The effect of autoers

[ddaanniiellh]

That wouldn't stop it, all it would do is lower the value that the autoer "program runners" would sell the gp for per mil.

 

 

 

I'm guessing you missed the bit where I said "undercut the gold farmers to the point where there is no way they can recover their bandwidth costs, let alone make a profit", so here it is again in big red letters:

 

 

 

undercut the gold farmers to the point where there is no way they can recover their bandwidth costs, let alone make a profit

 

 

 

Also, it would mess up the in-game money system, because now money is completely free flow and could be generated by Jagex 24/7...causing inflation.

 

Right... and people buying money from Jagex is different to people buying money from autoers and gold-farmers in what way? People already buy money. What difference does it make who they buy it from? What does inflation matter anyway? If today you're selling flax at 100gp and buying sharks at 1k, would it be any different if tomorrow you are selling flax at 200ea and buying sharks at 2k?

 

 

 

~Ddaanniiellh

 

At least you got that right.

 

 

 

And exactly how low would this be? =/....50 cents per mil?

 

 

 

The difference is that the value of the amount of money you have now would be worth waaaayyyy wayyy less. Same thing with US Dollars now, back then it was 5 cents for something like a ice cream, now like $2.00. would you prefer all your previously earned money to be lowered to 1/10 of its current value?

 

~Ddaanniiellh

[dwarfie76]

And exactly how low would this be? =/....50 cents per mil?

 

Who cares how low it is. If they do it, it gets rid of 99.9% of the autoers and all of the goldfarmers.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The difference is that the value of the amount of money you have now would be worth waaaayyyy wayyy less. Same thing with US Dollars now, back then it was 5 cents for something like a ice cream, now like $2.00. would you prefer all your previously earned money to be lowered to 1/10 of its current value?

 

Again... what does it matter what the percieved 'value' of a GP is? In case you missed it, it would happen to everyone. If the value of my GP goes down, so does yours. If it takes me 2000gp to buy a shark, and it costs you 2000gp to buy a shark, we're still on an even footing.

 

 

 

You still haven't addressed my question as to how it would be any different to the current situation where the money is simply purchased from other players instead of Jagex.

 

 

 

 

 

~Ddaanniiellh

 

Yes, we know... your name is beside your post, above your avatar... there is no reason to put it under your post as well.

[acenator]

And exactly how low would this be? =/....50 cents per mil?

 

Who cares how low it is. If they do it, it gets rid of 99.9% of the autoers and all of the goldfarmers.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The difference is that the value of the amount of money you have now would be worth waaaayyyy wayyy less. Same thing with US Dollars now, back then it was 5 cents for something like a ice cream, now like $2.00. would you prefer all your previously earned money to be lowered to 1/10 of its current value?

 

Again... what does it matter what the percieved 'value' of a GP is? In case you missed it, it would happen to everyone. If the value of my GP goes down, so does yours. If it takes me 2000gp to buy a shark, and it costs you 2000gp to buy a shark, we're still on an even footing.

 

 

 

You still haven't addressed my question as to how it would be any different to the current situation where the money is simply purchased from other players instead of Jagex.

 

Yes, but to "undermine" the autoers, gold would become extremely cheap and more people would be buying it due to the fact that it was official. Both of these facts would bring huge amounts of inflation into the game that would make all the accounts that don't buy gold practically obsolete due to the fact that their gp wouldn't get them as much as it used to (pretty much the only way they could do anything would be to get all their own supplies which is a huge pain).

[ddaanniiellh]

 

The difference is that the value of the amount of money you have now would be worth waaaayyyy wayyy less. Same thing with US Dollars now, back then it was 5 cents for something like a ice cream, now like $2.00. would you prefer all your previously earned money to be lowered to 1/10 of its current value?

 

Again... what does it matter what the percieved 'value' of a GP is? In case you missed it, it would happen to everyone. If the value of my GP goes down, so does yours. If it takes me 2000gp to buy a shark, and it costs you 2000gp to buy a shark, we're still on an even footing.

 

 

 

You still haven't addressed my question as to how it would be any different to the current situation where the money is simply purchased from other players instead of Jagex.

 

Its the fact that the price of items go up....while your money remain the same.

 

 

 

So its like you having $10k in real life (and you can, lets say, buy a car for that value).

 

However, one day the government decided it will give $1000 to anyone in exchange for 1 strand of hair...and so now everyone (except you) trade in most of their hair for money.

 

Now the cost of the car is $1,000,000, because of all the money in circulation, so your 10k is now basically worthless.

 

 

 

So the problem is that the money and items are not moving at equal rates.

 

~Ddaanniiellh (and yes, i post my name at the bottom of everything I write)

[dwarfie76]

Its the fact that the price of items go up....while your money remain the same.

 

Are you really that thick? If the price of items go up, then the amount that you sell items goes up at the same rate as the price that you buy items... so the net gain/loss is zero.

 

 

 

I did explain that in my original post to you but I imagine you were too busy practising writing your name to read it.

 

 

 

 

 

~Ddaanniiellh (and yes, i post my name at the bottom of everything I write)

 

Most of us grew out of that after kindergarten.

[dwarfie76]

Yes, but to "undermine" the autoers, gold would become extremely cheap

 

 

 

Cheaper than the autoers can sell it for at any rate. Remember they have to work for it, Jagex can simply fiddle a number in a database.

 

 

 

and more people would be buying it due to the fact that it was official.

 

Possibly... I can't say that anyone who would buy large amounts of gold would be the type to stick around and play the game for any real length of time. But yes, more people might be tempted to get that whip, full guthans etc.

 

 

 

Both of these facts would bring huge amounts of inflation into the game

 

Which would be completely offset by the fact that there are now no-longer large numbers of autoers and goldfarmers flooding the market with cut-price resources, making it far easier to make money by training skills.

[Nazgul740]

Look guys... jagex can't sell gold due to the fact that to undermine the gold farmers and autoers they would have to go really cheep... aka 1-2 dollers per mill... this means that more people would buy because of two reasons

 

 

 

A. its official no one would get banned

 

 

 

B. it would be alot cheaper

 

 

 

this means that more people would buy gold ... making the value of gold less in game... this would destabilize the whole market... sure goods would go up.. but people could just buy more gold whenever they wanted... prices would rise and rise and keep on rising...

 

 

 

also it would undermine the fact that people earn money through runecrafting and such... it would destabilize like 5 skills who rely on nature runes and hides being "x" amount... it would completely ruin the market...

[NightFiend]

I would like to point out an error in your set of data.

 

 

 

You can't take the total experience and divide it by the amount of experience per yew. Most of that experience had to have been gained by cutting normal trees, oaks, and willows because they wouldn't be able to cut yews until level 60. So your data isn't correct.

 

 

 

You actual calculation should look like:

 

 

 

Total experience - (exp for level 60 x # of autoers) / exp per yew = # of yews

 

 

 

double check yourself... i subtracted the exp gained from lvl 1 to lvl 60 from the amount of exp at level 73 then i did my calculations...

 

 

 

Sorry about that didn't realize you already subtracted before doing your calculation.

[Ran_Martin]

 

The difference is that the value of the amount of money you have now would be worth waaaayyyy wayyy less. Same thing with US Dollars now, back then it was 5 cents for something like a ice cream, now like $2.00. would you prefer all your previously earned money to be lowered to 1/10 of its current value?

 

Again... what does it matter what the percieved 'value' of a GP is? In case you missed it, it would happen to everyone. If the value of my GP goes down, so does yours. If it takes me 2000gp to buy a shark, and it costs you 2000gp to buy a shark, we're still on an even footing.

 

 

 

You still haven't addressed my question as to how it would be any different to the current situation where the money is simply purchased from other players instead of Jagex.

 

Its the fact that the price of items go up....while your money remain the same.N

 

So its like you having $10k in real life (and you can, ldets say, buy a car for that value).

 

However, one day the government decided it will give $1000 to anyone in exchange for 1 strand of hair...and so now everyone (except you) trade in most of their hair for money.

 

Now the cost of the car is $1,000,000, because of all the money in circulation, so your 10k is now basically worthless.

 

 

 

So the problem is that the money and items are not moving at equal rates.

 

~Ddaanniiellh (and yes, i post my name at the bottom of everything I write)

 

ddaanniiellh is talking the truth. if the moneys value is low, meaning things will cost much more = making selling gp useless. because everyone wants that santa, and if everyone buys money to get it, the worth of santas will go up due to the desire of getting it. and yes, as ddaanniiellh said it: Its called INFLATION, which means moneys value going down. that happened in germany after WW2, and a kg of ground meat was more than a house nowadays. and please, don't act like a jerk, dwarfie, because writing name under your post has nothing to do with kindergarten.

 

 

 

EDIT: and Inflation still doesn't stop macroers, because if the price of things go up, it means that flax and yews etc. will cost more = they get 'same' money out of it.

[Fredz]

With that kind of incentive there is now way jagex can stop autoers....

 

 

 

Sure there is. Jagex can sell RS gold themselves. All they need to do is undercut the gold farmers to the point where there is no way they can recover their bandwidth costs, let alone make a profit and there is no incentive to auto (except for the rare case of the player who simply wants to get high levels with minimal effort)

 

 

 

I would love if Jagex sold gold. But it's an unfair advantage to poor people.

 

 

 

If that happend...

 

Can you say Party Hats = instant 2.1b each?

[mchainmail]

With that kind of incentive there is now way jagex can stop autoers....

 

 

 

Sure there is. Jagex can sell RS gold themselves. All they need to do is undercut the gold farmers to the point where there is no way they can recover their bandwidth costs, let alone make a profit and there is no incentive to auto (except for the rare case of the player who simply wants to get high levels with minimal effort)

 

 

 

I would love if Jagex sold gold. But it's an unfair advantage to poor people.

 

 

 

If that happend...

 

Can you say Party Hats = instant 2.1b each?

 

 

 

so over a grand for a party hat? I don't think so.

[Platinum_Myr]

Its the fact that the price of items go up....while your money remain the same.

 

Are you really that thick? If the price of items go up, then the amount that you sell items goes up at the same rate as the price that you buy items... so the net gain/loss is zero.

 

 

 

I did explain that in my original post to you but I imagine you were too busy practising writing your name to read it.

 

 

 

 

 

~Ddaanniiellh (and yes, i post my name at the bottom of everything I write)

 

Most of us grew out of that after kindergarten.

 

 

 

Honestly, *I didn't want to quote all of your comments* you can't be more wrong. The difference between autoers getting gold from other players and selling it, is that they are RESELLING gold, not getting it from a magic twiddling of numbers in a database. Jagex CREATES gold, autoers RESELL gold. While I don't like Autoers, Jagex can't sell gold now because they didn't START by selling gold.

 

 

 

No one would play if everyone bought gold. If we could all spend 50c on 100 million, then we'd all do it, and then the price of everything would be so high, that people would stop trading in gold. And autoers would find a way to obtain "non-gold" gold substitutes.

 

 

 

Autoers will always be a problem, and they are in every game. The economy would restablize around a non-gold object, such as a resource or a rare. You wouldn't be able to buy things without trading items, because people wouldn't want to deal in gold, since everyone has 2.1bil.

 

 

 

Basically, the difference between autoers, is they RESELL gold which is gotten from the high-alching phenomenon, to other players for cash. They make resources others want cheap, so they buy, then the autoers resell to players who buy resources for money.

 

 

 

If jagex sold gold, they would HAVE to create it, not get it from players, and therefore they aren't reselling, they are inflating. The autoers are changing prices of items, but they AREN'T creating gold (all but the high-alching autoers, that is)

[dwarfie76]

You're seriously all that stupid?

 

 

 

You can't see that Jagex twiddling a number in a database to create some new gold is no different from an autoer running a computer program to harvest a couple of thousand yew logs overnight and flood those onto the market?

 

 

 

Fine... then don't complain about the autoers. They're obviously smarter than you.

[brave]

Why is everyone ruled by the mighty round gold pixel thing?

 

 

 

The effect of Jagex selling gold would have no effect on people like me I get all my own resources to make items to level skills. The results of which I either use (eg. potions, arrows, etc), alch (initially low, now high) or sell to shops if alching is not worth it. In fact I treat gp as simply yet another resource to gather to level a skill (construction). Until construction came out I never really bothered about gold. I very rarely trade and even then only in small numbers if I spot someone wanting something I have a lot of. When I do trade I am not too worried about how much gold I get, so long as I consider it a suitable amount. in fact in a lot of cases I just give the stuff away

 

 

 

Personally if (and its a big if) Jagex decided to sell gold to undercut the autoers/gold farmers to remove them from the game, I would let out a great big cheer as I could then gather my resources without fighting autoers for them. This would greatly improve my personal enjoyment of the game as I am fed up with having to compete with the likes of 20 autoers around the yews near the crafting guild (and other places).

[ddaanniiellh]

You're seriously all that stupid?

 

 

 

You can't see that Jagex twiddling a number in a database to create some new gold is no different from an autoer running a computer program to harvest a couple of thousand yew logs overnight and flood those onto the market?

 

 

 

Fine... then don't complain about the autoers. They're obviously smarter than you.

 

 

 

You still don't get it -.-

 

 

 

Jagex would be CREATING gold then, INFLATING the money value and economy.

 

 

 

Autoers, COLLECT items in exhange for gold that ALREADY EXISTS, therefore, not effecting the value of each piece of gold.

 

 

 

~Ddaanniiellh

[Dalcyte]

yes, impressive and scary numbers, but you're data is missing something.

 

 

 

The amount of accounts that gets banned.

 

 

 

Everyone looks at this raw data and numbers and thinks "why isn't jagex doing something?" and they are.

 

 

 

If the millions of yew logs were entering the economy constantly, we'd have 5gp yew logs, but there aren't, because these accounts are getting removed, so they thus can't sell.

 

 

 

It's huge, but a lot of is taken out by bannings.

[Nazgul740]

yes, impressive and scary numbers, but you're data is missing something.

 

 

 

The amount of accounts that gets banned.

 

 

 

Everyone looks at this raw data and numbers and thinks "why isn't jagex doing something?" and they are.

 

 

 

If the millions of yew logs were entering the economy constantly, we'd have 5gp yew logs, but there aren't, because these accounts are getting removed, so they thus can't sell.

 

 

 

It's huge, but a lot of is taken out by bannings.

 

 

 

 

 

true... but jagex let this whole group of autoers get 400+ people with the same type name and gave them enough time to get 82 wc... which even if autoed does take some time

[woopidoo2]

If only Jagex knew about these 480 accounts... Or has someone told it yet?

[mememe513]

Good facts, but other than that, think of all the other "base names". There must be over a hundred, so try multiplying all those facts by 100...

 

Also, as stated by other players, the money made is only a money transfer from player ~> Macroer, not bringing in new money

 

 

 

Off-topic: I wonder what Jagex does with the frozen logs?

[Nazgul740]

If only Jagex knew about these 480 accounts... Or has someone told it yet?

 

 

 

Well, I reported various names... then when i got sick of reporting the same name with just different numbers i looked them up... I'm sure im not the only one reporting autoers so jagex probably looks up all base names with just numbers added on the end...

[meili]

Yeah I get what people are saying and I agree with most. More than the "global" or Runescape-wide effect though, it has an effect on players on the individual level.

 

 

 

I mean here I am and many other legit players getting crowded out of wc because of tons and tons of autoers. It's just so annoying. *pouts* I like wc and I'd normally do it more but the autoers make it uncool now. :(

[dolomite129]

Yes, I have given up on F2P woodcutting as well. Even south of Falador (2 yew trees there, good spot to cut) has a few autoers. :( So I've gone an powermined in Al Kharid and all is well. :P But seriously, Jagex is trying their best to deal with autoers, and we can only hope that something will be done about them.

[tintin113]

I have to say, I think that Jagex are cracking down on autoers a lot more nowadays, and I have evidence for it.

 

 

 

The main thing that autoers do - other than mine rune ess - is cut down yew trees. Everyone knows that supply and demand affects the price of things - when there is more supply, prices go down, when there is more demand, prices go up.

 

 

 

The prices of yew logs in the last few months has shot up from 300, to 360gp per log. This is a 20% rise in price within a few months.

 

 

 

Therefore, the supply in yews has gone down a lot, and seeing that autoers mainly feed this economy, it means that there are now less autoers than there were before.

 

 

 

So, good work Jagex! :thumbsup:

[dwarfie76]

It's dolomite, baby!

 

Dark matter, a pound of which weighs over ten thousand pounds.

 

 

 

lolwut?

 

 

 

Dolomite is calcium magnesium carbonate... it's actually white to light pink in colour and a pound of it weights around about one pound.