amitoz

Note to mods: Yes, the highly controversial thread is back! The sole reason why this thread was locked before was, I believe, to debate which granted itself to arguing mindlessly. I/f we all cut down on this, there is no reason for this thread to be locked, for it is a highly viable topic to discuss. Thank you. Random drops are random; or are they? Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread. :mrgreen: Disclaimer: My opinion on this matter is simply my opinion, backed with my own sense of experience throughout the years as I have played the game. I have always tried to determine how drop rates are given in a game such as RuneScape, whether they are as a part of the player's pre-determined luck, or as a pre-determined drop rate, or both. Personally, I do not think players have a "luck" constant, per-sae, because I think that's immorally biased (although that hasn't stopped Jagex before), and it would be too much to give each player a set constant to multiply their drop rate by. Therefore, I think that Each individual drop, be it Draconic Visage, Abyssal Whip, or the sort, has an individual drop value, whereas if any player in RS kills said monster, It's droprate counter is added upon. Let's take the example of Abyssal demons, saying perhaps the chance they will drop an Abyssal Whip is 1/8000 (I made that number up, you damn trolls <3). Now, my theory is that if ANYONE on ANY world kills an abyssal demon, the dropcounter raises. Now, If 100 Abby Demons are killed in 5 minutes collectively on all worlds, The TOTAL Droprate counter raises by 100. Once that dropcounter hits 8000, the person who killed that 8000th Abby Demon gets the whip drop, and the counter is reset. I've had personal experience with that, as have my friends. I should mention that once Jagex releases a patch (update), the counter gets reset by default to one less than that of the max, in some cases; whether by glitch or severe miscoding, I do not know. This used to happen, but I could not for the life of me reproduce it now. Me and my friends would do GWD religiously when it came out. Whenever there was an update, we had the theory implemented in our heads that whoever kills Kree'arra right after the update will get an Armadyl Hilt right away, for it was the first kill after an update. This theory worked around 65% of the time. That's a VERY high percentile, if you ask me. However, when we try and reproduce that today, it ceases to work, even after EXTENSIVE testing. Perhaps this was just the glitch with the droprate resetting to 7999/8000 instead of 0/8000 after each update, but perhaps this is just me. Another explanation for getting 2 drops simultaneously: And for the people who think there is a wheel or "roulette", there isn't, it's a simple iconic metaphor Jagex uses to explain in visuals to noobs how the drops "supposedly" work. More eloquently described here: Computers can't "randomly" generate numbers. No matter what, it is slightly biased no matter what; in which it has to follow a set formula or a set of formulae that will generate that random number. This is what my theory coincides with, better explained here: And a simple formula to help visualize my theory easier: I said that if after an update, drops are determined with "(0+n)/x" wheres x is the predetermined number which must be fulfilled, then n is every kill gotten after an update. Very simple but simply put it is easier to see. This formula is reset once n=x. This formula used to be "[(x-1)+n]/x =D" instead of "(0+n)/x = D" whereas D is the drop of a specific item. Why the wheel theory is not a viable explanation: That doesn't make sense to me, nor should it to anyone who actually sees how numbers are generated. Unless if Jagex physically spins a wheel for every kill, then again for the drop (mind you that wheel must be unbaised physically [with equal weight on every side, perfectly symmetrical, which is not possible] and also that spin must be consistent constantly), would be the only viable explanation for a truly "random" number generator. All other numbers are pre-determined, no matter how minute this bias is. Since this number generating(with a RNG) relies on a formula, or more probably a set of formulae (so it's harder to crack), it is not COMPLETELY random, and therefore, since the wheel theory IS COMPLETELY random, the two can not correlate. Another piece of evidence that the wheel theory CAN NOT and IS NOT true: ^Wikipedia The number generator used by RS is a pseudoorandom number generator; which you even stated could not have been able to be replaced by 2010. Obviously, since it could not have been implemented since, RS still relies on this pseudorandom generator which is not 100% completely random, allowing you to derive at least some sort of equation for which to log drops. How can RS have 100% a completely random RNG without it being even created since 2010, and not even being implemented since then? It can't, and therefore this wheel theory is nothing more than a visual for people to comparitively speak of whilst not knowing how RNGs work. ------------------------------ Ts_Stormrage's (of the Tip.It Editorial Panel) opinions on my theory: Another poster's opinion: Also another note on the RNG-- the supposed RNG could not be used to determine drops for RS, because firstly, those drops have weightings, which makes them not random, and also, even if they weren't weighted, the RNG is not 100% random in and of itself. What everyone states of these back-to-back drops rely on the use of a RNG, which can NOT exist as a determiner of drops. Now, do you agree with this theory, disagree, or have your own thoughts on the matter? Speculations? Discuss. :wink:

I've learned throughout the years to talk scarcely, if at all, on RS, especially in public chat.

You know it son.

If you just got the reason you wanted, I don't see the problem?

If you don't do your homework, don't cry when you fail the test.

Yep, it's quite the hyperbolized cry of despair.

Honestly, the more f2p gets, the more they beg. Don't turn this into a Germany of a Munich.

Revenants ain't got jack shiet on me. And on the majority of the Rs population. It won't make it much easier than it already is.

Slayer is one of those skills that has huge release-era potential. When Abby demons were released, along with Slayer, I believe Zezima achieved 99 slayer in only 4 months; reaching 85 slayer in only about a month. Back then, there were very few high-level slayer monsters, with a high probability to get Abbies as a task. Many people wished to trade their Phats for an elusive whip. The same goes for frost dragon bones and the SoL is present today, although no where near the scalability, but still; Frosts are still a solid 1.5m gp/hr; being one of the best investments when slayer creatures are released, which they inevitably will be in the future.

Don'tstart training 20 minutes before a birthday party? Pretty common sense. :roll:

Bots will never cease to exist. There are peaks and valleys, but they will always survive; if not thrive.

Efficiency is the most enjoyable play style. At least for me. And if JAGEX (who cater to the noobiest of noobs) are telling you that you are fighting monsters too weak, that should be a sign. Jus' sayin'.

Likewise. There's now too much content which is further and further devaluing previous god-like items (D-Long, anyone?).

It is, lol. Bird snare or w/e.

U IS NON EFICNT GO DIE IN HOL. Let him do what he wants. OT: Sw is probably better mate.

F2P people miss out on hilarious moments as this: This guy will hunt you and your family. (6 years ago) xD

HE WILL HUNT YOU AND YOUR FAMILY. Try another spot buddy. xD BTW this is like 6 years ago.

Both GSs have same accuracy.

This ^ being in the top floor of any Stone building yet ican still bury bones ??? Never thought of that.. :D

/Thread. :thumbsup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

I would always check those out.

Melee player wearing ranged equipment with no draw-back what'so'evah. He has to be 1 square away to hit someone. That's a HUGE drawback.

Errm, no, that was 2005, 5 years ago :rolleyes: What?

so do I. but to say things are nearly balanced is pushing it (although it is A LOT more balanced then it was). but that is a bit besdies the point. just say you DO think the triangle was unbalanced, would my sujestions fix that? or at least give the CBT a balanced paltform to built upon? The combat triangle is pretty much balanced. Name one imbalanced aspect.

18m hp xp. Ooh, just noticed the whip drop as well. Awesome haha. Over 2 years ago. Look at the report abuse button. Good times, when 85 slayer was actually something. :)