Sarah Palin

[Kenshinjapan]

 

 

 

Who's more qualified? The one who has less foreign policy experience than I do, or the one who has been around the block, has been all over the world, and knows how Washington works? .

 

 

 

 

 

 

You just described John McCain :-$ .

 

 

 

Anyways, people haven't really been fair to the other side when discussing who they think is better. Instead of just insulting the other party, why don't we take a step back and see how faulted our own candidate is in the same place.

[jackattack]

Hey Peggy Noonan, that's not nice :lol:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Btw Jack, I still don't buy that she wasn't a member (or at the very least doesn't support what they stand for) when she addresses the Party:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It doesn't seem that strange to me that a *sitting Governor* of a state would welcome the convention or whatever it was of a prominent political party of that state. :wall:

 

 

 

And to everyone who's saying she was only picked because she was a woman, would Obama be the nominee right now if he was not black?

[1_man_army]

Well if the Democrats where going to choose a candidate just for the sake of making history Hilary would've won easily. Women make up just over half the population while African Americans make up a lot less. So in short, yes he would be.

[Celt23]

I thought that she wasn't too bad at first, and then I started disliking her very much after I found out that she supports creationism in schools and is pro-life. Then again this wasn't surprising at all.

 

 

 

She can have her own family values on abortion and such, but she has no right forcing those values on others.

[mmmcannibalism]

Well if the Democrats where going to choose a candidate just for the sake of making history Hilary would've won easily. Women make up just over half the population while African Americans make up a lot less. So in short, yes he would be.

 

 

 

there is a major difference though, the split of woman by party is something like 60 40 as opposed to a very large majority of black voters being democratic. And honestly Obama did get a lot of votes because he was black just like hillary got a lot for being a woman.

 

 

 

also Obama is getting a lot of votes just because he is a very good orator, it doesnt matter to a lot of people what his policies are they just think hes cool because of his speeches.

 

 

 

 

 

on topic now

 

 

 

my thoughts on palin is that she is too hard core right wing on a few things for me to truly like her on policy. I do thought think she is more legitimate then most politicians and I prefer someone that is hard core honestly right wing to someone that claims to be centrist and is just lying.

 

 

 

I may be back later to debate policy specifically but I do agree she is a bit too far right except on abortion where I agree with her(I go on the thought that as long as the baby is feasible and isnt going to kill or severly injure the mother it deserves to live, I say it should remain legal in cases of severe mental/physical handicap where I just feel its not the governments right to put that burden on someone. As to anyone that is going to say rape babies should be allowed to be aborted, you do realize they have the plan b pills now?

 

 

 

also creationism in schools is a bad idea, assuming it is her true belief I do agree on allowing it to be debated if it is brought up. It shouldnt be part of the curriculum though as there is very little if any proof of it(big bang and what happened before it being only shot of proof I know of)

[jackattack]

Well if the Democrats where going to choose a candidate just for the sake of making history Hilary would've won easily. Women make up just over half the population while African Americans make up a lot less. So in short, yes he would be.

 

 

 

 

 

It was a rhetorical question. He would probably not even have been a state senator. Would the south side of Chicago elect a white guy to the Illinois state senate? Even if he managed to get elected to the senate would John Kerry have selected him to deliver the keynote address in 2004?

[Nero]

All this stuff is from vague memory of reading, don't ask me for sources, and yes, some will most likely be slightly wrong (or wholly).

 

 

 

Obama:

 

Limited experience in the political field

 

Too much talk, not enough hard promises

 

Caved to pressure and voted for telecom immunity

 

Has not yet outlined a concrete plan for dealing with America's debt situation (not 100% here)

 

He may be too liberal to deal with tough situations

 

No military experience

 

 

 

 

 

McCain:

 

Regarded as one of the most brash and ignorant senators by his fellow senators

 

Makes countless errors in his speeches

 

Doesn't seem to have the momentum to spur America out of it's gargantuam debt

 

Still supports the Iraq War (and Bush)

 

Extremely elitist

 

Doesn't know how to use a computer

 

Graduated 894th of 899

 

Cheated on his first wife, then lied about it in the book he paid someone else to write about him

 

 

 

 

 

Flame away.

[Kenshinjapan]

All this stuff is from vague memory of reading, don't ask me for sources, and yes, some will most likely be slightly wrong (or wholly).

 

 

 

Obama:

 

Limited experience in the political field

 

Too much talk, not enough hard promises

 

Caved to pressure and voted for telecom immunity

 

Has not yet outlined a concrete plan for dealing with America's debt situation (not 100% here)

 

He may be too liberal to deal with tough situations

 

No military experience

 

 

 

 

 

McCain:

 

Regarded as one of the most brash and ignorant senators by his fellow senators

 

Makes countless errors in his speeches

 

Doesn't seem to have the momentum to spur America out of it's gargantuam debt

 

Still supports the Iraq War (and Bush)

 

Extremely elitist

 

Doesn't know how to use a computer

 

Graduated 894th of 899

 

Cheated on his first wife, then lied about it in the book he paid someone else to write about him

 

 

 

 

 

Flame away.

 

 

 

Flame?! You deserve a medal! Someone who actually posts the faults of BOTH sides without ignoring the other! =D>

[jackattack]

Voting for the telecom immunity isn't really caving to pressure, it's just doing what's right. McCain may be regarded by one of the more brash senators but he's not regarded as ignorant. Especially when Joe Biden wanted John Kerry to pick him for his vp. He knows how to use a computer. Back in 2000 he only won New Hampshire with help from his website. And graduating from the Naval Academy at all is still very impressive.

 

 

 

Man, Huckabee's speech was probably better than Lieberman or Thompson. That desk story was really something. =D>

[magekillr]

Hey Peggy Noonan, that's not nice :lol:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Btw Jack, I still don't buy that she wasn't a member (or at the very least doesn't support what they stand for) when she addresses the Party:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It doesn't seem that strange to me that a *sitting Governor* of a state would welcome the convention or whatever it was of a prominent political party of that state. :wall:

 

 

 

I am neither making a stretch here nor overstating the case. Sarah Palin was a proud member of the AIP before she began her disastrous term as mayor. Todd Palin is also a member of the AIP. The founder of the AIP died in a failed attempt to buy plastic explosives. Sarah Palin has documented ties with the AIP as recently as 2008, and you refuse to provide any evidence that her video appearance at their convention was anything less than extraordinary.

 

 

 

How about this: you say that Palin addressed the AIP convention only as a governor. If that's the case, then it seems to me that she's addressed the two larger party conventions as governor, too. If you can find evidence that Palin addressed the Democrats, then I'll back off. If you can't find evidence that Palin addressed the Democrats, but you can prove that she addressed the Republicans, that shows that she addressed parties she favored. If you can't find evidence that Palin addressed any party convention other than the AIP, then you're in hot water.

 

 

 

http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/arc ... _party.php

[mrpez]

this is an article claiming that palin's church believes "jews deserve to be victims of terrorism".

 

 

 

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/t ... h-ter.html

 

 

 

(this article has been reported to have inaccuracies)

[Kenshinjapan]

this is an article claiming that palin's church believes "jews deserve to be victims of terrorism".

 

 

 

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/t ... h-ter.html

 

 

 

(this article has been reported to have inaccuracies)

 

 

 

Why don't we just quote fox on everything then :s?

 

 

 

Anyways, Palin's speech just ended and I thought it was fairly good. She came out aggressive towards a lot of democrats.

[jackattack]

That was a one time guest speaker so I would hardly say her church believe that. However the central tenets of Obama's church of 20 years are...

 

 

 

Black theology cannot accept a view of God which does not represent God as being for oppressed blacks and thus against white oppressors. Living in a world of white oppressors, blacks have no time for a neutral God...Black theology refuses to accept a God who is not identified totally with the goals of the black community. If God is not for us and against white people, then he is a murderer, and we had better kill him. The task of black theology is to kill Gods who do not belong to the black community ... Black theology will accept only the love of God which participates in the destruction of the white enemy

 

 

 

 

I am neither making a stretch here nor overstating the case. Sarah Palin was a proud member of the AIP before she began her disastrous term as mayor. Todd Palin is also a member of the AIP. The founder of the AIP died in a failed attempt to buy plastic explosives. Sarah Palin has documented ties with the AIP as recently as 2008, and you refuse to provide any evidence that her video appearance at their convention was anything less than extraordinary.

 

 

 

How about this: you say that Palin addressed the AIP convention only as a governor. If that's the case, then it seems to me that she's addressed the two larger party conventions as governor, too. If you can find evidence that Palin addressed the Democrats, then I'll back off. If you can't find evidence that Palin addressed the Democrats, but you can prove that she addressed the Republicans, that shows that she addressed parties she favored. If you can't find evidence that Palin addressed any party convention other than the AIP, then you're in hot water.

 

 

 

http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/arc ... _party.php

 

 

 

They've released the voter registration records. She's been a registered Republican since 1982. I really don't know where you are going with this.

 

 

 

Voter registration records show Sarah Palin registered in May 1982 as a member of the Republican Party and has not changed her affiliation.

 

 

 

http://www.alaskajournal.com/stories/09 ... 2005.shtml

 

 

 

Asked how Palin could have been a member, when state records did not indicate Palin ever registered as an AIP member, Chyrson, in an interview with Mother Jones, backed off his account. "What could have been the confusionher husband was a member of the party. He was at the convention. She could have been consideredit might have been thought she was a member then"

 

 

 

http://www.motherjones.com/mojoblog/arc ... ction.html

 

 

 

And I find it hard to think that as a Republican Governor she addressed the aip convention but not the convention of her own party.

[magekillr]

And I find it hard to think that as a Republican Governor she addressed the aip convention but not the convention of her own party.

 

 

 

Evidence? No?

 

 

 

I'm a member of the Students for Sensible Drug Policy, but I don't put my name on ANYTHING for fear of jobs getting a hold of it when they look me up.

[Nero]

Voting for the telecom immunity isn't really caving to pressure, it's just doing what's right.

 

If you consider that most people don't want to have business companies having that sort of unaccountability and had voiced that opinion, it is caving to pressure.

 

 

 

McCain may be regarded by one of the more brash senators but he's not regarded as ignorant.

 

They go hand-in-hand with McCain.

 

 

 

He knows how to use a computer.

 

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=XNehRSWmvJM&feature=related

 

 

 

And graduating from the Naval Academy at all is still very impressive.

 

That might be. However, you have to think about the fact that he wasn't interested in learning new things when he was younger, so why would he have changed now, when it's even harder?

[jackattack]

^^ The telecom companies did their duty as they were asked. Why should they be penalized for doing it? No it doesn't. McCain had a website in 2000. http://www.4president.us/websites/2000/ ... ebsite.htm And The Naval Academy isn't a regular school. It isn't all about grades.

 

 

 

And I find it hard to think that as a Republican Governor she addressed the aip convention but not the convention of her own party.

 

 

 

Evidence? No?

 

 

 

I'm a member of the Students for Sensible Drug Policy, but I don't put my name on ANYTHING for fear of jobs getting a hold of it when they look me up.

 

 

 

I think the voter registration records speak for themselves.

 

 

 

sources within the party tell Mother Jones that the only way to become a member of the AIP is to register to vote with the AIP. Yet the state of Alaska released records confirming what the McCain-Palin campaign had maintained: Palin never registered as an AIP member.

 

 

 

And I guess this counts.

 

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAzv7Be6iqQ

[Nero]

^^ The telecom companies did their duty as they were asked. Why should they be penalized for doing it? No it doesn't. McCain had a website in 2000. http://www.4president.us/websites/2000/ ... ebsite.htm And The Naval Academy isn't a regular school. It isn't all about grades.

 

 

 

Yes but now they have immunity to do whatever they want. I didn't realize that if you tack your name on something it becomes yours, and proves that you did everything in it.

 

"I know not what weapons WW3 will be fought with, but ww4 will be fought with sticks and stones." -Dusty668

 

Wow, I'm a genius amirite?

 

Yet the Naval Academy is a school. School is about education. Grades are a reflection on your commitment to educate yourself.

[greene8535]

 

 

The only thing she has been in charge of is Alaska.... Yeah, certainly a lot of experience there :? .

 

 

 

 

Alaska is the largest state in the union.

 

 

 

 

It may be in terms of area but it's pretty small when you look at it in terms of population and if you exclude the energy industry it has a very small economy. Running a mainly rural state with a low population density is no preparation for national governance.

 

 

 

The peps in Alaska are Spread out and that's alot of land to govern...

[Ginger_Warrior]

 

 

The only thing she has been in charge of is Alaska.... Yeah, certainly a lot of experience there :? .

 

 

 

 

Alaska is the largest state in the union.

 

 

 

 

It may be in terms of area but it's pretty small when you look at it in terms of population and if you exclude the energy industry it has a very small economy. Running a mainly rural state with a low population density is no preparation for national governance.

 

 

 

The peps in Alaska are Spread out and that's alot of land to govern...

 

And? She's going to be governing people, not land.

 

 

 

Can we put this experience thing in some sort of context please? Alaska is the least densest state in America by a long shot. There's only 1.2 people per sq/m. It simply doesn't compare with the task of governing a large and dynamic economy, leading 300 million people, and then also dealing with some foreign affairs on the side

[jackattack]

^^ The telecom companies did their duty as they were asked. Why should they be penalized for doing it? No it doesn't. McCain had a website in 2000. http://www.4president.us/websites/2000/ ... ebsite.htm And The Naval Academy isn't a regular school. It isn't all about grades.

 

 

 

Yes but now they have immunity to do whatever they want. I didn't realize that if you tack your name on something it becomes yours, and proves that you did everything in it.

 

"I know not what weapons WW3 will be fought with, but ww4 will be fought with sticks and stones." -Dusty668

 

Wow, I'm a genius amirite?

 

Yet the Naval Academy is a school. School is about education. Grades are a reflection on your commitment to educate yourself.

 

 

 

 

 

They don't have immunity to do whatever they want. They have retroactive immunity from frivolous lawsuits for providing the NSA, CIA, or whoever with information they were asked for. And the rankings at the Naval Academy aren't only based on grades. John McCain wasn't very well behaved there, hence his ranking.

[flipflop121]

^^ The telecom companies did their duty as they were asked. Why should they be penalized for doing it? No it doesn't. McCain had a website in 2000. http://www.4president.us/websites/2000/ ... ebsite.htm And The Naval Academy isn't a regular school. It isn't all about grades.

 

 

 

Yes but now they have immunity to do whatever they want. I didn't realize that if you tack your name on something it becomes yours, and proves that you did everything in it.

 

"I know not what weapons WW3 will be fought with, but ww4 will be fought with sticks and stones." -Dusty668

 

Wow, I'm a genius amirite?

 

Yet the Naval Academy is a school. School is about education. Grades are a reflection on your commitment to educate yourself.

 

 

 

 

 

They don't have immunity to do whatever they want. They have retroactive immunity from frivolous lawsuits for providing the NSA, CIA, or whoever with information they were asked for. And the rankings at the Naval Academy aren't only based on grades. John McCain wasn't very well behaved there, hence his ranking.

 

 

 

So either way we have a guy who is A) didnt fare well at all in the naval acadamey or B) a guy who must have done a [cabbage]load of misbehaving to be judged that low.

[jackattack]

The Naval Academy has pretty high standards. I doubt it was much. I know one of the worst things he did was sneak a T.V. into his room. Compare that with Obama who's misbehaving in school included snorting coke.

[flipflop121]

The Naval Academy has pretty high standards. I doubt it was much. I know one of the worst things he did was sneak a T.V. into his room. Compare that with Obama who's misbehaving in school included snorting coke.

 

 

 

where is the source of Obama snorting coke?

 

 

 

i think you will find GWB was the coke snorter / alcoholic

[BlueLancer]

The Naval Academy has pretty high standards. I doubt it was much. I know one of the worst things he did was sneak a T.V. into his room. Compare that with Obama who's misbehaving in school included snorting coke.

 

 

 

Regardless of the candidate being McCain or Obama, some users complained about baseless rumors on this topic. Those will be removed in the future if no credible source is presented for things like "Obama snorted coke" or "McCain can't use a computer"

 

 

 

That being said.. I do recall Obama mentioning it already in 1996 in his autobiography... So it's nothing new. At least he has the guts to admit it.

 

 

 

Clinton admitted in 1992 he had "smoked marijuana but not inhaled it"

 

 

 

Bush was caught driving under influence in 1976, and admitted he has used marijuana (and doesn't deny using cocaine).

 

 

 

Nobody is "clean of guilt"...

[OldJoe]

I'm not american, but if i would be able to vote, this makes me wanting to vote even less on Republicans.

 

Against abortion, even if rape? Idiotic as hell.