Fire cape compromise. New post by Mod Chris L.

[Me_Hate_Libs]

Ya'll are starting to scare me about how hard Jad will be when I give it a go someday. I also have a degenerative issue with the joints in my hands -- it's called old age. I'm a horrible clicker -- regularly get my butt whipped anytime I try anything like pvp. But I've always assumed that with a little patience I'd be able to put up the right prayer at the right time. Is it really impossible for any but the most agile?

 

My problem is that I can't do anything for two hours straight. My hands get too tired and I screw up. By the time I get to Jad, my hands are throbbing. Logging out doesn't help either because when you log in you get killed quickly before you can react. Jad isn't that tough though.

 

Oh, and I'm simply not quick enough for Nomad. That kinda sucks.

[stonewall337]

[hide]

Don't worry denby, I'm currently writing a reply for that thread and will be putting it across any I find.

 

I don't care what people think on here, but this is my personal feelings and therefore my reply to the thread:

 

"I ABSOLUTELY CANNOT BELIEVE THIS! :o I AM OUTRAGED AND UTTERLY DISGUSTED AND DISAPPOINTED IN JAGEX :@

 

Jagex you have once again given in to the whiners and the whingers of the game that actually do make up the majority. So far, from everything you have done this year, it seems only correct to quote Aneron from Tip.it: "heaven forbid you have to do something that takes just an ounce of skill to access content in this game". The only thing that seems to have stayed the same is the difficulty of Nomad; however I wouldn't hold my breath too long for fear of passing out.

 

I am utterly appalled that you would do this..... On something that has given such good feedback! EVERYONE on TIF has praised you for the high level slayer update. Yes the first few days caused murmurs because of the fire cape achievement; but then it dawned on people. Those who have 93 slayer.... Surely to God by then SHOULD be able to kill Jad..... Even make a mockery out of him.

 

Jagex; you should have the courage of your convictions to ignore the minority or majority of whingers (whichever it is) and not dilute an update that was fine to begin with.

 

This is an upsetting and depressing day. You are going to make a good piece of content just to ruin it? Then I ask myself why should I bother getting myself high skills, or doing things in the game that you need skill for? Sooner or later you're going to do something like this and make that achievement no longer worth while. It took me my first try for my fire cape at 85 defence, 70 range and 70 prayer..... I think that any level 93 slayer should atleast have those stats, and therefore should atleast have an equal chance as I to get past Jad. Heck, all I wanted to do was kill a ket zek for my Karamja Diary.

 

You truly make this rookie sad. Why should I train slayer now? You'll just make the ice wyrms lower because not as many people can access them and they'll whinge about it?

 

I expected better. I... I am speechless and disillusioned."

 

I then put this because I am getting more angry the more I think about it:

 

"I'm double posting here; but still this is one last point I think:

 

If Jagex really stands for "Just About The Gaming Experience" then think of the experience of everyone else. And then think about your own experience. You made the content. You gave the requirements because it was something you enjoyed. How does it feel to see you having to change your work just to cave into the whingers? How does it feel that something you've worked on for months goes to dust because someone doesn't like it?

 

You aren't about the gaming experience. If you were then you'd stick true to your convictions and your experiences. The fact is that if you kept this piece of content you'd listen to more of the whingers with their empty threats to quit and to you that's cash. £3 for members by card up to £6 for members by text. That's £30 for every 10 people that threaten..... That is business talk and business decisions Jagex.

 

When MMG came up, I believed him. I truly did. You have destroyed my trust in you, and probably alot of other players trust. I doubt you'll even bother to reply to this post and even try to work back for a scrap of honour, dignity or trust."

 

Could some please explain how 93 slayer is in any way similar to killing jad? You don't need good internet connection or reflexes or learn not to panic in stressful situations for slayer. And as for stats and gear, those don't count much towards Jad. Pures who are good at prayer switching can kill him with flowers. (I don't know this, but I know pures have killed him and I know he's been killed with flowers.) Personally, I think the compromise was too in favour of people with a firecape, but then again I don't know how many points you need to spend. As for the experience of everyone else, what about the experience of people who have failed 10 times on jad? People who simply do not have the internet connection? Or just simply panic and die? Also, there is a difference between listening to constructive criticism and giving into whiners. Besides, people who have 93 slayer and complain about it aren't likely to be your average immature forum whiner.

 

"I already have the level to kill those but a minigame is preventing me!?" Can you see where the hubbub begins at least? :wink:

 

Not really much difficult than having a slayer monster that, say, requires a quest to access.

 

Personally my thing with the fire cape req is that a quest can be done without a chance of failure and wasting X hours doing it over and over with nothing to show for it.

 

Summer's End.

While Guthix Sleeps.

Nomad's Requiem.

Mourning's End Pt. II.

 

Need I continue?

PAH! Having done Jad and all the quests, none of those come close. Mep2 comes close, with that stupid agility part that I failed 50 times...But failing 50 times takes less then 3 hours. Nomads Requiem and Summers End also has a lot of deaths, but you can go back and try again within 5 minutes. Jad takes 3 hours to try again. And I have no idea why you think WGS is that hard.

 

Life. Isn't. Fair.

 

Either get a fire cape, or don't kill them.

 

If you want zerker (I) you spend 20+ hours getting 300 MA ranks. Should be EASY to get a fire cape in 20 hours.

 

 

1. Not really, 10 Firecape attempts can be up to 30 hours, and even then you might lose.

 

2. Life isn't fair. Deal with people without firecape killing ice strykewyrms?

 

I'm not a 93 slayer nor do i have a firecape yet, but I don't think that the requirement to have a firecape to kill them is unfair. If you can "grind" to 93 slayer then you should be able to spend a couple hours to get a firecape. However, since they did say they were going to change it, I think they should do one of 2 things:

 

1. They should either make very few (maybe 2 or 3) available to kill outside the area they're in now that don't drop staffs.

 

Or...

 

2. They should allow those without a firecape into the caves to kill the icewyrms, but with a significantly lowered drop rate of the SoL and reduced damage done to the icewyms.

 

Just my take on the issue though <_<

 

You forget one thing. You can't grind jad. With slayer, once you put in enough hours, you have 99. With Jad, it isn't guaranteed. Plus, you level up as you do slayer. If you do 3 hours at jad, then lose to jad, you've accomplished nothing except some range exp. Also, leave the sol drop-rate alone. You already need 93 slayer and task to kill them.

 

To play the devil's advocate, you don't have to wait 2 hours before getting to the boss fight in the God Wars Dungeon.

 

In Fight Caves, you can lose your progress if you disconnect in the middle of a wave. You get kicked out and have to start all over again.

 

 

For the people saying they have issues with reflexes and/or internet connection (and advocating the idea of 'time should be able to solve everything in RuneScape'), even if you remove the 2 hours of grinding prior to seeing Jad, they won't be able to beat it anyway, so what makes this point a legitimate argument?

^^

this. Only half the issue is connection.

 

This is mainly about adult players on the RSOF complaining that they can make it to jad but cant kill him. And honestly if they cant handle Jad they dont deserve free mills. (sorry im saying the same thing over again but im trying to beat this logic into peoples heads)

 

This isn't logic. It's an opinion. Logic has reasoning and understanding, not just stubbornly sticking to one point to try and force it down other people's throats.

 

Very disappointing. No reason why people can't get a cape if they have 93 slay

 

I can name one reason: Laggy connections. Its the one main reason i will never attain a fire cape,,, (untill of coure better pc or internt, both i have to pay for comes along)

 

But i, Personally don't care otherwise, just that post above bugged me

And what's stopping you from going to a friend's house? A library?

 

Sigh this is gonna turn into the new should f2p get skill capes debate isn't it?

 

For one you might be in the country where everyones internet connection is the same, if they have any at all.

 

2nd, just personally but the nearest library is a 3 hr round trip.

 

not everyone lives in a city where you can have anything in a 10 minute walk.

 

Then don't play the game. Just because of your personal issues (no money to pay members, no good connection to fight Jad among other dangerous game content), doesn't mean that we compromise on everything. Is the world unfair? I'm glad you realised that. That applies even for a game.

 

But hey, Jagex won't hear us here. I need to devote more time to posting on the RSOF.

 

WHY THE [bleep] DON'T YOU DEAL WITH IT INSTEAD! I AM SICK OF EVERYONE HERE BEING UNABLE TO DEAL WITH THE LACK OF FIRECAPE REQUIREMENT AND TELLING PEOPLE TO SUCK IT UP! WHY DON'T YOU SUCK IT UP AS WELL!

 

Sorry about that, but this is really irratating me.

 

Wewt jagex nerfed the ONLY thing that justified the reward.

 

Idc if they made it cost 10k slayer points, this is about combat expertise not mindless grinding. :thumbdown:

 

On the bright side at least SoL will be cheap (worthless) soon enough

 

Yeah. Afterall, 93 slayer is easy. I have 20 accounts with that, 15 of them with ice strykewyrm tasks.

 

And could someone come up with one good reason to make Jad a requirement? Other then, Jagex shouldn't nerf stuff, it makes it more elite, because 93 slayer and task only isn't enough. As for life not being fair, well, maybe life isn't fair and you need to deal with Jad not being a requirement. Or, if life not being fair is the reason for needing to kill jad, that implies you are criticizing Jagex for being fair? And again, 93 slayer is high level. Also, there's bad internet and there's bad for Jad internet. If you get a couple seconds of lag that messes up your prayer and you get k0ed... A couple seconds of lag every now and then isn't bad for must of RS except PVP and maybe difficult boss monsters. But with a good team, and not tanking....

 

However, after this huge rant, I must add that I dislike the compromise. The firecape doesn't offer a great advantage there anymore. I think perhaps Jagex should make firecape exclusive content that doesn't require something like 93 slayer?

 

And yes, it would have been better if Jagex did this upon release.

[/hide]

 

77 slayer= you have no right to comment. Get 93 slayer, try for a fire cape until you get one, and then find out jagex wants to remove req? No-uh.

 

You get SECONDS, not parts of a second, to change prayers. Jad is the EASIEST monster I know to change prayers on, except maybe TDS

I will try to kill anyone without a fire cape at ices.

[Me_Hate_Libs]

That was something I thought about as well. Is this a case that whiners got their way because of whining or that whiners got their way by accident? I'd like to believe in the latter, though I'm not that gullible.Would be nice if they told us the reasons for the change, such as the convo I had with a mod about my condition and my inability to kill Jad.

 

But no, they just stick to their line about "feedback." Specifics at Jagex is a four letter word.

[langer]

@Stonewall

 

How can you "kill" someone at Ice wyrms? Engage combat with a wyrm and move where someone is fighting another so "your" wyrm does a special attack on that player?

[SirHartlar]

 

 

So that's what happened to the Berlin wall.................... :blink:

 

I have to say that there were probably very few 93+ slayers who did not have a firecape though. Maybe there weren't but it seems unlikely.

 

Of the 30 93+ slayers I have talked this over with, only about half have fire-capes.

 

Berlin wall? Pshh, that wall got torn down. This is more like the wall dividing Cyprus, that is alive and kicking. On a serious note though: serious analysis requires thorough examination and reasoned argumentation :P

 

I'll be 93 Slayer eventually, but will never have Firecape due to my degenerative issues with the joints in my hands. Nice to know when I get that level, I'll be able to do them.

 

Ya'll are starting to scare me about how hard Jad will be when I give it a go someday. I also have a degenerative issue with the joints in my hands -- it's called old age. I'm a horrible clicker -- regularly get my butt whipped anytime I try anything like pvp. But I've always assumed that with a little patience I'd be able to put up the right prayer at the right time. Is it really impossible for any but the most agile?

 

My problem is that I can't do anything for two hours straight. My hands get too tired and I screw up. By the time I get to Jad, my hands are throbbing. Logging out doesn't help either because when you log in you get killed quickly before you can react. Jad isn't that tough though.

 

Oh, and I'm simply not quick enough for Nomad. That kinda sucks.

 

You can log out after each wave as far as I'm aware, which means you can do it in increments if you need to. :???:

[Me_Hate_Libs]

You can log out after each wave as far as I'm aware, which means you can do it in increments if you need to. :???:

 

But doing it after the 360s start to show up is suicide because when you log in, they spawn near you.

[BloodAngel]

But doing it after the 360s start to show up is suicide because when you log in, they spawn near you.

 

All you need to do it put on mage protect and run. They don't spawn right away, you have a few seconds to put distance between you and them.

[SirHartlar]

But doing it after the 360s start to show up is suicide because when you log in, they spawn near you.

 

You've got protection prayers and armour capable to withstand the opposite attack until you safespot, I'm sure it's possible.

[Soma2035]

But doing it after the 360s start to show up is suicide because when you log in, they spawn near you.

 

Not really.

 

1) The game gives you a short grace period when the wave begins, which includes if you log in. This means for the first couple seconds, the monsters will be there, but not attack.

2) Ket-Zek really doesn't hit that high. If your HP is decent, you can easily survive one hit, probably two. With good equipment, probably three.

3) There's no time limit, so if you wish, you can trap the remaining monsters on the wave and restore your hitpoints with the Enhanced Excalibur. Dream, Regen Bracelet, and resting can all be effective too, with patience, so as long as you survive the wave, the damage isn't necessarily a problem.

 

Keeping all this in mind, and the quick-prayers and hot keys, it's not hard at all to get through waves with Ket-Zek. I don't recommend logging out after Wave 61 though, for obvious reasons...

[Aneron]

I find it tremendously unfair that tormented demons attack with multiple attack styles. With my terrible reflexes, I am completely unable to kill them and fulfill my birthright as a player of runescape to get any item in the game that I want to.

[Obtaurian]

I find it tremendously unfair that tormented demons attack with multiple attack styles. With my terrible reflexes, I am completely unable to kill them and fulfill my birthright as a player of runescape to get any item in the game that I want to.

 

NO PAY TILL TD SLAY

[PereGrin]

But doing it after the 360s start to show up is suicide because when you log in, they spawn near you.

 

Not really.

 

1) The game gives you a short grace period when the wave begins, which includes if you log in. This means for the first couple seconds, the monsters will be there, but not attack.

2) Ket-Zek really doesn't hit that high. If your HP is decent, you can easily survive one hit, probably two. With good equipment, probably three.

3) There's no time limit, so if you wish, you can trap the remaining monsters on the wave and restore your hitpoints with the Enhanced Excalibur. Dream, Regen Bracelet, and resting can all be effective too, with patience, so as long as you survive the wave, the damage isn't necessarily a problem.

 

Keeping all this in mind, and the quick-prayers and hot keys, it's not hard at all to get through waves with Ket-Zek. I don't recommend logging out after Wave 61 though, for obvious reasons...

 

Well I died to jad yesterday, and today, and hopefully 3rd time is the charm cause im about to log in on wave 40 something. Soo, i will be posting in like 20-40 minutes, with results. Already failed while on slayer task :( just normally fighting now. Hope you are right about that grace period, otherwise im done for. Standing out the the middle of the cave and all

[wioneo]

Well I died to jad yesterday, and today, and hopefully 3rd time is the charm cause im about to log in on wave 40 something. Soo, i will be posting in like 20-40 minutes, with results. Already failed while on slayer task :( just normally fighting now. Hope you are right about that grace period, otherwise im done for. Standing out the the middle of the cave and all

 

I'd suggest that you hide like a wuss behind Italy before you log next time.

[Grimy_Bunyip]

I'd suggest that you hide like a wuss behind Italy before you log next time.

you log back in the center regardless of where you log off! isn't that awesome?

 

from what I heard, focus sight/hexcrest is still glitched against targets that do not have a slayer requirement to kill

in other words going on task with a focus sight won't be any easier than killing Jad without a task

 

Took me 4 tries personally, Don't sweat it too bad.

log off as many times as you need, look up new strategies

 

i personally prefer the keep prayer on pro mage at all times except when you see the range attack coming, since the range attack is easier to distinguish, and the magic attack looks similar to jad's recoil.

[stonewall337]

@Stonewall

 

How can you "kill" someone at Ice wyrms? Engage combat with a wyrm and move where someone is fighting another so "your" wyrm does a special attack on that player?

 

Yes. Get a few people doing it, and unless you pay 100% attention, that person is dead.

[Big_Stingman]

@Stonewall

 

How can you "kill" someone at Ice wyrms? Engage combat with a wyrm and move where someone is fighting another so "your" wyrm does a special attack on that player?

 

Yes. Get a few people doing it, and unless you pay 100% attention, that person is dead.

 

Why would anyone want to do that? It isn't like it would benefit them and they would get the drops (Because they won't)...I guess some people are just jerks.

[PereGrin]

I'd suggest that you hide like a wuss behind Italy before you log next time.

you log back in the center regardless of where you log off! isn't that awesome?

 

from what I heard, focus sight/hexcrest is still glitched against targets that do not have a slayer requirement to kill

in other words going on task with a focus sight won't be any easier than killing Jad without a task

 

Took me 4 tries personally, Don't sweat it too bad.

log off as many times as you need, look up new strategies

 

i personally prefer the keep prayer on pro mage at all times except when you see the range attack coming, since the range attack is easier to distinguish, and the magic attack looks similar to jad's recoil.

 

ah yes, i discovered this, and well, thats another 300k worth of pots gone :( 3 deaths in 2 days. wow, i dont even die this much pking.......

[Obtaurian]

@Stonewall

 

How can you "kill" someone at Ice wyrms? Engage combat with a wyrm and move where someone is fighting another so "your" wyrm does a special attack on that player?

 

Yes. Get a few people doing it, and unless you pay 100% attention, that person is dead.

 

Why would anyone want to do that? It isn't like it would benefit them and they would get the drops (Because they won't)...I guess some people are just jerks.

 

See someone slaying without a fire cape? Kill them. At least, that would work if the fire cape were actually vastly superior to other capes versus ice wyrms, which it's not, so you might accidentally kill someone who really DOES have a fire cape and chose not to wear it.

 

It's a fun idea in theory.

[Jehosaphat]

@Stonewall

 

How can you "kill" someone at Ice wyrms? Engage combat with a wyrm and move where someone is fighting another so "your" wyrm does a special attack on that player?

 

Yes. Get a few people doing it, and unless you pay 100% attention, that person is dead.

I see this as taking dislike for an update and turning into sheer, complete, unethical crap.

 

More on-topic: Jagex has taken pride for a good while in that their game can be run and enjoyed on practically any computer. When people stop enjoying it because of system requirements, Jagex plans to change it.

 

And it's not like the firecape is being completely demoted against the wyrms. I mean, you practically get a Kuradal ring bonus by using it, not to mention not needing to spend slayer points on the ability.