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200M in all Skills


Makilio
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You don't have to sacrifice your life to gain exp. The point still stands that what you said is extremely ignorant

Suomi, Drumgun, Forsberg, et al sacrificed their lives to gain xp so I'm not sure where these top 200m all contenders with balanced lives you speak of are.

 

Last time I checked, it takes at least 20,000 hours to get 200M all without spins (over 30k for Suomi IIRC). Care to explain how one can remain a top contender for that achievement while playing in moderation? Be specific with your hours logged.

 

If your point was that anyone can get 99 all skills in moderation these days, then yes I would probably agree with you, especially if they were buying spins. But 200m all skills? No way, Jose.

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Its true since we all have 24 hours, life is always a trade-off.

This is absolutely true. I used to think that you could prioritize everything and only play rs when you have nothing better to do, but once I stopped playing rs, I realized that there's always something better to do with your free time. You can ask your friends to hang out instead of waiting for them to ask you. If they're all busy, you can always go out alone and meet new people, or you could practice drawing, learn how to program, learn some new math, look for new music, volunteer, learn how to play an instrument. There are hundreds of activities that are more productive than rs.

 

Free time is arguably the most valuable thing in the universe. If you're spending yours on rs, and you have the right to, you're doing so at a huge cost. I know there are top players who maintain healthy social lives, but I know for a fact that it could be even healthier and that they've missed out on a lot of opportunities to improve their lives.

 

All I can really say is that I hope that anyone who sacrifices a lot for an online achievement is happy with their decision. I would feel terrible for cheering on someone who ultimately regrets their choice.

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Its true since we all have 24 hours, life is always a trade-off.

This is absolutely true. I used to think that you could prioritize everything and only play rs when you have nothing better to do, but once I stopped playing rs, I realized that there's always something better to do with your free time. You can ask your friends to hang out instead of waiting for them to ask you. If they're all busy, you can always go out alone and meet new people, or you could practice drawing, learn how to program, learn some new math, look for new music, volunteer, learn how to play an instrument. There are hundreds of activities that are more productive than rs.

 

Free time is arguably the most valuable thing in the universe. If you're spending yours on rs, and you have the right to, you're doing so at a huge cost. I know there are top players who maintain healthy social lives, but I know for a fact that it could be even healthier and that they've missed out on a lot of opportunities to improve their lives.

 

All I can really say is that I hope that anyone who sacrifices a lot for an online achievement is happy with their decision. I would feel terrible for cheering on someone who ultimately regrets their choice.

 

I certainly agree that there are better things to do than play rs all day, but I would also argue that it's very difficult to fill all your time with 'productive' activities.  They tend to be much more energy intensive than playing rs, and different people demand different amounts of downtime.  For myself, playing rs is the perfect thing after a hard workout or if I'm hungover etc.  Obviously very few of us just play rs during our desired downtime but certainly it's something I'd prefer to watching television etc.  And of course many things on rs are afkable so people may be doing something productive on the side.  

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best drops (reasonably accurate/up to date): 1x Elysian Sigil (LS), 1x Arcane Sigil (cs), 4x Armadyl Hilt (solo at 100m, 100m, 50m, and 5m), 2x Saradomin Hilt (solo at 25m), 5x Draconic Visage (34m,1.2m,1.2m) and various cs/ls/ffa Nex splits.
Drygore Drops: 7 Longswords, 3 Maces, 3 Rapiers, 3 Off-hand Rapiers,  5 Off-hand Maces, 3 Off-hand Longswords

ROTS Shields: 12  Seismics: 16

Ascension Crossbows: 6  Spider Legs: 10

Countless Armadyl armour pieces, Saradomin amulets, Dragon Hatchets, and Fremenik Rings.
Range~Herblore~Construction~Constitution~Defence~Farming~Magic~Attack~Prayer~Strength~Summoning~Slayer~Mining~Dungeoneering~Firemaking~Agility~Magic Mastery~Summoning Mastery~Cooking~Smithing~Fletching~Thieving~Hunter~Woodcutting~Fishing~Runecrafting

 

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Well, I think you guys are going into a spiral of misunderstandings again.

 

First you need to understand the defenition of "better things" for EACH individual. See, if I ask every single person on the planet what's the best thing to do, every single time I will get a different answer (if they give me a well-formed sentence) - I can garantee you that. 

 

And with that comes the definition of shared reality. Once a psychiatrist told me that this had this "uncurable" patient (my favorite ones!) that drank blood every single day. I thought "finally they found a vampire!". So, I was extremely curious to know this new race and went to the mental hospital to see what I could do. I asked him "What are you trying to do for your behalf when drinking blood?" and he told me "Well, my tribe in Africa used to do that. It's one of our routines. I'm just making sure that I don't forget who I am". So we made an agreement that he could do it when he was alone on his home at night.

 

See, the guy was already on hospital for years! Just because he was following a personal routine. If it was on Africa, it would be ok. Just because it was on the west world, it isn't. To me, the same thing applies to Top Players. I've had top players asking me "I play RS x hours. Do you think it's an addiction?! Do you think it's bad?!". All I ask them back is if they're happy with themselfs and they always answered me "yes". To me, that's all it's important.

 

Top players can look at you guys and say "Omg, they go outside all the time. They must be freaks!" just like you do.

 

So, please, stop trying to understand other people. It will not work. You will not ever understand them or anyone else. That's like trying to stop breathing while trying to keep yourself alive.

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A person's beliefs regarding the best use of their time is irrelevant, as their beliefs can be wrong and delusional (and they often are). There's a reason why people like alcoholics consciously make bad decisions-- they don't realize that their decisions are making them unhappy; or they do realize they're making poor decisions but they lack the self-discipline to adjust their behaviors accordingly.

 

The best way to "objectively" measure smart decisions and beliefs is to see if they are consistently happy in the long-term. In other words, if you're capable of being genuinely consistently happy while playing RS for 16+ hours a day, skipping exercise, skipping dating/sex, skipping education/career, etc. then that's great. But if people like that actually exist, I'd argue that they are in a very tiny minority, and it would be unwise for the average person to emulate their lifestyle.

 

Anyways I think this is starting to get off topic again. Feel free to shoot me a PM or start a new thread if you wish to continue this discussion, as this will be my last post on this topic

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A person's beliefs regarding the best use of their time is irrelevant, as their beliefs can be wrong and delusional (and they often are). The best way to "objectively" measure smart decisions and beliefs is to see if they are consistently happy in the long-term. In other words, if you're capable of being genuinely consistently happy while playing RS for 10+ hours a day, skipping exercise, skipping dating/sex, skipping education/career, etc. then that's great. But if people like that actually exist, I'd argue that they are in a very tiny minority, and it would be unwise for the average person to emulate their lifestyle.

 

Anyways I think this is starting to get off topic again. Feel free to shoot me a PM or start a new thread if you wish to continue this discussion, as this will be my last post on this topic

 

People need to stop looking at others as they are broke. If people are still alive, they function perfectly. The person has beliefs for a reason. Either the person consciously like those beliefs or not - that's a different discussion. There's no such thing as "wrong beliefs" or "delusional beliefs". That's ludicrous. 

 

No one can say if a x decision from someone else is a good or not because you don't have his personal history.

 

I might agree that this is going in a kind of off-topic direction. 99% of the thread is like that though.

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We'll just have to agree to disagree on this then. I consider a life of unhappiness to be a life not worth living.

 

And I agree with your last sentence. My point that that X, Y and Z beliefs for me would be inappropriate, considering my personal history and my goals - therefore would give me unhappiness. For other people, it would be the best thing that ever happened to them - leading them to happiness.

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We'll just have to agree to disagree on this then. I consider a life of unhappiness to be a life not worth living.

But the point is happiness is subjective and your perceived concept of a perfectly happy lifestyle is just as wrong as the ones you are judging. People are unique and we all enjoy different balances of different things.

 

Some people are asexual/aromantic for no reason other than they don't feel those emotions. Some people absolutely don't go out and party because they don't enjoy it. There is nothing wrong with these people, they are simply being themselves.

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[2:21:46 PM] Baldvin | Leik: these comp reqs are so bad

[2:22:36 PM] Arceus Dark: Time to get...req'd?

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Basically, people do what makes them happy and fulfilled in life is what gemeos is saying.  if you think that someone else's lifestyle would make you unhappy then you don't have to take part in it, but that does not mean that they have the same opinion of what they like, what is right and wrong.

 

For me, someone who plays a lot but also lives a balanced life (not always because i want to i live with my parents and they keep me busy, I'm 17), i would say that at this point in my life i enjoy gaming the most on my free time and especially rs.  For me, i know my priorities, i am healthy, i do well in school, i have healthy relationships with friends, etc, and i can maintain playing 6-12 hours a day year round.  I have gotten my computer taken away, and i tried to do other things and i did not enjoy them as much.  I fill my time with rs because this is what I WANT TO DO. The thing is, everyone has different priorities, and different skill sets.

 

Dragonseance for example has graduated college with a double major with honors while maintaining a top rank.  Alkan was a varsity football and rugby player during high school and he graduated.  He still takes time out every day to go to the gym with friends, while also playing a lot.

 

Everyone is different and i think that it is completely unfair to judge someone based on their life style choices, especially if those choices don't directly negatively effect you.

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Well, I think you guys are going into a spiral of misunderstandings again.

 

First you need to understand the defenition of "better things" for EACH individual. See, if I ask every single person on the planet what's the best thing to do, every single time I will get a different answer (if they give me a well-formed sentence) - I can garantee you that.

 

And with that comes the definition of shared reality. Once a psychiatrist told me that this had this "uncurable" patient (my favorite ones!) that drank blood every single day. I thought "finally they found a vampire!". So, I was extremely curious to know this new race and went to the mental hospital to see what I could do. I asked him "What are you trying to do for your behalf when drinking blood?" and he told me "Well, my tribe in Africa used to do that. It's one of our routines. I'm just making sure that I don't forget who I am". So we made an agreement that he could do it when he was alone on his home at night.

 

See, the guy was already on hospital for years! Just because he was following a personal routine. If it was on Africa, it would be ok. Just because it was on the west world, it isn't. To me, the same thing applies to Top Players. I've had top players asking me "I play RS x hours. Do you think it's an addiction?! Do you think it's bad?!". All I ask them back is if they're happy with themselfs and they always answered me "yes". To me, that's all it's important.

 

Top players can look at you guys and say "Omg, they go outside all the time. They must be freaks!" just like you do.

 

So, please, stop trying to understand other people. It will not work. You will not ever understand them or anyone else. That's like trying to stop breathing while trying to keep yourself alive.

The problem is that you're trying to turn an economics problem into a psychology one. Free time is a scarce resource and there are multiple ways to utilize it. Therefore, playing runescape in your free time has a cost. It's not any more complicated than that.

 

Runescape would have to be the most valuable way of spending your free time for it to be worth playing. I don't think anyone would be wrong to say that it is their most productive activity, but I'd have a hard time buying it.

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Well the whole point of something productive is something that will make you happy, because at the end of the day thats what any decision is trying to accomplish, so having a hobby and having goals that make you happy to wake up in the morning and look forward to the next day at night is already accomplishing that end goal of making you happy.  I think that it is important to make sure you have something like this to make every day good, rather than always try and be productive for the future, however if your goals involve doing something else with your free time and that makes you just as happy as someone else playing runescape, then do that.

 

At the end of the day everyone is just trying to be as happy as possible, so it doesnt matter how you accomplish that goal

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Ya maybe, i can see that.  Im pretty sure suomi said he has no regrets, and if some1 can look at it from the perspective of they enjoyed that time then they wouldnt, but i can understand where your coming from.

 

To each their own.

 

Anyway, back on topic

 

Can we get a time to 200m all update for Alkan, Dragonseance, Jdel, and i guess throw Geel in there for good measure even though he will be 3rd to 200m all

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Ya maybe, i can see that.  Im pretty sure suomi said he has no regrets, and if some1 can look at it from the perspective of they enjoyed that time then they wouldnt, but i can understand where your coming from.

 

To each their own.

 

Anyway, back on topic

 

Can we get a time to 200m all update for Alkan, Dragonseance, Jdel, and i guess throw Geel in there for good measure even though he will be 3rd to 200m all

Alkan - 2,413

Dragonseance - 2,132

Jdelacroix - 1,637

Geel - 1,293

 

Don't get why you couldn't check yourself, but whatever...

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You don't have to sacrifice your life to gain exp. The point still stands that what you said is extremely ignorant

Suomi, Drumgun, Forsberg, et al sacrificed their lives to gain xp so I'm not sure where these top 200m all contenders with balanced lives you speak of are.

 

Last time I checked, it takes at least 20,000 hours to get 200M all without spins (over 30k for Suomi IIRC). Care to explain how one can remain a top contender for that achievement while playing in moderation? Be specific with your hours logged.

 

If your point was that anyone can get 99 all skills in moderation these days, then yes I would probably agree with you, especially if they were buying spins. But 200m all skills? No way, Jose.

 

How can you be this stupid?

 

 

Do you have anything aside from meaningless ad hominems? Your assertion is completely delusional - the math and empirical evidence is completely against you. It is not possible to get the sort of experience gains that top players do within the timespan that they do by just playing in moderation. It is simply not possible no matter how much you want to believe otherwise. That's not an insult or indictment of top players, it's just a fact.

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You don't have to sacrifice your life to gain exp. The point still stands that what you said is extremely ignorant

Suomi, Drumgun, Forsberg, et al sacrificed their lives to gain xp so I'm not sure where these top 200m all contenders with balanced lives you speak of are.

 

Last time I checked, it takes at least 20,000 hours to get 200M all without spins (over 30k for Suomi IIRC). Care to explain how one can remain a top contender for that achievement while playing in moderation? Be specific with your hours logged.

 

If your point was that anyone can get 99 all skills in moderation these days, then yes I would probably agree with you, especially if they were buying spins. But 200m all skills? No way, Jose.

 

How can you be this stupid?

 

 

Do you have anything aside from meaningless ad hominems? Your assertion is completely delusional - the math and empirical evidence is completely against you. It is not possible to get the sort of experience gains that top players do within the timespan that they do by just playing in moderation. It is simply not possible no matter how much you want to believe otherwise. That's not an insult or indictment of top players, it's just a fact.

 

Yes, to get top rank you'd have to sacrifice some aspects of your life, but I'm arguing against something you implied, that gaining exp requires it.

You can play like 12 hours a day and don't have to sacrifice anything, so 200m all doesn't require sacrificing anything major, besides, in a year from now it will be 5k hours so it won't matter.

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You don't have to sacrifice your life to gain exp. The point still stands that what you said is extremely ignorant

Suomi, Drumgun, Forsberg, et al sacrificed their lives to gain xp so I'm not sure where these top 200m all contenders with balanced lives you speak of are.

 

Last time I checked, it takes at least 20,000 hours to get 200M all without spins (over 30k for Suomi IIRC). Care to explain how one can remain a top contender for that achievement while playing in moderation? Be specific with your hours logged.

 

If your point was that anyone can get 99 all skills in moderation these days, then yes I would probably agree with you, especially if they were buying spins. But 200m all skills? No way, Jose.

 

How can you be this stupid?

 

 

Do you have anything aside from meaningless ad hominems? Your assertion is completely delusional - the math and empirical evidence is completely against you. It is not possible to get the sort of experience gains that top players do within the timespan that they do by just playing in moderation. It is simply not possible no matter how much you want to believe otherwise. That's not an insult or indictment of top players, it's just a fact.

 

Yes, to get top rank you'd have to sacrifice some aspects of your life, but I'm arguing against something you implied, that gaining exp requires it.

You can play like 12 hours a day and don't have to sacrifice anything, so 200m all doesn't require sacrificing anything major, besides, in a year from now it will be 5k hours so it won't matter.

 

 

I didn't say gaining experience requires it. I said gaining experience at the rate that top players do it and within the timespan they gain it in does. There's a different between those two statements and it's not subtle.

 

Also, 12 hours is not 'moderate' gameplay even by generous definitions. That's more time than a full-time job, and half your day. It's completely astounding that you think people who sit at a computer (aside from say the well documented medical issues, such as say back problems, eye-sight, etc.) aren't sacrificing anything. They are sacrificing their health and a myriad of other things. You can argue that's their choice and that they have the right to do this, but it's completely unscientific, and not to mention pretty much contradicted by health sciences (physical and psychological), to claim that they aren't sacrificing anything. Again, it's not an insult, it's an observation. They have obviously chosen to do certain things, but it's obvious that they had to give up other things to do so.

 

Even half that time, say 6 hours a day daily on a game is barely moderate. By historical standards or even contemporary standards (depending on what place you look at it), spending 12+ hours on a purely non-productive, purely leisurely, and mostly non-educational activity is not moderate.

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You don't have to sacrifice your life to gain exp. The point still stands that what you said is extremely ignorant

Suomi, Drumgun, Forsberg, et al sacrificed their lives to gain xp so I'm not sure where these top 200m all contenders with balanced lives you speak of are.

 

Last time I checked, it takes at least 20,000 hours to get 200M all without spins (over 30k for Suomi IIRC). Care to explain how one can remain a top contender for that achievement while playing in moderation? Be specific with your hours logged.

 

If your point was that anyone can get 99 all skills in moderation these days, then yes I would probably agree with you, especially if they were buying spins. But 200m all skills? No way, Jose.

 

How can you be this stupid?

 

 

Do you have anything aside from meaningless ad hominems? Your assertion is completely delusional - the math and empirical evidence is completely against you. It is not possible to get the sort of experience gains that top players do within the timespan that they do by just playing in moderation. It is simply not possible no matter how much you want to believe otherwise. That's not an insult or indictment of top players, it's just a fact.

 

Yes, to get top rank you'd have to sacrifice some aspects of your life, but I'm arguing against something you implied, that gaining exp requires it.

You can play like 12 hours a day and don't have to sacrifice anything, so 200m all doesn't require sacrificing anything major, besides, in a year from now it will be 5k hours so it won't matter.

 

 

I didn't say gaining experience requires it. I said gaining experience at the rate that top players do it and within the timespan they gain it in does. There's a different between those two statements and it's not subtle.

 

Also, 12 hours is not 'moderate' gameplay even by generous definitions. That's more time than a full-time job, and half your day. It's completely astounding that you think people who sit at a computer (aside from say the well documented medical issues, such as say back problems, eye-sight, etc.) aren't sacrificing anything. They are sacrificing their health and a myriad of other things. You can argue that's their choice and that they have the right to do this, but it's completely unscientific, and not to mention pretty much contradicted by health sciences (physical and psychological), to claim that they aren't sacrificing anything. Again, it's not an insult, it's an observation. They have obviously chosen to do certain things, but it's obvious that they had to give up other things to do so.

 

Even half that time, say 6 hours a day daily on a game is barely moderate. By historical standards or even contemporary standards (depending on what place you look at it), spending 12+ hours on a purely non-productive, purely leisurely, and mostly non-educational activity is not moderate.

 

yep

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We'll just have to agree to disagree on this then. I consider a life of unhappiness to be a life not worth living.

But the point is happiness is subjective and your perceived concept of a perfectly happy lifestyle is just as wrong as the ones you are judging. People are unique and we all enjoy different balances of different things.

 

Some people are asexual/aromantic for no reason other than they don't feel those emotions. Some people absolutely don't go out and party because they don't enjoy it. There is nothing wrong with these people, they are simply being themselves.

 

 

Pretty sure his message is saying that most people most of the time would regret devoting 20-30k hours to runescape and that for any typical person to go after such a goal they would likely regret the years they put into it.

 

Sure you can balance life with runescape but you really can't and be a top player.

 

 

I have a problem with that "regret" thing people talk about so often and "unfinished business".

 

Let's be honest about your time. Whatever you have done on the past is a proccess that ended. There's nothing to "finish" and nothing to "regret" because you will NOT be able to change it. If you wanna regret anything, choose regret spending your time on present feeling bad about something that you can't change.

 

When my grandfather was dying from cancer he told me "If I regret anything that I have done, it is looking at my past while my future just pass by without me noticing it". And you can really change your future.

 

 

Let me tell you one thing: if you're playing for 12 hours a day, you're sacrificing a lot, whether you're aware of it or not.

 

Well, every time you do something, you are sacrificing another, whether you're aware of it or not. So, you're 24/7 sacrificing something that you could do instead. If choose to go through that, I would like you to save time and immediatly lock yourself into a mental hospital because that's what will happen to you if you bother with that too much. :D

 

This is one of the reasons why you should focous on doing what makes you happy. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You don't have to sacrifice your life to gain exp. The point still stands that what you said is extremely ignorant

Suomi, Drumgun, Forsberg, et al sacrificed their lives to gain xp so I'm not sure where these top 200m all contenders with balanced lives you speak of are.

 

Last time I checked, it takes at least 20,000 hours to get 200M all without spins (over 30k for Suomi IIRC). Care to explain how one can remain a top contender for that achievement while playing in moderation? Be specific with your hours logged.

 

If your point was that anyone can get 99 all skills in moderation these days, then yes I would probably agree with you, especially if they were buying spins. But 200m all skills? No way, Jose.

 

How can you be this stupid?

 

 

Do you have anything aside from meaningless ad hominems? Your assertion is completely delusional - the math and empirical evidence is completely against you. It is not possible to get the sort of experience gains that top players do within the timespan that they do by just playing in moderation. It is simply not possible no matter how much you want to believe otherwise. That's not an insult or indictment of top players, it's just a fact.

 

Yes, to get top rank you'd have to sacrifice some aspects of your life, but I'm arguing against something you implied, that gaining exp requires it.

You can play like 12 hours a day and don't have to sacrifice anything, so 200m all doesn't require sacrificing anything major, besides, in a year from now it will be 5k hours so it won't matter.

 

 

I didn't say gaining experience requires it. I said gaining experience at the rate that top players do it and within the timespan they gain it in does. There's a different between those two statements and it's not subtle.

 

Also, 12 hours is not 'moderate' gameplay even by generous definitions. That's more time than a full-time job, and half your day. It's completely astounding that you think people who sit at a computer (aside from say the well documented medical issues, such as say back problems, eye-sight, etc.) aren't sacrificing anything. They are sacrificing their health and a myriad of other things. You can argue that's their choice and that they have the right to do this, but it's completely unscientific, and not to mention pretty much contradicted by health sciences (physical and psychological), to claim that they aren't sacrificing anything. Again, it's not an insult, it's an observation. They have obviously chosen to do certain things, but it's obvious that they had to give up other things to do so.

 

Even half that time, say 6 hours a day daily on a game is barely moderate. By historical standards or even contemporary standards (depending on what place you look at it), spending 12+ hours on a purely non-productive, purely leisurely, and mostly non-educational activity is not moderate.

 

 

Ofc it's not scientific and not according to "health sciencies" and I'm glad I don't agree with those.

 

Once I had an interesting client that proves that "health sciences" are crap. He told me that his routine before dating was work hard on his goals during the day and relax in his home for the rest of the day and he was a really happy guy. Then he started dating and was still happy and kept spending the rest of the day in his home but now with his girlfriend.

 

So, they broke up and he felt terrible and decided to go to a psychologist (health science professional, right?). So, the psychologist made him feel better about the broke up proccess and then the psychologist insisted that the guy had to change his routines. The guy asked "why? I am happy!" and she said "well, you need to be social and communicate with lots of people otherwise you can't be healthy!!!". So the poor guy changed his routines and indeed started to have more and more friends but he was also about to suicide.

 

So, he came to me and asked for my help. I told him "go back to your routine." He looked at me thinking that I was even more crazy than him but still decided to go back to his routine - what really made him happy. And he's now as happy as he was before dating and all the mess.

 

See, Psychologists work are based on statistics. My question is "What do you do when someone doesn't work like most people?". Not even a single psychiatrist or psychologist gave me a answer to that one.

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