Scientology? Scam? Cult? Religion? Joke?

[Zamorakshadow]

Scientology is all 3. A scam, a cult and a joke. Loved the south park episode that revealed Scientology secrets, ones that are only supposed to be told to someone who donates lots of money.

 

 

 

How are all religions a scam? I'm Christian, and I follow the moral guidelines of the Bible. I didn't pay a cent to do so.

 

 

 

On Topic: Scientology is a joke in my opinion.

 

:wall: :wall: :wall: :wall:

 

The bible does not give you your morals, unless you're homophobic and sexist and all the other crap that's in there. You have your own based on society.

 

 

If you read the bible, you will find out that not even Jesus followed the guidelines of that book <_<

[Nero]

Scientology is all 3. A scam, a cult and a joke. Loved the south park episode that revealed Scientology secrets, ones that are only supposed to be told to someone who donates lots of money.

 

 

 

How are all religions a scam? I'm Christian, and I follow the moral guidelines of the Bible. I didn't pay a cent to do so.

 

 

 

On Topic: Scientology is a joke in my opinion.

 

:wall: :wall: :wall: :wall:

 

The bible does not give you your morals, unless you're homophobic and sexist and all the other crap that's in there. You have your own based on society.

 

 

If you read the bible, you will find out that not even Jesus followed the guidelines of that book <_<

And Moses had his own people killed when they didn't do what he wanted haha.

[Lenin64]

I'm a Latter-Day Saint so this topic is offensive to me.

Can you stop spamming?

It would be okay if you were at least funny.

He wants to get up to the Chicken [bleep]er rank (or whatever it is, can't remember).

I didn't know we had a "Kentucky" rank.

 

I think I have to watch that South Park episode now. I'td probably make more sense than the actual religion.

[warri0r45]

Any so-called religion that asks you to pay exorbitant amounts of money for their beliefs is surely a scam.

[vivimancer]

right ... fisrt please see the relivant South Park episode

and then google project chanology

 

also i really like I_hate_libs I think i saw you iRL once took a picture

 

[Skeptical]

All religions are a joke and a scam... Scientology is just a form of brainwashing that has received attention from the media because celebrities participate in it.

[Danqazmlp]

This is a bit of a large bump, but after watching BBC's Panorama tonight I thought about revisiting this topic here. If you are in the UK, I encourage you to watch it on i-player.

 

Details of uncovered:

 

-The presenter was indeed followed and spied on in this and the previous program.

- Families are brainwashed into totally neglecting other family members who have left the church.

- Many members categorically deny the whole intergalactic warlord story behind the religion.

- Mothers are encouraged to have abortions when part of the sea org.

- They have an evil leader, and evil HQ, evil bases around the world, an evil organisation and Batman is soon to be after them.

 

 

 

John Sweeney revisits the Church of Scientology In 2007, while investigating the Church of Scientology for Panorama, reporter John Sweeney had a dramatic on-camera confrontation with a church spokesman named Tommy Davis. The church was accusing the reporter of bias and it attempted to stop the documentary from being broadcast - a campaign backed by Scientology A-lister John Travolta. Sweeney has returned to investigate the church again. Pushing John Sweeney's 'bigot' button I never meant to shout. Strangers had been on my tail. Scientologist Tommy Davis and his colleague Mike Rinder - my handlers - had been on my case, day in and day out. They had taken me to an exhibit called 'Psychiatry: Industry of Death' on Hollywood Boulevard, where a Scientologist told me psychiatrists set up the Holocaust. I feared I was being brain-washed. And then I lost it - big time. The Church of Scientology put out my impression of an exploding tomato onto the internet which millions had a laugh at courtesy of YouTube. It was no way for me to behave. I apologised then and I apologise now. Shortly after that programme, Scientology & Me, aired in 2007, I received a tip-off that Mike Rinder had left the church. Three years on and my old adversary came to me to shed some light on what had been going on behind the scenes in the days leading up to my infamous meltdown and screaming session in Los Angeles. Now an independent Scientologist, Mike is critical of the church and of its leader David Miscavige, who was actor Tom Cruise's best man at his wedding to Katie Holmes. Mike, 55, wanted to meet and talk about his life in the church, which he was a part of from the age of six. 'Freed' He began by telling me about the moment when he decided to get out: "I knew as I was walking out - that was the last time I would ever talk to my wife, my children, the rest of my family. I couldn't take it anymore. When I left I felt I had been freed." FIND OUT MORE Panorama, BBC One Secrets of Scientology Tuesday, 9pm Mike was subjected to what the church calls disconnection. His wife, daughter, son, brother and mother have cut him out of their lives. Mike was one of a number of people we met who effectively grew up in the church and have since left. Those who speak out say they can be deemed by the church to be enemies and subjected to disconnection - when all ties to family and friends are severed. The Panorama team were followed while filming in America The church acknowledges some Scientologists choose to sever communications with family members who leave. The church says it is a fundamental human right to cease communication with someone. It adds disconnection is used against expelled members and those who attack the church. During our investigation in 2007, black SUVs with tinted windows appeared to be following our team as we carried out interviews. A mystery man who we suspected was from the church also appeared to be keeping tabs on us at breakfast in our LA hotel each morning. At the time, I put my suspicions of being under surveillance to Tommy Davis. He responded: "I don't know what you're talking about. It seems to me you're getting a bit paranoid." Mike Rinder has since given me a different answer. "Was I being paranoid?" I asked him when we met again. "No, you were being followed. No doubt whatsoever," he told me. Mike said he should know as it was he and Tommy Davis who were doing some of the covert surveillance. Mike said he and Tommy were reporting back on our movements to David Miscavige's office every few minutes or so. Through its UK lawyers, the firm Carter-Ruck, the church deny spying on us and reject Mike Rinder's version of events dating back to 2007. Celebrity members The public face of the church is as a force for good, perhaps most familiar to the public for its offers of free stress tests at its shopfront centres in major cities. Its star members include Tom Cruise, John Travolta, Kirstie Alley and Juliette Lewis. When I interviewed Alley in 2007 and put the question to her that many believe Scientology to be a sinister brain-washing cult, she replied: "Would you ever sit with a Jew and tell them that their religion is a cult?" When I asked the same question of Juliette Lewis, star of the film Natural Born Killers, she replied: "Some people say women are really stupid and shouldn't have the vote." Panorama Archive: Scientology and Me The church said it is a religion and is recognised as such in America for tax purposes. It denies emphatically that it is a cult and has maintained that I am biased. Many ex-Scientologists disagree with the celebrities who defend the church. Amy Scobee, now in her mid-40s, is a former member who said she believes it is "a dangerous cult". She was a member from the age of 14, much of her time in the church was spent as part of what is known as the Sea Org - the highly-disciplined wing that effectively runs the church's day to day operations. Private details When Ms Scobee left and began to criticise David Miscavige and the church, intimate details of her sex life before she was married leaked to the St Petersburg Times in Florida newspaper. The church admits sending the newspaper material about Ms Scobee's sex life, but said it was acceptable because the information was contained in an affidavit signed by her. They say it was not confidential. Ms Scobee said she had disclosed those details but she believed they would remain confidential. During our time in America for the latest Panorama, we were once again followed by people filming us, this time more openly than before. When we approached the people with cameras to ask them who they were with and what they were doing, they refused to answer our questions. That is why I was somewhat grateful to Scientology's UK lawyers at Carter-Ruck when they sent the BBC photographs of me hugging Amy Scobee at the end of a long and at times harrowing series of interviews about her experiences. The photographs were meant to demonstrate to my bosses at the BBC, once again, that I must be biased against the church as I was overly familiar with its critics. This was, oddly enough, welcome proof that the people who had been following and filming us in the States were indeed working for the Church of Scientology. As Mike Rinder had said, I was not being paranoid - I was being followed.

 

[20Rice04]

There are two kinds of Believers I just can't stand:

 

Scientologists

Militants

 

Scientology is just a scam, if you're going to create a religion please make it something which is [bleep]ing credible.

As for militant Religious fanatics ( Including Athiests) don't get me started.

[Racheya]

I watched it too. Nothing new for those well educated on the cult, yes I call it a cult not a religion, but still interesting to watch. I really encourage people who don't know much about Scientology to find out online. Not from THEIR website, but sites like xenu.net and whyweprotest.net that know the truth.

[sees_all1]

Ah, Scientology. If you don't like it, maybe you should buy shamwows.

 

:thumbup:

[Danqazmlp]

Ah, Scientology. If you don't like it, maybe you should buy shamwows.

 

:thumbup:

 

Is that true or very clever advertising? If its true I may go and buy some things I will never use.

[Skeptical]

To 20Rice, I am a militant atheist. You just happen to believe that you can blast one religion, while pretending that the one that you follow is any different.

 

 

All religion by definition is a cult:

"cult: (followers of an exclusive system of religious beliefs and practices) " Source

 

I'm actually quite fond of good old scientology: it raises quite the interesting question: what qualifies a religion? A good few years ago, a group of people wrote the bible. It's still hanging around. Why didn't people decry it the way they do the followers of this harmless faith? After all, they've never protested abortion, committed murders, molested children... probably a good bit of financial crime, but how does that compare to the incomparable harm committed by the three major mono-theistic religions that we somehow believe are special?

[ember3579]

To 20Rice, I am a militant atheist. You just happen to believe that you can blast one religion, while pretending that the one that you follow is any different.

 

 

All religion by definition is a cult:

"cult: (followers of an exclusive system of religious beliefs and practices) " Source

 

I'm actually quite fond of good old scientology: it raises quite the interesting question: what qualifies a religion? A good few years ago, a group of people wrote the bible. It's still hanging around. Why didn't people decry it the way they do the followers of this harmless faith? After all, they've never protested abortion, committed murders, molested children... probably a good bit of financial crime, but how does that compare to the incomparable harm committed by the three major mono-theistic religions that we somehow believe are special?

 

 

You need to draw a distinction between normal, law-abiding, reasonable people and the fringe lunatics of a group. You get any group big enough, you will find people who abuse it for evil purposes. The thing separating religions from cults by popular definition is this: religions don't want to brainwash or hurt innocent people, but cults do. Scientology is a group of fringe lunatics by its basest levels. Just because someone doesn't think that everything ends when we physically die isn't a good reason to label someone as a screwball. When you try, it makes your position look worse. And yes, religious folks have been guilty of this too.

[20Rice04]

To 20Rice, I am a militant atheist. You just happen to believe that you can blast one religion, while pretending that the one that you follow is any different.

 

Sorry, wut? Your post their would imply that I follow a religion, which I do not, I am Agnostic. The problem I have with Militant's of any religion as that by deffinition, in my eyes anyway, they go too far.

 

Militant Christians led "Holy Crusades", Militant Islamic groups are currently a source of turbulence to the safety of the World in general and Militant Athiests seem to think that they've got it all figured out so it's okay for them to harass all religions as they see fit. Just because they have a lack of faith does not mean they need to instill such ignorance in others. The only reason I mentioned Athiests in particular was because most people would probably overlook them entirely.

[sees_all1]

Ah, Scientology. If you don't like it, maybe you should buy shamwows.

 

:thumbup:

 

Is that true or very clever advertising? If its true I may go and buy some things I will never use.

I searched for the names, and yes, he did file a lawsuit. That was a few years ago, I don't know the outcome of it. But it does mean that Headset Vince did, in fact, sue scientology.

[Skeptical]

To 20Rice, I am a militant atheist. You just happen to believe that you can blast one religion, while pretending that the one that you follow is any different.

 

Sorry, wut? Your post their would imply that I follow a religion, which I do not, I am Agnostic. The problem I have with Militant's of any religion as that by deffinition, in my eyes anyway, they go too far.

 

Militant Christians led "Holy Crusades", Militant Islamic groups are currently a source of turbulence to the safety of the World in general and Militant Athiests seem to think that they've got it all figured out so it's okay for them to harass all religions as they see fit. Just because they have a lack of faith does not mean they need to instill such ignorance in others. The only reason I mentioned Athiests in particular was because most people would probably overlook them entirely.

 

Absolutely. I pride myself on not standing by while evil acts are committed. I will not tolerate discrimination against myself or others, or the abuse of any human being, if I can prevent it.

 

Religion is not just incorrect. If it was merely incorrect, I wouldn't have much of a problem with it: more of something along the lines of eye-rolling and exasperation. But it is evil.

[fakeitormakeit2]

Scientology is all 3. A scam, a cult and a joke. Loved the south park episode that revealed Scientology secrets, ones that are only supposed to be told to someone who donates lots of money.

 

 

 

How are all religions a scam? I'm Christian, and I follow the moral guidelines of the Bible. I didn't pay a cent to do so.

 

 

 

On Topic: Scientology is a joke in my opinion.

 

:wall: :wall: :wall: :wall:

 

The bible does not give you your morals, unless you're homophobic and sexist and all the other crap that's in there. You have your own based on society.

 

 

If you read the bible, you will find out that not even Jesus followed the guidelines of that book <_<

Oh you silly ignorant people who make presumptions. Perhaps you should read a bit before you assume.

"Do not think that I came to destroy the Law but to fulfill it." Jesus's human life and death was the essential fulfillment and if one says they are a Christian yet all the old laws are still in effect, they might as well not be Christian, as they're missing a large point. There is a pattern of covenants between God and people, every time a covenant is made there are new terms.

 

Jesus always emphasizes the difference between the rules of men, such as the unessential rituals, in comparison what must really be done, i.e. moral action. Hence the story of the Good Samaritan, I'm sure you've heard of it. I despise how often it is recited and paraphrased, and yet most people don't even know in what context it was delivered. Jesus was telling it to an expert on the Law, Jesus laughed at the stupidity of them putting rituals before morals and made the underdog Samaritan, who the Jews would have considered a pagan, the one who acted righteously and morally.

 

So you two posters are both wrong. The bible does give moral guidance [what do you think the parables are? To state one of many deliveries] and Jesus followed all the rules.

 

And @Skeptical, I don't find religion incorrect or "evil" at all. It is an abstract idea. It does not think nor is it conscious, therefore it cannot be evil. Religion in itself is a good thing, as it is unifying, a rallying point for doing good things. However, an evil person can come along and manipulate religion to serve their evil purposes. Then they aren't being religious, they're just being vicious deceivers who wish to fulfill their own materialistic whims.

 

I also don't like how many people refer to the Crusades and pin it on all Christians, which is very ignorant. May I remind you that the Christians of the Far East, Antiochene, Alexandrian, Edessan and Constantinoplean traditions [currently number a quarter of all Christians, which is estimated to be much less than what they use to be pre-complete Islamization] had little to do with it and payed the blunt of the anger meant for the Crusaders. The Crusaders sack Constantinople, now correct me if I'm wrong but people normally don't loot their own cities.

[Alg]

I'm starting to get the impression that people who refuse to study a topic in detail (Such as Theology) shouldn't complain if it turns out that they don't know what they're talking about. :razz:

 

As for Scientology, I don't know or care enough to make a judgment.

[Skeptical]

It's not about making judgments, but seeking the truth.

[Alg]

It's not about making judgments, but seeking the truth.

Good and bad is judgment. What the belief system is, is truth. At the moment I don't care enough to learn the truth of what Scientologists believe, so I'm not going to say whether said beliefs are good or bad.

[Skeptical]

The truth is impartial. Morality is a human construct.

[Alg]

The truth is impartial. Morality is a human construct.

And I'm saying I'm indifferent to the truth of this topic. Morality doesn't factor in to not wanting to form an opinion without facts.

 

Also, pretty sure you are human.

[Skeptical]

The truth is impartial. Morality is a human construct.

And I'm saying I'm indifferent to the truth of this topic. Morality doesn't factor in to not wanting to form an opinion without facts.

 

Also, pretty sure you are human.

 

Yes. I'm not quite clear on what your point is. And yes, morality is factored into every decision that a human being makes. It''s a symptom of our humanity: we can temper it with logic, it can be coloured by our experiences, but in the end we will all develop a sense of morality.

[fakeitormakeit2]

The truth is impartial. Morality is a human construct.

And I'm saying I'm indifferent to the truth of this topic. Morality doesn't factor in to not wanting to form an opinion without facts.

 

Also, pretty sure you are human.

I admire you and your lack of stupidity.

[blakdragon39]

It's not about making judgments, but seeking the truth.

Good and bad is judgment. What the belief system is, is truth. At the moment I don't care enough to learn the truth of what Scientologists believe, so I'm not going to say whether said beliefs are good or bad.

 

I on the other hand, WANT to know what they believe, before making any judgements! ALL I've read on this thread is that scientology is evil, the church is evil, its all a scam/cult/evil and it's just for money. Does ANYONE know what they actually believe in?