Mining Sucks (round 2)

[quelmotz]

Think of it this way:

 

Either have auto-dropping and one ore per rock OR

 

Not have auto-dropping and more ore per rock.

 

Auto-dropping was a very nice feature as long as you kept track of how many ores you had (if you're not powermining). Make it optional and I would love to have it back.

 

 

 

What you said doesn't make sense. Having auto-dropping would benefit woodcutters too, but why should miners be left out of the deal by only having one ore per rock?

[Sir_Kurity]

Autodropping is a good idea, but only if it is significantly slower than mousekeys is now.

 

 

 

It needs something to balance out its ease.

[unkn0wnwarrior]

Think of it this way:

 

Either have auto-dropping and one ore per rock OR

 

Not have auto-dropping and more ore per rock.

 

Auto-dropping was a very nice feature as long as you kept track of how many ores you had (if you're not powermining). Make it optional and I would love to have it back.

 

 

 

What you said doesn't make sense. Having auto-dropping would benefit woodcutters too, but why should miners be left out of the deal by only having one ore per rock?

 

I've said before that I would rather just see more Mithril and Adamant rocks be added. However, I have thought about it a bit over the last few pages and think that with limitations on it, multiple ores per rock COULD work.

 

 

 

My post in that quote was just to show my personal support of auto-dropping.

 

 

 

Autodropping is a good idea, but only if it is significantly slower than mousekeys is now.

 

 

 

It needs something to balance out its ease.

 

It doesn't NEED to be slower, at all.

[Makoto_the_Phoenix]

I was just looking in rants and saw a familiar thread title, so I looked in here and saw someone else thought that mining sucks. Of course, I typed that up when I was going for 70 mining and was getting royally pissed at it all.

 

 

 

Of course, I still think mining sucks. Every other skill has been streamlined and made easier for a lazier player base, anyone still clinging onto mining needs to realize that they're a minority. I guarantee some people complained when Jagex put in higher level agility courses when they suffered at Ape Atoll all the way to 99. I know people complained about Cook X/Mix X/Do X. If everyone could admit that whatever Jagex does will piss people off, then we can actually get some good updates going.

 

 

 

Good to see the Original Poster making a return. I do agree with much of what you said, and your ultimate point - players have to accept that change will be controversial, and then they should move on for the better of the game.

 

 

 

Autodropping is a good idea, but only if it is significantly slower than mousekeys is now.

 

 

 

It needs something to balance out its ease.

 

Ease? Guys, we're not talking about making the skill easier - we're making it purposeful. That's all that is.

 

 

 

I've said before that I would rather just see more Mithril and Adamant rocks be added. However, I have thought about it a bit over the last few pages and think that with limitations on it, multiple ores per rock COULD work.

 

 

 

Explain what these limitations are, and assume that all respawn times are similar or proportional to those of Woodcutting trees.

[unkn0wnwarrior]

I've said before that I would rather just see more Mithril and Adamant rocks be added. However, I have thought about it a bit over the last few pages and think that with limitations on it, multiple ores per rock COULD work.

 

 

 

Explain what these limitations are, and assume that all respawn times are similar or proportional to those of Woodcutting trees.

 

The limitations I had were the same as those mentioned by others. Keep Rune with 1 ore per rock, but add more to lower level rocks, so tin/copper have the most.

[quelmotz]

Good to see the Original Poster making a return. I do agree with much of what you said, and your ultimate point - players have to accept that change will be controversial, and then they should move on for the better of the game.

 

 

 

 

Agreed totally. :thumbsup:

 

 

 

Stubborn and unadaptive players who can't adapt to change and don't believe that it is controversial are probably 75% or so of the rant thread starters in this forum.

[Makoto_the_Phoenix]

I've said before that I would rather just see more Mithril and Adamant rocks be added. However, I have thought about it a bit over the last few pages and think that with limitations on it, multiple ores per rock COULD work.

 

 

 

Explain what these limitations are, and assume that all respawn times are similar or proportional to those of Woodcutting trees.

 

The limitations I had were the same as those mentioned by others. Keep Rune with 1 ore per rock, but add more to lower level rocks, so tin/copper have the most.

 

That's fine, but...

 

 

 

The sliding scale would still have to be generous enough to Mithril and Adamantite to make them worth it, or we're still in the same spot. It's great that we keep Runite the same, but if we get two or three ore per Adamant spawn (although it's an improvement), it's still not worth it in the long haul.

 

 

 

Of course, we could totally nuke the respawn times and again, make them proportional to trees of a respective level. What do you think about that?

[quelmotz]

I've said before that I would rather just see more Mithril and Adamant rocks be added. However, I have thought about it a bit over the last few pages and think that with limitations on it, multiple ores per rock COULD work.

 

 

 

Explain what these limitations are, and assume that all respawn times are similar or proportional to those of Woodcutting trees.

 

The limitations I had were the same as those mentioned by others. Keep Rune with 1 ore per rock, but add more to lower level rocks, so tin/copper have the most.

 

That's fine, but...

 

 

 

The sliding scale would still have to be generous enough to Mithril and Adamantite to make them worth it, or we're still in the same spot. It's great that we keep Runite the same, but if we get two or three ore per Adamant spawn (although it's an improvement), it's still not worth it in the long haul.

 

 

 

Of course, we could totally nuke the respawn times and again, make them proportional to trees of a respective level. What do you think about that?

 

 

 

IMHO, it would just cause a drastic drop in ore prices and make mining too similar to woodcutting, which isn't what we want. A smaller change would be better IMO.

[unkn0wnwarrior]

I've said before that I would rather just see more Mithril and Adamant rocks be added. However, I have thought about it a bit over the last few pages and think that with limitations on it, multiple ores per rock COULD work.

 

 

 

Explain what these limitations are, and assume that all respawn times are similar or proportional to those of Woodcutting trees.

 

The limitations I had were the same as those mentioned by others. Keep Rune with 1 ore per rock, but add more to lower level rocks, so tin/copper have the most.

 

That's fine, but...

 

 

 

The sliding scale would still have to be generous enough to Mithril and Adamantite to make them worth it, or we're still in the same spot. It's great that we keep Runite the same, but if we get two or three ore per Adamant spawn (although it's an improvement), it's still not worth it in the long haul.

 

 

 

Of course, we could totally nuke the respawn times and again, make them proportional to trees of a respective level. What do you think about that?

 

I thnk if they added more adamantite and mithril rocks to the game, giving each adamantite two ores and each mithril 3 (?), it would be plenty enough to make mining livable. Just add some to places that already have it, and some where there currently aren't any but it makes sense to have some.

[999134]

personally I hate mining , too many clicks because of single ores and then even if your banking coal or gold for example your still making less than a level 3 picking swamp toads up or making planks #-o .

[quelmotz]

I've said before that I would rather just see more Mithril and Adamant rocks be added. However, I have thought about it a bit over the last few pages and think that with limitations on it, multiple ores per rock COULD work.

 

 

 

Explain what these limitations are, and assume that all respawn times are similar or proportional to those of Woodcutting trees.

 

The limitations I had were the same as those mentioned by others. Keep Rune with 1 ore per rock, but add more to lower level rocks, so tin/copper have the most.

 

That's fine, but...

 

 

 

The sliding scale would still have to be generous enough to Mithril and Adamantite to make them worth it, or we're still in the same spot. It's great that we keep Runite the same, but if we get two or three ore per Adamant spawn (although it's an improvement), it's still not worth it in the long haul.

 

 

 

Of course, we could totally nuke the respawn times and again, make them proportional to trees of a respective level. What do you think about that?

 

I thnk if they added more adamantite and mithril rocks to the game, giving each adamantite two ores and each mithril 3 (?), it would be plenty enough to make mining livable. Just add some to places that already have it, and some where there currently aren't any but it makes sense to have some.

 

 

 

Possible, but I'm still a fan of the auto-drop feature to make mining easier/more convenient.

[xxamzyxx]

im mining atm and i dnt mind it, it depends i preferr chattin while doin it thsn it bein completely silent but probs many of them are autoers x

[unkn0wnwarrior]

Possible, but I'm still a fan of the auto-drop feature to make mining easier/more convenient.

 

I would love to see auto-dropping re-added to the game, but I would like it to be optional. Just in case I don't want to drop my ores.

[AgingMiser]

I read the first post, and I must say, you have a good point. Frankly, from 85-90 mining, I earned maybe 1m, from runite. The rest was powermining iron :-#

 

 

 

But one thing I'd like to tack on here. Mining. Is. Broken. Of course, the time you take to mine some ores must have some tendency of randomness, but statistically? To mine mithril & coal in the mining guild, the best level to have is in the 60-67 range. I'm not kidding here - I've seen it happen, and I can recall stealing 8 something coal from a person with 94 mining while i was at like what, 63. It's not right. The higher your level, the higher your tendency to mine it faster - that's the way it should be, but it isn't like that. :thumbdown:

 

 

 

Also, I saw a post on the first page that I think would be a good suggestion. Make it like Runecrafting, in a sense. Perhaps, at, say, 60 mining, you start to obtain 2 coal/rock randomly, and at 80 mining, you always obtain 2 coal/rock.

 

 

 

However, I can't say that I'd support that for ores mithril and up. That'd make the market crash waay too fast.

[quelmotz]

 

However, I can't say that I'd support that for ores mithril and up. That'd make the market crash waay too fast.

 

 

 

No. Mithril and adamant ores are stupidly hard to obtain now, and they seriously need a boost. Not so much for Rune though, but definitely for mithril and adamant.

[Sir_Kurity]

Well for some reason mithril is worth a stupidly low amount, dispute how hard it is to mine, maybe its because its a noted drop from some creatures, in which it should no longer be a drop.

 

 

 

Adamant is the same, and the only way to mine it half efficiently is to world switch, and even then its only worth like 1k each.

[fenrir321]

I thoroughly agree with everything in this rant (and that's not something I do lightly seeing with a bunch of spam in these forums and the rsof). Just a tip: you might want to add the argument on how adding multiple ores per rock would not "nerf" mining. you still have to mine the exact same number of rocks; you just won't get carpal tunnel doing so.

 

 

 

Hopefully, this also means that the coal rocks in the mining guild can be conglomerated into fewer rocks resulting in more room for mithril and adamant and possibly rune in there without having to bend over backwards to design another, unneeded layer in the guild.

[Makoto_the_Phoenix]

A few replies...

 

 

 

Possible, but I'm still a fan of the auto-drop feature to make mining easier/more convenient.

 

I would love to see auto-dropping re-added to the game, but I would like it to be optional. Just in case I don't want to drop my ores.

 

 

 

I'm not much of a fan of auto-dropping ores. It means we'd be back to Square One as far as refreshing Mining went. Getting experience faster isn't really the point, as far as I see it - it's about actually using the ores we get from Mining to feed back into Smithing.

 

 

 

I read the first post, and I must say, you have a good point. Frankly, from 85-90 mining, I earned maybe 1m, from runite. The rest was powermining iron :-#

 

 

 

But one thing I'd like to tack on here. Mining. Is. Broken. Of course, the time you take to mine some ores must have some tendency of randomness, but statistically? To mine mithril & coal in the mining guild, the best level to have is in the 60-67 range. I'm not kidding here - I've seen it happen, and I can recall stealing 8 something coal from a person with 94 mining while i was at like what, 63. It's not right. The higher your level, the higher your tendency to mine it faster - that's the way it should be, but it isn't like that. :thumbdown:

 

 

 

Also, I saw a post on the first page that I think would be a good suggestion. Make it like Runecrafting, in a sense. Perhaps, at, say, 60 mining, you start to obtain 2 coal/rock randomly, and at 80 mining, you always obtain 2 coal/rock.

 

 

 

However, I can't say that I'd support that for ores mithril and up. That'd make the market crash waay too fast.

 

 

 

quelmotz did a good job of summing everything up in this, but I'll add something about other ores/bars. A lot of NPCs out there already drop a large quantity of ores and bars for smithers, which is seen as kind of underhanded - why bother mining 12K adamant when you can just camp Aviansies for it? I think that should be fixed a bit, too, since if we're able to make Mining be the major producer of ores and bars, then the NPC dropping problem wouldn't really be a problem.

 

 

 

I thoroughly agree with everything in this rant (and that's not something I do lightly seeing with a bunch of spam in these forums and the rsof). Just a tip: you might want to add the argument on how adding multiple ores per rock would not "nerf" mining. you still have to mine the exact same number of rocks; you just won't get carpal tunnel doing so.

 

 

 

Hopefully, this also means that the coal rocks in the mining guild can be conglomerated into fewer rocks resulting in more room for mithril and adamant and possibly rune in there without having to bend over backwards to design another, unneeded layer in the guild.

 

 

 

Thanks for agreeing and reading the rant :P But on to a reply, I really think that the guild itself needs a complete rework. Not moving around anything, really, just make it multi-tiered, and give plenty more resources for miners; something that could be worthy of being called a real guild.

[lavirylime]

A lot of NPCs out there already drop a large quantity of ores and bars for smithers, which is seen as kind of underhanded - why bother mining 12K adamant when you can just camp Aviansies for it?

 

Yeah... f2p here, and I stopped mining mithril in swamps after I realized that I can get the same amount (if not more) in the same timeframe by farming ankous and cockroaches. And no world-hopping involved.

[ownage90]

i agree there isnt much mith ore to mine or addy they need to place more spots of addy and mith i enjoy mining as it is a good source of making money :thumbsup:

[quelmotz]

A lot of NPCs out there already drop a large quantity of ores and bars for smithers, which is seen as kind of underhanded - why bother mining 12K adamant when you can just camp Aviansies for it?

 

Yeah... f2p here, and I stopped mining mithril in swamps after I realized that I can get the same amount (if not more) in the same timeframe by farming ankous and cockroaches. And no world-hopping involved.

 

 

 

True.

 

 

 

One of the main problems with mining is that by using combat/other ways, YOU CAN GET MORE ores than by mining, which is absurdly absurd.

[Sir_Kurity]

Jagex seems to want to make combat every other skill rolled into one.

 

 

 

Monsters drop ores, sometimes faster than you can mine them.

 

Monsters drop weapons.

 

Monsters drop food...

 

Monsters drop jewelery...

 

Monsters drop runes...

 

Monsters drop arrows...

 

Monsters drop herbs (though i guess herblore was out before farming..)

[quelmotz]

Jagex seems to want to make combat every other skill rolled into one.

 

 

 

Monsters drop ores, sometimes faster than you can mine them.

 

Monsters drop weapons.

 

Monsters drop food...

 

Monsters drop jewelery...

 

Monsters drop runes...

 

Monsters drop arrows...

 

Monsters drop herbs (though i guess herblore was out before farming..)

 

 

 

Yeah.

 

 

 

Jagex should rework their drop list of monsters. Nuke all the drops of food, jewelry, and other stuff that are supposed to be made by skills, or AT THE VERY LEAST lower them to a point that it is inefficient.

[fenrir321]

Jagex seems to want to make combat every other skill rolled into one.

 

 

 

Monsters drop ores, sometimes faster than you can mine them.

 

Monsters drop weapons.

 

Monsters drop food...

 

Monsters drop jewelery...

 

Monsters drop runes...

 

Monsters drop arrows...

 

Monsters drop herbs (though i guess herblore was out before farming..)

 

 

 

Yeah.

 

 

 

Jagex should rework their drop list of monsters. Nuke all the drops of food, jewelry, and other stuff that are supposed to be made by skills, or AT THE VERY LEAST lower them to a point that it is inefficient.

 

The problem with that is now that the drop tables only hold cash and/or untradeables (since the raws aren't drops any more), you would have a massive drop in supply driving price up with a massive influx of liquefied gp entering the game (causing massive inflation and driving the price up further (assuming that you don't change the average drop value of the monster.))

 

 

 

Another note on that: since gp is the standard, gold as a currency has to change with the market; a monster can't drop only 100 gp every time because of the supply/demand wave. Because stock or items in this case fluctuates, a drop that's 100 gp on day will be automatically alter itself through natural economic means without Jagex interfering to "re-balance" the tables (which I believe they have in the past.) A drop that is 100 gp will always stay 100 gp until Jagex changes it. Ironically, even though it's the standard, gold's value changes constantly because of inflation/deflation.

[quelmotz]

Jagex seems to want to make combat every other skill rolled into one.

 

 

 

Monsters drop ores, sometimes faster than you can mine them.

 

Monsters drop weapons.

 

Monsters drop food...

 

Monsters drop jewelery...

 

Monsters drop runes...

 

Monsters drop arrows...

 

Monsters drop herbs (though i guess herblore was out before farming..)

 

 

 

Yeah.

 

 

 

Jagex should rework their drop list of monsters. Nuke all the drops of food, jewelry, and other stuff that are supposed to be made by skills, or AT THE VERY LEAST lower them to a point that it is inefficient.

 

The problem with that is now that the drop tables only hold cash and/or untradeables (since the raws aren't drops any more), you would have a massive drop in supply driving price up with a massive influx of liquefied gp entering the game (causing massive inflation and driving the price up further (assuming that you don't change the average drop value of the monster.))

 

 

 

Another note on that: since gp is the standard, gold as a currency has to change with the market; a monster can't drop only 100 gp every time because of the supply/demand wave. Because stock or items in this case fluctuates, a drop that's 100 gp on day will be automatically alter itself through natural economic means without Jagex interfering to "re-balance" the tables (which I believe they have in the past.) A drop that is 100 gp will always stay 100 gp until Jagex changes it. Ironically, even though it's the standard, gold's value changes constantly because of inflation/deflation.

 

 

 

Yeah, it's one of those "too bad, too late" things, like skillcapes. Once they're out for a period of time, it's impossible to change it back unless you want a public outcry. And what, monsters that drop processed materials/raws have been around since the beginning of the game.