why do you say that God is not subject to the laws of causation? Why are you firstly limiting Gods abilities to negotiate reason and by doing so why are you picking and choosing what logical laws he must abide by?

 

Okay, he is not bound by the laws of logic, but man's mind is - to us he'd be lying.

 

 

 

So God can not communicate with us now because to do so he will co-exist with sin?

 

Communicating and co-existing are totally different. He tells us his will through the Bible and we can tell him things through prayer.

 

 

 

Did he not co-exist with sin when he placed a sinful snake into the garden of eden to tempt man?

 

He did not place a sinful snake into the garden. And maybe co-exist isn't the right term here. God and sin are like oil and water...they don't mix. Therefore if man is sinful then man & God don't walk walk with eachother as they did in the Garden of Eden.

 

 

 

Does he not always co-exist with his creation? Did he not co-exist with sin when his son was sent down to the earth?

 

Like I said, co-exist isn't the right word. Jesus was not apart of this world - he was in it, but not part of it.

 

 

 

How convinient.

 

Things like this really tick me off.

 

I'm 14 - you can't expect me to know everything.

[unorclan]

Yes, I have to see God to believe that this is all his creation, just like you have to see the baker to believe that the pastries and breads are his creation.

 

Faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen(ie: God)

 

So, you believe air exist right? You know - oxygen, nitrogen, all those other gases = air. Yep....oh wait....but where is it? OH MY GOSH! Well, I can't see air so it must be there. Case solved.

 

 

 

So I'll assume you've seen God. What was He like? :)

 

:roll:

[Harakiri]

every one is entitled to their own opinion. Just let it rest. Just last night on clan chat we had a dirtbag who could not keep his mouth shut about religion. Its stupid to fight over and you cannot just walk up to a guy and say

 

"God is real because I saw Jesus's face on my grilled cheese sandwich."

 

There really is no point to this. You can practice your own religion, but if your gonna fight about it, please look back at WWII. A whole population of people were murdered for practicing a religion and you know what, if people continue to fight over religion like this then I will say that within my lifetime, another halocaust will happen, lead by the people who should be killed because they cannot accept people for who they are.

 

 

 

You can be accepted into society for caring and allowing other people to have opinions or you can be accepted into slavery, where your minds prejudices take you over and ultimately control you.

 

 

 

Just allow other people an opinion and live with their decisions.

[unorclan]

every one is entitled to their own opinion. Just let it rest. Just last night on clan chat we had a dirtbag who could not keep his mouth shut about religion. Its stupid to fight over and you cannot just walk up to a guy and say

 

"God is real because I saw Jesus's face on my grilled cheese sandwich."

 

There really is no point to this. You can practice your own religion, but if your gonna fight about it, please look back at WWII. A whole population of people were murdered for practicing a religion and you know what, if people continue to fight over religion like this then I will say that within my lifetime, another halocaust will happen, lead by the people who should be killed because they cannot accept people for who they are.

 

 

 

You can be accepted into society for caring and allowing other people to have opinions or you can be accepted into slavery, where your minds prejudices take you over and ultimately control you.

 

 

 

Just allow other people an opinion and live with their decisions.

 

 

 

Yes, but when one religion cares about and wants to save everybody else not in their religions and they go out to try to convert to what they believe is the true belief...its starts arguements.

[Rebdragon]

Faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen(ie: God)

 

So, you believe air exist right? You know - oxygen, nitrogen, all those other gases = air. Yep....oh wait....but where is it? OH MY GOSH! Well, I can't see air so it must be there. Case solved.

 

:lol:

 

 

 

One- faith is illogical, and the knowledgable believers that I've been taught by attest to that. Don't turn it into something it's not, like evidence. It's no evidence- it's belief in face of contradictory evidence or in lieu of the lack of evidence to begin with.

 

 

 

Two- Air is physical -composed of the same matter as you and I-, thus it can be recognized by the senses. 'Nother analogy please, that one doesn't help your case.

 

 

 

Three- Calm down. Screaming OH MY GOSH! doesn't make you look any smarter, nor does saying such a thing as "case solved", as if to say you've one and there's no way you can be incorrect. That's not a proper way to debate, and I believe everyone here would prefer if tried not to act like that, if only for this discussion.

 

 

 

So I'll assume you've seen God. What was He like? :)

 

:roll:

 

It was a serious question.

 

 

 

`~`

 

I despise this attitude. With a passion. Largely because it's just so prevalent, but the idea itself is just annoying.

 

 

 

If we were to leave everyone to their own beliefs, if we were to avoid discussion, debating, and teaching, no one would ever learn. If the pre-med student was never corrected by his teacher or peers in his belief that the heart is not an essential organ of the human body, would it be "wrong" to try and correct his belief? Or should we simply let him be with what he believes true, no matter how detrimental said belief could be to himself or others?

 

 

 

In connection to this topic, yes, discussion of the supernatural should end, because it is just that- supernatural. Etymoligically, "above and beyond nature". We can not, and never will understand it while in this current state, and never will as long as we exist on this level. What we can argue, though, is human logic and understanding, and how it relates to the belief of these supernatural beings, which is what is being done on this thread.

 

 

 

You can practice your own religion, but if your gonna fight about it, please look back at WWII. A whole population of people were murdered for practicing a religion and you know what, if people continue to fight over religion like this then I will say that within my lifetime, another halocaust will happen, lead by the people who should be killed because they cannot accept people for who they are.

 

They were killed as a scapegoat tactic, not for their religion.

[unorclan]

Faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen(ie: God)

 

So, you believe air exist right? You know - oxygen, nitrogen, all those other gases = air. Yep....oh wait....but where is it? OH MY GOSH! Well, I can't see air so it must not be there. Case solved.

 

:lol:

 

 

 

One- faith is illogical, and the knowledgable believers that I've been taught by attest to that. Don't turn it into something it's not, like evidence. It's no evidence- it's belief in face of contradictory evidence or in lieu of the lack of evidence to begin with.

 

Who said religion must be logical? And mind explaining your point a bit more, sorry if I sound stupid, but I really didn't exactly get what your point was overall.

 

 

 

Two- Air is physical -composed of the same matter as you and I-, thus it can be recognized by the senses. 'Nother analogy please, that one doesn't help your case.

 

I was using air to explain that his "If I cant see it I don't believe it" attitude.

 

 

 

Three- Calm down. Screaming OH MY GOSH! doesn't make you look any smarter, nor does saying such a thing as "case solved", as if to say you've one and there's no way you can be incorrect. That's not a proper way to debate, and I believe everyone here would prefer if tried not to act like that, if only for this discussion.

 

1 - You cant scream online

 

2 - Obviously you didn't catch I was be extremely sarcastic in that sentence.

 

 

 

 

 

So I'll assume you've seen God. What was He like? :)

 

:roll:

 

It was a serious question.

 

Right.