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The Game of Thrones TV series - Season 4

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pretty great finale. idk about the final daenerys scene but [bleep]ed if i don't know how they could've done it better.

It's just a sort of condensed version of everything bad about her. She pretty much has everything handed to her, the world worships the ground she walks on, and she's more than a little smug about it. She's perfect and anyone that disagrees will have to answer to her dragons.

 

I admit I'm not much of a fan of her in the books (to the point of skipping her chapters when I re-read them), but at least she has some pretty reasonable doubts and insecurities behind all of it. Her actress seems to have ignored those in favor of the "[bleep], I'm the mother of dragons" approach.

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pretty great finale. idk about the final daenerys scene but [bleep]ed if i don't know how they could've done it better.

It's just a sort of condensed version of everything bad about her. She pretty much has everything handed to her, the world worships the ground she walks on, and she's more than a little smug about it. She's perfect and anyone that disagrees will have to answer to her dragons.

 

I admit I'm not much of a fan of her in the books (to the point of skipping her chapters when I re-read them), but at least she has some pretty reasonable doubts and insecurities behind all of it. Her actress seems to have ignored those in favor of the "[bleep], I'm the mother of dragons" approach.

 

Don't think it's Emilia Clarke at fault here (though she's probably one of the weak spots in the cast)...rather it's become very apparent that D&D have the biggest boner on Dany (And a profound hate of Stannis...)

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i dunno im okay w/all that, i just felt it kinda paled in comparison to the finales of previous seasons.

 

i feel that they're playing up the v. high-fantasy aspects of daenerys' storyline to make the inevitable fall that much more shocking. the audience not being able to completely read a character's thoughts and motivations like they can in a book necessitates a different approach, and i think its working for the most part.

 

fwiw i don't think she's meant to be completely likable

 

e - daenerys seems to be pretty much everybody's least favourite character in the book so im glad theyre trying to change it up, unintentionally or not


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I don't mind dany. I admit her story-line isn't as intriguing but she doesn't annoy me...


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Don't think it's Emilia Clarke at fault here (though she's probably one of the weak spots in the cast)...rather it's become very apparent that D&D have the biggest boner on Dany (And a profound hate of Stannis...)

Feel free to take it with a grain of salt, I'll admit that I just don't like the character. :razz:

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TV has the disadvantage of not having any convenient means of an internal dialogue. They need a supporting character to be a sounding board against. Since they killed off the ones that could've been there for her (her handmaidens) there aren't a lot of options left. It has to be someone she'd be near in private, where it'd make sense for her character to shed what she thinks is the noble attitude she's supposed to have as the 'rightful heir' to the Seven Kingdoms. Selmy is really the only one that fits the bill for that, or maybe her new hand maiden she saved from the Slavers.

 

[spoiler=book stuff]Once she comes into all the problems she faces in Yunkai and the selfless (though misguided) decisions she makes there, I feel like it'll be easier to connect and sympathize with her.

 

 

Likewise, Stannis has had a lot of his personal discussions with other characters that made him more sympathetic - or at least, easier to understand why he's such a jerk.

 

[spoiler=bookstuff]Hopefully when he comes to the aid of the Wall and he is forced out of Melisandre's grip a bit we'll see the "good" side of doing his duty at any cost.

 


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Hmm so I'm not the only one who thinks Dany is a little too smug, and too one-dimensional right now. Although I didn't think she was one-dimensional in season 1 and 2, because we got to see more of her thoughts/feelings than now. What she he did in Astapor was impressive, but I was surprised she wanted to take Yunkai too. I didn't realize she was on some sort of crusade to free all the slaves of the world. Yunkai doesn't have many soldiers, so I don't see the point in taking it. Maybe they have gold/treasure, I don't know. But what she's got now is a bunch of ordinary slaves, a few could be trained for combat, but the rest are kinda useless. Although now that I think about it, maybe not. The slaves could stay in Yunkai, while her troops eat/rest, prepare ships, and if things go wrong she can return to yunkai, kind of like a homestead.


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The finale didn't really do much for me besides confirm what happened to Theon and set up an easy transition into season 4.


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TV has the disadvantage of not having any convenient means of an internal dialogue. They need a supporting character to be a sounding board against. Since they killed off the ones that could've been there for her (her handmaidens) there aren't a lot of options left. It has to be someone she'd be near in private, where it'd make sense for her character to shed what she thinks is the noble attitude she's supposed to have as the 'rightful heir' to the Seven Kingdoms. Selmy is really the only one that fits the bill for that, or maybe her new hand maiden she saved from the Slavers.

 

[spoiler=book stuff]Once she comes into all the problems she faces in Yunkai and the selfless (though misguided) decisions she makes there, I feel like it'll be easier to connect and sympathize with her.

 

 

Likewise, Stannis has had a lot of his personal discussions with other characters that made him more sympathetic - or at least, easier to understand why he's such a jerk.

 

[spoiler=bookstuff]Hopefully when he comes to the aid of the Wall and he is forced out of Melisandre's grip a bit we'll see the "good" side of doing his duty at any cost.

 

 

You're right, it's not unredeemable but I doubt they will put too much work into fixing them. Their personal view of the character gets in the way here (Well, maybe not for Dany, but definitely for Stannis). In the series, he is nothing more than a pawn to Melisandre. And look at the Gendry issue - in the series, there isn't even as much as a hint of him thinking about it, or resenting it.

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They had to give Gendry those conflicts, if you think of who he was replacing from the books. He's not a child, but a man. Moreover, a man recently betrayed by people he was ready to embrace as friends.

 

I really don't think their personal views are warping the characters. Stannis was always showcased as a ruthless, uncompromising man who would latch onto what was right until it killed him. His defense of the wall is where he will shine. Likewise with Dany. She's a young woman, can't bear children, wants to protect everyone with her lofty idealism - same as the book.

 

Are they perfect carbon copy representations of what we see in Martin's characters, compared to Weiss'? Not exactly. But the differences in them seem more likely to be victims of television storytelling than writers who don't understand the source material.

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Dany can't bear children? In the show it was made to seem like it was just the ritual that killed her child...


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I'm almost certain Miri told her she'd never bear children again in the book and the show.


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I'm almost certain Miri told her she'd never bear children again in the book and the show.

 

She may well have. Must have missed it...


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I'm almost certain Miri told her she'd never bear children again in the book and the show.

 

 

Until the sun rises in the west and sets in the east, that is . . . I recently realized that Quentyn Martell's part of Dance might not have been useless after all.

 

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her whole prophecy schtick was about drogo returning to life, not her having a child. "when she has a child" was part of her saying when drogo would return in the book but not in the show. there's nothing one way or the other about whether she can have another child in the show, i'm pretty sure.


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I'm almost certain Miri told her she'd never bear children again in the book and the show.

 

 

Until the sun rises in the west and sets in the east, that is . . . I recently realized that Quentyn Martell's part of Dance might not have been useless after all.

 

 

[spoiler=Book spoilers]

Well, unless some Quentyn jerky is what can cure her infertility, I doubt he can "rise" to the occasion anymore.

 

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[spoiler=Book 5]Sun referring to his house/status/etc, rising in the east and setting in the west referring to his trek from Westeros (rising as part of Doran's grand plan) to Essos, and his death by clever-girl. Unless I'm wrong, you can read the rest of the prophecy in equally creative ways.

 

"When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east. When the seas go dry and mountains blow like leaves in the wind. When my womb quickens again and I bear a living child. Then you will return, my sun and stars, and not before."

 

 

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Thought some of you guys would love to hear this. I personally haven't read the books, but will hopefully get around to it once I graduate from my M.A.

 

There is swearing btw.

 

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Reacting impulsively and saying what's on your mind feels oh so good.. for a little, until you realize you just started WWIII.


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[spoiler=Book 5]Sun referring to his house/status/etc, rising in the east and setting in the west referring to his trek from Westeros (rising as part of Doran's grand plan) to Essos, and his death by clever-girl. Unless I'm wrong, you can read the rest of the prophecy in equally creative ways.

 

"When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east. When the seas go dry and mountains blow like leaves in the wind. When my womb quickens again and I bear a living child. Then you will return, my sun and stars, and not before."

 

 

 

However, Martin has destroyed quite a few fantasy tropes...and the "impossible prophecy" that everybody thinks just means "never" and still ends up happening is one of them....

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Reacting impulsively and saying what's on your mind feels oh so good.. for a little, until you realize you just started WWIII.


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I'm almost certain Miri told her she'd never bear children again in the book and the show.

 

 

Until the sun rises in the west and sets in the east, that is . . . I recently realized that Quentyn Martell's part of Dance might not have been useless after all.

 

 

Never considered that before, but I like it. New headcannon accepted.

 

 

 

My personal belief on Cersei's prophecy is that Jaime is the little brother who will ruin her and her Daughter, not Margery will be the queen who takes her place. At least if Dorne has anything to say about it.

 


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[hide]Doran Martell has been playing a very underhanded game to get revenge for Elia, though. Its unlikely he would abandon his plans to get revenge and instead choose to put Myrecella on the throne when he hasn't an army strong enough to face a united House Tyrell and House Lannister. Even if he did, that would mean the Lannisters - who Gregor was sworn to - would still be in power through Myrcella. With Arianne Martell unwed and Aegon returning to the Seven Kingdoms to begin his campaign, it's likely he'd wed her to him instead and join Dorne's forces with Aegon's. But Margaery's been used as a pawn to take down Cersei since the beginning of the books. They tried to force her on Robert, then on Renly when they thought he would win, then on her sons who she tried to erode the authority Cersei had over them. She has the love, adoration, and respect that Cersei never had. She's youthful and beautiful, whereas Cersei was just made as undesireable and unappealing as a woman could feel when she was forced to do her literal walk of shame. And then, there's the upcoming trial for both of them.

 

I still think Margery will be the one her little fortunetelling granny warned her of.

 

E: You could be spot on though with the Jamie call. Cersei was technically born first, which would make Jamie the 'little brother'. That's a good catch tbh. Especially since he refused to be her champion...Hmmm...[/hide]


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Reacting impulsively and saying what's on your mind feels oh so good.. for a little, until you realize you just started WWIII.


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Pretty sure most of the people here have watched season 3 lol. Use hide tags regardless


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"It's not a rest for me, it's a rest for the weights." - Dom Mazzetti

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