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PMods - Purpose or Status?


Guest jrhairychest

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You see then that frequent reporting is hardly necessary, because rulebreaking that can't be handled verbally is so uncommon. For example, I wouldn't report somebody for talking about the Runescape Wiki, even though it's technically illegal. Most player mods would agree with me that such a situation would be better handled by giving the probably-accidental rulebreaker the benefit of the doubt. Am I right, mods?

 

Approach these things in two ways. Either have a word or report them. I know which one I choose. You can find reports if you look for them so trying to make out pmods used common sense instead of reporting flies in the face of Jagex as well as how they would get noticed in the first place.

 

 

 

 

You're right, no Pmod would ever admit to getting their "status" solely by reporting as many people as possible, as often as possible. If they say otherwise, they're obviously lying.

 

 

 

Similarly, a real witch would never admit to being a witch, so if she denies the accusations, it proves she's a witch! Burn her! :ohnoes:

 

Your first paragraph is bang on the nose. The second is a little sketchy as reporters exist and witches don't.

 

 

 

 

So you admit it's a contradiction. I said that because you accused me of both in your post. Hence the question mark. And if you didn't notice that you did misunderstand it. I can't spell it out any more simply.

 

Can you not see I'm making a point that even though something isn't against the rules, you're wishing it was for the reporting value?

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Look, you obviously have no understanding of how moderators are, were, or ever have been selected. All you seem to understand is that reporting is involved somehow, and from that you've apparently drawn the conclusion (or you give the impression of having drawn it) that the only way to become a Pmod is/was to report as often as possible, period. That's simply NOT TRUE. :notalk:

 

 

You're right, no Pmod would ever admit to getting their "status" solely by reporting as many people as possible, as often as possible. If they say otherwise, they're obviously lying.

 

 

 

Similarly, a real witch would never admit to being a witch, so if she denies the accusations, it proves she's a witch! Burn her! :ohnoes:

 

Your first paragraph is bang on the nose. The second is a little sketchy as reporters exist and witches don't.

 

I think you missed that I was commenting on your logic. :thumbdown:

 

 

 

 

So you admit it's a contradiction. I said that because you accused me of both in your post. Hence the question mark. And if you didn't notice that you did misunderstand it. I can't spell it out any more simply.

 

Can you not see I'm making a point that even though something isn't against the rules, you're wishing it was for the reporting value?

 

He's wishing for something to be against the rules for the "reporting value"? So now you read minds? You know all of a random internet stranger's hopes and dreams? :lol:

 

 

 

The only thing you know about what a_local_guy's wishes comes from his posts. And rather inconveniently for you, his posts have also said he's not in it for the status and he'd like to be able to hide the crown. That's some pretty serious cherrypicking you're doing. :shame:

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Ok....I think we need to be clear that Jagex are the ones who have emphasised the important role 'reporting' has had in their selection of pmods in the past, inarguably stated as for both quantity and quality, and they said this is no longer what they are looking for, hence the application process now.

 

 

 

Maybe I should be really blunt about how the whole pmod status vs purpose appears to me now......

 

 

 

What gives you the right?.....

 

  • to be superior?
     
    to be more important than the ordinary player?
     
    to control conversation wherever you appear?
     
    to cause grovelling, anger, boredom when you appear?
     
    to have your reporting given more weight than mine?
     
    to mute fellow players?

and I could go on.....

 

Are you more helpful? No, you are just RS players with a crown, you are still human. There a probably good pmods and just as many bad, knowledgeable ones as well as ignorant. Please don't come at me with this 'holier than thou' attitude, look at the list! There are good ordinary players and bad, exactly the same as pmods, who can be just as helpful or not.

 

 

 

I don't care if Jagex offered the crown out of the blue "oooooo I was soooo surprised" *blush*. This isn't an oscar award, it is giving you perceived status over other ordinary players, you accepted the role and all it entails. Why? (Please note that 'you' is plural here). :shame:

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Ok....I think we need to be clear that Jagex are the ones who have emphasised the important role 'reporting' has had in their selection of pmods in the past, inarguably stated as for both quantity and quality, and they said this is no longer what they are looking for, hence the application process now.

 

 

 

Maybe I should be really blunt about how the whole pmod status vs purpose appears to me now......

 

 

 

What gives you the right?.....

 

  • to be superior?
     
    to be more important than the ordinary player?
     
    to control conversation wherever you appear?
     
    to cause grovelling, anger, boredom when you appear?
     
    to have your reporting given more weight than mine?
     
    to mute fellow players?

and I could go on.....

 

Are you more helpful? No, you are just RS players with a crown, you are still human. There a probably good pmods and just as many bad, knowledgeable ones as well as ignorant. Please don't come at me with this 'holier than thou' attitude, look at the list! There are good ordinary players and bad, exactly the same as pmods, who can be just as helpful or not.

 

 

 

I don't care if Jagex offered the crown out of the blue "oooooo I was soooo surprised" *blush*. This isn't an oscar award, it is giving you perceived status over other ordinary players, you accepted the role and all it entails. Why? (Please note that 'you' is plural here). :shame:

35cq0q9.png
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This list caught my eye -

 

 

 

What gives you the right?.....

 

 

 

to be superior?

 

 

 

No PMod (or most) tries to act superior to other players. I cannot say this for all, but a large majority don't do so.

 

 

 

to be more important than the ordinary player?

 

 

 

How are they more important?

 

 

 

to control conversation wherever you appear?

 

 

 

The major flaw with your reasoning is that, PMods aren't entrusted a large number of their 'rights' by Jagex. They are given by the players. I don't think you'll find ANY where a statement that says PMods must be given first priority in a conversation. It is the PLAYERS who get diverted and start lobbing greetings/questions upon the PMods.

 

 

 

to cause grovelling, anger, boredom when you appear?

 

 

 

The common belief is that PMods are a part of the Jagex staff. As such, players often vent out their feelings towards PMods in hopes that they are actually informing a Jagex staffperson that they are displeased with some aspect of the game.

 

 

 

Again, wrong player beliefs led to this so-called 'right'.

 

 

 

to have your reporting given more weight than mine?

 

 

 

The penalty is higher on wrong reports than normal players too, so I guess it balances out?

 

 

 

to mute fellow players?

 

 

 

I'm sorry, but Muting isn't a game. You CANNOT mute anyone you wish. You CANNOT mute anyone you see. You CANNOT mute anyone who annoys you. If you do so, you'll find that this 'right' wouldn't be available to you from the following days. In the end, the only people who DO get muted are the people who DESERVE to get muted.

 

 

 

Thanks..

 

Lord Shalaj

[99 Woodcutting] [99 Strength][99 Hitpoints]

 

30db3v5.jpg

 

"What will come, will come..

..We will have to face it when it does!"

 

Farming With Profit and VineSweeper Guide

A better method to slay Dagannoths!

 

PvP drops:

[hide=]1 x Vesta's Chainbody, 3 x Brawling gloves (Melee [1], Range [1], Magic [1])[/hide]

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This list caught my eye -

 

 

 

What gives you the right?.....

 

 

 

to be superior?

 

 

 

No PMod (or most) tries to act superior to other players. I cannot say this for all, but a large majority don't do so.

 

 

 

to be more important than the ordinary player?

 

 

 

How are they more important?

 

 

 

to control conversation wherever you appear?

 

 

 

The major flaw with your reasoning is that, PMods aren't entrusted a large number of their 'rights' by Jagex. They are given by the players. I don't think you'll find ANY where a statement that says PMods must be given first priority in a conversation. It is the PLAYERS who get diverted and start lobbing greetings/questions upon the PMods.

 

 

 

to cause grovelling, anger, boredom when you appear?

 

 

 

The common belief is that PMods are a part of the Jagex staff. As such, players often vent out their feelings towards PMods in hopes that they are actually informing a Jagex staffperson that they are displeased with some aspect of the game.

 

 

 

Again, wrong player beliefs led to this so-called 'right'.

 

 

 

to have your reporting given more weight than mine?

 

 

 

The penalty is higher on wrong reports than normal players too, so I guess it balances out?

 

 

 

to mute fellow players?

 

 

 

I'm sorry, but Muting isn't a game. You CANNOT mute anyone you wish. You CANNOT mute anyone you see. You CANNOT mute anyone who annoys you. If you do so, you'll find that this 'right' wouldn't be available to you from the following days. In the end, the only people who DO get muted are the people who DESERVE to get muted.

 

 

 

Thanks..

 

Lord Shalaj

[99 Woodcutting] [99 Strength][99 Hitpoints]

 

30db3v5.jpg

 

"What will come, will come..

..We will have to face it when it does!"

 

Farming With Profit and VineSweeper Guide

A better method to slay Dagannoths!

 

PvP drops:

[hide=]1 x Vesta's Chainbody, 3 x Brawling gloves (Melee [1], Range [1], Magic [1])[/hide]

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Look, you obviously have no understanding of how moderators are, were, or ever have been selected. All you seem to understand is that reporting is involved somehow, and from that you've apparently drawn the conclusion (or you give the impression of having drawn it) that the only way to become a Pmod is/was to report as often as possible, period. That's simply NOT TRUE. :notalk:

 

And you still cannot provide any evidence to dispute the Jagex report.

 

 

 

 

I think you missed that I was commenting on your logic. :thumbdown:

 

I think you missed I was extracting the urine :thumbup:

 

 

 

 

He's wishing for something to be against the rules for the "reporting value"? So now you read minds? You know all of a random internet stranger's hopes and dreams? :lol:

 

 

Take a look at his early posts on the subject. You can feel the venom about price manipulators.

 

 

The only thing you know about what a_local_guy's wishes comes from his posts. And rather inconveniently for you, his posts have also said he's not in it for the status and he'd like to be able to hide the crown. That's some pretty serious cherrypicking you're doing. :shame:

 

Hey, if people want to deny the obvious, I'm not going to stop them. If he was so innocent he would have said "yeah whatever you don't know what you're talking about" a long time ago and not wasted his time any further. Me thinks the man doth protest too much.

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Look, you obviously have no understanding of how moderators are, were, or ever have been selected. All you seem to understand is that reporting is involved somehow, and from that you've apparently drawn the conclusion (or you give the impression of having drawn it) that the only way to become a Pmod is/was to report as often as possible, period. That's simply NOT TRUE. :notalk:

 

And you still cannot provide any evidence to dispute the Jagex report.

 

 

 

 

I think you missed that I was commenting on your logic. :thumbdown:

 

I think you missed I was extracting the urine :thumbup:

 

 

 

 

He's wishing for something to be against the rules for the "reporting value"? So now you read minds? You know all of a random internet stranger's hopes and dreams? :lol:

 

 

Take a look at his early posts on the subject. You can feel the venom about price manipulators.

 

 

The only thing you know about what a_local_guy's wishes comes from his posts. And rather inconveniently for you, his posts have also said he's not in it for the status and he'd like to be able to hide the crown. That's some pretty serious cherrypicking you're doing. :shame:

 

Hey, if people want to deny the obvious, I'm not going to stop them. If he was so innocent he would have said "yeah whatever you don't know what you're talking about" a long time ago and not wasted his time any further. Me thinks the man doth protest too much.

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First I never said I do this to make myself feel good about myself or to gain something from it. I do it because my morals dictate that i don't stand by and just let things happen to others if I can help prevent it.

 

 

 

My standards won't allow me to turn a blind eye to stealing or scamming. Personally, I feel that someone that sees something like the above examples and doesn't do anything about them is at fault as much as the person actually committing the acts.

 

"Everybody complains about the weather, but nobody does anything about it." It's easier just to whine about something than to actually take a stand against it.

 

I would say the examples you used were stupid things that people somtimes do could have dealt with directly yourself by having a word. Instead you opted to report those people, thus probably they ended up fired. They could end up losing their houses or families break up etc. Now I'm not denying that this type of thing is wrong. If I'm being honest, however, I ask is this a sign of weakness because you were not strong enough to deal with this yourself? You could have done, had a word, explain it's not the done thing. If they had have continued they would have been caught eventually so they would've fell on their own sword. You will end up with a reputation for running to the boss and as soon as anyone else see's an opportunity they return the favour to you. Everyone screws up once in a while but they should be given a chance to redeem themselves via a little education. I'm sure theres a moral in this somewhere......

 

 

 

 

How would you know if they have been warned before? Maybe everyone else was like you and warned them and then it's "not my problem" anymore. Same in game, there's no telling how many times someone might have warned someone. At some point someone needs to report them.

 

 

 

And yes, eventually they'll get caught, but how much will they have taken in the time between my warning and when they get caught? How is it acceptable to sit back and be so nonchalant about a situation someone could have helped prevent. If only they had taken a bit more responsibility.

 

 

 

Step to the other side for a moment. If someone were stealing from you, would you rather an employee warn someone or come to you and alert you? Yes, the warning might stop them or they could just be more careful about it continuing to steal from you until when? You find out yourself as no one feels it's their responsibility to tell you about it.

 

 

 

You don't want to report then don't. But understand that others don't think the same way and actively take a stand in certain situations.

If Jagex ever made a perfect update, there would be players complaining about nothing to complain about.

[hide=My Stats]Jake_Corsair.png[/hide]

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First I never said I do this to make myself feel good about myself or to gain something from it. I do it because my morals dictate that i don't stand by and just let things happen to others if I can help prevent it.

 

 

 

My standards won't allow me to turn a blind eye to stealing or scamming. Personally, I feel that someone that sees something like the above examples and doesn't do anything about them is at fault as much as the person actually committing the acts.

 

"Everybody complains about the weather, but nobody does anything about it." It's easier just to whine about something than to actually take a stand against it.

 

I would say the examples you used were stupid things that people somtimes do could have dealt with directly yourself by having a word. Instead you opted to report those people, thus probably they ended up fired. They could end up losing their houses or families break up etc. Now I'm not denying that this type of thing is wrong. If I'm being honest, however, I ask is this a sign of weakness because you were not strong enough to deal with this yourself? You could have done, had a word, explain it's not the done thing. If they had have continued they would have been caught eventually so they would've fell on their own sword. You will end up with a reputation for running to the boss and as soon as anyone else see's an opportunity they return the favour to you. Everyone screws up once in a while but they should be given a chance to redeem themselves via a little education. I'm sure theres a moral in this somewhere......

 

 

 

 

How would you know if they have been warned before? Maybe everyone else was like you and warned them and then it's "not my problem" anymore. Same in game, there's no telling how many times someone might have warned someone. At some point someone needs to report them.

 

 

 

And yes, eventually they'll get caught, but how much will they have taken in the time between my warning and when they get caught? How is it acceptable to sit back and be so nonchalant about a situation someone could have helped prevent. If only they had taken a bit more responsibility.

 

 

 

Step to the other side for a moment. If someone were stealing from you, would you rather an employee warn someone or come to you and alert you? Yes, the warning might stop them or they could just be more careful about it continuing to steal from you until when? You find out yourself as no one feels it's their responsibility to tell you about it.

 

 

 

You don't want to report then don't. But understand that others don't think the same way and actively take a stand in certain situations.

If Jagex ever made a perfect update, there would be players complaining about nothing to complain about.

[hide=My Stats]Jake_Corsair.png[/hide]

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So you admit it's a contradiction. I said that because you accused me of both in your post. Hence the question mark. And if you didn't notice that you did misunderstand it. I can't spell it out any more simply.

 

Can you not see I'm making a point that even though something isn't against the rules, you're wishing it was for the reporting value?

 

No, actually. I'm wishing it is because it's scamming. And giving it "reporting value" as you call it is acknowledging that. And I don't think I need a reason to dislike scammers that also make items unbuyable or unsellable for *all players*.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pump_and_dump

 

For evidence, let's look at the graph for prayer pots, which you can find here:

 

http://itemdb-rs.runescape.com/Prayer_potion%283%29/viewitem.ws?obj=139&scale=0

 

Notice the peak from August 19th to August 25th? They, ranarrs, and ranarr seeds, were not buyable for that period. Prayer potions are nearly essential for most higher level monster hunting, barrows, and slaying. And they were not buyable for 6 days. The clan(s?) that merchanted them kept players from selling their stock early by promising to drive them up to over 30k, which would never happen because that would ruin the scam. Then some higher ups in the clan sold their stock early, leaving the leader with over 1 billion in prayer pot related items that he had not yet sold to the clan members. And so they plummeted.

 

That is where the venom cones from. Because it's been going on for months and Jagex has only just recently said that they're working on something.

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So you admit it's a contradiction. I said that because you accused me of both in your post. Hence the question mark. And if you didn't notice that you did misunderstand it. I can't spell it out any more simply.

 

Can you not see I'm making a point that even though something isn't against the rules, you're wishing it was for the reporting value?

 

No, actually. I'm wishing it is because it's scamming. And giving it "reporting value" as you call it is acknowledging that. And I don't think I need a reason to dislike scammers that also make items unbuyable or unsellable for *all players*.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pump_and_dump

 

For evidence, let's look at the graph for prayer pots, which you can find here:

 

http://itemdb-rs.runescape.com/Prayer_potion%283%29/viewitem.ws?obj=139&scale=0

 

Notice the peak from August 19th to August 25th? They, ranarrs, and ranarr seeds, were not buyable for that period. Prayer potions are nearly essential for most higher level monster hunting, barrows, and slaying. And they were not buyable for 6 days. The clan(s?) that merchanted them kept players from selling their stock early by promising to drive them up to over 30k, which would never happen because that would ruin the scam. Then some higher ups in the clan sold their stock early, leaving the leader with over 1 billion in prayer pot related items that he had not yet sold to the clan members. And so they plummeted.

 

That is where the venom cones from. Because it's been going on for months and Jagex has only just recently said that they're working on something.

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Ok....I think we need to be clear that Jagex are the ones who have emphasised the important role 'reporting' has had in their selection of pmods in the past, inarguably stated as for both quantity and quality, and they said this is no longer what they are looking for, hence the application process now.

 

 

 

Maybe I should be really blunt about how the whole pmod status vs purpose appears to me now......

 

 

 

What gives you the right?.....

 

  • to be superior?
     
    to be more important than the ordinary player?
     
    to control conversation wherever you appear?
     
    to cause grovelling, anger, boredom when you appear?
     
    to have your reporting given more weight than mine?
     
    to mute fellow players?

and I could go on.....

 

Are you more helpful? No, you are just RS players with a crown, you are still human. There a probably good pmods and just as many bad, knowledgeable ones as well as ignorant. Please don't come at me with this 'holier than thou' attitude, look at the list! There are good ordinary players and bad, exactly the same as pmods, who can be just as helpful or not.

 

 

 

I don't care if Jagex offered the crown out of the blue "oooooo I was soooo surprised" *blush*. This isn't an oscar award, it is giving you perceived status over other ordinary players, you accepted the role and all it entails. Why? (Please note that 'you' is plural here). :shame:

 

I want to address this as well.

 

 

 

Causing grovelling and controlling the conversation are not rights given to player moderators. In fact, it's more a concern with popular and famous players like Tehnoobshow, Zezima, or Gertjaars. That some people fling stones at mods or kiss up to them is hardly the fault of the mod in question, and whether they dominate the conversation is more a matter of personality than of the crown.

 

 

 

Superiority and importance are not exclusive to player moderators either. Any player can act superior as long as they have something the player standing next to them does not have. It's very common to see higher-level players making fun of "n00bs." It has nothing to do with the crown.

 

 

 

The muting and reporting abilities are a right of player moderators, and what gives them that right is their proven history of quality abuse reports that has shown they have a firm grasp of the rules, as opposed to those random n00bs who will try to report you if you don't give them free money. Presumably, the customer service team abhors wading through crappy invalid reports all day long, and much prefers looking at the abuse reports filed by a player they trust to be competent. (At least, that's how I'd feel, anyway.)

 

 

 

As for that why you keep going back to, again, that's a personal issue, and those submitting their names for consideration are asked to answer that question individually. For me, if I was offered the post, what it would really come down to is why not, as I'm knowledgeable enough and whatnot to be qualified for the job, and the Pmod crown, while obviously not essential, makes it easier to help people.

 

 

 

I mean, it's not as if the Pmod system has some huge negative impact on the community that it so badly needs to justify its existence. I think "Why not?" is an appropriate response.

 

 

 

Hey, if people want to deny the obvious, I'm not going to stop them. If he was so innocent he would have said "yeah whatever you don't know what you're talking about" a long time ago and not wasted his time any further. Me thinks the man doth protest too much.

 

...

 

 

 

Well...yeah...you really don't know what you're talking about...

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Ok....I think we need to be clear that Jagex are the ones who have emphasised the important role 'reporting' has had in their selection of pmods in the past, inarguably stated as for both quantity and quality, and they said this is no longer what they are looking for, hence the application process now.

 

 

 

Maybe I should be really blunt about how the whole pmod status vs purpose appears to me now......

 

 

 

What gives you the right?.....

 

  • to be superior?
     
    to be more important than the ordinary player?
     
    to control conversation wherever you appear?
     
    to cause grovelling, anger, boredom when you appear?
     
    to have your reporting given more weight than mine?
     
    to mute fellow players?

and I could go on.....

 

Are you more helpful? No, you are just RS players with a crown, you are still human. There a probably good pmods and just as many bad, knowledgeable ones as well as ignorant. Please don't come at me with this 'holier than thou' attitude, look at the list! There are good ordinary players and bad, exactly the same as pmods, who can be just as helpful or not.

 

 

 

I don't care if Jagex offered the crown out of the blue "oooooo I was soooo surprised" *blush*. This isn't an oscar award, it is giving you perceived status over other ordinary players, you accepted the role and all it entails. Why? (Please note that 'you' is plural here). :shame:

 

I want to address this as well.

 

 

 

Causing grovelling and controlling the conversation are not rights given to player moderators. In fact, it's more a concern with popular and famous players like Tehnoobshow, Zezima, or Gertjaars. That some people fling stones at mods or kiss up to them is hardly the fault of the mod in question, and whether they dominate the conversation is more a matter of personality than of the crown.

 

 

 

Superiority and importance are not exclusive to player moderators either. Any player can act superior as long as they have something the player standing next to them does not have. It's very common to see higher-level players making fun of "n00bs." It has nothing to do with the crown.

 

 

 

The muting and reporting abilities are a right of player moderators, and what gives them that right is their proven history of quality abuse reports that has shown they have a firm grasp of the rules, as opposed to those random n00bs who will try to report you if you don't give them free money. Presumably, the customer service team abhors wading through crappy invalid reports all day long, and much prefers looking at the abuse reports filed by a player they trust to be competent. (At least, that's how I'd feel, anyway.)

 

 

 

As for that why you keep going back to, again, that's a personal issue, and those submitting their names for consideration are asked to answer that question individually. For me, if I was offered the post, what it would really come down to is why not, as I'm knowledgeable enough and whatnot to be qualified for the job, and the Pmod crown, while obviously not essential, makes it easier to help people.

 

 

 

I mean, it's not as if the Pmod system has some huge negative impact on the community that it so badly needs to justify its existence. I think "Why not?" is an appropriate response.

 

 

 

Hey, if people want to deny the obvious, I'm not going to stop them. If he was so innocent he would have said "yeah whatever you don't know what you're talking about" a long time ago and not wasted his time any further. Me thinks the man doth protest too much.

 

...

 

 

 

Well...yeah...you really don't know what you're talking about...

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Well...yeah...you really don't know what you're talking about...

 

 

 

That's why you can't produce any evidence to the contrary and you keep coming back ;) . And by the way, on the subject of mind reading, read below:

 

 

 

 

No, actually. I'm wishing it is because it's scamming. And giving it "reporting value" as you call it is acknowledging that. And I don't think I need a reason to dislike scammers that also make items unbuyable or unsellable for *all players*.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pump_and_dump

 

For evidence, let's look at the graph for prayer pots, which you can find here:

 

http://itemdb-rs.runescape.com/Prayer_potion%283%29/viewitem.ws?obj=139&scale=0

 

Notice the peak from August 19th to August 25th? They, ranarrs, and ranarr seeds, were not buyable for that period. Prayer potions are nearly essential for most higher level monster hunting, barrows, and slaying. And they were not buyable for 6 days. The clan(s?) that merchanted them kept players from selling their stock early by promising to drive them up to over 30k, which would never happen because that would ruin the scam. Then some higher ups in the clan sold their stock early, leaving the leader with over 1 billion in prayer pot related items that he had not yet sold to the clan members. And so they plummeted.

 

That is where the venom cones from. Because it's been going on for months and Jagex has only just recently said that they're working on something.

 

 

 

Right....and nobody thought to make their own and not buy any from the G.E. or was that too much like common sense? To simply call it scamming isn't correct as you well know. You can't prove it and no-one can. Jagex is correct on this. They will sort it. So, as its not illegal in game you're trying to fight some sort of crusade you cannot possibly win. Instead of going around with a gunslinger attitude, why not just play the game instead and let Jagex do the work. By the way I enjoyed selling my rannar seeds during that period of rocketing prices. It made me a pretty penny and you can bet your bottom dollar most of the cash came from the clans. A little poetic justice that should make you feel better.

 

 

 

 

How would you know if they have been warned before? Maybe everyone else was like you and warned them and then it's "not my problem" anymore. Same in game, there's no telling how many times someone might have warned someone. At some point someone needs to report them.

 

 

 

And yes, eventually they'll get caught, but how much will they have taken in the time between my warning and when they get caught? How is it acceptable to sit back and be so nonchalant about a situation someone could have helped prevent. If only they had taken a bit more responsibility.

 

 

 

Step to the other side for a moment. If someone were stealing from you, would you rather an employee warn someone or come to you and alert you? Yes, the warning might stop them or they could just be more careful about it continuing to steal from you until when? You find out yourself as no one feels it's their responsibility to tell you about it.

 

 

 

You don't want to report then don't. But understand that others don't think the same way and actively take a stand in certain situations.

 

 

 

Sorry but I don't take your view at all. However you justify this to yourself is up to you. To me, it shows a lack of dealing with people. Anyone can run to the boss and snitch. It takes a stronger person to deal with it directly. You obviously feel you need to do this so why? Whats in it for you? You may think you're taking the moral high ground, but you'll just destroy your own reputation. Who wants to work with a snitch? Who wants to be knifed in the back at the first opportunity? I trust your work colleagues understand your POV and accept that this is what you do? Or this is a form of covert snitching with a cloak and dagger routine?

 

 

 

If you give me the choice of a thief or a snitch, give me the thief every time. I know where I stand with them. They eventually get caught, and they always do, so I could dispense my own punishment without the need of an [wagon] kisser. In the end all are judged.

 

 

 

I'm a big believer in what goes around comes around. Everyone makes some form of mistake in their job or in game at times. Just don't be surprised or call foul if someone is waiting for you to make yours, and believe me you will.

 

 

 

I will report for 'serious' stuff I have previously mentioned. But I won't for stuff thats completely ridiculous just to point score. Some people play RS to play the game, not to act as judge and jury for their own personal kicks. I take my own responsibility by using my ignore list if I have to as well as personal responsibility for my actions. I don't need others to make these decisions for me.

 

 

 

I thank you for your candour in this matter. It really does give a further insight into the types of players that were selected for pmods under the old system.

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Well...yeah...you really don't know what you're talking about...

 

 

 

That's why you can't produce any evidence to the contrary and you keep coming back ;) . And by the way, on the subject of mind reading, read below:

 

 

 

 

No, actually. I'm wishing it is because it's scamming. And giving it "reporting value" as you call it is acknowledging that. And I don't think I need a reason to dislike scammers that also make items unbuyable or unsellable for *all players*.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pump_and_dump

 

For evidence, let's look at the graph for prayer pots, which you can find here:

 

http://itemdb-rs.runescape.com/Prayer_potion%283%29/viewitem.ws?obj=139&scale=0

 

Notice the peak from August 19th to August 25th? They, ranarrs, and ranarr seeds, were not buyable for that period. Prayer potions are nearly essential for most higher level monster hunting, barrows, and slaying. And they were not buyable for 6 days. The clan(s?) that merchanted them kept players from selling their stock early by promising to drive them up to over 30k, which would never happen because that would ruin the scam. Then some higher ups in the clan sold their stock early, leaving the leader with over 1 billion in prayer pot related items that he had not yet sold to the clan members. And so they plummeted.

 

That is where the venom cones from. Because it's been going on for months and Jagex has only just recently said that they're working on something.

 

 

 

Right....and nobody thought to make their own and not buy any from the G.E. or was that too much like common sense? To simply call it scamming isn't correct as you well know. You can't prove it and no-one can. Jagex is correct on this. They will sort it. So, as its not illegal in game you're trying to fight some sort of crusade you cannot possibly win. Instead of going around with a gunslinger attitude, why not just play the game instead and let Jagex do the work. By the way I enjoyed selling my rannar seeds during that period of rocketing prices. It made me a pretty penny and you can bet your bottom dollar most of the cash came from the clans. A little poetic justice that should make you feel better.

 

 

 

 

How would you know if they have been warned before? Maybe everyone else was like you and warned them and then it's "not my problem" anymore. Same in game, there's no telling how many times someone might have warned someone. At some point someone needs to report them.

 

 

 

And yes, eventually they'll get caught, but how much will they have taken in the time between my warning and when they get caught? How is it acceptable to sit back and be so nonchalant about a situation someone could have helped prevent. If only they had taken a bit more responsibility.

 

 

 

Step to the other side for a moment. If someone were stealing from you, would you rather an employee warn someone or come to you and alert you? Yes, the warning might stop them or they could just be more careful about it continuing to steal from you until when? You find out yourself as no one feels it's their responsibility to tell you about it.

 

 

 

You don't want to report then don't. But understand that others don't think the same way and actively take a stand in certain situations.

 

 

 

Sorry but I don't take your view at all. However you justify this to yourself is up to you. To me, it shows a lack of dealing with people. Anyone can run to the boss and snitch. It takes a stronger person to deal with it directly. You obviously feel you need to do this so why? Whats in it for you? You may think you're taking the moral high ground, but you'll just destroy your own reputation. Who wants to work with a snitch? Who wants to be knifed in the back at the first opportunity? I trust your work colleagues understand your POV and accept that this is what you do? Or this is a form of covert snitching with a cloak and dagger routine?

 

 

 

If you give me the choice of a thief or a snitch, give me the thief every time. I know where I stand with them. They eventually get caught, and they always do, so I could dispense my own punishment without the need of an [wagon] kisser. In the end all are judged.

 

 

 

I'm a big believer in what goes around comes around. Everyone makes some form of mistake in their job or in game at times. Just don't be surprised or call foul if someone is waiting for you to make yours, and believe me you will.

 

 

 

I will report for 'serious' stuff I have previously mentioned. But I won't for stuff thats completely ridiculous just to point score. Some people play RS to play the game, not to act as judge and jury for their own personal kicks. I take my own responsibility by using my ignore list if I have to as well as personal responsibility for my actions. I don't need others to make these decisions for me.

 

 

 

I thank you for your candour in this matter. It really does give a further insight into the types of players that were selected for pmods under the old system.

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No, actually. I'm wishing it is because it's scamming. And giving it "reporting value" as you call it is acknowledging that. And I don't think I need a reason to dislike scammers that also make items unbuyable or unsellable for *all players*.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pump_and_dump

 

For evidence, let's look at the graph for prayer pots, which you can find here:

 

http://itemdb-rs.runescape.com/Prayer_potion%283%29/viewitem.ws?obj=139&scale=0

 

Notice the peak from August 19th to August 25th? They, ranarrs, and ranarr seeds, were not buyable for that period. Prayer potions are nearly essential for most higher level monster hunting, barrows, and slaying. And they were not buyable for 6 days. The clan(s?) that merchanted them kept players from selling their stock early by promising to drive them up to over 30k, which would never happen because that would ruin the scam. Then some higher ups in the clan sold their stock early, leaving the leader with over 1 billion in prayer pot related items that he had not yet sold to the clan members. And so they plummeted.

 

That is where the venom cones from. Because it's been going on for months and Jagex has only just recently said that they're working on something.

 

 

 

Right....and nobody thought to make their own and not buy any from the G.E. or was that too much like common sense? To simply call it scamming isn't correct as you well know. You can't prove it and no-one can. Jagex is correct on this. They will sort it. So, as its not illegal in game you're trying to fight some sort of crusade you cannot possibly win. Instead of going around with a gunslinger attitude, why not just play the game instead and let Jagex do the work. By the way I enjoyed selling my rannar seeds during that period of rocketing prices. It made me a pretty penny and you can bet your bottom dollar most of the cash came from the clans. A little poetic justice that should make you feel better.

 

I have to wonder if you actually read any of the links...

 

Sure, it'd have been a good idea to drop whatever I wanted to do to kill monsters in the hopes that I get enough ranarr weeds to last that long. But that's still a negative effect.

 

Would have thought the proof would be obvious. Even on the basic level a promise to buy up a stock of an item and sell at inflated prices for guaranteed profit is at least a bit suspect, wouldn't you agree? Especially since ranked players get advance information on when to sell the items, and since in order to be ranked players have to recruit more and more players on the very bottom. That alone makes it the definition of a pyramid scheme, because if everybody made money as their advertisements claim there would be no need for a continually growing bottom.

 

 

 

What makes this such a problem is that usually it isn't items that are as easy to get as ranarrs. Usually it's items that are randomly dropped, and so very difficult to get. When it's a consumable (such as monkfish) that's being bought out it can't be sustained as well because most are easy to get. When it's a rarer one (such as ranarr) it's still reasonable to collect your own, but difficult because of the rarity (Ranarr is an uncommon herb). Often it's an item like a barrows piece of a high level weapon that's only supply is through random drops. And I cannot expect to just go and get my own guthan set (for example) because of how unlikely actually getting just one piece of it is.

 

 

 

And as an added note, if I was in it for the status, would I honestly care about that issue this much?

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No, actually. I'm wishing it is because it's scamming. And giving it "reporting value" as you call it is acknowledging that. And I don't think I need a reason to dislike scammers that also make items unbuyable or unsellable for *all players*.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pump_and_dump

 

For evidence, let's look at the graph for prayer pots, which you can find here:

 

http://itemdb-rs.runescape.com/Prayer_potion%283%29/viewitem.ws?obj=139&scale=0

 

Notice the peak from August 19th to August 25th? They, ranarrs, and ranarr seeds, were not buyable for that period. Prayer potions are nearly essential for most higher level monster hunting, barrows, and slaying. And they were not buyable for 6 days. The clan(s?) that merchanted them kept players from selling their stock early by promising to drive them up to over 30k, which would never happen because that would ruin the scam. Then some higher ups in the clan sold their stock early, leaving the leader with over 1 billion in prayer pot related items that he had not yet sold to the clan members. And so they plummeted.

 

That is where the venom cones from. Because it's been going on for months and Jagex has only just recently said that they're working on something.

 

 

 

Right....and nobody thought to make their own and not buy any from the G.E. or was that too much like common sense? To simply call it scamming isn't correct as you well know. You can't prove it and no-one can. Jagex is correct on this. They will sort it. So, as its not illegal in game you're trying to fight some sort of crusade you cannot possibly win. Instead of going around with a gunslinger attitude, why not just play the game instead and let Jagex do the work. By the way I enjoyed selling my rannar seeds during that period of rocketing prices. It made me a pretty penny and you can bet your bottom dollar most of the cash came from the clans. A little poetic justice that should make you feel better.

 

I have to wonder if you actually read any of the links...

 

Sure, it'd have been a good idea to drop whatever I wanted to do to kill monsters in the hopes that I get enough ranarr weeds to last that long. But that's still a negative effect.

 

Would have thought the proof would be obvious. Even on the basic level a promise to buy up a stock of an item and sell at inflated prices for guaranteed profit is at least a bit suspect, wouldn't you agree? Especially since ranked players get advance information on when to sell the items, and since in order to be ranked players have to recruit more and more players on the very bottom. That alone makes it the definition of a pyramid scheme, because if everybody made money as their advertisements claim there would be no need for a continually growing bottom.

 

 

 

What makes this such a problem is that usually it isn't items that are as easy to get as ranarrs. Usually it's items that are randomly dropped, and so very difficult to get. When it's a consumable (such as monkfish) that's being bought out it can't be sustained as well because most are easy to get. When it's a rarer one (such as ranarr) it's still reasonable to collect your own, but difficult because of the rarity (Ranarr is an uncommon herb). Often it's an item like a barrows piece of a high level weapon that's only supply is through random drops. And I cannot expect to just go and get my own guthan set (for example) because of how unlikely actually getting just one piece of it is.

 

 

 

And as an added note, if I was in it for the status, would I honestly care about that issue this much?

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If you give me the choice of a thief or a snitch, give me the thief every time. I know where I stand with them. They eventually get caught, and they always do, so I could dispense my own punishment without the need of an [wagon] kisser. In the end all are judged.

 

 

 

I'm out.

 

 

 

You may be telling the truth, but I can't believe anyone would choose to be unaware of someone stealing from them over being told.

If Jagex ever made a perfect update, there would be players complaining about nothing to complain about.

[hide=My Stats]Jake_Corsair.png[/hide]

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If you give me the choice of a thief or a snitch, give me the thief every time. I know where I stand with them. They eventually get caught, and they always do, so I could dispense my own punishment without the need of an [wagon] kisser. In the end all are judged.

 

 

 

I'm out.

 

 

 

You may be telling the truth, but I can't believe anyone would choose to be unaware of someone stealing from them over being told.

If Jagex ever made a perfect update, there would be players complaining about nothing to complain about.

[hide=My Stats]Jake_Corsair.png[/hide]

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I have to wonder if you actually read any of the links...

 

Sure, it'd have been a good idea to drop whatever I wanted to do to kill monsters in the hopes that I get enough ranarr weeds to last that long. But that's still a negative effect.

 

I did read them...there a point to that remark? Sure anyone can stand there and whinge about it, or spend the time better getting the ingredients yourself. Which is more common sense? I don't feel the need to stamp my feet on the issue. Its going to be dealt with so as far as I'm concerned, that's that.

 

 

 

 

Would have thought the proof would be obvious. Even on the basic level a promise to buy up a stock of an item and sell at inflated prices for guaranteed profit is at least a bit suspect, wouldn't you agree?

 

Good advice or scam? Jagex have specified this is difficult to prove. Thats why instead of trying to cure the problem they want to prevent it being able to happen in the first place. Thats much better than trying to go around banning people. So no, I disagree as Jagex are quite correct in the burden of proof.

 

 

 

 

Especially since ranked players get advance information on when to sell the items, and since in order to be ranked players have to recruit more and more players on the very bottom. That alone makes it the definition of a pyramid scheme, because if everybody made money as their advertisements claim there would be no need for a continually growing bottom.

 

I wouldn't keep relying on wiki as no-one trusts it. I know what pyramid selling is but the trouble is still the burden of proof. I also know that to get into this type of thing needs a reasonable amount of cash, that no 'green' player would have. So players go into it knowing exactly what they are doing. If they lose out, its their problem. If their cash happens to go into my pocket, even better. Its also good advice to have patience on buying items until the price drops again, which it inevitably does.

 

 

 

 

What makes this such a problem is that usually it isn't items that are as easy to get as ranarrs. Usually it's items that are randomly dropped, and so very difficult to get. When it's a consumable (such as monkfish) that's being bought out it can't be sustained as well because most are easy to get. When it's a rarer one (such as ranarr) it's still reasonable to collect your own, but difficult because of the rarity (Ranarr is an uncommon herb). Often it's an item like a barrows piece of a high level weapon that's only supply is through random drops. And I cannot expect to just go and get my own guthan set (for example) because of how unlikely actually getting just one piece of it is.

 

But you could still do it, despite the timescale. You can go out and get anything (rares excepted). Its our own laziness that prevents us all from doing so.

 

 

 

 

And as an added note, if I was in it for the status, would I honestly care about that issue this much?

 

No, I think you're trying to justify your purpose, and I think its more you trying to convince yourself, not me.

 

 

 

I see a pmod who directs a lot of harsh words at Jagex, the ones who made him a pmod. You complain about them not doing things right away, not changing things at all and you also deny what they say. I'd say you're a very angry man with Jagex because they said some things that you didn't want to hear, and perhaps they now consider you a liability. If you were all doing the job that you say you do (community stuff was a definate no-no before they changed it) they would feel no need to change things and left them as they were. Before, you felt you had a purpose in reporting players for this that and the other, and maybe you loved that power and the status it gave you. Now, its all being taken out of your hands. You're struggling for a reason to exist apart from a glorified game guide. In time with more pmods, you'll become more diluted so your status won't even be noticed. You've never really come up with anything sufficient to dispute what Jagex have said, and neither has anyone else who supports the pmod case.

 

 

 

The sheer irony of all of this is, I'm the one defending Jagex about these and other issues, and you're the one doing all the attacking. Shouldn't have this been the other way round? :-k

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I want to address this as well.

 

 

 

Causing grovelling and controlling the conversation are not rights given to player moderators. In fact, it's more a concern with popular and famous players like Tehnoobshow, Zezima, or Gertjaars. That some people fling stones at mods or kiss up to them is hardly the fault of the mod in question, and whether they dominate the conversation is more a matter of personality than of the crown.

 

 

 

No, its the fault of the crown and the perceived status that implies, the same as it is for those who have given up their life to be a *cough* famous RS player, crown/lots of 99's and top level xp = status. Which reinforces my previous statement that a crown could be seen as another '99' provided by Jagex as a player incentive.

 

 

 

Superiority and importance are not exclusive to player moderators either. Any player can act superior as long as they have something the player standing next to them does not have. It's very common to see higher-level players making fun of "n00bs." It has nothing to do with the crown.

 

 

 

Absolutely agree with this

 

 

 

The muting and reporting abilities are a right of player moderators, and what gives them that right is their proven history of quality abuse reports that has shown they have a firm grasp of the rules, as opposed to those random n00bs who will try to report you if you don't give them free money. Presumably, the customer service team abhors wading through crappy invalid reports all day long, and much prefers looking at the abuse reports filed by a player they trust to be competent. (At least, that's how I'd feel, anyway.)

 

 

 

Yes the 'right' is given and authorised by Jagex, but I think that to give one player that 'right' over another player, by the previous so called "selection process" is dreadful and I am sure is a key aspect in the changes. Evidence clearly shows that not all pmods can be trusted to file competent reports, and why is a pmod more trusted than me????? I am an experienced, adult player who is considerate to others in the game and helpful, why are my reports less trusted or competent???? :evil:

 

 

 

As for that why you keep going back to, again, that's a personal issue, and those submitting their names for consideration are asked to answer that question individually. For me, if I was offered the post, what it would really come down to is why not, as I'm knowledgeable enough and whatnot to be qualified for the job, and the Pmod crown, while obviously not essential, makes it easier to help people.

 

 

 

That is a negative default answer, As my parent used to say: "would you put your head in the oven if the teacher asked you to?".....erm, no! So why take up the offer? I really want to know :wall:

 

 

 

 

 

I mean, it's not as if the Pmod system has some huge negative impact on the community that it so badly needs to justify its existence. I think "Why not?" is an appropriate response.

 

 

 

See above, and yes I do believe the pmod has has an insidious impact on the community. It will need to justify its existence slightly less in the future. But for those pmods who have been around, yes I want their reasons or admission that this was for personal status, justified with a perceived and imaginary sense of purpose. But be aware that so far the reasons given are all arguable as being applicable to any player, bar the 'mute' option and even that is balanced by the 'ignore' capability. :shame:

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Your reports are less "trusted" simply because of the limitations of the system. It's not possible to give priority reports to everyone. I honestly have no idea exactly how the selection system works, but it's obvious that if everybody has priority reports, then nobody has priority reports.

 

 

 

As for "why take up the offer," I'm serious when I say it's a case of why not. For something like whether to put your head in an oven, there's an obvious con in that you will probably die. (Or if the oven is off, then at least that it probably smells funny and there's nothing exciting to look at in there.)

 

 

 

What insidious effects exactly are you talking about here? Any negative effects I can think of are caused by misconceptions about player moderators, not the actual moderators themselves.

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