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Icefiends/Slayer XP nerfed to the ground


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#41
Platinum_Myr
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That's horrible! Cannon doesn't do much, some monsters are practically unklllable... everything is just ruined atm.

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#42
fishy227
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The new slayer creatures, automatons gave a bit over 3,600 xp* earlier this morning, then after a while I only got 1,650ish xp a kill. ( not sure exact number but it was halved)

* experience per kill as in range and hit points xp, not slayer, I'm unsure what their slayer xp is.

Edited by fishy227, 05 March 2013 - 06:13 PM.

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#43
jayc3399
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That's horrible! Cannon doesn't do much, some monsters are practically unklllable... everything is just ruined atm.


What monsters are "unkillable"?

The new slayer creatures, automatons gave a bit over 3,600 xp earlier this morning, then after a while I only got 1,650ish xp a kill. ( not sure exact number but it was halved)


I would assume this is the reason everything else saw a nerf, it was a quick fix that effected more then it should have.

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#44
Platinum_Myr
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Mithril dragons state they are weak to earth magic, but when I used ahrims wand and earth surge I was splashing more than I was hitting. I was getting about 1 kill per overload, and taking too much damage. Was using a shield and stuff too...

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#45
jayc3399
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Mithril dragons state they are weak to earth magic, but when I used ahrims wand and earth surge I was splashing more than I was hitting. I was getting about 1 kill per overload, and taking too much damage. Was using a shield and stuff too...

Unless they have been buff'd your doing something wrong, because I have no issues killing them with a poly staff and earth spells. I take alot of dmg but SS takes care of that.

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#46
Platinum_Myr
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When did you last do them? It's possible that I needed the 2h for the higher accuracy because the 1h wand has low accuracy? I dunno I've heard I should try chaotic rapiers so that's what I am gonna do next task.

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#47
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You really need a staff or either ahrims/virtus wand. Because every other wand has REALLY low accuracy.

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#48
jayc3399
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When did you last do them? It's possible that I needed the 2h for the higher accuracy because the 1h wand has low accuracy? I dunno I've heard I should try chaotic rapiers so that's what I am gonna do next task.


Would have been a couple weeks ago now.

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#49
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I think they did some defense buffing since then, not sure. I had Ahrims wand, it wasn't enough. Once I get the tokens I will try chaotic staff.

The Ahrims wand + shield was not enough accuracy to dmg them. Bestiary says they have 80 defence, 80 attack, 1 ranged, and 1 magic.

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#50
jayc3399
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I think they did some defense buffing since then, not sure. I had Ahrims wand, it wasn't enough. Once I get the tokens I will try chaotic staff.

The Ahrims wand + shield was not enough accuracy to dmg them. Bestiary says they have 80 defence, 80 attack, 1 ranged, and 1 magic.


You have super antifires, just use a poly staff, they are what? 100k

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#51
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We'll see when I get the task next. I'm hoping to get the few tokens I need for chaotic before then, but I have other staffs if necessary :) I just normally prefer to dual wield or use a shield

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#52
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I think they did some defense buffing since then, not sure. I had Ahrims wand, it wasn't enough. Once I get the tokens I will try chaotic staff.

The Ahrims wand + shield was not enough accuracy to dmg them. Bestiary says they have 80 defence, 80 attack, 1 ranged, and 1 magic.

A player with level 80 armour bonus will have 31.25% (according to the Wiki) of t80 armour put towards magic defence, which is about equal to 100% of level 75 magic defence.

If you assume that holds for monsters, then your mithril dragon has 2280 * .3125 = 712.5 armour vs magic (or 2888 * .3125 = 902.5 if miths have a shield as well). That's not taking into account defence/magic level because I have no clue how that's added (if at all). Armour taken without cape/ring/amulet, but with gloves/boots/top/legs/helm.

Your weapon accuracy bonus with t70 (Ahrim's), t75 (polypore/sol) and t80 is:
1868 (t70)
2384 (t75)
3043 (t80)

If you take really crudely just 1868 vs. 712 attack vs defence roll, you get 1076544/1330016 = ~80% accuracy.
If you simply add 99 magic to the one and 80 defence to the other, you get 1967 vs. 792 which gives you 1244232/1557864 = ~0,80% accuracy.
With shield, adding levels, you get 1449432/1931594 = ~0,75% accuracy.
(take the lowest roll squared, divide by two and subtract from the product of attack and defence roll - basically a matrix of all possible combinations of attack & defence rolls, there is a triangle equal to half the smallest roll squared which is either hits or misses depending on which roll is smallest)

I'm not really trying to prove anything here, just thinking aloud. Right now I'd consider the possibility that monsters have an entirely separate system, which makes sense considering they have more specific weaknesses, but on the other hand it seems overly complicated. It's also possible that defence/armour points are not equal to attack/hit bonus points which would be somewhat annoying.
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#53
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Yea it's all very confusing. But I know with ahrims wand and an arcane shield I was taking way too much damage and not hitting much at all. I'm guessing that the staff would help a lot as it has a higher accuracy due to being 2h I believe? Either way I am guessing trying to do them with a shield is bad.

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#54
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Yeah jagex made it so that all wands are crap untill virtus.
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#55
jayc3399
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Yea it's all very confusing. But I know with ahrims wand and an arcane shield I was taking way too much damage and not hitting much at all. I'm guessing that the staff would help a lot as it has a higher accuracy due to being 2h I believe? Either way I am guessing trying to do them with a shield is bad.


Part of the staff advantage is the extra dmg per hit, without an offhand casting a spell your losing out on dps using just a wand versus a stave or wand/offhand combo.

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#56
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The only valid reason for using a shield against a Mithril Dragon would be antifire, for those without 84+1 herblore. I'm not sure why you would use an arcane in those circumstances, except to look fancy maybe. The damage reduction is surely countered by the far superior damage caused by staves/dual wields.

#57
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Well since we're discussing the slayer xp nerf now, can an admin change the title of the thread to reflect that?

Responding to my previous thread:

Pre-Eoc slayer had worthwhile rewards that reflected well on how the skill was trained. It was by no means a ridiculously slow skill, but it was still one of the slowest in the game. I was getting around 50-60kxp/hr (without steel titan and cannon, it's possible to get a lot higher). The initial introduction of EOC brought slayer xp up substantially, upwards of 100-120k hr (This is for me, using the same levels) with a proper task list. Kill-speed increased, and so did xp. Slayer drops soon plummeted, whips went from ~1.5m to their current price of 100k in a span of 3 months. This was okay, because slayer was a lot more bearable to train, and more interesting due to combat changes. This update kills slayer xp for a lot of monsters. I'll use steel dragons as an example.

EOC Introduction - Steel dragons are 398 xp/kill. They go down fairly easily and give some of the best slayer xp/hr in game
EOC Accuracy/Defense Changes - Steel dragons are 398 xp/kill. They are [bleep]ing impossible to down without anything but top-tier weapons, most people skip them completely.
EOC Accuracy/Defense Tweak - Steel dragons are 398 xp/kill. They are doable, although at a relatively slower rate. They give good slayer xp, but not quite as much.
EOC Hidden Update - Steel Dragons are 200 xp/kill. Low xp coupled with unnecessary difficulty makes this task complete garbage now.

This same trend can be seen for a lot of monsters, most notably: ganodermic creatures, mithril dragons (still impossible to do unless you have virtus/access to overloads), strykewyrms, and others.
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#58
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From a thread on the RSOF:

Dual Wielding fixes have been made to the game
As I went to barrage my Dagganoth task, I noticed how much more powerful this casting was, and faster too! Excited, I went to training dummies and began testing all sides of the combat triangle.
All Sides of the combat triangle have been given AT LEAST a 25% DPS increase! Some as big as 50%!
But As I went on, I noticed some MAJOR inconsistencies.
*ALL Tests were done with Turm/Anguish/Torment, Overloads, and Void Armor for that respective combat class*
Problems/Fixes/New Things:
__________________________________
ONE OF THE MAIN PROBLEMS I NOTICED:
Auto Attacks seem to be MUCH weaker than before FOR MAGIC ELEMENTAL, especially since they buffed ability damage. Another thing, this is MOST noticeable in Magic Autocasting, a little noticeable with melee, and not noticeable at all with Range.

Try Hitting anything with an auto attack, even with momentum, Magic rarely hits above a 600, and almost always is 200-300. A Staff with auto attacks in now horrible

+ is Positive
- Is Negative

Magic Findings:
- Auto Attack damage is terrible for Elemental spells.
+ Auto Attack damage was boosted for Ancient Spells
+ Dual Wielding auto attacks seem faster than before (2 Hit splats)
+ Wild Magic now hits twice
+ Wrack Hits over 2.3K If Dual Wielding/Staff!
+ About a 50% Damage Boost to ALL abilities, if using 2H/Dual wield
- When Using Staff, Auto attack takes forever to cast after using an ability.
- Torment Prayer has no effect on Magic.
@@@@@@ +++ ICE BARRAGE HITS AS A LEVEL 94 WEAPON @@@@@@
+ When Using a wand, You can Spam Wrack + Auto attack at the same time.

Melee Findings:
- Auto Attack damage seems slightly lower than before (main problem is a big inconsistency in hits. Hit 100 one hit, 1.9K the next)
+ Dual Wielding is MUCH stronger (Duh)
+ Hit Over 2.5K with Slice (Drygores)
- Decimate/Havoc Majorly Nerfed. Hits same as Slice. (100% Damage). Not Worth using because Slice has 3 Second Cooldown
- Massacre Nerfed (Hits very low usually, and bleed is half of what it used to be)
-+ 50% Buff to all abilities EXCEPT most dual wield abilities were Nerfed (ironic.)

Range Findings:
+ Auto attacks seem VERY powerful (Can hit over 3K with Royal Crossbow)
+ Piecing Shot can hit over 2.1K (Royal Crossbow)
= Rapid Fire remained the same (Only ability that didn't change!)
- Deadshot Majorly nerfed (Hits low and bleed is much worse)
+ All Abilities saw a 25-50% Increase in DPS!
DID NOT TEST DUAL WIELDING RANGE.

I do not have chaotic crossbows. If anyone can test them using Ovld, Anguish, and Void would be very helpful. Although I imagine the result will be the same as Royal xBow

_____________
Will add more if found/suggested.

CONCLUSION:
Magic: Abilties VERY powerful. Ancients Stronger than Elemental. Auto Attacks need to be SERIOUSLY looked at.

Melee: Great fix to dual wielding, and overall increase in DPS. Auto Attacks need to be looked at, and something needs to be done to Massacre/Decimate/Havoc

Range: Came out on top. Everything was boosted, from auto attack to abilities EXCEPT Deadshot. Needs to be looked at


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#59
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Gf using momentum ever again.

#60
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Gf using momentum ever again.


Meh, could be perception but I'm using momentum while training magic and I noticed a DPS increase aswell. Even with a lousy master wand.
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