WikiLeaks releases footage believed to show civilian deaths in Iraq in 2007.

[Nero]

This is an article in 2007 detailing what happened: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/13/world/middleeast/13iraq.html?_r=3&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

 

Mod edit - This is actual footage of civilians being shot at, watch at your own risk.

(pff pansy)

 

 

This is the video:

(The two kind of conflict as to what actually happened)

 

Watch it while you can.

 

Idk how many people here have been following the [cabbage]e storm wiki threw up when it said it had the video, but it's out now.

[Skull]

I knew I wouldn't have to be the one to make the topic. I'm not positive where I stand on this. I think the soldiers made a mistake for sure, but it's hard to tell what happened beforehand. It sounded to me like they (or the troops on the ground) may have been taking fire in the time leading up to the event, which would make guys on the street with weapons a reasonable target to fire on. Firing on the van that came to pick up the wounded seemed unnecessary to me, since they apparently were not armed and didn't appear to make an attempt to pick up any of the weapons.

 

The soldiers in the helicopter did sound a bit over-eager to me, but I'm sure they were pretty stressed out and the only way to be absolutely sure it's safe is to kill the people who might be trying to harm you. I have no idea though, I've obviously never been in a situation like that.

[Faux]

The convo is hilarious, really shows the kind of people working for the US army. bunch of gun-trotting hicks.

[Laura]

"Well it's their fault for bringing their kids into battle."

"That's right."

 

That is the most disturbing aspect of the video.

[Kriegsmier]

I see weapons in that video. An RPG to be specific. Which is not legal to own. Each man can own 1 AK47, but no RPG. An RPG in a group of individuals...accessories? Its just like you being there if you friend committed a felony, even if you are standing away from him watching. You have to remember, 2007 was a big year in the war. One of the most deadliest for US troops, and a major troop surge. A lot of stuff was going on and the rules of engagement were still very open unlike they are now. One RPG can take down an Apache, one guy with the camera can put out a lot of propaganda.

 

I will say, I do not think they should of re-engaged the van picking up wounded. But up to that point I see no problem.

 

The convo is hilarious, really shows the kind of people working for the US army. bunch of gun-trotting hicks.

 

Ignorant statement.

[InkofDeath]

They had the valid reasoning with the guy that looked like he was holding an RPG. Don't take chances in such situations. I can completely side with the soldiers for why they took this course of action. It is war, you don't not do something because of possible consequences later. Even in the video as soon as they could make out the RPG, they were genuinely fearful and had to take action.

 

There is no right or wrong in this situation, it just will continue to happen.

[Faux]

Valid reasoning? The US army shouldn't even be in Iraq, let alone the Middle East.

 

But it's okay these civilians are killed because you secured the second largest oil reserves in the world.

[Nero]

I see weapons in that video. An RPG to be specific. Which is not legal to own. Each man can own 1 AK47, but no RPG. An RPG in a group of individuals...accessories? Its just like you being there if you friend committed a felony, even if you are standing away from him watching. You have to remember, 2007 was a big year in the war. One of the most deadliest for US troops, and a major troop surge. A lot of stuff was going on and the rules of engagement were still very open unlike they are now. One RPG can take down an Apache, one guy with the camera can put out a lot of propaganda.

 

I will say, I do not think they should of re-engaged the van picking up wounded. But up to that point I see no problem.

 

The convo is hilarious, really shows the kind of people working for the US army. bunch of gun-trotting hicks.

 

Ignorant statement.

 

The guy with the 'RPG' was actually a Reuters journalist with a camera.

[ThurinEthir]

"Well it's their fault for bringing their kids into battle."

"That's right."

 

That is the most disturbing aspect of the video.

I was about to say that.

Mistakes happen, even though this one was particularly tragic. Admitting those mistakes is what should be done though, rather than coming up with (lame) excuses.

And yea, those soldiers sounded pretty eager to kill. Guess that's why they're soldiers though.

[The Dark Lord]

"Well it's their fault for bringing their kids into battle."

"That's right."

 

That is the most disturbing aspect of the video.

I was about to say that.

Mistakes happen, even though this one was particularly tragic. Admitting those mistakes is what should be done though, rather than coming up with (lame) excuses.

And yea, those soldiers sounded pretty eager to kill. Guess that's why they're soldiers though.

 

 

I know a kid that's going to Afghanistan this December. He's a private, and he claims that he was told that they were going to launch an invasion of Iran. There are a lot of people like the soldiers in the video in the US army...

[Abc1230]

Didn't we like... uh... carpet bomb the hell outta Europe and Japan in WWII? :/ It could be worse :P

[Giordano]

I [bleep]ing hate cocky soldiers. :roll:

[Faux]

Didn't we like... uh... carpet bomb the hell outta Europe and Japan in WWII? :/ It could be worse :P

That was when the US was under real threat. You're doing it now because of oil.

 

Here's another story of civilians getting murdered by US forces

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/05/world/asia/05afghan.html?ref=world

[Kriegsmier]

Cocky? Eh. Someone said it. Thats why they are soldiers. Look back in history, most of the great armies hand selected the people for certain traits. Some people just can't hack it and only a special breed is prepared for war. So yes they can be cocky, confident, work well under pressure, be mentally stable to handle what they see, etc. Honestly I wouldn't expect you to understand because you've never been there or had that kind of rush.

 

Do I think they took this to far? Yes I do. Do I think they were right and had a valid reason for engaging? Hell yes.

 

I see weapons in that video. An RPG to be specific. Which is not legal to own. Each man can own 1 AK47, but no RPG. An RPG in a group of individuals...accessories? Its just like you being there if you friend committed a felony, even if you are standing away from him watching. You have to remember, 2007 was a big year in the war. One of the most deadliest for US troops, and a major troop surge. A lot of stuff was going on and the rules of engagement were still very open unlike they are now. One RPG can take down an Apache, one guy with the camera can put out a lot of propaganda.

 

I will say, I do not think they should of re-engaged the van picking up wounded. But up to that point I see no problem.

 

The convo is hilarious, really shows the kind of people working for the US army. bunch of gun-trotting hicks.

 

Ignorant statement.

 

The guy with the 'RPG' was actually a Reuters journalist with a camera.

 

Seriously? You must not be looking at the same person as me. That is definitely an RPG, he props it on the ground at one point. Its way to long and skinny to be a camera or an AK. And whats with him kneeling and peeking around the corner?

 

Didn't we like... uh... carpet bomb the hell outta Europe and Japan in WWII? :/ It could be worse :P

That was when the US was under real threat. You're doing it now because of oil.

 

Another ignorant statement. Oil? Really? Be real. Where is it then?

[tortilliachp]

Most of the Iraq war documentaries I know of, have been rated NC-17 due to violence, language or barbarity. Many of these haven't been released in America because of this rating. This censorship is over-reaching, because a nation that spends 4% of its GDP on war, without conscription, does not want to be confronted with the reality of its wars. They're freedom fighters right?

[Hunterowner]

Being from Baghdad, Iraq, this hit me hard. I'm speechless as to what they did. At the end where there is that one person walking on the sidewalk just as the building was fired upon with a missle was horrible. The whole video was horrible. That was clearly a camera ON A TRIPOD... not an RPG. They were reporters and the people surrounding them with the AK-47s were bodyguards for the reporters.

[Azvareth]

This video is abhorrent and it should be plastered on CNN and everywhere else, uncensored, running 24/7 for the next 3 days.

 

But it won't, because Tiger Woods just announced he's returning to golf.

[tortilliachp]

This video is abhorrent and it should be plastered on CNN and everywhere else, uncensored, running 24/7 for the next 3 days.

 

But it won't, because Tiger Woods just announced he's returning to golf.

 

no. it's probably illegal to show on US tv, unless it's late, you'd have to censor and bleep, because reality is too strong for people to see uncensored according to american law :S

[Dizzle229]

Lot of ignorance in this thread.

 

A ) You can't take chances in a situation like this. If it looks like a weapon, you have to take them down.

B ) Of course they're eager to kill. Would you put your faith into an army of people that is afraid to hurt someone?

C ) Accidents like these are GOING to happen.

 

Does that mean they did the right thing? Does that mean they didn't make a mistake? Absolutely not. I just don't think the entire U.S. armed forces should be condemned for it. And I agree with what Azvareth said, seems like people are more concerned with who the most popular celebrity is banging than what's going on in the world.

 

Eh, Krieg explained it better than I did.

[Hunterowner]

Lot of ignorance in this thread.

 

A ) You can't take chances in a situation like this. If it looks like a weapon, you have to take them down.

B ) Of course they're eager to kill. Would you put your faith into an army of people that is afraid to hurt someone?

C ) Accidents like these are GOING to happen.

 

Does that mean they did the right thing? Does that mean they didn't make a mistake? Absolutely not. I just don't think the entire U.S. armed forces should be condemned for it. And I agree with what Azvareth said, seems like people are more concerned with who the most popular celebrity is banging than what's going on in the world.

 

So your agreeing with this killing when its obviously a camera on a tripod? MAybe you should actually watch the video. Heck, those could have been my relatives or something. Guess I'll never know. Also, why did they have to shoot at that van? Please tell me that cause I'm dieing to know.

[Pinkbullet3]

So... what exactly is going to happen to these soldiers?

[Dizzle229]

Lot of ignorance in this thread.

 

A ) You can't take chances in a situation like this. If it looks like a weapon, you have to take them down.

B ) Of course they're eager to kill. Would you put your faith into an army of people that is afraid to hurt someone?

C ) Accidents like these are GOING to happen.

 

Does that mean they did the right thing? Does that mean they didn't make a mistake? Absolutely not. I just don't think the entire U.S. armed forces should be condemned for it. And I agree with what Azvareth said, seems like people are more concerned with who the most popular celebrity is banging than what's going on in the world.

 

So your agreeing with this killing when its obviously a camera on a tripod? MAybe you should actually watch the video. Heck, those could have been my relatives or something. Guess I'll never know. Also, why did they have to shoot at that van? Please tell me that cause I'm dieing to know.

 

Did you even read my post? I never said I agreed with it, but in the vid you can see how they could EASILY be mistaken for weapons. We know now the real story, but at first glance it looks like they're armed to the teeth, and stopping for a second glance can be the difference between life and death for someone on the ground. You really seem to think that these guys said "hey look dem civvies lets smoke em' LOL".

[Faux]

 

 

Another ignorant statement. Oil? Really? Be real. Where is it then?

So why are you in iraq again?

[Marco]

So... what exactly is going to these soldiers?

 

Well, judging by the opening text, nothing. 

 

 

 

 

"Reuters demanded an investigation into the killings. U.S. military authorities concluded that the actions of the soldiers and pilots involved were in accordance with the law of armed conflict and their Rules of Engagement."

[Hunterowner]

Lot of ignorance in this thread.

 

A ) You can't take chances in a situation like this. If it looks like a weapon, you have to take them down.

B ) Of course they're eager to kill. Would you put your faith into an army of people that is afraid to hurt someone?

C ) Accidents like these are GOING to happen.

 

Does that mean they did the right thing? Does that mean they didn't make a mistake? Absolutely not. I just don't think the entire U.S. armed forces should be condemned for it. And I agree with what Azvareth said, seems like people are more concerned with who the most popular celebrity is banging than what's going on in the world.

 

So your agreeing with this killing when its obviously a camera on a tripod? MAybe you should actually watch the video. Heck, those could have been my relatives or something. Guess I'll never know. Also, why did they have to shoot at that van? Please tell me that cause I'm dieing to know.

 

Did you even read my post? I never said I agreed with it, but in the vid you can see how they could EASILY be mistaken for weapons. We know now the real story, but at first glance it looks like they're armed to the teeth, and stopping for a second glance can be the difference between life and death for someone on the ground. You really seem to think that these guys said "hey look dem civvies lets smoke em' LOL".

 

I never said that you were agreeing to the situation, I was asking if you did. I understand what you mean that they do look alot like RPG's, but take in the factor of how many laps that helicopter took around the people and also of how many times he zoomed in on them. He should have been paying more attention instead of just killing for the fun of it.