Help put an end to junk trading

[jenova1692]

I've got to tell you, we're not ignorant nor unknowing.

 

How do you know? If you were you wouldn't know that you were right?

 

 

 

Giving up this debate won't make you look weak,

 

Well yeah it does. It may not matter and I may not give a [cabbage], but the people who read this will think it subconsciously.

 

 

 

but calling the OP or myself (who so happens to be in the OP's corner) "brick walls" will.

 

No it doesn't. It makes us look like idiots because we are arguing with brick walls.

 

 

 

Funnily enough, the same could be said about you from my standpoint

 

Yes, but you are wrong and I am right. There is a lot to be said by that.

 

 

 

but for the sake of simplicity, I'll just give this whole thing up.

 

Finally, you admit defeat.

 

 

 

The point here is to get rid of junk trades. Creating some sort of black-hole in which one can get some amount of cash back for their junk (between 50 and 70%) is half the battle; fixing stuck items, like 3A, Party Hats, or Divine Shields is the other half. The major issue here is that no one here can agree on what exactly needs to be done, and that's unfortunate.

 

 

 

 

Actually all of the intelligent people are agreeing that the GE just needs to be removed, or at least altered to make prices more accurate. Attacking junk trading itself will only cause more problems.

 

 

 

 

 

Perhaps one day we'll finally agree that junk trades aren't beneficial to the game, and we'll end them of our own volition. Until that day, I'll be pushing for some updates to the GE to allow players to sell en masse to Gen stores.

 

Actually most people already agree that junk trades aren't beneficial to the game. The only difference is that the intelligent people realize that it is completely necessary until the GE is either fixed or removed.

[jettrider]

I do understand that people have more money today than a few years ago, but 100M is still an extremely large amount of cash, even 10M is. There really isn't that many people with over 400M and higher, that is an extremely high amount of money. If 10s of thousands of people had over 400M like the other guy was suggesting, then this game would just be ridiculous. Nothing would be the prices they are now and merchanting would be far out of control. If 10,000 people had 400M each, that's 4,000,000,000,000 GP. That's just ridiculous, that many people don't have over 400M. :wall:

 

 

 

However, as I'm writing this I feel like this is starting to get a little off topic...

 

 

 

It is completely on topic, if you blame junk trading on the ultra rich. Duke Freedom guessed 4 years ago that there was 455 billion gp in RS. Think how many more people have joined, gotten 99 fletching and magic, alched stuff, etc etc. Think of Coinshare. Then you've got to understand that junk trading is done on all levels, actually most often on small rares and armor pieces by medium levels (90-120 combat) with a bunch of useless items. It is true that high levels and rich merchants are the main buyers of items such as spirit shields; this is simply because they have the most money sitting around and the most time to do stuff with it. It's a status symbol and a plaything that makes money, not a way of depriving the market of one of its items.

 

 

 

People have been talking about items such as these for months. Jagex has refused to alter the GE system. What needs to happen is to identify "stagnant items" and then alter the prices for those items based on unfilled orders. The longer they refuse to step in and alter the system, the longer that people waste their time and sometimes break the rules in BH to bypass a broken system. The system simply doesn't work. Some items will always get stuck unless the following issues are addressed:

• 
   
  [*:jsqynuhn]Stagnant items
   
  [*:jsqynuhn]Unreasonable price floors and ceilings
   
  [*:jsqynuhn]Unreasonable price links (eg Addy arrows(p+) in response to Addy arrows and weapon poison(p+))

 

 

 

Basically, Jagex needs to either make the GE work for any item, or create a shop or minigame that reimburses every item for its actual value (but this will only work if the stagnant items are fixed in the first place).

[yuriqiu]

I really am tired of arguing on this topic. To all the people that complain about junk trade, google the following:

 

-The invisible hand

 

-Microeconomics

 

-Theory of Supply and Demand

 

-Price controlled economies

 

 

 

I believe after a bit of reading in those topics, you will have a better understanding of the GE and its economy.

[canu44]

 

Basically, Jagex needs to either make the GE work for any item, or create a shop or minigame that reimburses every item for its actual value (but this will only work if the stagnant items are fixed in the first place).

 

 

 

 

 

Well remember when All the flatpacks were junk? Now ge has made it such that they arent junk anymore.

 

 

 

We will see jagex killling junk more often, maybe maple longs being 3/4th ge price in store.

[glasscube]

 

Well remember when All the flatpacks were junk? Now ge has made it such that they arent junk anymore.

 

 

 

We will see jagex killling junk more often, maybe maple longs being 3/4th ge price in store.

 

The GE wasn't fixed so the flat packs were not junk, they added new content instead of fixing the GE.

[bedman]

 

Well remember when All the flatpacks were junk? Now ge has made it such that they arent junk anymore.

 

 

 

We will see jagex killling junk more often, maybe maple longs being 3/4th ge price in store.

 

The GE wasn't fixed so the flat packs were not junk, they added new content instead of fixing the GE.

 

Right on!

 

 

 

And I think that's a BAD solution. Just like shops buying up junk, and manually changing prices, those are only temporarily solutions. Every update which has some relevance will cause problems again.

 

 

 

Remember smoking kills: the GE couldnt keep up with the increased demand of slayer masks (blame the merchants too for that, but hey, that's been of all times) and bam: black masks are being junk traded for over 1M

 

This will happen all the time if they dont fix the MECHANICS of the GE.

 

 

 

Again: read Soma's propositions for fixing it. They are good.

[Beriorn]

But if there's no more Junk Trading, then what we're gonna do with all that junk, all that junk, in our... bank?

[Will H]

But if there's no more Junk Trading, then what we're gonna do with all that junk, all that junk, in our... bank?

 

Give the junk a use so it is no longer junk! I don't know, introduce an extension to firemaking? If we could construct some bonfires and throw in the junk for xp and some other rewards, you could quickly drain them out of the economy. As long as it's balanced so the cost/reward peaks at the 'useless item' end of the scale, and the rewards are reasonable, it would be a welcomed addition.

 

Even better, it could be a team minigame, where you have to utilise the heat to free treasure trapped in ice or something.

 

 

 

You know you want to burn those maple longbows.

[Beriorn]

Getting both Fletching AND Firemaking xp out of the same log?

 

 

 

That... could work. In fact, it's a pretty good idea.

[Igor]

Sorry to mean, but this is stupid.

 

Seriously.

 

 

 

No free trade = junk trades

[manutham]

fine. no problem. i will quit this forum for good.

 

 

 

u need not being so mean and sarcastic idiot. oh ya, my first langauge is this: your mother chee bye! you chow ang mo go to hell. - understand? muahaha.

[magzar]

Unless JX realizes it soon, else it will still end up putting GE into dedundancy in the near future as nowadays almost all rares are fast turning into this nature of trades. Compounding their effort into the drain and peeps accessing into GE for purchases of such rare items from many other areas of their mistakes.

 

 

 

These days so much also being damaged on the prices of partyhats (except to blue) from such trades recently. I would not see why JX does not react to market price to adjust on those benchmark prices of theirs like the Spirit Shields, but even though, it do not seem to address to the appetites of those traders/merchants I would forsee, an example - D Claw though being adjusted to 22m odds in GE recently, traders/merchants are pricing them @50m in market and so forth. LoL .. else they wont be called traders or merchants to make profit and disposing their junks from training skills on material that is worthless IE. bow (u) or javelines etc.

 

 

 

In a nutshell, this becomes a chicken and egg thing. For me, I would live without such luxury of owning an Elysian Spirit Shield as I might as well bring more food into a battle than ending up more space being compromised to junks obtained from sellers on such circumstances.

 

 

 

 

 

Wow your post is absolutely unintelligible. I take it english isn't your first language. I tried, but i just couldn't make any sense of this, sorry.

[bedman]

Unless JX realizes it soon, else it will still end up putting GE into dedundancy in the near future as nowadays almost all rares are fast turning into this nature of trades. Compounding their effort into the drain and peeps accessing into GE for purchases of such rare items from many other areas of their mistakes.

 

 

 

These days so much also being damaged on the prices of partyhats (except to blue) from such trades recently. I would not see why JX does not react to market price to adjust on those benchmark prices of theirs like the Spirit Shields, but even though, it do not seem to address to the appetites of those traders/merchants I would forsee, an example - D Claw though being adjusted to 22m odds in GE recently, traders/merchants are pricing them @50m in market and so forth. LoL .. else they wont be called traders or merchants to make profit and disposing their junks from training skills on material that is worthless IE. bow (u) or javelines etc.

 

 

 

In a nutshell, this becomes a chicken and egg thing. For me, I would live without such luxury of owning an Elysian Spirit Shield as I might as well bring more food into a battle than ending up more space being compromised to junks obtained from sellers on such circumstances.

 

 

 

 

 

Wow your post is absolutely unintelligible. I take it english isn't your first language. I tried, but i just couldn't make any sense of this, sorry.

 

You have turned into an absolute, arrogant [wagon].

 

why?

[magzar]

Unless JX realizes it soon, else it will still end up putting GE into dedundancy in the near future as nowadays almost all rares are fast turning into this nature of trades. Compounding their effort into the drain and peeps accessing into GE for purchases of such rare items from many other areas of their mistakes.

 

 

 

These days so much also being damaged on the prices of partyhats (except to blue) from such trades recently. I would not see why JX does not react to market price to adjust on those benchmark prices of theirs like the Spirit Shields, but even though, it do not seem to address to the appetites of those traders/merchants I would forsee, an example - D Claw though being adjusted to 22m odds in GE recently, traders/merchants are pricing them @50m in market and so forth. LoL .. else they wont be called traders or merchants to make profit and disposing their junks from training skills on material that is worthless IE. bow (u) or javelines etc.

 

 

 

In a nutshell, this becomes a chicken and egg thing. For me, I would live without such luxury of owning an Elysian Spirit Shield as I might as well bring more food into a battle than ending up more space being compromised to junks obtained from sellers on such circumstances.

 

 

 

 

 

Wow your post is absolutely unintelligible. I take it english isn't your first language. I tried, but i just couldn't make any sense of this, sorry.

 

You have turned into an absolute, arrogant [wagon].

 

why?

 

 

 

 

 

I actually wasn't being an [wagon] here. I really just don't know what he said. Usually I can figure it out if i really try, but this just seems like it has multiple sentences mixed together, while leaving off the points of each. If you can make it out then let me know, but I just couldn't make sense of it. Anyway, I just like having an alter ego on the forums. If you ever talk to me in game I'm actually really nice. I'm usually one of the first to volunteer if someone needs help with something.

[Kilo]

I don't think a forum topic structured this way is going to help anything, and people do what they wish at the time. Does anyone feel moral restraint when using or buying junk? I know I don't have the little guy upstairs telling me "No, it's wrong!". It sounds to me like you just want a party hat than anything else.

[Omar]

Wow your post is absolutely unintelligible. I take it english isn't your first language. I tried, but i just couldn't make any sense of this, sorry.

 

You have turned into an absolute, arrogant [wagon].

 

why?

 

Because he's wrong...

[magzar]

I don't think a forum topic structured this way is going to help anything, and people do what they wish at the time. Does anyone feel moral restraint when using or buying junk? I know I don't have the little guy upstairs telling me "No, it's wrong!". It sounds to me like you just want a party hat than anything else.

 

 

 

It's not about it being "wrong." The issue I have is that it damages the RS economy, and on top of that, does not do what it is intended to do. I'm not looking to purchase any rares at the moment, nor do I plan to in the near future, with the possible exception of a SS. That can hardly be considered a rare at this point though.

[PereGrin]

Unless JX realizes it soon, else it will still end up putting GE into dedundancy in the near future as nowadays almost all rares are fast turning into this nature of trades. Compounding their effort into the drain and peeps accessing into GE for purchases of such rare items from many other areas of their mistakes.

 

 

 

These days so much also being damaged on the prices of partyhats (except to blue) from such trades recently. I would not see why JX does not react to market price to adjust on those benchmark prices of theirs like the Spirit Shields, but even though, it do not seem to address to the appetites of those traders/merchants I would forsee, an example - D Claw though being adjusted to 22m odds in GE recently, traders/merchants are pricing them @50m in market and so forth. LoL .. else they wont be called traders or merchants to make profit and disposing their junks from training skills on material that is worthless IE. bow (u) or javelines etc.

 

 

 

In a nutshell, this becomes a chicken and egg thing. For me, I would live without such luxury of owning an Elysian Spirit Shield as I might as well bring more food into a battle than ending up more space being compromised to junks obtained from sellers on such circumstances.

 

 

 

 

 

Wow your post is absolutely unintelligible. I take it english isn't your first language. I tried, but i just couldn't make any sense of this, sorry.

 

You have turned into an absolute, arrogant [wagon].

 

why?

 

 

 

 

 

I actually wasn't being an [wagon] here. I really just don't know what he said. Usually I can figure it out if i really try, but this just seems like it has multiple sentences mixed together, while leaving off the points of each. If you can make it out then let me know, but I just couldn't make sense of it. Anyway, I just like having an alter ego on the forums. If you ever talk to me in game I'm actually really nice. I'm usually one of the first to volunteer if someone needs help with something.

 

 

 

 

 

I have to give it to manutham, this post really was totally incomprehensible.

 

 

 

Also, who really wants a party hat. What a stupendous waste of money. Far better to get any of the upgraded spirit shields. I really think that you guys are not quite getting his proposition.

[Sir_Kurity]

Junk is slower to make than real money, so it dosent encourage real world trading, on the other hand, its helps players to set there own prices on goods for lending, and for items like dclaws, partyhats, and spirit sheilds.

[Obtaurian]

Also, who really wants a party hat. What a stupendous waste of money. Far better to get any of the upgraded spirit shields. I really think that you guys are not quite getting his proposition.

 

 

 

Party Hats are the only "expensive" items available to skillers, currently.

[magzar]

lulz oh no my thread!!!!!! :o

[Returned3]

fine. no problem. i will quit this forum for good.

 

 

 

u need not being so mean and sarcastic idiot. oh ya, my first langauge is this: your mother chee bye! you chow ang mo go to hell. - understand? muahaha.

 

 

 

You can't say that! That's a high level of vulgarity!

[Bouwzie]

fine. no problem. i will quit this forum for good.

 

 

 

u need not being so mean and sarcastic idiot. oh ya, my first langauge is this: your mother chee bye! you chow ang mo go to hell. - understand? muahaha.

 

 

 

Your mother offences are about as low as you can go, and are (almost) never true, and make you look like a complete idiot (so not alot of change here).

[wozfe]

What never ceases to amaze me is this; YOU ARE STILL SELLING YOUR ITEMS FOR THE SAME PRICE!!!

 

 

 

 

Absolutely correct. Junk is basically just another currency, which can still be used as regular money except you can't use them in stores and some people don't accept them as money.

 

 

 

If I don't have any junk, and want to lend an expensive item for 100k, I first have to buy 40k worth of junk to be able to receive 100k, and the 40k worth of junk cost me... 40k! Surprise! So, basically, I'm offering 40k and a loan for 100k. 100k - 40k is 60k, so I'm basically only receiving 60k.

 

 

 

If an item has a way higher street value than its GE value, the only way to fix it is to adjust the GE prices and the formula for how it calculates the price. I agree that GE should take all offers into account (not only completed offers).

 

Junk is money in disguise.

[Ax600]

ok so how many of you have come across a rare item, and naturally were ecstatic at this new found source of riches, only to realize "i don't have millions worth of junk to be able to sell this with!!!!!!"

 

 

 

so what do you do?

 

either you spend an inordinate amount of time gathering junk just to sell your rare, or you dump in on the g.e. and take a profit loss

 

 

 

so how do we solve this problem?

 

how can we possibly find some way to sell items for what they're worth?

 

 

 

well the simple solution to this, is we can't

 

due to merchers and junk traders the "true value" of rares is much much higher than their g.e. value

 

it seems every new item released now has its price gouged to the ridiculous

 

 

 

but who decides an item's true value? the first person to get the item? do they automatically become the sole judge and jury on what an item should cost?

 

 

 

i say it's time to end the practice of setting the "true value" of items high above their g.e value making them only available to players who find it beneficial to waste time gathering tons of useless junk just to eat up the extra value

 

 

 

so my suggestion is this

 

STOP JUNK TRADING!!!!!!!

 

and start using the g.e.

 

insist on cash only trades

 

and blatantly refuse to have anything to do with junk

 

this will force price gougers to lower their prices

 

while forcing g.e. prices to rise with the new influx of items

 

 

 

while i know a lot of players are thinking "why would i want to lose (insert amount) gold by doing this when i can use junk"

 

think about it, the junk you gather has the same value as the extra gold being added to the rare item's cost

 

you're not increasing your profit, you're just selling your rare for its market price and the a ton of junk for its respective price

 

nothing is gained by this, and it is in turn one of the biggest problems with the g.e.

 

 

 

so start selling and buying rares on the g.e. help adjust prices to a level where everyone can be satisfied!!!!

 

 

 

i for one certainly will, and will even post pictures to prove it

 

and i encourage others to do so as well

 

 

 

for discussion value, what is your opinion on this?

 

and what suggestions might you have to improve the process?

 

 

 

i think all of runescape will ultimately benefit from this though it may seem like a loss to some players at first (but honestly if you're rich enough to deal in rares you're rich enough for this not to leave you broke)

 

if we leave trading solely to the ge, players would have no say in the prices of items. RS would be a Communist state! :shock: