Is God real post your thoughts!

[Lateralus]

God is real. I don't think God is real, I am sure. Say w/e you want about it, say that I am a fool for believing in a religion...But I don't consider my self having a religion, I have fate. Let's take our lovely planet for my next example: The inclination of the earth is 23,27 degrees...science (or whats left of it) proved that if we were at 23,26 we would burn and if we were at 23,28 we would freeze. Your so called big-bang could not have been so precise, its like taking a toothbrush and paint and scrub the brush on your fingers to try making a painting that will be detailled.

 

Why ppl who believe in God and follows the bible are so blessed, while ppl who are atheist often find their life "plain"?

 

 

 

Why do I see a lot of ppl saying their life is empty and are trying to search for the answer to their problems or think that "The Secret" (a book and a dvd about getting what you want in life) will change their lives forever while ppl who believes in God and the bible and are following those say they fell blessed, they know God is acting in their lives?

 

 

 

They're nice arguments if being right is the same thing as being happier and anthropocentric. The big bang didn't happen with humans in mind so it wasn't precise at all, it was aimless (perhaps I should say it was much more likely to be aimless than directed). We just got lucky that the Earth is what and how it is; and what it is is a planet that supports life some of the time on some of its surface.

 

 

 

I'm perfectly willing to believe religious people are happier. I haven't seen any studies about it, but I'm not going to say it's am impossibility. How happy someone is has nothing to do with how right their (unverifiable) beliefs are.

[Lenticular_J]

 

By the way, Agunimon. Take your stupid somewhere else. We really don't like it.

 

 

 

ooh, what are you going to do, type at me? From behind your little computer desk? You're not tough on the internet.

 

Yep. I appear tough, you appear ignorant, internet keeps on flowin'.

 

 

 

As to Lateralus. I don't believe the whole "we just got lucky", as the probability of our world being created as good as it is for us, and us coming about when we did, and evolving as fast we did, well, to give you logic, it isn't particularly probable. I wonder if there've ever been simulations over that.

 

 

 

Yes, it doesn't matter your beliefs. You'll just be happy in different ways - whether your beliefs are currently verifiable or not.

[mmmcannibalism]

actually considering the size of the universe the odds of intelligent life forming somewhere is pretty good, we just happen to be human and not lizard like or whatever else.

 

 

 

Im sure a study on if religious people are happier has been made, but does it really matter if it makes you happier? Im sure plenty of people would rather understand more science at the cost of a little bliss.

[Sly_Wizard]

I'm to this thread what a fly is to a gingko bilobo.

 

 

 

You're assuming I actually believe the Big Bang is the be-all-and-end-all of explaining the universe's origin. I don't.

 

 

 

The beauty of science is that it is continuous. We could work out what started the universe, but that would lead to another question, "What was before the Big Bang?". Religion is too absolute - there is God, then there is a world, then He made life. No one seems to think "Well, what made God?".

 

 

 

Much as the theist argument goes "Big Bang? You can't make something out of nothing" - and they're right to say that because of the laws of conservation of mass - I look at religion and think "God? He can't have appeared from nowhere".

 

 

 

With science, there is a method to answering that question. Religion seems to conveniently brush the question to one side and say, "Don't ask it again, or you'll be sentenced to eternal damnation in Hell!".

 

 

 

100% incorrect. Why does God himself need a creator? No religion that I'm aware of-- Much less Christianity-- Treats God as a materialistic being, but rather an immaterial being and, last I checked, there is no law which states that an immaterial being is subject to the laws of the material universe. In other words, to assume that God must be privy to the same laws as you or I are is fallacious. If people seem to "brush the question aside", it's because it's a nonsensical question.

 

 

 

...Oh, and you're making the false assumption that God appeared out of nowhere, or even had a beginning, when Christian doctrine states otherwise. Juuust saying.

[Cup Lion]

[hide=Quote]

God is real. I don't think God is real, I am sure. Say w/e you want about it, say that I am a fool for believing in a religion...But I don't consider my self having a religion, I have fate. Let's take our lovely planet for my next example: The inclination of the earth is 23,27 degrees...science (or whats left of it) proved that if we were at 23,26 we would burn and if we were at 23,28 we would freeze. Your so called big-bang could not have been so precise, its like taking a toothbrush and paint and scrub the brush on your fingers to try making a painting that will be detailled.

 

 

 

I dont think god is real, however I dont think we will ever know how this earth was made so I slightly agree. I think.

 

 

 

Why ppl who believe in God and follows the bible are so blessed, while ppl who are atheist often find their life "plain"?

 

 

 

I agree that the church brings families together, but it separates everyone else from you. Also I'm an atheist and my life is much more wild and crazier than a little "o bibel dusnt say its rihgt" bible thumper.

 

 

 

Why do I see a lot of ppl saying their life is empty and are trying to search for the answer to their problems or think that "The Secret" (a book and a dvd about getting what you want in life) will change their lives forever while ppl who believes in God and the bible and are following those say they fell blessed, they know God is acting in their lives?

 

God is not in your life, lol, who told you that?

 

 

 

Why my neighbor (and close friend) was diagnozed with lungs cancer and was said to have only 2 months left to live and then those 2 months became 4 months and those became 4 years and so on (he is still alive) All the cancerous tissues have disapered and he has the pulmonary capacity of a 30 yrs old guy (he his 70). The doctors could not explain this and they were 100% sure my neighbor had cancer at the first place and the x-ray showed it. My neighbor happens to believe in god the bible, etc... Why is he still alive while doctors told him 4 years ago you will have 2 months to live when God is not real and is a myth....why?

 

 

 

People who don't believe in god DO survive just as much, the bible thumpers however dont care and only report the christians who survive "to raese moer money fur the church ppl will go heer more ololol"

 

 

 

Call me crazy, call me stupid, call me a pawn in a plan that we have no idea it is happening. I know God is real.

 

 

 

Yes, and I believe Candlejack is real. Damn crazy peo

[/hide]

 

While reading through your argument, I was like, "Hmm, interesting." And then, that all went away since you decided to be a smartass with your typing. =D>

[Lenticular_J]

Might want to fix your quotes and stuff, chap.

[Lateralus]

As to Lateralus. I don't believe the whole "we just got lucky", as the probability of our world being created as good as it is for us, and us coming about when we did, and evolving as fast we did, well, to give you logic, it isn't particularly probable. I wonder if there've ever been simulations over that.

 

 

 

With an estimated 10^24 stars in the universe and an average of 3 planets per star and billions of billions of years it was bound to happen somewhere, and probability is a tricky business. It's not a perfect example, but I know someone who hit a straight flush on one of the first hands of Texas Hold 'Em they ever played (odds are 1/79,122). Again, I don't think you can view these things anthropocentrically. This planet was not created good for us, we ended up being adapted to it. While the planet may support life, it's certainly not the best it could conceivably be, is it? Some places are far too hot, some far too cold, not to mention the floods, earthquakes and other natural disasters.

[Greatsilverwyrm]

Not to mention that just because something is improbable doesn't mean it won't happen.

[Baldur]

I agree that the church brings families together, but it separates everyone else from you. Also I'm an atheist and my life is much more wild and crazier than a little "o bibel dusnt say its rihgt" bible thumper.

 

 

 

religion tears ppl lives apart, faith reunites them.

 

 

 

Also. if you think churches raise money for their own personal greed you are right for some churches but not all of them. And I know that because I have worked in 5 churches (not saying it is a lot). They raise money for helping the poor, making food and clothes banks, sending money to missionaries around the globe, helping other churches. I know about churches that are classed under "pentecostal" <- part of protestantism. For catholic churches i don't and won't care

[Da_Latios]

As to Lateralus. I don't believe the whole "we just got lucky", as the probability of our world being created as good as it is for us, and us coming about when we did, and evolving as fast we did, well, to give you logic, it isn't particularly probable. I wonder if there've ever been simulations over that.

 

 

 

With an estimated 10^24 stars in the universe and an average of 3 planets per star and billions of billions of years it was bound to happen somewhere, and probability is a tricky business. It's not a perfect example, but I know someone who hit a straight flush on one of the first hands of Texas Hold 'Em they ever played (odds are 1/79,122). Again, I don't think you can view these things anthropocentrically. This planet was not created good for us, we ended up being adapted to it. While the planet may support life, it's certainly not the best it could conceivably be, is it? Some places are far too hot, some far too cold, not to mention the floods, earthquakes and other natural disasters.

 

Couldn't agree more. Well, I could... but that would spoil the whole post.

[Furah]

I agree that the church brings families together, but it separates everyone else from you. Also I'm an atheist and my life is much more wild and crazier than a little "o bibel dusnt say its rihgt" bible thumper.

 

 

 

religion tears ppl lives apart, faith reunites them.

 

 

 

Also. if you think churches raise money for their own personal greed you are right for some churches but not all of them. And I know that because I have worked in 5 churches (not saying it is a lot). They raise money for helping the poor, making food and clothes banks, sending money to missionaries around the globe, helping other churches. I know about churches that are classed under "pentecostal" <- part of protestantism. For catholic churches i don't and won't care

 

 

 

yeah I agree, nobody in my church makes any money from it (apart from the senior pastors, I think) They also have people volunteering to do everything. With the money they have been raising for Mosambique they used it for materials to build a church. That way the people over there learnt how to build a house (some people went from our church to help them) so now they can go and build other places, with their newly learnt skill (which is a far better thing for them than just getting money to buy things with :))

[Lenticular_J]

Not to mention that just because something is improbable doesn't mean it won't happen.

 

Huh, so you're saying that because of something being improbable doesn't mean it doesn't exist? What a leap of faith.

 

 

 

With an estimated 10^24 stars in the universe and an average of 3 planets per star and billions of billions of years it was bound to happen somewhere, and probability is a tricky business. It's not a perfect example, but I know someone who hit a straight flush on one of the first hands of Texas Hold 'Em they ever played (odds are 1/79,122). Again, I don't think you can view these things anthropocentrically. This planet was not created good for us, we ended up being adapted to it. While the planet may support life, it's certainly not the best it could conceivably be, is it? Some places are far too hot, some far too cold, not to mention the floods, earthquakes and other natural disasters.

 

Well, it was a bit of a bad idea to try and bring logic into a debate over faith - something I spoke of before. And not oly because it just doesn't work, but because I'm not good at it :P

[user1991]

Not to mention that just because something is improbable doesn't mean it won't happen.

 

Huh, so you're saying that because of something being improbable doesn't mean it doesn't exist? What a leap of faith.

 

 

 

With an estimated 10^24 stars in the universe and an average of 3 planets per star and billions of billions of years it was bound to happen somewhere, and probability is a tricky business. It's not a perfect example, but I know someone who hit a straight flush on one of the first hands of Texas Hold 'Em they ever played (odds are 1/79,122). Again, I don't think you can view these things anthropocentrically. This planet was not created good for us, we ended up being adapted to it. While the planet may support life, it's certainly not the best it could conceivably be, is it? Some places are far too hot, some far too cold, not to mention the floods, earthquakes and other natural disasters.

 

Well, it was a bit of a bad idea to try and bring logic into a debate over faith - something I spoke of before. And not oly because it just doesn't work, but because I'm not good at it :P

 

 

 

Here's a question,

 

 

 

Which is more vital in your life - faith or logic?

[Lenticular_J]

Depends on the situation. They're completely different things, and you don't have to have a one or the other attitude.

[JeremyM]

God is real. I don't think God is real, I am sure. Say w/e you want about it, say that I am a fool for believing in a religion...But I don't consider my self having a religion, I have fate. Let's take our lovely planet for my next example: The inclination of the earth is 23,27 degrees...science (or whats left of it) proved that if we were at 23,26 we would burn and if we were at 23,28 we would freeze. Your so called big-bang could not have been so precise, its like taking a toothbrush and paint and scrub the brush on your fingers to try making a painting that will be detailled.

 

Why ppl who believe in God and follows the bible are so blessed, while ppl who are atheist often find their life "plain"?

 

 

 

Why do I see a lot of ppl saying their life is empty and are trying to search for the answer to their problems or think that "The Secret" (a book and a dvd about getting what you want in life) will change their lives forever while ppl who believes in God and the bible and are following those say they fell blessed, they know God is acting in their lives?

 

 

 

Why my neighbor (and close friend) was diagnozed with lungs cancer and was said to have only 2 months left to live and then those 2 months became 4 months and those became 4 years and so on (he is still alive) All the cancerous tissues have disapered and he has the pulmonary capacity of a 30 yrs old guy (he his 70). The doctors could not explain this and they were 100% sure my neighbor had cancer at the first place and the x-ray showed it. My neighbor happens to believe in god the bible, etc... Why is he still alive while doctors told him 4 years ago you will have 2 months to live when God is not real and is a myth....why?

 

 

 

Call me crazy, call me stupid, call me a pawn in a plan that we have no idea it is happening. I know God is real.

 

 

 

im happy to hear about your neighbour, but not everyone is as lucky as him. 10 days ago a friend of mine died of brain cancer (at the age of 16 or 17), he was the nicest, most humorous and uplifting guy i've ever known at my age. he even made his own charity which has raised over $30,000.

 

 

 

in march my uncle died at the age of 44 from brain cancer too. i dont know if he sincerelly believed in god, but we all prayed for him (including myself, literally every night for 2 years).

 

 

 

im not saying that i dont believe in god, but now i think you cant use that as a reason god exists, cause why wouldnt god save my two loved ones too? well, who knows? maybe my uncle and friend already did what they needed to do on this earth?

[Zierro]

im not saying that i dont believe in god, but now i think you cant use that as a reason god exists, cause why wouldnt god save my two loved ones too? well, who knows? maybe my uncle and friend already did what they needed to do on this earth?

 

 

 

Maybe. It's a sad thing to hear that, but I'm one of those who believe that everything happens for a greater good. A whole system of 'cause and effect' which leads to the best possible world. That's what I believe.

 

 

 

PS: Bumping cause most of the current topics are boring ATM. :?

[Saru Inc]

I agree that the church brings families together, but it separates everyone else from you. Also I'm an atheist and my life is much more wild and crazier than a little "o bibel dusnt say its rihgt" bible thumper.

 

 

 

religion tears ppl lives apart, faith reunites them.

 

 

 

Also. if you think churches raise money for their own personal greed you are right for some churches but not all of them. And I know that because I have worked in 5 churches (not saying it is a lot). They raise money for helping the poor, making food and clothes banks, sending money to missionaries around the globe, helping other churches. I know about churches that are classed under "pentecostal" <- part of protestantism. For catholic churches i don't and won't care

 

 

 

yeah I agree, nobody in my church makes any money from it (apart from the senior pastors, I think) They also have people volunteering to do everything. With the money they have been raising for Mosambique they used it for materials to build a church. That way the people over there learnt how to build a house (some people went from our church to help them) so now they can go and build other places, with their newly learnt skill (which is a far better thing for them than just getting money to buy things with :))

 

 

 

Well yo guys do know that the average tithe is used to pay the Pastor's salary, and bills for the church. My chruch holds seperate tihhes along with the usual one if they're going on a mission's trip or saving to buy something.

 

 

 

 

 

Aww Jeremy I'm sorry :(( That's goota feel awful. Tbh, I don't think anyone knows why God chooses to take some people and not others, why an Atheist may live, and a Christian die if maybe they both had the same condition, maybe people know, but I don't. All I know, is God loves us, all of us, it doesn't matter if you're the most uhhh.. anti-god atheistic person in the world, God loves you, and tbh, that;s the only thing that;s kept me alive. Also, I find it strange why Atheists exist at all, I mean, if I thought no God existed, I'd at least pick a religion, so I could give my life meaning I'd imagine an Atheist's is empty. (No, I'm not trying to insult someone, sorry if you take it that way.)

 

 

 

 

 

Edit: TheTrueNoob, the thing is, many people use logic incorrectly, lemme give you some examples: (Note, you all may have seen these ones a lot, but Idk if you have or not so:)

 

 

 

Ray Charles is blind

 

Love is blind

 

God is love

 

Ray Charles is God.

 

 

 

 

 

Or

 

 

 

Harry Potter is a book

 

Books are good for you

 

Harry Potter is good for you

 

 

 

While those are basic examples, and I'm not saying Harry Potter is bad (though I don't like it) many people think about logic... uhhh... illogically.

 

 

 

And tbh, I think you can have both logic and faith at the same time, I do.

[Cup Lion]

I recently read in a book that our Milky Way galaxy contains some 100,000 million other stars, and that there are at least 100 million more galaxies like ours. If there are, lets say, 10 planets for each star, that comes to roughly 10^20 chances that we could have been created. At least, that is how I interpreted it. You could even say 10^100 if you wanted. Yet, in the early 1980s, Chandra Wickramasinghe (an astrophysicist in Wales) and Fred Hoyle (a well-known British astronomer) calculated that if humans were created by chance, and not designed by a higher being, we would have a one in 10^40,000 chance of being created. They did this by calculated the odds on whether random shuffling of amino acids could have produced life. Kind of an unimaginable number, if you ask me...

 

 

 

How would one explain that?

[Lenticular_J]

I just don't understand the most base form of (a Godless) evolution: How was the very first cell created? Did it just pop up out of nothing?

 

 

 

EDIT: Godless evolution.

[Skull]

I just don't understand the most base form of (a Godless) evolution: How was the very first cell created? Did it just pop up out of nothing?

 

 

 

EDIT: Godless evolution.

 

I believe it's some mixture of chemicals that were present a few billion years ago or whatever and high levels of energy (lightning strike?) causing the first life form. I'm not sure of any specifics but I think some scientist managed to re-create it. This is off the top of my head though, and I learned about it years ago so I could be totally wrong. I'll look it up.

[Lenticular_J]

Ah, okay. I figured there was a hypothesis or something for it, but I wasn't sure, so I thought, "Maybe Darwin just said [bleep] that, I won't go that far."

 

 

 

I'll look it up, too.

[Cup Lion]

Kind of interesting to think about it though. Even if it was just a bunch of chemicals that were introduced to energy, how did a human form to have such insight and a conscience, among other things.

[Intriguing]

I've never even learnt about Evolution, let alone the specifics of the Big Bang. I spent grades 1 - 10 being home-schooled with a Christian education organization, and they didn't touch the subject. I probably could have researched it a bit, but Biology isn't something that really interests me..

[Cup Lion]

When I was younger, the Big Bang Theory was mentioned a lot. A power outage happened right next to my house and it made a huge bang, so I always thought that is what people meant by the Big Bang. I remember going around whenever it was mentioned, saying, "I remember when that happened." Quite funny, to be honest.

 

 

 

A little Off-Topic, but oh well.

[venomai]

I just don't understand the most base form of (a Godless) evolution: How was the very first cell created? Did it just pop up out of nothing?

 

The Origin of Life Made Easy

 

 

 

The series begins with the history of the universe. Highly recommended!

 

 

 

 

If there are, lets say, 10 planets for each star, that comes to roughly 10^20 chances that we could have been created. At least, that is how I interpreted it. You could even say 10^100 if you wanted. Yet, in the early 1980s, Chandra Wickramasinghe (an astrophysicist in Wales) and Fred Hoyle (a well-known British astronomer) calculated that if humans were created by chance, and not designed by a higher being, we would have a one in 10^40,000 chance of being created. They did this by calculated the odds on whether random shuffling of amino acids could have produced life. Kind of an unimaginable number, if you ask me...

 

 

 

How would one explain that?

 

This is explained by a number of logical errors and a general misunderstanding of evolution.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoyle%27s_Fallacy

 

 

 

This is an article I often link to that explains alien life for laypeople. It's a little outdated, and purely speculative, but it's an interesting read nevertheless.

 

http://www.krysstal.com/extrlife.html

 

 

 

You might also be interested in reading about the Drake Equation.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drake_equation

 

 

 

"Frank Drake's own current solution to the Drake Equation estimates 10,000 communicative civilizations in the Milky Way. Dr. Drake, who serves on the SETI League's advisory board, has personally endorsed SETI's planned all-sky survey."

 

From: http://www.setileague.org/general/drake.htm

 

 

 

The results of the equation largely depend on the accuracy of the given variables. Here is a calculator that you can fool with:

 

http://www.activemind.com/Mysterious/To ... ation.html