First the Wilderness Ditch, Now This?(May Someone Lock This)

[Dogman112018]

Well, as those who have checked my "Wilderness Ditch-Good, or Bad?"topic, you would know that I supported the Wilderness Ditch. But now, Jagex has made it so that it blocks out your password(or somewhat blocks it out). IS Jagex beginning to baby new players? If you weren't smart enough to not say your pass to one of those patented,"Jagex blocks out your pass-Look *******" scams, then you shouldn't be playing this game. Discuss what you think about it.

[One Too Far]

Yep, they now treat the community like babies. The problem is that the community consists of babies now. Stil hate the update. Had to change my password because of the update otherewise i could not talk normaly.

[Dogman112018]

Same here, My old password had "LIKE" in it, and every time I would say that, It would block it out. I got so annoyed at it that I switched it.

[Dalcyte]

...

 

 

 

why does this effect you at all. It's helping people, and it doesn't directly hurt you at all unless you scam. Why in the world is this a bad thing. Jagex doesn't cater to smart players only, and if you were running a million dollar company, maybe you'd see that part of the light as well.

 

 

 

Jagex is a company, thus they try to make the most money as possible. When people, regardless of intelligence, get hacked because of password scams, they quit. If they are A) A F2p player, then they will most likely quit and not become a member giving jagex money. If they are B) A p2p player, then they will quit and jagex will lose money.

 

 

 

Jagex HAS to appeal to all players, not just the ones that are smart enough to not try to say their pass, its as simple as that. The wilderness ditch one, i used the same arguement as before, but that one is different, because it directly effects you.

 

 

 

Why are you complaining about something that ONLY HELPS PEOPLE!!!

 

 

 

sorry..i'm just mad about this, people seem to be taking a lot of offence to it.

 

 

 

EDIT: And if you had to spend 3 seconds changing your pass, that you should do frequently anyway, its not the end of the world..really.

[Sly_Wizard]

I'm just going to copy and paste what I wrote elsewhere.

 

 

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

 

 

"You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink."

 

 

 

The problem isn't so much that Jagex is trying to protect it's players as much as it's fostering player idiocy. Jagex can't fix player stupidity; They can try, but it's impossible. By continuing to dish out updates which are, by internet standards, very babyish they only send the message to it's players that things such as common sense and accountability are a thing of the past. Players don't have to think; Jagex will do it for them :?

 

 

 

You never saw inane updates such as this on RSC because players were generally older, wiser and more accountable for their actions. While I can't speak for everyone, I can speak for a large majority. If you were scammed on RSC you took it as a learning lesson and worked your way back up. Nowadays if someone is scammed they head over to the RSOF and whine and complain to Jagex. If Jagex would simply say "We've given you the necessary tools to protect your own account, so use them!" then a lot of these problems would all but disappear as people would be forced to take better care of their account and items contained therein.

 

 

 

Sometimes the hard way is the only way people will learn. I can assure you that if someone is lured or scammed or whatever that they're less likely to be scammed in the future because they now know better. I saw the following example on the RSOF and I happened to like it:

 

 

 

In the real world people tell their children not to touch a hot stove as it will burn them. Often the child does it anyway and gets burned, ultimately learning his/her lesson. This is similar. Jagex had told people for years to not tell people their password (Don't touch the hot stove) and yet they do it anyway (Touch the hot stove); Ultimately, these people learned their lesson. What Jagex is doing now is telling them not to touch the stove and then grabbing their hand and preventing them from doing while they try anyway; People aren't going to learn and will continue to do what they want to do. Jagex is expending unecessary energy trying to protect people who don't want to protect themselves.

 

 

 

In closing, one doesn't need to be told that you don't say your password on Runescape; We know this. If you don't know this, then you shouldn't be playing Runescape, much less using the internet. It's the players responsibility to take care of his/her character and the items contained therein.

[unkn0wnwarrior]

I'm not sure why this should affect you... Care to explain? Who cares if they are catering to new players? Unless you have a password like dog or something, it shouldn't really matter.

[darkforaster]

I'm not sure why this should affect you... Care to explain? Who cares if they are catering to new players? Unless you have a password like dog or something, it shouldn't really matter.

 

 

 

Sometimes the hard way is the only way people will learn. I can assure you that if someone is lured or scammed or whatever that they're less likely to be scammed in the future because they now know better. I saw the following example on the RSOF and I happened to like it:

 

 

 

In the real world people tell their children not to touch a hot stove as it will burn them. Often the child does it anyway and gets burned, ultimately learning his/her lesson. This is similar. Jagex had told people for years to not tell people their password (Don't touch the hot stove) and yet they do it anyway (Touch the hot stove); Ultimately, these people learned their lesson. What Jagex is doing now is telling them not to touch the stove and then grabbing their hand and preventing them from doing while they try anyway; People aren't going to learn and will continue to do what they want to do. Jagex is expending unecessary energy trying to protect people who don't want to protect themselves.

 

 

 

If you read this person's post, then reread this part. Read it again, and think about it. Now think of the future consequences if they keep on catering to the new players like this.

 

 

 

If they don't learn and are stopped then nothing will get done. They need to learn.

[Iamdan]

I agree with sly wizard, and have written something similar in a reply to a topic about the wilderness ditch.

 

 

 

No matter how much Jagex babies them, idiots will always find better ways to be idiots. The only way they will develop common sense is if they are forced to.

[Toxicologist]

You do realise that some (I won't say a lot, though there may well be) idiots who get scammed and hacked gets bitter and start scamming/hacking themselves? Perhaps JAGeX is thinking along the lines of "Prevention is better than Cure", preventing people from getting hacked and preventing them from becoming scammers/hackers themselves.

 

 

 

Though I appreciate JAGeX helping their players, I do not think that they should waste their time on people like these. No matter how hard you try, an idiot would still be able to pick at your faults, and there is simply no way to please them. They would just whine and complain and whine. Those smart enough to not get scammed/hacked, or are wise enough to shrug it off and learn from their mistakes, would likely won't need these protection updates.

[Rock Hard]

 

Sometimes the hard way is the only way people will learn. I can assure you that if someone is lured or scammed or whatever that they're less likely to be scammed in the future because they now know better. I saw the following example on the RSOF and I happened to like it:

 

 

 

In the real world people tell their children not to touch a hot stove as it will burn them. Often the child does it anyway and gets burned, ultimately learning his/her lesson. This is similar. Jagex had told people for years to not tell people their password (Don't touch the hot stove) and yet they do it anyway (Touch the hot stove); Ultimately, these people learned their lesson. What Jagex is doing now is telling them not to touch the stove and then grabbing their hand and preventing them from doing while they try anyway; People aren't going to learn and will continue to do what they want to do. Jagex is expending unecessary energy trying to protect people who don't want to protect themselves.

 

 

 

If you read this person's post, then reread this part. Read it again, and think about it. Now think of the future consequences if they keep on catering to the new players like this.

 

 

 

If they don't learn and are stopped then nothing will get done. They need to learn.

 

 

 

The thing is, most of the time when kid's get hacked - Instead of learning from their mistakes, they go and play Guild Wars.

 

 

 

I can fully understand Jadex's motivation behind attempting to prevent password scams:

 

 

 

Hacking -> Quitting -> Less Profit.

 

 

 

As Toxicologist said, Prevention is better than cure.

 

 

 

I was having this debate with a RL friend yesterday actually. He was following the 'Remove all the safety labels, and let the problem sort itself out' train of thought. I just can't get over the opinion that preventing an issue from coming up entirely, and stopping people from getting hurt - Is a greater alternative than letting people learn from experience, with harmful [Possibly fatal] consequences along the way.

 

 

 

Now, we were talking about gun-crime, but I think the point still stands in RuneScape scamming.

 

 

 

- Gid.

[Gin_and_Tonic]

Pathetic how people rant about JAGeX making Runescape a better place.

 

 

 

Im sure if YOU did say your password in game and got scammed, you'd be ranting that they didn't block it...

[Lunar_Drifter]

I believe that it's not the specific rule that's causing all this hot debate; it's just the overall idea of it, among other updates. I haven't been playing for a while, but the two topics I hear most about right now are the Wilderness Ditch and now this.

 

 

 

The Wilderness Ditch is great in my opinion. It stops people from haplessly wander out into the wilderness, only to have a) their internet disconnect, B) their computer start to lag, or c) them get sidetracked (their fault on the last one). Those things have happened to all of us at one point in time, and it really irks me, to say the least. All this debate about how long it takes to jump over the ditch... (as said in another thread) "who takes 2 seconds to move the mouse!" People are seriously over exaggerating this thing. It cuts maybe 1-1.5 seconds out of your RCing or PKing.

 

 

 

Now as for the password blocking. As previously stated, blocking one's password is a really over protective thing to do. What if someone had a password like "iamsocool" or something. They wouldn't be able to say any of those words (if I'm correct). I know it's easy to change your password, don't get me wrong. But the point is, why block the password?! We as a community have gone over 6 years without our password being blocked. Why start now? I loved that great analogy that Sly Wizard quoted. This is just harboring the newer/unexperienced/idiotic players from what they would do and learn from. If JaGEx let them touch that hot stove, then they sure as heck wouldn't do it again, now would they? But constantly "holding their hand" causes them to grow dependent on JaGEx instead of their own common sense. Eventually, their common sense skills begin to diminish (albeit slowly). Their intelligent thinking may be decreased. "Oh.. is this a scam? Oh well!" Of course, these are a bit exaggerated. But nonetheless, something to this scale will happen if JaGEx continues to baby this community. We might as well be playing with JaGEx having a leash around our neck.

 

 

 

~Lunar

[trunksrs]

As much as I hate the idea of the passwords being blocked, I just thought of something.

 

 

 

If they undo this now, after everyone has already been told their password is blocked,could you imagine how easy it would be for scammers to get people to say their password.

[Freesia]

This password blocking update is already an update players have been waiting for.. literally 5 years already. Today they finally implemented it. Tbh, i'm amused over how players actually fall for the "Jagex blocks your pass, look ****" trick. it reflects their inability to think of future negative consequences over small actions.

[Dogman112018]

 

 

 

Im sure if YOU did say your password in game and got scammed, you'd be ranting that they didn't block it...

 

 

 

Uh...I might get really mad about it, but I wouldn't make the same mistake twice. It's just the whole "Hot Stove" analogy. If you do something that hurts you once, you won't do it again. And no, I wouldn't rant about doing something stupid that was entirely on my part...

[Bufoman]

hello Dogman. once again we find ourselves in agreement.

 

 

 

I feel strongly that the community has been going down hill over the years, players are getting younger and more immature. and now it would seem jagex has started babysiting them.

 

 

 

if this keeps up I may just quit this game, every year more and more of the good/ mature players leave and in their place I see immature children come and ask me over and over again things like "where is the neerest bank"

 

 

 

follow me please I reply. I then explain how to follow me... lets not get into my horror story about how some of these players are simply too young. if jagex insists on babysitting them then the older, more mature players will get sick of this game and go play something else. then all jagex has to call its costomer base are abunch of children at the mercy of their parrents for funds (or should I say parrents at the mercy of their children?).

 

 

 

Jagex if you are reading this I strongly advise you to stop holding these kids hands, let them learn from their mistakes and value your older players more. maby give us some decent updates that we would reely like, you know maby some extra bank space for every month played... even if it was just one I know us life long f2pers would love it.

 

 

 

this devalueing the older players of this game is a reely short sighted concept, when the kids get older they will simply play a diffrent game, this game has always gotten its players by word of mouth. it used to be " runescape has a great community with mature players" now its "runescape will hold your hand in a world full of bots and scammers" which would you rather be apart of?

[darkforaster]

 

The thing is, most of the time when kid's get hacked - Instead of learning from their mistakes, they go and play Guild Wars.

 

 

 

I can fully understand Jadex's motivation behind attempting to prevent password scams:

 

 

 

Hacking -> Quitting -> Less Profit.

 

 

 

As Toxicologist said, Prevention is better than cure.

 

 

 

I was having this debate with a RL friend yesterday actually. He was following the 'Remove all the safety labels, and let the problem sort itself out' train of thought. I just can't get over the opinion that preventing an issue from coming up entirely, and stopping people from getting hurt - Is a greater alternative than letting people learn from experience, with harmful [Possibly fatal] consequences along the way.

 

 

 

Now, we were talking about gun-crime, but I think the point still stands in RuneScape scamming.

 

 

 

- Gid.

 

 

 

If they can't take the loss of some pixels easily, then they shouldn't be playing the game anyway. In runescape, you have to learn the fact that you lose items. But you can always get those items back. i'm not saying they should drop thier entire bank on the floor, but I am saying they need to learn that sometimes they will lose items.

 

 

 

If jagex keeps on treating the younger less intelligent ones, every time they lose some items, it's going to appear on rants.

 

 

 

So the question here is: Do you want idiots to rule runescape? Because by disagreeing with this thread and idea, you are saying yes. For the community will get lazier and more idiotic. Surely those who is stupid enough to say thier password, doesn't really belong on a game like runescape, where a good long-term plan and goals are involved.

 

 

 

I agree with Bufoman's post above this one.

[baron8000]

This password blocking update is already an update players have been waiting for.. literally 5 years already. Today they finally implemented it.

 

 

 

And as always, people moan. Lets face it this update does nothing wrong to older players it certainly doesn't devalue them.

 

 

 

To the person who had to change their pass because it was a common word then you are an idiot for having such a common pass.

 

 

 

To Lunar drifter - say your pass was "iamsocool" you would be able to say "I" and "am" "so" and indeed "cool" just not "iamsocool" exactly as your pass is.

 

 

 

So it helps out the stupid, so what? What do you think laws in real life are for? To protect the weak, stupid or downright idiotic from people out to get them.

 

 

 

Also the burning stove analogy is flawed, a child will need to use a stove in later life; nobody will ever need to say their pass in game. A better analogy would be a "end of the world" button which Jagex is putting an impassable wall in front of - quite rightly in my view.

 

 

 

P.S. apologies for any half formed ideas in there, getting late where I am.

[PoorLepRecon]

Jagex is giving too much attention to the lower leveled players nowadays. They are babying them, so they don't lose the items they "worked" hard for *cough*begged for*cough*, but i see why Jagex is doing. The lower level players are the ones that they want to become members, and many players quit if they die, or get their account stolen. Jagex is doing this in the sole interest of business, though it only benefits the lower level players.

 

 

 

All of us higher leveled players, which is most since the updates just came out, have had to learn the hard way about scammers, hackers, and the Wildernerss. Yet now, new players don't get to learn that, making them more vulnerable to scams later on. It was in Jagex's best interest to help the new players, yet by doing that, they are also hurting them.

[HatshepsutLecter]

I actually think that this is a fantastic idea. I think that this should have been put into place a long time ago. I don't know why this wasn't in place since the game started. A lot of the other sites that I go to that have chat systems in place had filters for your password a long time ago. I don't think that it is babying the new players. I think that it is a good way to take a major scam risk off of the site for good. :)

[Teeg]

I also think that Sly's "hot stove" analogy is flawed. By telling the child not to touch the stove, you are not exonerated from any responsibility if the child then burns his/herself. I would begin to question your parenting techniques if you allowed a child too young to know any different, to be in the vicinity of a hot stove without supervision.

 

 

 

Would you, for example, tell a child not to drink a bottle of bleach, then leave the bottle where the child could reach it? I hope not! You would put it out of reach, where the child would not be tempted.

 

 

 

This, I believe, is what Jagex have done. Put the whole "password" thing out of reach. No temptation, no scamming, a safer world for all.

 

 

 

Teeg

[baron8000]

Jagex is giving too much attention to the lower leveled players nowadays.

 

 

 

Judging by your sig, account ,and assuming its your main I have news for you. You are not a high level player my friend, neither am I - I'd only count a 100+ combat or 70+ non combat player to be high levelled (or around there)

 

 

 

Kudos to teeg as well for pulling that analogy apart even more, I missed that area completely.

[King_Peter18]

As did I.

[Sly_Wizard]

Sometimes if people don't want to learn through words, then they have to learn through actions. There's no sense is trying to draw parallels between my example and an extreme case, as such could be done with any debatable topic. As the saying goes "What doesn't kill you will only make you stronger". There's a difference between learning the hard way and dying in real life; I'm sure you realize that.

 

 

 

Anyway, I don't think there isn't a single person alive who isn't the wiser today because of hard lessons learned in the past. It's an inevitable part of growth. Have you ever met someone who seems to have no common sense what-so-ever, only to later find out (s)he is that way because his/her parents protected him/her from everything? At some point in time, one has to let others make their own mistakes. For as long as people refuse to be accountable for their actions, Jagex will continue to dish out inane update after inane update instead of focusing it's efforts on things which the players can't control (Such as game content and auto'ers, though I personally have no problem with them).

 

 

 

The only thing which Jagex owes to it's players are updates for those who pay and a safeguard against hacking (Something outside of the player's control). Scamming, however, is an entirely different story all together. It's the responsibility of the player to protect his or her character and the items contained therein while playing in-game.

[Lunar_Drifter]

 

 

 

Would you, for example, tell a child not to drink a bottle of bleach, then leave the bottle where the child could reach it? I hope not! You would put it out of reach, where the child would not be tempted.

 

 

 

Teeg

 

 

 

JaGEx didn't tell them not to drink the bleach, and leave it in their reach. They told them, put it in a higher cabinet, and then the child proceeded to grab a chair to climb up and reach it.

 

 

 

People are always going to find a way around things. Scamming is always going to be there. If one person learns the hard way, then that person sure as heck won't do it again. And if he's smart, then he would warn others about it and/or the scammer; and hopefully those people will learn from his mistake.

 

 

 

(And by "he" and "his", that applies to women and it-things as well.)

 

~Lunar