The Back Room

[The_Mather1]

"Never don't" isn't bad English when it's intended as a double negative to enforce a positive, as it is stronger than saying always.

[Seraphin]

"Never don't" isn't bad English when it's intended as a double negative to enforce a positive, as it is stronger than saying always.

Double Negatives are always bad english.

[The_Mather1]

Then explain why English even has a single word that is a double negative in its own; nevertheless.

[Retech]

Well, it's only one word, so it's not a double.

 

And it's not negative either.

[The_Mather1]

Nevertheless = never(negative) the(binder) less(negative).

Meaning despite(negative) seeming(binder) otherwise(negative).

It's a synonym to still(positive).

[archimage_a]

Double negatives are not always bad English(Indeed they are generally good English), there are numerous examples:

'Its not unusual'

'I wouldn't say I don't like it'

'Its not infrequent'

'Thats not bad'

 

However:

Double Negatives that give an incorrect assessment 'I didn't do nothing'. Since its not conveying what you want it to.

Double Negatives that enforce an unqualified superlative 'Its not not Green'. It can't be more Green than Green, and can't have another meaning.

Double Negatives that are overly complex 'I never don't never do nothing'. Simply because they confuse people and have no other purpose.

Are all bad English.

 

Double negatives are permissable, only, when convey cunning nuances of meaning:

'She's not unattractive' has huge amount of ambigity surrounding it, you could be saying something postive or negative.

'It is not unusual' implies that it is the usual reaction, but is far more sympathetic than 'It was the usual reaction'

'Its not that I don't like your house' could mean 'I don't like your house but I am leaving anyway' or it could mean 'I do like your house but I think it should be painted green'

 

Nevertheless fits into the same catagory. 'Yes I think this, but I still think we should do this.'

 

 

 

However I still cannot see how "Never Don't" is stronger than "Always"?

Always means 100% of the time. Are you saying that 101% of the time you use the WASD keys? Because then you fail Maths...

 

If you were intentionally trying to trip people up then you are trolling, but using correct English.

If you were not trying to trip people up then you were using bad English, since there is no second context, but merely using an unqualified superlative.

[The_Mather1]

Didn't say it had a stronger meaning, just that it sent a stronger message.

 

Always can be anything from habitual to unchangeable, whereas never don't puts it as a static.

"I always use WASD" implies that I have a preference for WASD when it's possible.

"I never don't use WASD" implies that if the game has another setting, I either change it or find another game.

[Resistance]

Language has words that don't make sense... Obviously, the English language isn't consistent or pre-planned, it's a natural language.

 

I am right handed, being left handed would be a nightmare since everything is made for right handed people. I also get annoyed when left-handed people are proud of their handedness, there really is nothing to be proud of.

 

Also all of Archi's examples above were improper just common mistakes.

[archimage_a]

Always

al·ways

   [awl-weyz, -weez] Show IPA

 

adverb

1.

every time; on every occasion; without exception: He always works on Saturday.

 

2.

all the time; continuously; uninterruptedly: There is always some pollution in the air.

 

3.

forever: Will you always love me?

 

4.

in any event; at any time; if necessary: She can always move back with her parents.

 

As ever your mastery of the English language astounds.

[The_Mather1]

I said implies, not states.

Words, despite having one meaning in the dictionary, tend to be interpreted as having another in daily speech, hence precautions such as saying a double negative rather than a single positive are necessary in order to emphasize meaning.

 

And I'm not particularly proud of my handedness, however if it is relevant to the conversation, I will see fit to bring it up.

[archimage_a]

Words, despite having one meaning in the dictionary, tend to be interpreted as having another in daily speech, hence precautions such as saying a double negative rather than a single positive are necessary in order to emphasize meaning.

 

Maybe if you just spoke normally...rather than trying to tell people how they are going to read it...then people would understand you...

 

Or underlining words you want to emphasise...

[Alg]

He's right, though. "Never don't" isn't considered good English (Irony powers ACTIVATE!), while "always" has the meaning you intended. If you don't feel that it's enough, add emphasis: "I always use WASD".

Edited October 21, 2012 by Ieyfura
Edited out offensive post quote

[Corvus]

He's right, though. "Never don't" isn't considered good English (Irony powers ACTIVATE!), while "always" has the meaning you intended. If you don't feel that it's enough, add emphasis: "I always use WASD".

Or there is always "I never use anything other than WASD" or the super efficient "I only use WASD"

Edited October 21, 2012 by Ieyfura
Edited out offensive post quote

[Nexaduro]

WASD.

 

Always.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSMeUPFjQHc

[Alg]

And now that song is stuck in my head. Thanks for that.

[archimage_a]

I will point out that the majority of my argument was copied out of the book "My Grammar and I"(or Should that be 'Me'?)[i/] by Caroline Taggart and J.A. Wines.

Edited October 21, 2012 by Ieyfura
Edited out offensive post quote

[archimage_a]

Eh, its only the second time he has done it (to me recollection) and he may not have deemed it sufficently offensive to cause offence.

 

The comment itself is not particularly offensive, though is largely inaccurate, given the complex nature of Aspergus and the Spectrum on which it operates...Generalising it was the same condition in two different people would be like generalising beak length in all birds. It is further complicated by education, personal interests and the like, which form a complex human being, capable of operating within and without the narrow confines of the generalised defination of any one of their traits.

 

I was more irked by the fact that he was dismissing my arguments because of one character trait, and did so in a serious manner. If left unchecked it could lead to untold misery for others (and me).

[Leiana]

Arguing amongst themselves again.... We honestly can't last a month without arguing from Mather and Archi.... Which is kinda disappointing seeing how I used to be as foolish and do nothing but complain about my life but i managed to get over it. Sure I'm childish at times still, but I don't get into uber long and pointless arguments that no one really gives a damn about.

 

Mather, Archi, be civil and stop arguing like children!

[Resistance]

Sometimes I have no idea what he's saying. He should just use standard English instead of pseudo-intellectual nonsense.

Actual intellectuals, like myself find it tedious.

[archimage_a]

Mather, Archi, be civil and stop arguing like children!

 

This kind of comment serves no purpose, other than to legitimise Mather's offensive comments.

 

[Alg]

She does have a point, though. I'm surprised one or both of you hasn't resorted to the ignore list yet.

[The_Mather1]

Not an insult, a fact. We both suffer from Asperger's syndrome, a form of social retardation, so if the case is me misunderstanding a concept related to communication, it's more likely than not that he has trouble understanding it as well.

 

 

Sometimes I have no idea what he's saying. He should just use standard English instead of pseudo-intellectual nonsense.

Actual intellectuals, like myself find it tedious.

I'm not sure if this is a very poorly executed joke or evidence of a complete lack of self-awareness.

 

And for the record, pseudo-intellectual speech means talking around the subject, resorting to using large amounts of semi-complex words rather than intelligent speech which means wording each section of one's speech concisely and using accurate words with the length being attributed to additional, if sometimes redundant, information.

In other words pseudo-intelligent speech means talking like a politician or teacher.

Edited October 21, 2012 by Ieyfura
Edited out hidden post content.

[archimage_a]

Not an insult, a fact. We both suffer from Asperger's syndrome, a form of social retardation, so if the case is me misunderstanding a concept related to communication, it's more likely than not that he has trouble understanding it as well.

 

'You have a limp, I had my leg ripped off by a lion, I can see of no reason why you would buy trousers if I don't.'

[The_Mather1]

More like "You stepped on a landmine when you were a kid, I stepped on a landmine when I was a kid. I don't think I'll take advice from you on modern fashion in footwear."

[Nero]

More like "You stepped on a landmine when you were a kid, I stepped on a landmine when I was a kid. I don't think I'll take advice from you on modern fashion in footwear."

Silly analogy considering you don't even need feet to know about shoe styles...