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Isn't filter mode and unfilter mode still here? I haven't been playing lately, but I'm sure that's still the case (correct me if I am mistaken). What's the point of allowing filters/unfilters if this will get you an automatic mute?

 

Also, obviously this is complete nonsense which seeks to for some inexplicable reason to destroy harmless and private fun between friends. I mean is it not enough that if your friends are upset they retain the option to report you? Why add this to the picture?

 

Also, their excuse of "Well, just because we didn't address it for like 10 [bleep]ing years, just means we were busy, not that we had forgotten about it" is pathetic. No. If you didn't do it for years, then it obviously wasn't on your mind or a priority. To suggest that the rule has always existed and we were all "rulebreakers" is basically a lazy retcon. Rules are based on enforcement, understanding and precedent. That you didn't do anything or make any expectation or understanding known to the public which might have suggested that you don't approve of swearing amongst friends means that you didn't care. Don't pretend now that you cared all these years and were just "extremely busy". Bullshit.

 

It is said that idle minds are the devil's workshop. This has certainly been true of this company, and it may as well be their anthem. They have a special talent for 'fixing' things which are not broken. Unsurprisingly they found the time to do it this month of all times when they had announced a slightly less demanding update schedule. They got a little bit of time and were off breaking things again for shits and giggles. Even more egregious that they did not see fit to mention this on the front pages. Keeping in line with their second most vaunted principle: let's change laws behind everyone's backs and not announce them so we can dole out punishments sadistically on people who did not know.

 

Just pathetic.

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Big Brother is watching you...

 

I am quite concerned about Jagex wiretapping our private messages, and enforcing their rules based on what we say. While I can understand their viewpoint about the rules on offensive language (on a few different levels), I find their measures rather illogical. These are 'private' to begin with, as long as recipient do not find content offensive, and that both parties keep conversation strictly private there shouldn't be any problem. One could possibly draw a parallel from this to the case of text messaging/phone calls - supposedly strictly private, but who knows, telco might send your details to the govt and you might just get 'muted'. (it resonates in my mind because of the PRISM scandal...) My point is that Jagex have no particular reason to be concerned about what people say in private messages (asides from silencing critics and preventing organised demonstrations in w66); if they don't know what is being said under what context and what parties are involved, then what are they trying to achieve? Keep calm, Jagex.

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I also disagree with the view that it's "none of their business" - it's their game on their servers which we have access to after agreeing to their T&Cs which include following their rules. They have EVERY right to do whatever they like to any of our chat, be that monitoring or enforcing rules.

so by that logic it's acceptable for the government to censor what I say to other people via text message? It's not (or at least shouldn't be) jagex's responsibility to determine what I find offensive. They gave me the tools to block what I find offensive, it's my responsibility to use them. Should this auto-muting be in place in public chat? absolutely. Private/cc/fc? not so much.

 

By my logic that is not true at all.

 

Jagex is a private company offering a service which we partake in.

Government firstly, does not have direct ownership of communication networks and secondly does not have the right too unless it is written in to law and to try and do so would raise issues of free speech and human rights as those communications are part of the public domain.

 

Two entirely different concepts.


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Government firstly, does not have direct ownership of communication networks and secondly does not have the right too unless it is written in to law and to try and do so would raise issues of free speech and human rights as those communications are part of the public domain.

Erm... Royal Mail is government-owned, and I see no issues around "freedom of speech". Before you raise the "private sector" card, a lot of them do their business through Royal Mail.

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Government firstly, does not have direct ownership of communication networks and secondly does not have the right too unless it is written in to law and to try and do so would raise issues of free speech and human rights as those communications are part of the public domain.

Erm... Royal Mail is government-owned, and I see no issues around "freedom of speech". Before you raise the "private sector" card, a lot of them do their business through Royal Mail.

 

If you'd paid attention he specified texting.

If a Government wanted to impose censorship on the mail system it owns we would simply go elsewhere, we are not obliged to use it. And it would raise my secondary point of trying to legalise such measures would meet great issues in freedom of speech/expression and human rights activism in the first place.

 

But this side tangent is entirely irrelevant to the main topic of this thread. I was only making the point the logic of my initial point, that Jagex has every right to enforce their rules as they wish and any chat within their game is their business, does not logically make government snooping ok. They are different ball games entirely to do with what is and is not acceptable.


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Aiel's point was less about public ownership of communication (which does happen, contrary to your misguided insistence that it does not) and more about self-responsibility. In other words, if I find something offensive, there's an ignore list, there's a report button, there's a chat filter... it doesn't require a third party holding my hand to determine what I find offensive, if indeed, I even find it offensive in the first place (re: Leik's post).

 

Fine, they have every right to do whatever they want in terms of censorship, but it doesn't make any practical or pragmatic sense to do so, and there's easily an argument to suggest it's a collective responsibility of everyone to promote respectful behaviour and shun abusive behaviour, rather than being solely the responsibility of Jagex.

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That's a valid opinion, but that is not what I was commenting on or retorting too.

 

I was only defending the point that it is ludicrous to suggest my logic of Jagex owns it and we accept their T&Cs and rules and therefore they can enforce them how they see fit extends to make it also ok for governments to censor and stifle general communication at large. Because they are in no way the same context or the same ramifications to it.


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I'm afraid I have to agree with most of the negative feedback regarding this update. Auto-muting in public chat, which anyone can see, yes. In Friends Chats, which are semi-public (usually anyone can join or enter), okay. Clan chats, for which people must be invited into to join, no. While I personally do not, and do not allow offensive language in my clan chat, many do, and that is their right. If they don't like it, the higher-ranking players take action, or even the leader. In private messages? God no. That stuff is private for a reason. You're talking to your friends, and only that specific person can see it. While I don't use profanity, its private messaging. Private for a reason. While I 100% support auto-muting across all chats if people advert illegal sites, botting, or serious rule-breaking, saying a cuss word and getting a mute is just ridiculous. Especially if there's little to no explanation as to why you were muted offered.

 

The chat system was already too strict, randomly putting stars in messages of people with filter off if they say a long sentence with commas in it, and now this... I agree, most people are making this out into a bigger deal then it is, but it is pretty unreasonable on their part. All its going to do is drive people away from the game into other ways of communicating with each other (messengers, skype, etc).


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The automute system for offensive language has now been disabled.

 

I guess it's because of the number of people complaining of "false" mutes... of course everyone is going to say they are falsely muted if the mute is labeled incorrectly and with no visible evidence. Someone didn't really think this one through...

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Meanwhile at the NSA.........................................................................

 

 

am I the only one spotting similarities?

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Big Brother is watching you...

 

I am quite concerned about Jagex wiretapping our private messages, and enforcing their rules based on what we say. While I can understand their viewpoint about the rules on offensive language (on a few different levels), I find their measures rather illogical. These are 'private' to begin with, as long as recipient do not find content offensive, and that both parties keep conversation strictly private there shouldn't be any problem. One could possibly draw a parallel from this to the case of text messaging/phone calls - supposedly strictly private, but who knows, telco might send your details to the govt and you might just get 'muted'. (it resonates in my mind because of the PRISM scandal...) My point is that Jagex have no particular reason to be concerned about what people say in private messages (asides from silencing critics and preventing organised demonstrations in w66); if they don't know what is being said under what context and what parties are involved, then what are they trying to achieve? Keep calm, Jagex.

Meanwhile at the NSA.........................................................................

 

 

am I the only one spotting similarities?

 

i think the timing of this chatwatch programme is quite nice


'Time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time.' T.S. Eliot

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The automute system for offensive language has now been disabled.

 

I guess it's because of the number of people complaining of "false" mutes... of course everyone is going to say they are falsely muted if the mute is labeled incorrectly and with no visible evidence. Someone didn't really think this one through...

 

Meaning we can swear in our PMs again? If so, is there any J Mod confirmation? Or am I misunderstanding your post?

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The automute system for offensive language has now been disabled.

 

I guess it's because of the number of people complaining of "false" mutes... of course everyone is going to say they are falsely muted if the mute is labeled incorrectly and with no visible evidence. Someone didn't really think this one through...

 

Meaning we can swear in our PMs again? If so, is there any J Mod confirmation? Or am I misunderstanding your post?

Yes - can we get a source on that?

 

 

 

 

Overall:

 

1. A change in policy (and yes, it is a change in policy since it's never been enforced) should be communicated before it is enforced. Otherwise, people are going to be upset and the purpose of the mute in the first place will be forgotten.

 

2. Jagex needs to stop focusing on after-the-fact reactions and create some modern-day intervention programs. Mutes only serve to enrage most people that either a.) don't believe their mute is warranted (especially if they receive no evidence or message from Jagex) or b.) don't give a flying flip in the first place. Perhaps if they did a better job of WARNING before muting, we would see better results. How about instead of using ChatWatch just to mute, it also popped up warnings IN GAME giving the player feedback that their language is bit over the top or is likely to offend others? Maybe mute after 3 warnings or such. I believe this feedback would do far more good to curb the actions than a flat out mute.

 

3. We have no idea what this system actually catches. Jagex is so secretive. They just say 'trust us, we know it works.' Then when it fails, everyone knows they messed up, but of course they would never admit it (okay, maybe 2% of the time). Again, communication. Jagex acts like it's perfect so the smallest of imperfections stick out like a sore thumb, serving as a beacon for ranters and griefers to latch onto.

 

TL;DR Jagex really needs to work on how they communicate their policies and CHANGES to players.

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The auto-mute system already in effect mutes you if you use “certain phrases” – even if you’re in PM’s, Friends Chat or Clan Chat – and most of those phrases deal with terms relating to real world trading and gambling. In my experience, I’ve found that it’s a “delicate” system, and by that I mean it’s got a “hair trigger”. Any phrase that looks similar to one that’s in the auto-mute data-base sets it off. <_<


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We’ve added a new feature to the old chat filter, now renamed as the profanity filter. Its default function is still to be turned on to filter out all the words (and URLs) on our blacklist, but we’ve added the option for you to turn the filter off. We recognise that RuneScape has a maturing player base and, as such, wish to give you the freedom to choose for yourselves, while also still keeping the filter for those players who do not wish to see swear words and the like.

 

So we've gone from a maturing player base back to being an adolescent one with Daddy Jagex having to hold our hands and cover our ears when swear words come back up on the screen?

 

This is like everything they seem to do now-a-days. Do something good, wait months/years and then renege on their stance and change exactly what they mean. It's just absolutely stupid and pointless.

 

And what if the chat is like this one (from Tan's Bloggeh <3: )

 

[spoiler=Lots of cussing... Beware those of sensitive nature etc.]3bKjx.jpg

 

 

That's just banter and fun... Sure it's offensive to someone outside the clan/old EoE/friends group, or to someone who misconstrues this as an offensive attack on Draz... But why should we be scared of swearing at or with friends? Just turn your filter back on if this is that much of a problem.

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What exactly are they getting banned for?

Probably, circumventing the filter system so those that have it on still have to suffer the indignity of morons.


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What exactly are they getting banned for?

Probably, circumventing the filter system so those that have it on still have to suffer the indignity of morons.

 

As I said – in my experience, it appears that most of the muting results from using terminology and URLS relating to RWT and gambling …


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I think this is shit.

 

Especially for friends, clans, groups where NOBODY will be offended by some banter.

 

I can understand it completely for public chat, however I'm sure the censor is more than adequate.

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I don't really care. There are many stupid things in the world. Just avoid swearing. This is certainly rather stupid, but honestly, compared to many real changed to the game (gameplay) this is nothing.


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I haven't had a problem with it, but I know quite a few people who have - they really need to stop flip-flopping.


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That's just banter and fun... Sure it's offensive to someone outside the clan/old EoE/friends group, or to someone who misconstrues this as an offensive attack on Draz... But why should we be scared of swearing at or with friends? Just turn your filter back on if this is that much of a problem.

Is it really ever appropriate to pass off homophobic language as "fun", even with friends? Doesn't that just encourage and reinforce discrimination and oppressive behaviour against homosexuals at a personal level?

 

I'm not really making a point about Jagex here, I agree that we don't need Jagex to treat us like babies, I'm just querying your definition of the word "fun" and how that represents your clan/friend chat. Let's say that Joe, a gay man, enters your friend chat and sees that "banter"... does it continue to be appropriate then?

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Is it really ever appropriate to pass off homophobic language as "fun", even with friends? Doesn't that just encourage and reinforce discrimination and oppressive behaviour against homosexuals at a personal level?

 

It depends how it's framed. If it's transparently framed as part of a joke and all the parties involved are aware of this and alright with it, then no harm no foul.

 

I'm not really making a point about Jagex here, I agree that we don't need Jagex to treat us like babies, I'm just querying your definition of the word "fun" and how that represents your clan/friend chat. Let's say that Joe, a gay man, enters your friend chat and sees that "banter"... does it continue to be appropriate then?

 

It depends. Who is this Joe? Is he a random stranger? If so, then he shouldn't be in my chat. If he's a friend whom I know to be gay, that'd be a consideration before I started making such jokes, yes.

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So you admit that in that situation, he shouldn't choose to be part of your group of friends because he's gay and because he'd take offence at your homophobic sense of humour, but you won't admit that that situation has only come about because of your own personal discrimination. I think you're trying to have your cake and eat it there.

 

My point is that there are a dozen other ways to achieve the humour that's being attempted in that screenshot, but the choice of a term that is specifically homophobic is an interesting one. Especially when this is subsequently described as simply being "fun".

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