Tip.It Times - 30th May 2010

[Racheya]

Time for a new release of the: >>>Tip.It Times!<<<

 

 

When replying please make sure to clarify the article you are replying to! Thanks!

 

If you spot any typos or mistakes in the article then please PM them to me :)

 

Enjoy the articles!

[Nomrombom]

To the Eggstreme article:

 

He's quite right with the Goldman Sachs link. Players and especially merchanting clans are basically the Wall Street of Runescape (if you don't know, Wall Street is where the big stock trading goes on along with multiple loan giants and banks). As you might know, the economy CRASHED afterwards and took a long time to rebound. Of course, this is Runescape, not the richest country in the world, but still.

 

It angers me to see price manipulators screw with the RS economy for their own benefit. Just like the predatory lenders... :???:

[Hedgehog]

Just What It Needed:

 

Castle wars, having always been my favorite activity, just got a little bit better in my eyes. The new rewards are very good stat-wise, the armor providing excellent, yet not overpowered, bonuses, the shield being great for prayer, and the halos are good helmet choices for any monster you pray against. However, none of them are too pleasing to the eye: the armor is just plain ugly, the shield is horrible (although the purple "things" are a nice touch), and the halos look more like plain, unmagical circles than halos. Overall, I'll be looking forward to playing this game when the hype dies down and my stats get a bit better, but don't expect me to go out of my way for any of the rewards.

[qeltar]

Decent introductory article on the issues with the GE and price manipulation.

 

The problems with it are easy to understand, and in fact easy to predict. Many people knew this would happen from the very start, because history shows that whenever you try to put excessive controls on a marketplace, you usually get worse problems than the ones you tried to correct.

 

Jagex is apparently not able to understand that you cannot create market stability through restraint of trade. the tight control mechanisms on the GE don't prevent abuses and manipulation, they enable these activities to occur.

[Kill_Life]

I liked the article about Price Manipulation.

 

Merchanters are the cause of the ridiculous prices in the GE.

People who have no idea of the GE but just want money do the rest and amplify it all.

[thunderlord]

I liked the article about Price Manipulation.

 

Merchanters Manipulators are the cause of the ridiculous prices in the GE.

People who have no idea of the GE but just want money do the rest and amplify it all.

 

Indeed A good article about the manipulation, I hope that in the near future Jagex will finally see that their system isn't working.

[civie]

Eggstreme Management:

 

I agree with the author.

In my view, there are only a few options: 1: manually adjust the prices of these rares so the ultra-rich collectors just lose money in a blink of an eye (hey, only those who caused it would be actually punished by this right?)

2: ban the known players (hmm, maybe a bit over-the-top)

3: remove the items from the game

 

I've been hating the ridiculous prices from the GE, and consequently, I've started to buy and sell at mid or lower prices only. Due to my pretty good stats, I can make almost all items I need myself. If every TIPIT'er would use the mid-price as the maximum, and we join forces with other communities we, the average players, can force the prices to stagnate and ultimately lower them.

 

The idea of the GE is pretty good actually, I love it even. The biggest problem are the merchanting clans, or better said GREED. To bad we can't erase this negative human factor...

[jettrider]

The DYK was actually wrong. A few of the gathering quests such as Doric's Quest, Cook's Assistant, and Witch's Potion can be completed within a few game ticks.

[Infi]

The DYK was actually wrong. A few of the gathering quests such as Doric's Quest, Cook's Assistant, and Witch's Potion can be completed within a few game ticks.

 

When I wrote that I took into consideration the time making the items for the quest, depends how you look at it.

 

Above poster got it in before me =D>

[UserOnRS]

The DYK was actually wrong. A few of the gathering quests such as Doric's Quest, Cook's Assistant, and Witch's Potion can be completed within a few game ticks.

"with no help from any other players!"

 

Also quests such as Cook's Assistant have been changed to make them longer and have untradable items which need to be collected.

 

The first article sums up my opinions, the halos do affect ranged and magic prayers though according to a JMod (the KB is wrong).

 

I haven't read the second one.

[tortilliachp]

the eggstreme manipulation article is a very notable topic, as each rare is being bought out one by one.

 

this week was santa week, where the exact same thing happened to santas. dip (caused by hoarders) followed by w2 filled with the same hoarders buying the rares up.

 

did you know that santas have a 4h buy limit of 2 santas, but no selling limit, so the dump was ensured to be 100% successful? could easily have been the same conglomerate of hoarders.

 

 

Sadly, this article could have helped prevent that if it had been published earlier. Now it may be close to impossible to get your hands on a rare through the ge, for the foreseeable future. That is, unless you camp GE updates.

[strilmus]

I'm being cold and spiteful here, but I'm hoping this destroys the rares market altogether.

 

If you play often enough you should be able to notice whenever a dump is happening anyway.....

 

It's hard not to notice a large crowd in the GE frantically trying to get rid of one type of thing.

[fragg]

im glad everyone enjoyed my article =)

[jettrider]

The DYK was actually wrong. A few of the gathering quests such as Doric's Quest, Cook's Assistant, and Witch's Potion can be completed within a few game ticks.

"with no help from any other players!"

 

Also quests such as Cook's Assistant have been changed to make them longer and have untradable items which need to be collected.

 

What prevents you from collecting the items beforehand *by yourself* and then going to the actual quest start point? For Doric's quest, you can mine the ores *yourself* then go to him and complete the quest in 2-3 game ticks.

 

For Witch's Potion, you need to start the quest, kill a rat and get its tail, then run back. You can gather the other items by yourself beforehand. This is still faster than The Blood Pact.

 

When I wrote that I took into consideration the time making the items for the quest, depends how you look at it.

 

The description was left ambiguous so you really didn't set the ground requirement that "shortest quest" meant total preparation time. If you think of special cases when you're writing for such a wide audience, include them! You want to spell out exactly what the fact is.

 

Why is this important? The Blood Pact required a lot more coding than Doric's Quest or Witch's Potion. Your little fact on the times page influences thousands of peoples' opinions. It should be absolutely clear what the fact is - ambiguity creates incorrect viewpoints. We like to deride these smaller updates but are never reminded of some of the lowest level, smallest content quests we have.

[bedman]

Eggstreme Management:

 

I agree with the author.

In my view, there are only a few options: 1: manually adjust the prices of these rares so the ultra-rich collectors just lose money in a blink of an eye (hey, only those who caused it would be actually punished by this right?)

2: ban the known players (hmm, maybe a bit over-the-top)

3: remove the items from the game

 

I've been hating the ridiculous prices from the GE, and consequently, I've started to buy and sell at mid or lower prices only. Due to my pretty good stats, I can make almost all items I need myself. If every TIPIT'er would use the mid-price as the maximum, and we join forces with other communities we, the average players, can force the prices to stagnate and ultimately lower them.

 

The idea of the GE is pretty good actually, I love it even. The biggest problem are the merchanting clans, or better said GREED. To bad we can't erase this negative human factor...

Sorry but that idea is completely rubbish.

 

the eggstreme manipulation article is a very notable topic, as each rare is being bought out one by one.

 

this week was santa week, where the exact same thing happened to santas. dip (caused by hoarders) followed by w2 filled with the same hoarders buying the rares up.

 

did you know that santas have a 4h buy limit of 2 santas, but no selling limit, so the dump was ensured to be 100% successful? could easily have been the same conglomerate of hoarders.

 

 

Sadly, this article could have helped prevent that if it had been published earlier. Now it may be close to impossible to get your hands on a rare through the ge, for the foreseeable future. That is, unless you camp GE updates.

 

I don't see how this article could have prevented anything? It's been known for ages that rares are susceptible to manipulation. Thing is, when something is manipulated, it's hard to predict what's going to happen, unless you are on of the manipulators. That's the whole point of manipulation, lieing/making secret agreements/... in order to have information others don't and use this to your advantage. If manipulation became totally predictable, it wouldn't work anymore.

[jettrider]

Yeah, as for the GE article. The santa dip this week was enough to push me out of the rares market for good and I sold all my santa hats just after the dip was over. The rares market is a creative and profitable way for players beyond the cash cap to keep making money at the same rate, but it is a full time activity. You need capital and constant alertness. I made a nice profit off my santa hats but it was time to sell them. I can make more by solo merchanting with the money I earned than by having them passively rise in the GE, and I prefer that my economic future not be decided by a handful of players I have no connection to.

[bedman]

Yeah, as for the GE article. The santa dip this week was enough to push me out of the rares market for good and I sold all my santa hats just after the dip was over. The rares market is a creative and profitable way for players beyond the cash cap to keep making money at the same rate, but it is a full time activity. You need capital and constant alertness. I made a nice profit off my santa hats but it was time to sell them. I can make more by solo merchanting with the money I earned than by having them passively rise in the GE, and I prefer that my economic future not be decided by a handful of players I have no connection to.

I dunno man. If I'd have invested all of my money in santa's last year, I would have surely made more than what I made now (and I still made damn nice buck). Same for the last 1-2 weeks. Had 6 santa's that rose 40m each. While I might have been able to get that in 2 weeks by flipping, it wouldnt have been an easy feat, and much harder than just holding my santas. Of course, rises like the past one wont't happen that much anymore, but still, can't see santas going well below 100m anymore tbh.

[All_Is_Great]

Goddamn, if fragg's article is true, then there's no hope for me and other regular players to get a hold of one of those rares anymore. I mean, couple years ago, before the deflation (phats being junk, masks and santas selling for 10m), it was still possible for normal players to achieve that. But now, this hoarding, manipulating, this is getting out of hand tbh; the rich get richer, and the poor just stay the same. There's no [bleep]'ing way I can even afford something like that. The whole rares market is bogus. /rant.

[jettrider]

Goddamn, if fragg's article is true, then there's no hope for me and other regular players to get a hold of one of those rares anymore. I mean, couple years ago, before the deflation (phats being junk, masks and santas selling for 10m), it was still possible for normal players to achieve that. But now, this hoarding, manipulating, this is getting out of hand tbh; the rich get richer, and the poor just stay the same. There's no [bleep]'ing way I can even afford something like that. The whole rares market is bogus. /rant.

 

It isn't terribly difficult to get into the rares market. Cash helps a lot though, but you need it anyway to be able to afford the price of rares with the inflated value of coins. You can create things that are rare on the street and are intermediaries to the big rares (unfinished wergali/torstol potions, onyx gems, royal crowns). It takes cash, patience, time, and luck (in the case of crowns), but it's possible to create enough of these items so that your cash stack can access a rare.

[Wouter828]

Castle wars being dominated by melee players? Well I'd say that your experience must've taught you that a whole game can be decided by a few barragers stading around freezing flag carriers.

[demby123]

Castle wars being dominated by melee players? Well I'd say that your experience must've taught you that a whole game can be decided by a few barragers stading around freezing flag carriers.

armadyl>barragers

[De_Lille_D]

To eggstream:

The problem here is the entire concept of a game economy. People have lost sight of what this game is all about: (no, not money... ) fun.

The best way to deal with these manipulators, leeching money of thousand of normal players (they are basically paying them for messing with prices), is to simply replace the economy with an exchange system.

Let the GE exchange your cash for item or vice versa.

This way, Jagex controls all the prices and will make sure prices stay fair. Now, I can hear the merchanters growling while I suggest to remove their virtual livelihood, but do you really think spending so much time on a fake stock market is the way this game is meant to be played? When you mention a medieval-themed video game with quests, skills and monsters, a stock market just doesn't fit the picture.

 

One exception though: rares. If you want to try and rip each other off for useless discontinued items, I don't care. But it won't be long before this is going to happen to other items which actually have a use.

[tortilliachp]

the eggstreme manipulation article is a very notable topic, as each rare is being bought out one by one.

 

this week was santa week, where the exact same thing happened to santas. dip (caused by hoarders) followed by w2 filled with the same hoarders buying the rares up.

 

did you know that santas have a 4h buy limit of 2 santas, but no selling limit, so the dump was ensured to be 100% successful? could easily have been the same conglomerate of hoarders.

 

 

Sadly, this article could have helped prevent that if it had been published earlier. Now it may be close to impossible to get your hands on a rare through the ge, for the foreseeable future. That is, unless you camp GE updates.

 

I don't see how this article could have prevented anything? It's been known for ages that rares are susceptible to manipulation. Thing is, when something is manipulated, it's hard to predict what's going to happen, unless you are on of the manipulators. That's the whole point of manipulation, lieing/making secret agreements/... in order to have information others don't and use this to your advantage. If manipulation became totally predictable, it wouldn't work anymore.

 

a lot of people read the tip.it times. a lot of people have rares, from way back, but little understanding of the rares market (being in a clan shows you that). a lot of people don't realize the difference between a dip and a dump, these are the ones panicking. With an article published at an earlier stage, more people would have held on to their santas at the last dip.

 

manipulating is VERY predictable. go to w2 after a ge update before selling your goods. look at the people buying items that are "crashing". if they're buying in bulk, it's manipulation. If noone's in w2, then check the forums. you're likely to find the same people selling in w2 selling on the forums; buying in w2 buying on the forums. you can then see if they've been selling just recently by checking their post history

[Racheya]

Castle wars being dominated by melee players? Well I'd say that your experience must've taught you that a whole game can be decided by a few barragers stading around freezing flag carriers.

armadyl>barragers

Exactly. While mages can have a strong impact against melee players, just a few mages (with or without ancients) can't compete against the much stronger, and more common, melee players who can rip through a mage pretty fast.

[JHalpert]

To Eggstreme:

 

Nice job on the article. I really enjoyed it. The opinion articles serve their purpose, but it was nice to see some objective reporting on events in the Times. Great work! =D>