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Behind the Scenes - November


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#41
Nico Robin
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One of the best months for a haul of updates.

899th to 120 attack! August 9, 2014~!


#42
Gwasha
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I think you're all overlooking the fact that xp in a team of 5 will still be better than solo so in reality it's not killing the team aspect at all.



Regardless, it probably won't affect team dungeoneering too much since it'll still be the best.


Eh, I think it will eventually. There'll be a lot less people coming up from DGing who would be able to qualify for today's 5:5 standards, as they can just take the easy way out and solo and not have to deal with "shit teams in bad worlds" (And therefore can't be lured to come and try proper dging with proper teams).

Quality has already dropped immensely over the past few months in DG. This certainly won't help.


That^
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#43
ilovecuttingyews
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Make x improvement looks good. Saves me a trip to Google docs to find prices and experiences. Haven't dunged in a year plus but it was all solo in f2p so part of me doesn't want exp rates to go up out of spite.

#44
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With the dung update this is the best update in the year for me.

I was happy at the daily task reward 0_0 But doubling the xp rate has been necessary since the beginning. I have managed 62m on my own, so the other 42m will have an extremely satisfying xp rate compared to what I have already done atm. It wont feel overpowered at all but something thats necessary.

I can say that when its double xp weekend, the xp rates seem about right. It doesnt seem like a double xp weekend, it seems like a 'this is what it should of always been' weekend. Unlike rc xp rates in older times, solo dung just seemed too slow to train considering there was 104m for the top level. (99 aint so bad though.) Team xp seemed about right but not the solo side of it. Sometimes its less enjoyable when an xp rate seems like it isnt calculated properly, asin when its being underpowered, ditto for when its overpowered.

No offence to the jmods but I expect I can get better xp rates considering the amount of time I have put into that skill lol. So although I think doubling the xp rates is necessary, (While also more than I ever hoped for.) I be interested in seeing what actually comes out of this.

I like bunch of the other updates too but I donno what to think until I see them. I still manage to do tears of guthix out of nostalgia more than anything so that is nice that we getting a bigger bowl... (Keeps up with the revamped xp rates I guess.)
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#45
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-snip-
That^

That might have more to do with how high 5:5 standards are these days and how few people are really willing to teach others. The fact that a lot of the 'experts' have 120/200m isn't helping in that regard.

That skill is quite inaccessible if you're not already good at it. This is a bonus for those of us that play at our own pace.

#46
999134
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bots solo dg'ers rejoice!

Seriously >.>, removing randoms now this, do they even care anymore?
Check it out, huge amount of effort has gone into this massive mod!
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#47
aerendil
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>jagex introduces free trade, sgs and squeel
>wonders if they care anymore

logic says they stopped caring a lonnnggg time ago, and various bot stopping stuff is just PR waffle
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#48
Alg
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Wait, randoms actually did stuff to bots?

#49
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I personally think moving DG away from being fundamentally a team-based skill is an unfortunate step in the wrong direction.


This is how I feel. DG was meant to be team-based, for better or worse. To remove that part kills the integrity of the skill.


And leeching doesn't..? (This isn't necessarily aimed at anyone.)


Right. Leeching doesn't.

You're paying other players for skills you yourself do not have. In other words, you're substituting other benefits for you lack of teamwork.

So yes, DG is meant to be team-based and rewards those with the necessary skills.


I just have to disagree. I feel that if you don't train the skill in some form, you don't deserve the levels. Hence why I have a low dungeoneering level, etc. To pay someone then do nothing for 15 minutes or less then get more xp than I would in hours is just not fair, regardless of the "team aspect." If I were to go to a dungeoneering world, as I have in the past, chances are it's going to be extremely difficult to find a genuine team amongst all the leech teams.

To clarify, dungeoneering is team-based, yes. However, to reason that solo experience getting better is worse for the skill is hypocritical if all you base it on is the intent of the skill. Dungoneering was not meant to be a buyable skill, regardless of how you try and rationalize. You can claim it is "emergent gameplay" or whatever, but you are still being hypocritical of the intent of the skill, regardless.


But is any skill intended to be a buyable skill? The buyability of any skill is a direct result of player institutions that develop.

Take Smithing. I don't think Jagex's intention was for players to buy bars, smith them into stuff, then sell them. More likely it was meant for players to make sure of the ores they mined to produce combat equipment they require. Would you say that being able to "buy" smithing is against the intend of the skill?


I have to disagree with this point. DG and smith are fundamentally different because smith follows in a long line of "production" skills like fletch, fm, craft, cook, etc; DG on the other hand is not a production skill and indeed doesn't follow the trends of any other skill to date. To me it's fairly clear that JaGeX's attempts to make the skill as non-afkable as possible until leeching came along is one of its trademark quirks that sets it apart from most other skills, but I suppose all of this depends on whether or not you put much stock in authorial intent.

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#50
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Or it will be like when Clan Wars was introduced. It got more people "hooked" and interested in serious clanning. The same thing could happen with DG where people solo and enjoy the high exp rates and want to do more 5:5 floors for the even higher exp rate.

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#51
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This looks good-I'm especially looking forward to more XP for solo Dungeoneering. Hopefully this update will make it a viable option in F2P, because as it stands it's really not.
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#52
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That might have more to do with how high 5:5 standards are these days and how few people are really willing to teach others. The fact that a lot of the 'experts' have 120/200m isn't helping in that regard.

That skill is quite inaccessible if you're not already good at it. This is a bonus for those of us that play at our own pace.


^ This. You get instantly better when you can bind 3 items at lv100, and it is really hard to remember that you have to be aware of players without 3binds if you yourself already have them. (Let alone 4 binds from 120!)

Right now I have found generally 3 classes of DG player;

Most dg'ers I've found are either already high level and skilled and they learned when others were also learning with them, or are very low level and don't have the patience to learn the skill on their own. While there are exceptions many of these high level dgers aren't teaching lower level players how to learn to get better. This frustrates the low player because they feel that they can never catch up and are always too slow to be helpful.. High players see the low players as "unskilled" instead of "untrained"



Now.. if only Jagex would implement a better version of dgsweeper into the game that just permanently kept the map up and marked all key doors and who's gatestones were where..... :s

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#53
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3rd bind isn't that huge at all, nor is it that hard to find good teams. But you do need to have a clan or group of friends, you can't use themed worlds or Jagex' auto-group rooms, which means that the most obvious dungeoneering resources are also the most misleading ones and are actually barely/not helpful.

Imo there should be the possibility to form teams and start floors in Clan Citadels to promote dungeoneering clans.

I don't think solo dungeoneering should be competetive xp. Considering the time and effort it takes to put a team together, the xp rate for soloing should be half of the 5:5 rate.
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#54
the_korny
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People complaining that 5:5 DGing will suffer missed the line that it will still be the fastest method of gaining exp. So you can keep your family doctor team. As it is now, the upper echelon of teams that are full of angry efficiency experts have isolated themselves into a Catch-22 where no new individuals can join their ranks. "You got one mime emote wrong! Never DGing with you anymore."
I've never seen Sixth Sense nor Inception nor many other popular movies and I intend to keep it that way.

#55
aerendil
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posting here ranting is inefficient, should be watching inception and dging, and teasing da noobs




trolling aside, I like the looks of this month, lots of needed updates, nd faster dging is good, as it is a very hard skill to get into without the right connections...
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#56
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posting here ranting is inefficient, should be watching inception and dging, and teasing da noobs

I support this motion, especially in regards to Inception.

#57
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I definitely support Inception!

3rd bind isn't that huge at all, nor is it that hard to find good teams. But you do need to have a clan or group of friends, you can't use themed worlds or Jagex' auto-group rooms, which means that the most obvious dungeoneering resources are also the most misleading ones and are actually barely/not helpful.

Imo there should be the possibility to form teams and start floors in Clan Citadels to promote dungeoneering clans.

I don't think solo dungeoneering should be competetive xp. Considering the time and effort it takes to put a team together, the xp rate for soloing should be half of the 5:5 rate.


I would *love* to be able to start dungeons from clan citadels.

My experience is that 3rd bind has enabled me to worry less about having food.. Then again I had hood before and so I couldn't tank anything without prayer. Now with primal chain (haven't had time to hunt for plate) I can do pretty well and not worry so much about having tons of food. It wasn't about decreasing floor time as much as it helped me decrease death rates :)

I do think that team xp should be faster *counting* time spent putting teams together... so the xp/floor. should be quite a bit higher since you don't lose time putting team together, and this allows for team to be still faster.

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#58
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I'm happy about the dung update because it allows me to dung on my own clock without feeling like I'm wasting my time. Zaaps is just mad because he sells floors, the 120 dung prods are mad because they had to spend hundreds of hours figuring out dung, and I'm happy because I don't have to spend 400 hours learning how to dung nor do I have to put up with doing 1 hour larges for exp.

#59
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I don't think solo dungeoneering should be competetive xp. Considering the time and effort it takes to put a team together, the xp rate for soloing should be half of the 5:5 rate.


I really can't decide if this is going to cause team dungeoneering to go to shit or not.

On one hand there's going to be a whole lot less people wanting to dungeoneer in a team as solo xp rates will be close to those of 5:5, but on the other hand those that do want to dungeoneer in a team will generally be those who want maximum efficiency and generally (from my experiences anyway) make better team-mates.

#60
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This month is going to be fun. I absolutely love the Dungeoneering update, I've been waiting for this for a very long time. Now it's finally happening!

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