Tip.It Times Presents: All Great Achievements Require Time

[Ginger_Warrior]

Ths article was unfortunetely naÃÆÃâÃâïve as much as it was anticipated:

 

 

 

The "I'm special, I'm entitled to special treatment" attitude is becoming increasingly prevalent in the real world, in almost every area of life.

 

 

 

I'm sorry to wake everyone up to the real world here, but welcome to Capitalism. The whole idea of Capitalism is that a select few prosper, and inevitably, some people suffer because it of it. Marx says this himself, and some 150 years on, what he said is becoming common-place in everyday society. The Western-world chose this structure of society, and just as you said in your article, abide by the rules or perish. I personally am a Socialist and I don't believe in this kind of structure, but it exists, and it would be completely naÃÆÃâÃâïve to try and even deny it's there. You're preaching Existentialism, and while I partly agree with this philosophy, humans don't always have the choice over what they want to do, and often there are constricting factors, such as money.

 

 

 

What you and Jagex are effectively trying to say is "In the Real World, he who owns most doesn't get what they want". Well, what a load of crap quite frankly! Have you seen Chelsea FC the past two years? While I don't agree either that you should be judged in RS on how much wealth you own in Real Life, I realise that I'm foolish to even try to take such an ideology and then realistically compare it to the Real World.

 

 

 

I'm sorry Editor, this was a bad and misinformed article. 2/5 tops.

[Sr_Fork]

Ths article was unfortunetely naÃÆÃâÃâïve as much as it was anticipated:

 

 

 

The "I'm special, I'm entitled to special treatment" attitude is becoming increasingly prevalent in the real world, in almost every area of life.

 

 

 

I'm sorry to wake everyone up to the real world here, but welcome to Capitalism. The whole idea of Capitalism is that a select few prosper, and inevitably, some people suffer because it of it. Marx says this himself, and some 150 years on, what he said is becoming common-place in everyday society. The Western-world chose this structure of society, and just as you said in your article, abide by the rules or perish. I personally am a Socialist and I don't believe in this kind of structure, but it exists, and it would be completely naÃÆÃâÃâïve to try and even deny it's there. You're preaching Existentialism, and while I partly agree with this philosophy, humans don't always have the choice over what they want to do, and often there are constricting factors, such as money.

 

 

 

What you and Jagex are effectively trying to say is "In the Real World, he who owns most doesn't get what they want". Well, what a load of crap quite frankly! Have you seen Chelsea FC the past two years? While I don't agree either that you should be judged in RS on how much wealth you own in Real Life, I realise that I'm foolish to even try to take such an ideology and then realistically compare it to the Real World.

 

 

 

I'm sorry Editor, this was a bad and misinformed article. 2/5 tops.

 

 

 

Very well put, I agree.

[Rebdragon]

When you sign up for an account, you agree to abide by the terms and conditions. All of them. As written. When, or if, Jagex changes the terms and conditions, you either abide by the revised versions or you quit the game. It's a simple binary proposition: Play by the rules or don't play.

 

That means if you're under 13 you shouldn't be playing. If you're between 13 and 18, you need your parents' explicit permission to play. It means that you can't play on your brother's, sister's, boyfriend's, girlfriend's, aunt's, uncle's, cousin's, grandfather's (or gramdomother's!), or best friend's account. And they can't play on yours. It means you should be reasonably polite to other players and not attempt to cheat them in trades, insult them, or use foul language in conversations. It means keeping your personal details to yourself and not asking other people for theirs. And most of all it means no real world item trading, no autoing and no running macros.

 

"Blindly follow the law." Pfft.

 

 

 

I've heard it said that perhaps Jagex should allow people to trade items in the real world. The usual justification for this is that the people who'd be able to take advantage of this and buy their way to the higher levels would be mainly adults in their 30s, who deserve to be able to buy their skills because they don't have the time to train them up like high school or college kids do. I'm sorry, but I think that's a load of recycled cattlefeed. If you don't have the time to train your character the way Jagex has written the game, then you need to go find another game. I don't care how hard you work, how rich you are, or how little time you have. You are not a special snowflake, you don't deserve to be able to buy your way around, beside, over or under the rules.

 

I fail to see the reasoning behind this point, other than "follow the law", as Duke has already stated.

 

 

 

I myself see [almost] nothing wrong with real world trading. I'd be a full-fledged advocate of adults being able to spend their cash on gp if it wasn't for the fact that it would be selling and buying something owned by someone else- Jagex. It's their property, not the sellers- that is pretty much my one and only argument against real world trading.

 

 

 

The "I'm special, I'm entitled to special treatment" attitude is becoming increasingly prevalent in the real world, in almost every area of life. Everyone wants to be a special case, as long as it gets them out of doing the dirty work. Nobody wants to start at the bottom and work their way up. Everyone wants the corner office and the expense account without having to put in the time learning the skills of their trade first.

 

Weak argument. Money takes time to earn, genius. And it's it's not like there's anything to learning to play Runescape past a 1st grade diploma.

 

 

 

Neither the Real WorldTM or RuneScape owe you any kind of special treatment. If you aren't willing to expend sufficient effort in your day job, the boss is not going to pay you a bonus, or promote you. If you don't expend the minimum he or she requires, you're going to find yourself unemployed, and I don't recommend trying a life of crime ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Ãâ I'm not sure you'd get all that much Internet access in jail.

 

Buying gp is transferring work in the real world to work in Runescape.

 

 

 

These analogies are a little long-winded, with a lot of extra junk thrown in that has nothing to do with his argument. "Life of crime"... where the hell did that come from?

 

 

 

Every GP in my pitiful bank account was earned by me (or picked up off the floor by me after being left behind by those too rich or too lazy to take every last coin a monster drops). And it's going to stay that way.

 

But by paying for the gp, you technically earned it. Now, I'm against kids using their parents money to buy gp (as they didn't earn it), but if an adult wants to transfer outside work to the virtual world, it's fine by me.

 

 

 

The bottom line is, it's a game. We play for fun. There's no requirement to do anything, get to any level, complete any quest ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Ãâ well, OK there are quests you have to complete to get access to certain aspects and areas of the game, but in general, everything in RuneScape is purely what we want to do. If you're not having fun, if you feel compelled to win, to beat other people's scores, then maybe you're playing the wrong game.

 

They want to play for fun. Sadly, I would agree with most of them that the work required to get to the point of having fun is not fun at all.

 

 

 

Ever think that they're playing for fun as well? That they want to get past the tedious tasks to the Barraging fun? Way to stereotype.

 

 

 

I'm sorry, but these are some of the most pathetic arguments I've ever seen. Not written well either :|.

[rebrew576]

great read, and

 

i totally get what your saying about stuff you dont earn, i recently got 5.5mil from a buddy who quit and i bought sum stuff, but it just doesnt feel right because its just not mine

[lonew0lf1974]

Simply put if you don't like having to do the work to get your levels go find a game where cheats are allowed, and leave us to play on a level playing field the way we like it.

 

 

 

lonew0lf

[lostdreamer3]

Interesting read..tho I probably would have touched on why buying outside money is bad for runescape. Or why having other people play your account is bad.

 

 

 

I have played for all of my stats...I've never cheated. I recently bought 4000 coal (from my own RS money that I earned thru clues) and felt wierd about it..but I didn't cheat.

 

 

 

I never had a big issue with account sharing because I never personally dealt with anyone who had done it or is doing it. Then recently someone i know bought someone to 43 prayer and gave them all expensive armour. Then logged into their account to get their combat level up just so they could wear it. This person who received the 43 prayer didn't have ANY levels before this. I didn't tell this person I was offended..because well...I don't want to be a tattle tale or a know it all. Plus, I was rather baffled by my own reaction to their behavior.

 

 

 

I've gotten over it slightly because I can look at the high scores and say that I am still a higher level at everything than them (except prayer).

 

 

 

My point being..i felt that my playing was cheapened by these other players..and that is what now makes me care about account sharing.

 

 

 

However, I do think the article should have expanded on whys instead of just "because I said so" mentality.

 

 

 

BTW: a 12 year old mod...umm....wow...that's all i have to say about that.

[littlejohnnyboy]

I really dug that article. Fo weal.

 

Thought the non-linearness made the article more interesting.

 

Points came across really well - I agree lvling is realy tedious and hard but it's such a fun part of what the game is. Without it, the game would have very few goals.

 

 

 

Can't understand these cheats.

[CarrieB]

Members you're paying for an expansion of the game, paying for items is paying for someone else to play the game for you.

 

I understand what you're saying and I agree; it's just the way you said it.

 

If you've ever bought an item from another player that you couldn't get yourself - say, an Abyssal Whip or Dragon Helm - then you are, in fact, paying someone else to play for you.

[tru_vampire0]

My favorite article by far, as of now. Very Good Job!, to The Editor, whoever you are.

[CarrieB]

Now that I've finished the thread...

 

 

 

I'm rather shocked at the amount of class envy being displayed here.

 

There are important lessons to life - "you have to work for every penny you earn" is not one of them. However, "being creative enough to find a way to make your money work for you" is one of them.

 

 

 

People who are "born into money" do not have it all. Sit there and envy them all you want, but I'm sorry - they're just as clueless as you are. So they can party a lot - big deal. That's not what life is about.

 

 

 

If people like Paris Hilton were to lose all of their money tomorrow, they'd be out on their rear in the street begging for food. Period.

 

Why?

 

Because they haven't learned how to earn the money themselves.

 

 

 

It's the same situation with RS, and players buying their way up. So they've got full Guthans and every 99 cape available - so what? How in the world does that affect you? It doesn't.

 

There is, however, one very important point that you are missing... the folks that buy their way up have not learned how to get those things themselves, and they're going to have to keep paying gold to keep themselves in the style of playing they've become accustomed to. You, Mr. Hard Worker, on the other hand have done the quests and put in the work required - and now you know all of the monsters and where they are. You know the shortcuts that can cut your nat creating time from 5 minutes to just under 2. You know where you can easily replace that special item just by asking an NPC.

 

 

 

Mr. Buy My Way does not know these things, and as such, his way of playing becomes a permanent chain around his neck... it truly is its own punishment.

 

 

 

Now, all of that being said, back to the "R"eal "W"orld.

 

You never have to work for every penny you earn. What a fallacy of thinking. Ever heard of a house earning equity? Ever heard of interest? Ever heard of multiple streams of passive income?

 

That mindset in and of itself will keep you from ever breaking out of the class/caste that you believe yourself to currently be in.

 

 

 

One of the beautiful things about the "western world" and its structure of capitalism is that anyone - ANYONE - with any amount of schooling (or none), can become a very rich person with just a little effort. Entrepreneurs abound in the U.S., and it's petty for those who are short-sighted to sit and whine that the world should be socialist so that the people who have great ideas, or who work hard, or who have creative ways of making money work for them should have to turn around and give that money away to the folks who sit on their butts with their hand stuck out. This is the exact reason why the welfare system does NOT work, and why countries run by socialism are the poorest and have the least-ambitious populace.

 

 

 

I'll help you guys out a bit:

 

1. Work Smarter, Not Harder

 

2. Don't work for every penny; make every penny work for you.

 

3. Focusing on what other people have and what you don't have is a waste of time. Focus instead on how to get what you want. It's time better-spent.

 

 

 

As for kids playing with their parents' permission - our entire family plays, including 2 sons under the age of 13. I know when they're on, I am usually online at the same time. Jagex made the right call by leaving that decision up to the parents. My husband and I love being able to play an interactive game with our sons that actually helps them learn important things like setting and reaching goals, and we gladly pay a monthly fee for that.

[nadir]

here we go again...

 

 

 

to all those who agree with real world trading: why not jagex just scrap the rule 12 and start selling characters with 99 in all skills and 500 mil in bank + 1 of each rare directly to players that want?

 

 

 

-"because there are legal issues" i played knight online and they were selling items to players. i'm sure jagex can do this too, if they wanted to, and this way, they get some pretty nice extra cash, instead of letting others get that cash

 

 

 

-"because it would imbalance the economy, it would insert big values in rs" i thought you claim that only very few people would buy large amounts of rs cash. if this is true, at 1 mil (and growing) members, it shoud not be an issue, and there are barrows and rune shops and crystal bow as rs cash drains (and jagex can insert more), so i think this is a non-issue

 

 

 

-"because the average lvl would rise" i thought you claim that only very few people would buy large amounts of rs cash. if this is true, at 1 mil (and growing) members, it shoud not be an issue, besides that NEWSFLASH! players already train 24/7 and that is already rising, lots of high-lvl training areas are actually crowded lately, so there would be little difference.

 

 

 

 

 

you claim that only very few people would buy large amounts of rs cash. there are many players that play this game for YEARS to get to decent-good-very good levels.

 

 

 

getting huge instant rs cash (by buying it with real cash) helps any newcommer to buy raw materials and get those high skill levels in a way shorter time compared to the players that spent months and years to get the cash or gather those raw materials by themselves.

 

 

 

examples? prayer, construction, crafting, fletching, cooking, runecrafting (do i have to explain how can a rc-er can buy p ess runer's time and get up to 6 times faster xp?), smithing

 

 

 

now if someone made my levels in 1/6 the time i spent in rs just because he bought rs cash with real cash and done what i described above, it would make all that i have done meaningless to me.

 

 

 

people that say this is a non-issue:

 

-this IS an issue, for ME!

 

-you haven't yet had someone make a ton of your work meaningless, alot of time spent on something that just went down the trash up untill now, did you? then you have no idea what it feels like. if you do, then you know what i mean

 

-you don't care? tough luck, i don't care about you wanting to gain cash while ruining my fun, so i guess we're even here

 

-you keep on saying that very few people want to buy with large amounts of cash. those people mean less than the players that care for highscores and noone cutting in front of the line (like me) because they are already bored with the game, they just want to feel what's like on top, then they will quit, as opposite to players that are willing to spend years to get those levels/items.

 

 

 

 

 

i doubt people would stop macroing just because real world trading would be allowed. in fact i am convinced that alowing trading rs cash for real cash would increase by alot the number of macroers. why? because there are people in real life that do very bad things to get real cash. making 100 bots to get that (rs cash and exchange it for) real cash easier and not risk anything

 

 

 

 

 

"Weak argument. Money takes time to earn, genius. And it's it's not like there's anything to learning to play Runescape past a 1st grade diploma."

 

exactly how much time did it get you to learn all the map of rs? all the transportation methods? how much time to understand why a certain route is faster than another one to make nats?

 

how much time did it took you to learn the prices of most valuable items so that you don't sell something for alot less than it's worth?

 

how much time did it took you to find out wich smithing method is fastest to power-train?

 

 

 

""Blindly follow the law." Pfft."

 

you don't like it, play another game, or just buy jagex :P. i don't like that i have to pay some taxes, but i pay them. people that take the law in their own hads are either owners of the right to make laws (in this case, jagex) or want to be rebels and end up breaking the law just because they decided that they have the right to decide for others (and I do NOT give you that right) what is wrong and what is right. "The "I'm special, I'm entitled to special treatment" attitude". usually the law is made to fit and to meet the APROVAL of the majority.

 

 

 

"These analogies are a little long-winded, with a lot of extra junk thrown in that has nothing to do with his argument. "Life of crime"... where the hell did that come from?"

 

you did not consider the implications above

 

 

 

"Buying gp is transferring work in the real world to work in Runescape. "

 

we all know that. consinder all implications of doing that before going in head-first. if you can't think of any, then make a pool amongst your friends, or try to understand what is said about this issue by both sides, and the STRONG reason behind every person that agrees/disagree with the issue.

 

the main idea of playing this game is to have fun.

 

the main idea of (alot of) supporters of real world trading is "i can sell my rs cash/character(s) for real cash, yay!"; "i can get to level 99 alot quicker/buy that expensive item"

 

the main idea of opposers: it would ruin my fun, it would be unfair, it would make the long hours i have spent in rs skillng meaningless

 

my translation:

 

supporters: "i want to play less the game, i care more about real life"

 

opposers: "i want to play more the game and i feel that the supporters would ruin my fun INGAME and would make me" (as someone else posted, thank you) "quit rs"

 

 

 

"But by paying for the gp, you technically earned it. Now, I'm against kids using their parents money to buy gp (as they didn't earn it), but if an adult wants to transfer outside work to the virtual world, it's fine by me."

 

it's fine by you, it's not fine by others, including me. see above

 

 

 

"They want to play for fun. Sadly, I would agree with most of them that the work required to get to the point of having fun is not fun at all. "

 

you have no idea how to train and have fun at the same time?

 

"it's not like there's anything to learning to play Runescape past a 1st grade diploma. "

 

you DON'T get my diploma for your first grade in rs. i can assure you, i have fun in rs, even while "grinding". why? becaus i choose the way i skill, and what skill i train, so that i don't get bored doing it, and if i get bored, i switch to another skill. but that's me. each player has it's own way.

 

 

 

"it's not a competitive game". then why you feel compeled to do the "grinding"? why not just explore the landscape? why train to kill a blue dragon with a combat lvl 50/60 character when you can try to kill a black knight with a combat lvl 10 character? why want to have a phat and other rares when you can try and be happy with a character that has 1k coins in bank? (i can still remember how happy i was whan i got 1k+ coins in bank my first time). why? because because you feel that you COMPETE with others, and you MUST have more/the same as they do.

 

 

 

"Ever think that they're playing for fun as well? That they want to get past the tedious tasks to the Barraging fun? Way to stereotype."

 

you call "grinding". i call "fun play". if they play for fun, as i said before, why not just convince jagex to give them 99 in all skills and more cash and rares and stuff thant they can ever lose/use for a modic sum, let's say 1k USD and have fun with all that stuff? because after that, the fun will be very short. that player will have no other higher target to reach out to. that player will quit wery quick.

 

 

 

"I'm sorry, but these are some of the most pathetic arguments I've ever seen. Not written well either"

 

edit: what i wrote sounded like an insult (and i am sorry about that), so i changed it to:

 

when you will consider the implications, you're going to understand.

[Wachtwoord]

Sadly the Editor remains unable to actually address why Real World Item Trading is so bad. I can basically summarize his whole arguement as "it is against the rules and thus shouldn't be done". Those who read my article should know that I actually agree with that.

 

 

 

However, RWIT being against the rules does not mean it is actually morally wrong itself. While that is exactly what I argue against and what you are clearly unable to defend apparently.

 

 

 

Real Life law has had rules that encouraged anything from discrimination to violence. Defending a rule with the fact that it is currently a rule is extremely weak argumentation and a reasoning fallacity called circular reasoning.

 

 

 

The bottom line is, it's a game. We play for fun.

 

 

 

Exactly the reason why I don't get why people care so much about what others do.

 

 

 

There's no requirement to do anything, get to any level, complete any quest ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Ãâ well, OK there are quests you have to complete to get access to certain aspects and areas of the game, but in general, everything in RuneScape is purely what we want to do. If you're not having fun, if you feel compelled to win, to beat other people's scores, then maybe you're playing the wrong game. I, on the other hand intend to go on ignoring the existence of metal dragons and various other imposing monsters and continue to 'scape like a newb.

 

 

 

You seem to agree here with one of my main arguements for allowance of RWIT, being that RuneScape is essentially not a competitive game and that the game is what you make of it. It's a Virtual World. It has no starting conditions nor ending conditions.

 

Runescape is mostly about achievements. Nobody really enjoys all the massive grinding, but the fact you can show your achievement to other players makes it worth while. Just face it, would anyone get 99 mining (just an example) if this game wasn't multi player? I don't think so.

 

There for, real world trading is just like pest control. Nobody says you have to use pc to get combat levels, but because of the fact you have the possebility to level very easy, it is way less respected among the community then before. Same goes for real world trading: if you know it's possible to easily buy the cash you need for 99 construction (just an example), would you still respect it that much? I don't think so.

 

 

 

For the people who say they also earned that money IRL, I doubt if they realize how cheap RuneScape money is. 200 Mil is around 300$-350$. You can do a lot with that and I know a lot of adults who easily pay multiplies of that for their hobbies!

 

 

 

Yes, this is indeed some kind of summary of what the guy above said.

[Bozebo]

great article...

 

 

 

lol

 

...the Real WorldTM or RuneScape ...

[greg1g]

i have notice that JAGEGX WATCHES YOUR EVERY TRADE:

 

eg:Greg1g offers nothing: Slasher X53 offers a blue party hat, dragon chain, dragon platelegs,dragon med helm.

 

 

 

they can track this because i no but.... that trade is made up and slasher x53 is my cuz so oh well i hope he doesnt mind

[Wachtwoord]

i have notice that JAGEGX WATCHES YOUR EVERY TRADE:

 

eg:Greg1g offers nothing: Slasher X53 offers a blue party hat, dragon chain, dragon platelegs,dragon med helm.

 

 

 

they can track this because i no but.... that trade is made up and slasher x53 is my cuz so oh well i hope he doesnt mind

 

So? I don't really care if they know what all my trades are.

[wolfsilent]

i really liked this article, and thought it was well written

 

 

 

my favorite line in the whole thing sums it up well:

 

 

 

YOU ARE NOT A SPECIAL SNOWFLAKE

 

 

 

thanks for the good read

[xavier6657]

The day that GP can be bought in Real life will be the day that I stop playing runescape. I work hard for every GP I earn, and it wouldnt sit well \ with me when Mr Rich turns around and buy's himself levels with his 'real' money.

 

.

 

 

 

ummm i hate to break it too u but that day came like 5 years ago.

 

 

 

i think he means when money can be bought with out getting you account banned, even though it did start "like 5 years ago" Jagex doesn't allow it so you could get banned for it.

 

 

 

Um, what? First you talk about achievement diaries, then macroing, then real world trading. That article didn't make sense. Well, it made sense, just not linear sense.

 

 

 

he was refering to them as he got to the point (hint:read the article insted of skimming)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

anyway good read i totaly suport your opinon :thumbsup: (exept for that remark about scaping like a noob, you arn't a noob when u play the right way)

 

 

 

and i have a little confeson, i once tryed to cheat but then i realized how much of a jerk i wus for trying, and now i'm folow the rules like i folow the law

[Evil Pig20]

Um, what? First you talk about achievement diaries, then macroing, then real world trading. That article didn't make sense. Well, it made sense, just not linear sense.

 

 

 

Achievement Diaries

 

 

 

Macroing - Cheating

 

 

 

Real world trading - Cheating

 

 

 

The editor is trying to make a point about how levels can be bought but fun cannot.

[Rebdragon]

Note: IÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢m sorry Editor if youÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢re female, IÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢m just using the masculine case to make my responses a little easier to get through :P .

 

-"because there are legal issues" i played knight online and they were selling items to players. i'm sure jagex can do this too, if they wanted to, and this way, they get some pretty nice extra cash, instead of letting others get that cash

 

Jagex selling their own property is different than someone else selling Jagex's property. Me, I have nothing against Jagex selling items and whatnot- it'd be a good marketing decision and there's really nothing morally wrong with it at all.

 

 

 

now if someone made my levels in 1/6 the time i spent in rs just because he bought rs cash with real cash and done what i described above, it would make all that i have done meaningless to me.

 

Really? I wouldn't care at all to be honest.

 

 

 

C'mon, why do you even care? It's their way of playing; it doesn't even affect you at all. You have the pride of your levels, he doesn't. Frikking get over yourself.

 

 

 

people that say this is a non-issue:

 

-this IS an issue, for ME!

 

OkayÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæ

 

 

 

-you haven't yet had someone make a ton of your work meaningless, alot of time spent on something that just went down the trash up untill now, did you? then you have no idea what it feels like. if you do, then you know what i mean

 

Currently I have 94 Magic. Now, there are plenty of people who have abused new updates, bought items with RW money, used PC etc. to get ahead and have the advantage over me in Magic training. Does that make me think my level is meaningless?

 

 

 

Hell no. I worked hard for this level. I spent hours upon hours training and gaining magic experience. If some loser took a shortcut, itÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s his problem, not mine. I donÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t respect his level, and he doesnÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t deserve the respect. But he got to that level, and he enjoys using that level, so kudos to him, heÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s having fun.

 

-you don't care? tough luck, i don't care about you wanting to gain cash while ruining my fun, so i guess we're even here

 

If this ruins your fun, youÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢re probably playing the wrong game.

 

 

 

-you keep on saying that very few people want to buy with large amounts of cash. those people mean less than the players that care for highscores and noone cutting in front of the line (like me) because they are already bored with the game, they just want to feel what's like on top, then they will quit, as opposite to players that are willing to spend years to get those levels/items.

 

I repeat: Way to stereotype. Maybe, just maybeÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæ they play for fun too?

 

 

 

"Weak argument. Money takes time to earn, genius. And it's it's not like there's anything to learning to play Runescape past a 1st grade diploma."

 

exactly how much time did it get you to learn all the map of rs? all the transportation methods? how much time to understand why a certain route is faster than another one to make nats?

 

how much time did it took you to learn the prices of most valuable items so that you don't sell something for alot less than it's worth?

 

how much time did it took you to find out wich smithing method is fastest to power-train?

 

Your point being? If a RWITer wants to spend the money to get ahead, even if it means not gaining full knowledge in the game, thatÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s his problem, not mine. Heck, you could call it justice if you want to. YouÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢re practically supporting RWIT by saying that.

 

 

 

""Blindly follow the law." Pfft."

 

you don't like it, play another game, or just buy jagex :P. i don't like that i have to pay some taxes, but i pay them. people that take the law in their own hads are either owners of the right to make laws (in this case, jagex) or want to be rebels and end up breaking the law just because they decided that they have the right to decide for others (and I do NOT give you that right) what is wrong and what is right. "The "I'm special, I'm entitled to special treatment" attitude". Usually the law is made to fit and to meet the APROVAL of the majority.

 

That ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬ÅusuallyÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâÃ

[11the_mask_1]

very nice read, i really enjoyed it :thumbsup:

[nadir]

Rebdragon,

 

 

 

"-you haven't yet had someone make a ton of your work meaningless, alot of time spent on something that just went down the trash up untill now, did you? then you have no idea what it feels like. if you do, then you know what i mean"

 

my bad, i thought it was implied that i was referring to real world...

 

i mean like make a big nice novel, or a painture or w/e that you were proud of, that took you tons of time and effort, and someone came and done/said somethig and destroyed what you have done/made it look meaningless in your own eyes.

 

 

 

"If this ruins your fun, youÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢re probably playing the wrong game. "

 

the second anyone can just buy rs cash with real cash (and jagex approves this on all servers) i will agree with you on this one :)

 

 

 

"I repeat: Way to stereotype. Maybe, just maybeÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæ they play for fun too? "

 

setting goals and reaching them yourself is the fun. setting goals and reaching them 5 minutes later... sorry, i missed the "play" part... where does the "play" part stick in that sentence anyway? you played. ok. jagex agees with real world blah-blah. ok. you suddenly meet 10+ times more people with barrage. you are no longer an elite, one of the few.

 

 

 

"Your point being? If a RWITer wants to spend the money to get ahead, even if it means not gaining full knowledge in the game, thatÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s his problem, not mine. Heck, you could call it justice if you want to. YouÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢re practically supporting RWIT by saying that."

 

those were things you need to learn if you want to understand how to play runescape and skip (some of) the "grinding". there is loads to learn about rs.

 

 

 

"That ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬ÅusuallyÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâÃ

[Wachtwoord]

Rebdragon your points are pretty strong but you forgot something:

 

The fact something is an achievement is because it's hard to get and you can show it (off) to other players. I'll use the same example again, would you get 99 mining, rares, etc. if this wasn't multiplayer? I don't think so. The fact you can show it to other people, the fact your one of the few who has it makes it an achievement. As I said I like to compare it PC, combat levels are (hardly) respected anymore, just because you now have the possibility already makes it less respected thus less of an achievement.

 

I mean; if you trained all your combat from the scratch with a rune scimmitar only, you indeed have done something unique. But everyone else would think it's foolish to do it that way. What would you think of a 110+ training with a rune scimitar (in members)? Pretty stupid, but the first maxed out trained like that -kinda-. Back then it was an achievement because it was the only way, now it'd be considered foolish and time wasting.

 

 

 

The same goes for Real Word trading. The fact that's possible to earn something like 99 con, rares, etc. very easily will make it way less respected thus it takes most of the achievement away.

 

 

 

Maybe your one of the people who doesnÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢t care about how others think of their achievements, but I think your one of the few? (Just look at all the people wearing achievements cape everywhere, on a lot of those places it's totally unnecessary besides the showing off factor.)

[Ltje]

A new system of legal gold trading would reduce macros, not effect the economy, and raise commonly macroed items prices back close to their original.

 

Ehhh?

 

 

 

How would allowing RWIT reduce macroing? I could only see it increasing. I know that on the day Jagex officially allows RWIT, I'd sell my santa and get some bots. As well as some of my friends would. I'm quitted anyway, so if I can make a bit of money with it, why not?

 

I've said this in the orginal article of Duke, and his response was that it is possible now already. And yes, I know that. But I believe that Jagex is quite good at banning RWIT, and not so good at banning macroes. Proxy's FTW anyway.

 

 

 

But actually, I'm a quite honest player normally, so I think that they only should allow RWIT if they can make it MUCH harder to macro. To prevent players like me to start macroing.

 

 

 

 

I've heard it said that perhaps Jagex should allow people to trade items in the real world.

 

 

For all the people interested: This is the article he is talking about.

 

If Ltje is correct in that The Editor spent half of this article elaborating his response to the RuneHead article - it is usually good practice to reference or link to it so readers can read both arguments. Example:

 

 

 

I've heard it said that perhaps Jagex should allow people to trade items in the real world (1).

 

 

 

(1) Real World Item Trading: The Crack Down

 

 

 

I agree. And I don't know for certain if it was a response to that article. But seeing the reaction, and the topic of the times, I think it was a pretty accurate guess. :P

[whackster]

It was a strong article, especially the part about those who doesn't abide by the rules. The article looks disjointed maybe because the editor has his mind on other things... also taking hint from the recent "once a month tip.it times" poll.

 

 

 

The cheating and RWIT (or generally those breaking the big rules) vs those who play it the 'right' way is really a 'good vs evil' issue. As much as we would like the baddies to all be punished and put in ScapeRune jail forever and ever, they're here to stay. Like it or not. That's the truth. And that too has to be accepted, just like we have to accept the RuneScape rules. As long as there are good guys, there will be bad guys. And just like the RuneScape rules, if you don't like it, then go play another game. Problem is, you'll face the same issues in other games too. Life's like that.

 

If there's a 'right' way of doing things, someone will try doing it the 'wrong' way.

 

 

 

"So what then", you ask. There need to be a balance between 'good and evil'. Just as it is in real world. As long as the editor's yews are not crowded by bots, he'll be quite contented i think. As long as my mining guild is not crowded by bots, i'll be quite ok. As long as the list of high-scorers consists of less than 10% RWITraders, i'm ok with it. Keep the 'evil' under control, and we'll all be able to live happily ever after. Try to change the 'evil' people to see things our way, you say? Let's head down to the temple of Saradomin... tis not a job for mere mortals.

[Rebdragon]

Rebdragon,

 

 

 

you haven't yet had someone make a ton of your work meaningless, alot of time spent on something that just went down the trash up untill now, did you? then you have no idea what it feels like. if you do, then you know what i mean"

 

my bad, i thought it was implied that i was referring to real world...

 

i mean like make a big nice novel, or a painture or w/e that you were proud of, that took you tons of time and effort, and someone came and done/said somethig and destroyed what you have done/made it look meaningless in your own eyes.

 

Well, this is an opinion thing, so it's not like we can argue it :|.

 

 

 

I'm against kids using their parents money to buy Runescape stuff- that's just pathetic and immoral because it is gaining something they didn't earn. But... if an adult puts their hard-earned cash into the game, I see nothing wrong with it at all.

 

 

 

"I repeat: Way to stereotype. Maybe, just maybeÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâæ they play for fun too? "

 

setting goals and reaching them yourself is the fun. setting goals and reaching them 5 minutes later... sorry, i missed the "play" part... where does the "play" part stick in that sentence anyway? you played. ok. jagex agees with real world blah-blah. ok. you suddenly meet 10+ times more people with barrage. you are no longer an elite, one of the few.

 

Hate to break it to you, but there are something like fifteen thousand barragers in the game. Being a barrager already isn't enough to make you an elite :XD: .

 

 

 

"Your point being? If a RWITer wants to spend the money to get ahead, even if it means not gaining full knowledge in the game, thatÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢s his problem, not mine. Heck, you could call it justice if you want to. YouÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ã¢ââ¬Å¾Ã¢re practically supporting RWIT by saying that."

 

those were things you need to learn if you want to understand how to play runescape and skip (some of) the "grinding". there is loads to learn about rs.

 

And there's plenty of stuff to not learn. Trust me, there are plenty of people like me who don't care to learn about over 90% of the game.

 

 

 

Me, I'd probably buy gp from Jagex if it wasn't illegal (and I was still playing). I make $8 bucks an hour, and I have nothing better to spend it on, so I mineswall use that hoursworth of work to avoid spending a couple hours earning the 2mil that $8 bucks is worth.

 

 

 

"That ÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬Ãâ¦Ã¢â¬ÅusuallyÃÆââââ¬Å¡Ã¬ÃâÃ