Well as someone with a psychology degree, you're both (partially) wrong :P

 

Negative reinforcement isn't the same thing as punishment. Negative reinforcement means taking away something bad to encourage good behavior. Punishment means taking away something good, or adding something bad, to encourage good behavior.

 

But yes, reinforcement > punishment

Well as someone with a psychology degree, you're both (partially) wrong :P

 

Negative reinforcement isn't the same thing as punishment. Negative reinforcement means taking away something bad to encourage good behavior. Punishment means taking away something good, or adding something bad, to encourage good behavior.

 

But yes, reinforcement > punishment

Damn got me lol... I had a feeling a fudged up somewhere. Thanks... Add me on runescape i might be interested in talking a bit.

Cleaned up some posts. I would remind everyone that bashing other users with personal attacks are not permitted on these boards. Additionally, political discussion, including political based insults, are forbidden from this area of the boards, and pointless commentary of fights on the boards is considered spam. If you are not capable of debating in a calm and civilized manner, and feel the need to resort to petty attacks of each others character then do not post. Anyone who goes back to attacking fellow users, rather than what is being said, or otherwise resorts to trolling/bashing/intentionally posting false arguments etc, will either receive a much more personal warning, or a face a suspension.

 

Have a nice day.

Their business stance has changed so much recently i'm sorta glad I quit before I invested another 1000 hours into something that could go to hell in a hand-basket tomorrow. Usually i'm optimistic, maybe i'll check back in a few months and something changes for the better but as of now i'm going to stay away as to not disappoint myself.

In the end everything dies anyways so might as well enjoy what you like and leave when you're ready to move on to other entertaining things.

Holy crap that's morbid.

 

Not morbid. Just practical. And it's what many of us who are unhappy yet still like the game are doing. It's just sound advice no matter who you are (Y)

 

Have no time for games at this point in my life anyways. Just sort of bummed i never "completed" this game I've played since my teen years. Completed as in accomplished my goals considering it's nearly impossible to complete a mmorpg. I understand some of you don't see the seriousness of these recent updates, but usually when a company takes a 360 degree on developmental and business stance it's not a good sign.

 

As for the argument of people trying out micro-transactions and reinforcing Jagex's change in policy, that's what happens with anything. Comparatively, with new tech such as gaming or cars people jump at the new and cool thing leaving the better model and designs behind for sugar-coated shit.

 

360=back to where they started.

aka a circle

Why should someone show any respect towards somebody else who is paying for the downfall of RS?

 

It's a simple and mature method called "minding your own business." For the same reason you wouldn't walk up to someone on the street and start berating them for wearing shoes from a brand you don't like, you don't go up to someone in RuneScape and start harassing them for wearing cash shop clothing.

Why should someone show any respect towards somebody else who is paying for the downfall of RS?

 

It's a simple and mature method called "minding your own business." For the same reason you wouldn't walk up to someone on the street and start berating them for wearing shoes from a brand you don't like, you don't go up to someone in RuneScape and start harassing them for wearing cash shop clothing.

It's more like going up to someone driving a hummer in 150 years when the ozone layer is almost gone and fossil fuels are almost nonexistent and berating them. In other words, berating someone who's contributing to the downfall of your livelihood.

On another note it didn't seem like light-hearted fun by calling people out for doing things they enjoy nor did it even hint at it.

That's just your interpretation. There's no harm in poking a bit a fun, unrusle your jimmies.

You can't, at all, blame people for participating in these though. As much as I hate Jagex for taking this path, I fully understand people for taking advantage of it.

 

It might be expensive. It might be a scam. However, so long as people have the money to spend, they'll spend it. Why buy a $1,000 wrist watch when you can get a cheap digital from the dollar store? Because you've got the money to spend.

 

If XP lamps didn't cap at level 99 for dungeoneering, I'd have completionist tomorrow.

 

Do you think if people stopped using it that they'd remove it? Something that's in the game as large as SoF is, even if people did boycott it, it'd sit as dead content like 90% of the minigames in RuneScape.

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Their business stance has changed so much recently i'm sorta glad I quit before I invested another 1000 hours into something that could go to hell in a hand-basket tomorrow. Usually i'm optimistic, maybe i'll check back in a few months and something changes for the better but as of now i'm going to stay away as to not disappoint myself.

In the end everything dies anyways so might as well enjoy what you like and leave when you're ready to move on to other entertaining things.

Holy crap that's morbid.

 

Not morbid. Just practical. And it's what many of us who are unhappy yet still like the game are doing. It's just sound advice no matter who you are (Y)

 

Have no time for games at this point in my life anyways. Just sort of bummed i never "completed" this game I've played since my teen years. Completed as in accomplished my goals considering it's nearly impossible to complete a mmorpg. I understand some of you don't see the seriousness of these recent updates, but usually when a company takes a 360 degree on developmental and business stance it's not a good sign.

 

As for the argument of people trying out micro-transactions and reinforcing Jagex's change in policy, that's what happens with anything. Comparatively, with new tech such as gaming or cars people jump at the new and cool thing leaving the better model and designs behind for sugar-coated shit.

[/hide]

360=back to where they started.

aka a circle

 

Dang i posted at like 4am zoned out of my mind trying to stay up so i can work 3rd shift tonight. I meant in the opposite direction but I goofed. :P

I don't care. You should still have a minimum amount of respect for people. I said it before and I'll say it again... Pick you're battles wisely because if SoF really matters that much to you then you got more to figure out in your life than you think.

 

Why should someone show any respect towards somebody else who is paying for the downfall of RS?

Why should someone show no respect towards somebody else who is paying for the downfall of something that isn't important?

 

Why should someone show any respect towards somebody else who is paying for the downfall of RS?

 

It's a simple and mature method called "minding your own business." For the same reason you wouldn't walk up to someone on the street and start berating them for wearing shoes from a brand you don't like, you don't go up to someone in RuneScape and start harassing them for wearing cash shop clothing.

It's more like going up to someone driving a hummer in 150 years when the ozone layer is almost gone and fossil fuels are almost nonexistent and berating them. In other words, berating someone who's contributing to the downfall of your livelihood.

Except the ozone layer is actually important, while a videogame is much less important.

(And no offense, but if you consider the downfall of RS the downfall of your livelihood, then you might want to find something else to do in life apart from RS.)

You can't, at all, blame people for participating in these though. As much as I hate Jagex for taking this path, I fully understand people for taking advantage of it.

 

It might be expensive. It might be a scam. However, so long as people have the money to spend, they'll spend it. Why buy a $1,000 wrist watch when you can get a cheap digital from the dollar store? Because you've got the money to spend.

 

If XP lamps didn't cap at level 99 for dungeoneering, I'd have completionist tomorrow.

 

Do you think if people stopped using it that they'd remove it? Something that's in the game as large as SoF is, even if people did boycott it, it'd sit as dead content like 90% of the minigames in RuneScape.

To expand on this...

 

Why would you expect someone to sacrifice their own potential gain for your benefit? Do we really have people here who expect other people to be this magnanimous? If people have the money to spend, and it gets them ahead, why would you expect them to not do this? If this makes the game more fun for them, why would you expect them to sacrifice their joy?

 

I think it's perfectly reasonable to be mad at Jagex and their investors for making this an option, but I don't understand how people can be so mad at other people for being human. Sure, I don't like it anymore than other people do. The more people spend the more Jagex is encouraged to do it. But it's not the players fault that it's an option, and if they can take advantage of it, there is no reason they shouldn't. Also, the people who are in a place in their lives where they see what the future implications of this will be are in a totally different place from the people who are spending money. The people spending money either don't care, or are not yet old enough to see this kind of big picture (or not old enough to care). It's like getting mad at a 6 year old for not understanding why their parents can't afford every toy in the store.

 

Why should someone show any respect towards somebody else who is paying for the downfall of RS?

 

It's a simple and mature method called "minding your own business." For the same reason you wouldn't walk up to someone on the street and start berating them for wearing shoes from a brand you don't like, you don't go up to someone in RuneScape and start harassing them for wearing cash shop clothing.

It's more like going up to someone driving a hummer in 150 years when the ozone layer is almost gone and fossil fuels are almost nonexistent and berating them. In other words, berating someone who's contributing to the downfall of your livelihood.

Except the ozone layer is actually important, while a videogame is much less important.

(And no offense, but if you consider the downfall of RS the downfall of your livelihood, then you might want to find something else to do in life apart from RS.)

 

I apologize for considering something I've put thousands of hours into important.

Why should someone show any respect towards somebody else who is paying for the downfall of RS?

 

It's a simple and mature method called "minding your own business." For the same reason you wouldn't walk up to someone on the street and start berating them for wearing shoes from a brand you don't like, you don't go up to someone in RuneScape and start harassing them for wearing cash shop clothing.

It's more like going up to someone driving a hummer in 150 years when the ozone layer is almost gone and fossil fuels are almost nonexistent and berating them. In other words, berating someone who's contributing to the downfall of your livelihood.

Except the ozone layer is actually important, while a videogame is much less important.

(And no offense, but if you consider the downfall of RS the downfall of your livelihood, then you might want to find something else to do in life apart from RS.)

 

I apologize for considering something I've put thousands of hours into important.

 

As you get older, you'll consider it less and less important. It's all relative.

soon pendants of skill will be available for purchase at Soloman's store, this is just an intro to the item.....

Why should someone show any respect towards somebody else who is paying for the downfall of RS?

 

It's a simple and mature method called "minding your own business." For the same reason you wouldn't walk up to someone on the street and start berating them for wearing shoes from a brand you don't like, you don't go up to someone in RuneScape and start harassing them for wearing cash shop clothing.

It's more like going up to someone driving a hummer in 150 years when the ozone layer is almost gone and fossil fuels are almost nonexistent and berating them. In other words, berating someone who's contributing to the downfall of your livelihood.

Except the ozone layer is actually important, while a videogame is much less important.

(And no offense, but if you consider the downfall of RS the downfall of your livelihood, then you might want to find something else to do in life apart from RS.)

 

I apologize for considering something I've put thousands of hours into important.

 

As you get older, you'll consider it less and less important. It's all relative.

 

Not to mention it's unlikely to be your livelihood...unless you're a goldselling, in which case you're worse than any hatred that could be heaped onto any SoF spin buyer.

I apologize for considering something I've put thousands of hours into important.

 

It's okay, eventually you'll realize that video games are only temporary. You do recognize that eventually RuneScape will hit its peak in players and start its slide toward death, and your thousands of hours will be wasted regardless of what Jagex does simply because the game has become too old and antiquated for the market.

Its funny how everyone write off these experiences as useless as you get older. If you have truly learned nothing from this game over the years you should quit now as your missing the point of playing a multiplayer game. If you feel that everything you've ever done in your years is useless as you get older your missing the lessons that are there to be learnt.

 

 

 

PS: I find it offensive my post was deleted instead of having been edited like some posts, I felt it held a valid argument towards the discussion.

 

Kimberly edit: you're right! I'll PM you the content of your hidden post where you can repost the relevant discussion if you wish :)

Edited July 30, 201213 yr by Kimberly

No my interest stayed strong even after my ban. My second account has far better stats than my banned account.

 

I still play occasionally. I just don't consider RS important anymore because:

-90% of my close RS friends quit long ago and I don't play frequently enough to form new friendships

-I've got much better things to do with my free time now which contribute to my happiness much more than RS does (ex. going out with friends/girls, working on my business, going to the gym, etc.)

 

Like I said, it's all relative. If I was still in high school living with my parents, I'd probably dedicate a lot more free time to RS since I wouldn't really have much access to the RL goals I have now, which are all more exciting and meaningful than RS is to me.

 

All the recent marketing updates have no effect on my interest in RS, for better or worse. This is because I don't take RS seriously anymore and therefore any changes to RS make no difference to me.

 

And finally, if I could do everything over regarding playing RS, I would. I had a ton of fun over the years and met a lot of kind and interesting people, many of whom I still keep in touch with via Facebook. My RS "glory days" are far behind me now, and I don't enjoy the game like I used to, but that doesn't mean I don't cherish the good times I had on here. RS is about enjoying the journey towards completing your goals, and the experiences you have along the way.

As you get older, you'll consider it less and less important. It's all relative.

I think that's a pretty bad reason to not care now... we know it's likely not important in twenty years, but that doesn't mean we should pretend we are the people we will be in twenty years.

 

I don't know whether microtransactions will be the end of RS. But I do think it's better to remove them because they take away from the level playing field. Even cosmetic items are in a way part of the playing field. As such, telling people they are annoying (to you) when they buy stuff from Jagex is justified. It's just not very likely do accomplish anything.

As you get older, you'll consider it less and less important. It's all relative.

I think that's a pretty bad reason to not care now... we know it's likely not important in twenty years, but that doesn't mean we should pretend we are the people we will be in twenty years.

 

I don't know whether microtransactions will be the end of RS. But I do think it's better to remove them because they take away from the level playing field. Even cosmetic items are in a way part of the playing field. As such, telling people they are annoying (to you) when they buy stuff from Jagex is justified. It's just not very likely do accomplish anything.

 

i disagree... Really the core of the truth is that everything in life, as far as importance, is relative to your situation.

You can't, at all, blame people for participating in these though. As much as I hate Jagex for taking this path, I fully understand people for taking advantage of it.

 

It might be expensive. It might be a scam. However, so long as people have the money to spend, they'll spend it. Why buy a $1,000 wrist watch when you can get a cheap digital from the dollar store? Because you've got the money to spend.

 

If XP lamps didn't cap at level 99 for dungeoneering, I'd have completionist tomorrow.

 

Do you think if people stopped using it that they'd remove it? Something that's in the game as large as SoF is, even if people did boycott it, it'd sit as dead content like 90% of the minigames in RuneScape.

To expand on this...

 

Why would you expect someone to sacrifice their own potential gain for your benefit? Do we really have people here who expect other people to be this magnanimous? If people have the money to spend, and it gets them ahead, why would you expect them to not do this? If this makes the game more fun for them, why would you expect them to sacrifice their joy?

 

I think it's perfectly reasonable to be mad at Jagex and their investors for making this an option, but I don't understand how people can be so mad at other people for being human. Sure, I don't like it anymore than other people do. The more people spend the more Jagex is encouraged to do it. But it's not the players fault that it's an option, and if they can take advantage of it, there is no reason they shouldn't. Also, the people who are in a place in their lives where they see what the future implications of this will be are in a totally different place from the people who are spending money. The people spending money either don't care, or are not yet old enough to see this kind of big picture (or not old enough to care). It's like getting mad at a 6 year old for not understanding why their parents can't afford every toy in the store.

 

Remember RS is a game: in a game the highest goal is to have fun & fair playing field. In any game where me and my friends find the rules not adequate we simply modify the rules to make it more fair, I won't stop playing the game I'll just play in my way. And we expect everyone to adjust to those rules. Similar to MMOs: when the rules set by jagex become ridiculous I will expect people to follow some different rules; as thanks to things like highscores & GE everyone is playing together. Otherwise they'll lose my respect completely, might not be a problem at for them but it is still the case.

As you get older, you'll consider it less and less important. It's all relative.

I think that's a pretty bad reason to not care now... we know it's likely not important in twenty years, but that doesn't mean we should pretend we are the people we will be in twenty years.

 

I don't know whether microtransactions will be the end of RS. But I do think it's better to remove them because they take away from the level playing field. Even cosmetic items are in a way part of the playing field. As such, telling people they are annoying (to you) when they buy stuff from Jagex is justified. It's just not very likely do accomplish anything.

i disagree... Really the core of the truth is that everything in life, as far as importance, is relative to your situation.

How is that in any way not compatible with my statement?

First off re-posting this:

[spoiler=Old post]Negative reinforcement is the only way that exists to stop an action from occurring. If you got a new puppy and it was constantly pissing in the house would you coddle and praise it because it deserves a "base amount of respect" or would you rub its nose in it to show it what it did is bad?

 

The whole model of microtransactions that we are starting to see is, by the standards of most people, not being implemented well. However it is thriving because people want to try it out hense the continual thrust of more of it down our throats. There were people right off the bat that said the only way to protect against the sof is to avoid using it all and that's what negative reinforcement would do.

 

 

Second, even though I understand that Jagex and IVP are companies and need to make money there are certain things you need to maintain true to, to maintain a solid user base. A game goes no where if you have no people playing, that's why IVP is is pushing their luck with this game. Because for the most part its long standing members that still play this game, you'd be hard pressed to be a new player nowadays and catch up to anyone in terms of "end game" content. Now if you are purely playing for the social aspect having everyone give up the game as though nothing matters is a true waste of time. Some of my best life lessons on how to deal with people were learned online in games. Its a whole experience unto itself that, whether you like to think it has or not, has molded who you are today.

If more xp lamps before didn't do the trick, this will for sure. More SoF spins will have been bought this weekend than ever before.

If more xp lamps before didn't do the trick, this will for sure. More SoF spins will have been bought this weekend than ever before.

 

They will be disappointed. I bought 25 ($9.99) spins and received 1 fishing and 1 hunting pendant.