Summoning looked down upon?

[nightzero]

Just yesterday I decided to go to Castle Wars because imo its the funnest thing to do in runescape and its fun to freeze people with ancients and see *** *** ****. So this lvl 74 keeps coming into our base and I keep killing him.(im lvl 114) After the 3rd or 4th time I get bored and go to their base to get the flag. On the way there, I kill the 74 again :D.

 

 

 

Anyway after the game the guy pms me and starts saying stuff like omg ure such a noob ure only lvl 114 because of summoning, my main is lvl 110 for real. Youre only lvl 107. You only got summoning to get more cb lvls, etc,etc So I just tell him that summoning is a skill just like any other albeit more expensive and harder than alot of others and i block him. Then later on tip.it.forums there are people who's sigs say 120 for real, 1 summoning ftw, etc,etc.

 

So my question is why summoning is looked down upon when i think it's actually a lot harder than lots of skills and helps in many other skills (i love my terrorbird :D). I mean couldnt people have the same argument with prayer?

[Bobbington]

Summoning is still a new skill and so is not viewed by allot of the community as "true" interms of combat.

 

 

 

For many years people have gone by their way of quantifying a players ability by a number next to their name:

 

 

 

100+?

 

120+?

 

124+?

 

126!?

 

 

 

 

 

Now that has changed and a 126 is not what it used to be.... a player shouting I am level 126! does not mean what it did lat year.

 

 

 

 

 

Basically player just need time for summoning to become an accepted skill, and this will come.

[Outsanity]

Even though it's true that from the first view it would SEEM that a Level 120 now has only put in the work of an "old" 115 or so, in actuality, they have put in more work obtaining those very hard to train and VERY expensive Summoning Levels.

 

 

 

So next time a person tells you that you're less of a player for being higher leveled, tell them they need to grow a set and put in the extra time and MONEY to do what you did, because Summoning is now one of the most useful skills. I have a familiar with me for over 90% of the overall things I do in RS now.

 

 

 

And don't worry, over time people will accept that 138 is like an old 126, but WAY better because they've spent way more time and money to achieve 138 than an old 126 (such as how I used to be) did to get level 126.

 

 

 

People are ignorant, and try to belittle things they cannot achieve. It's like people who say high levels have no lives. This isn't really true, obviously, but because they don't have the drive or the ability or option to spend a little more time playing, anyone who plays even a bit longer than them automatically has no life.

 

 

 

It all boils down to jealousy. Everyone in this game is either jealous, or arrogant. Whether we like to admit it or not, one of them lives inside the average RS player at all times.

[Thrawn]

I agree with Outsanity. I find summoning to be one of the most usefull skills ever. Im not much into combat at all and combat lvls have never meant much to me. But I love summoning so much after the update of it that i force myself to do a lot of combat just to get charms. I often meet people who have no idea of how usefull summoning are and all I can do is try and tell them why I also have a familiar summoned 90%+ of the time I play rs. Im having great problems finding time to raise my pets :P

 

 

 

 

 

People just need to learn how usefull it is and how to use it themself

[Aneron]

In most intelligent circles summoning is not looked down upon at all. ;)

[highlanders]

The thing is, you are not always using a familiar. And when you aren't, your level doesn't represent your true strength. It's a conditional combat level, that doesn't mean anything most of the time.

[RandomKnight]

The thing is, you are not always using a familiar. And when you aren't, your level doesn't represent your true strength. It's a conditional combat level, that doesn't mean anything most of the time.

 

 

 

But wouldn't that mean that unless we're constantly attacking something our level isn't representing our true strength aswell, aru? :-k

[Outsanity]

The thing is, you are not always using a familiar. And when you aren't, your level doesn't represent your true strength. It's a conditional combat level, that doesn't mean anything most of the time.

 

 

 

But wouldn't that mean that unless we're constantly attacking something our level isn't representing our true strength aswell, aru? :-k

 

 

 

Exactly. Sorry, Highlanders, but your point is invalid. It contradicts itself, because if it were true, then I'd have to be fighting a monster 100% of the time I play Runescape for my combat level to really "Represent my strength."

 

 

 

Oh, and by the way, when I say I have a familiar 90% of the time I play, I mean 90% OF THE TIME I PLAY. When i am in combat I have a familiar with me 100% of the time. No fail. End of story. End of point.

[timmyx50]

you know, some people compare summoning to prayer. and then people say "well, prayer can be used anywhere... summoning cant."

 

well, prayer CANT be used anywhere. some boss battles, mini games, ect... :ugeek:

 

 

 

but anyways...

 

when people ask me what my true level is, i say 109. (my lvl with sum.) then they say "oh, so you have 1 summoning?" and i say "nope, 62 summoning. if its in the game, then it counts. as far as im concerned (parden my bad spelling. :oops: ) ny true level is 109. anyone who says otherwise is just... well... i dont know what to say.

[P_E_N_N_Y]

its looked down upon because it's the most expensive combat skill and many people won't ever be able to obtain a decent level in it

[matanui12321]

its looked down upon because it's the most expensive combat skill and many people won't ever be able to obtain a decent level in it

 

Not nearly. With summoning you can MAKE money. Can you make money training prayer?

[highlanders]

The thing is, you are not always using a familiar. And when you aren't, your level doesn't represent your true strength. It's a conditional combat level, that doesn't mean anything most of the time.

 

 

 

But wouldn't that mean that unless we're constantly attacking something our level isn't representing our true strength aswell, aru? :-k

 

 

 

Exactly. Sorry, Highlanders, but your point is invalid. It contradicts itself, because if it were true, then I'd have to be fighting a monster 100% of the time I play Runescape for my combat level to really "Represent my strength."

 

 

 

Oh, and by the way, when I say I have a familiar 90% of the time I play, I mean 90% OF THE TIME I PLAY. When i am in combat I have a familiar with me 100% of the time. No fail. End of story. End of point.

 

 

 

Rofl, that's not the point :P Your melee, magic, prayer, and ranged levels are your own. While your summoning combat levels represent the strength of the combat familiars you could possibly use. That strength is not your own, but the familiar's, thus when your familiar is not summoned that strength is completely gone.

[Inuashakent]

It is a new skill, and on top of that, it affects your combat level. People do hate change, especially one this big.

 

 

 

Summoning IS useful, but you can't use it in non-multi, and to them, it's not a part of YOU.

[Ragnar_2006]

tell me how to train it and i wont look down on it :P dunno where to go from 22 summoning...

[CampbellMC]

Most lower levels look down upon summoning because they do not have the funding to get it to a reasonable level where it helps with combat. At level 68 (which is not that high for any other combat stat except prayer) you get the bunyip which you can use anytime and it heals a good amount, where it may not attack with you to show how fast you can kill another creature with your higher combat level, it is like an extension to your HP stat. Summoning isnt really seen as its own skill to me, but it is seen as a way to further all of your current stat through alternate ways.

[Outsanity]

 

 

 

Rofl, that's not the point :P Your melee, magic, prayer, and ranged levels are your own. While your summoning combat levels represent the strength of the combat familiars you could possibly use. That strength is not your own, but the familiar's, thus when your familiar is not summoned that strength is completely gone.

 

 

 

Lol....so tell me, do prayer levels count? They are not my OWN strength. They are the God's strength being bestowed upon me!

 

 

 

The experience a familiar gets GOES TO YOU. It is YOUR experience, and the damage the familiar does counts as YOUR damage. Your familiar doesn't get the drop if it deals more damage than you to a monster, does it? No. So then why would you consider a familiar to not be part of your combat?

 

 

 

Oh, and furthermore, a familiar does not have to fight for it to be effective in battle. Healing familiars heal you, which is VERY much a part of combat, but not on the offensive. Steel and Iron Titans add 15% and 10% defense bonus to you, respectively. And furthermore, what about the familiars that eat at your opponent's food, or unequip their shields and weapons, or drain their prayer, or poison or cure you of poison? Are those not combat related skills?

 

 

 

Just because you're not hacking away at something with your familiar does not mean you are not using it for combat. Your idea of combat is simple minded and I laugh at you because you honestly don't realize there's more to combat than offense. This skill is NOT meant to be solely an offensive skill. Yes, it can be offensive, some familiars (Like the Steel Titan) can one hit most average player. But by no means does that mean that is all Summoning is good for.

 

 

 

So, your argument is crap and you know it. Excuse me for being blunt about it.

[Trollface]

Most lower levels look down upon summoning because they do not have the funding to get it to a reasonable level where it helps with combat. At level 68 (which is not that high for any other combat stat except prayer) you get the bunyip which you can use anytime and it heals a good amount, where it may not attack with you to show how fast you can kill another creature with your higher combat level, it is like an extension to your HP stat. Summoning isnt really seen as its own skill to me, but it is seen as a way to further all of your current stat through alternate ways.

 

 

 

Heck, even the Void Spinner pwns, it heals 116 extra hp during it's lifetime and requires level 37(I think) summon, which is fairly easy to get due to Bogrog now.

[highlanders]

Lol....so tell me, do prayer levels count? They are not my OWN strength. They are the God's strength being bestowed upon me!

 

Wow! Roleplay as argument. I give up!

 

 

 

The experience a familiar gets GOES TO YOU. It is YOUR experience, and the damage the familiar does counts as YOUR damage. Your familiar doesn't get the drop if it deals more damage than you to a monster, does it? No. So then why would you consider a familiar to not be part of your combat?

 

Obviously me and my familiar live in the same body permanently. I don't know where people get that "pouch" idea from :?:

 

 

 

 

Oh, and furthermore, a familiar does not have to fight for it to be effective in battle. Healing familiars heal you, which is VERY much a part of combat, but not on the offensive. Steel and Iron Titans add 15% and 10% defense bonus to you, respectively. And furthermore, what about the familiars that eat at your opponent's food, or unequip their shields and weapons, or drain their prayer, or poison or cure you of poison? Are those not combat related skills?

 

 

 

Just because you're not hacking away at something with your familiar does not mean you are not using it for combat. Your idea of combat is simple minded and I laugh at you because you honestly don't realize there's more to combat than offense.

 

This skill is NOT meant to be solely an offensive skill. Yes, it can be offensive, some familiars (Like the Steel Titan) can one hit most average player. But by no means does that mean that is all Summoning is good for.

 

Oh wow, reading that I just realized that my idea of combat is simple minded and that I honestly dont realize theres more to combat than offence! Omg, I just noticed theres a defence level in melee! Thanks, it would have taken me atleast 3 more years to realize that without your help!

 

 

 

 

So, your argument is crap and you know it. Excuse me for being blunt about it.

 

Says who? Oh wait, right, you are God overlord Outsanity? Wow, I better watch out or Im going to get struck by lightning. :ohnoes:

[Range_This11]

Personally, I dislike summoning. I disagree with almost every pro-summoning post in this topic. I'm not going to train it. I do have plenty of cash to train it with and charm counts over 1k for each color (aside from blue). I'm sorry, but I just do not think that summoning should have an affect on combat levels. That's just my side of the story and I'm going to stick to it.

[Millard]

Castle wars is full of morons, and you just met one. If he actually had an IQ higher than 5 he would see that summoning is by far the most useful skill.

[Irish_Geek]

Lol....so tell me, do prayer levels count? They are not my OWN strength. They are the God's strength being bestowed upon me!

 

Wow! Roleplay as argument. I give up!

 

 

 

The experience a familiar gets GOES TO YOU. It is YOUR experience, and the damage the familiar does counts as YOUR damage. Your familiar doesn't get the drop if it deals more damage than you to a monster, does it? No. So then why would you consider a familiar to not be part of your combat?

 

Obviously me and my familiar live in the same body permanently. I don't know where people get that "pouch" idea from :?:

 

 

 

 

Oh, and furthermore, a familiar does not have to fight for it to be effective in battle. Healing familiars heal you, which is VERY much a part of combat, but not on the offensive. Steel and Iron Titans add 15% and 10% defense bonus to you, respectively. And furthermore, what about the familiars that eat at your opponent's food, or unequip their shields and weapons, or drain their prayer, or poison or cure you of poison? Are those not combat related skills?

 

 

 

Just because you're not hacking away at something with your familiar does not mean you are not using it for combat. Your idea of combat is simple minded and I laugh at you because you honestly don't realize there's more to combat than offense.

 

This skill is NOT meant to be solely an offensive skill. Yes, it can be offensive, some familiars (Like the Steel Titan) can one hit most average player. But by no means does that mean that is all Summoning is good for.

 

Oh wow, reading that I just realized that my idea of combat is simple minded and that I honestly dont realize theres more to combat than offence! Omg, I just noticed theres a defence level in melee! Thanks, it would have taken me atleast 3 more years to realize that without your help!

 

 

 

 

So, your argument is crap and you know it. Excuse me for being blunt about it.

 

Says who? Oh wait, right, you are God overlord Outsanity? Wow, I better watch out or Im going to get struck by lightning. :ohnoes:

 

 

 

And on that note, you will no longer be taken seriously. We have an "e-Thug" in the house!

 

 

 

Summoning just needs to be recognized as not only a combat skill, but also like any other skill, whether it be money making or just useful for various tasks. Take the Pyrelord for example. Yes you can take it into combat and raise strength while it attacks for you, or you can use it while firemaking. Not only will it count as your tinderbox, but you get a whopping 10 extra experience with every log burnt. From level 45, you need to burn 96096 maple logs. With an extra 10 experience you save the time of burning 7119 logs, and roughly 300k. Sounds like a good deal to me.

[Silver_Corner]

So, your argument is crap and you know it. Excuse me for being blunt about it.

 

Says who? Oh wait, right, you are God overlord Outsanity? Wow, I better watch out or Im going to get struck by lightning. :ohnoes:

 

 

 

Actually, I agree with Outsanity. Your very wrong highlanders with your squewed point of view on combat.

 

 

 

Take this for example. Consider summoning, as an extension of the 6 combat skills, strength, attack, defense, range, magic, and HP.

 

 

 

Prayer and Summoning are both extensions to these skills improving their accuracy and damage, or assisting them in other ways. That is why they are based very similarly in combat level additions.

 

 

 

For example: Bunyips heal you like the rapid restore prayer rate heals you. Lava titans increase your max hit and hit additional damage like the piety prayer. The fact is summoning is alot like prayer, but much more advanced adding alot of additional bonuses. The fact its a NPC has no effect on if its a combat or non-combat skill.

 

 

 

So as you can see prayer and summon have many similarities. They are both skill enhancers! Which is why they both count towards your combat level. Unlike attack, or range, you dont not have to train the skill enhancers (prayer or summon) to deal damage in the game. But the enhancer skills help improve it. THAT is why summon adds combat levels.

 

 

 

So really Highlander, you agrument has no valid point. Your simply expressing that summoning alone is worthless, which is true, but its not mean to be a major skill on its own. Its meant to help other skills making them more powerful, which is the EXACT same thing as prayer.

 

 

 

So many people think combat familiars are so weak on their own, but really, the combat familiars hitting +6 more damage is more damage than some combat prayers add. So dont think of it as a skill on its own, but an addition and you will see why it adds to combat levels.

[Irish_Geek]

Also, when and where are we judged on combat anyways nowadays. The only spot is probably bounty hunter, which if you don't want extra levels you don't need to train it. Should defence pures be considered less because they have lower defence than the average player around their level? Didn't think so. It's just a new way to train, and getting the skill to where it is now for me has been fun, because I'm always testing the new familiars. By the way, Dust Devils suck.

[Will H]

 

Exactly. Sorry, Highlanders, but your point is invalid. It contradicts itself, because if it were true, then I'd have to be fighting a monster 100% of the time I play Runescape for my combat level to really "Represent my strength."

 

 

 

Oh, and by the way, when I say I have a familiar 90% of the time I play, I mean 90% OF THE TIME I PLAY. When i am in combat I have a familiar with me 100% of the time. No fail. End of story. End of point.

 

 

 

Rofl, that's not the point :P Your melee, magic, prayer, and ranged levels are your own. While your summoning combat levels represent the strength of the combat familiars you could possibly use. That strength is not your own, but the familiar's, thus when your familiar is not summoned that strength is completely gone.

 

 

 

You have to look a bit more openly when it comes to what is 'your own' strength. You've also got the capability to produce something with it's own strength, which when fighting adds to your own damage, so It's technically damage coming from you and technically your own strength. Plus, it's like having high melee stats and medium level magic stats and using magic instead of melee, so therefore by your logic your combat level should decrease because you're not using your superior melee stats which decides your combat level. It's all to do with maximum potential, which exclude factors such as you enemies' defensive properties. You could decide, for whatever reason (such as your opponent is wearing armour), that you will not use your best skills to fight and will use a different skill (such as magic) to actually get a better amount of damage in. Then your combat level is inaccurate.

 

You could summon a familiar to attack an enemy, but you might not because it's not worth the pouch. Again your combat level is inaccurate.

 

But that's the nature of combat levels, the fact that a sensible character with a fighting familiar is a better fighter than the same character on it's own justifies the combat level increase.

[MicroLegionnaire]

Castle wars is full of morons, and you just met one. If he actually had an IQ higher than 5 he would see that summoning is by far the most useful skill.

 

 

 

Well, I wouldn't say its THE most useful skill, though I fully agree that you meet lots of morons in Castle Wars, and that it is pretty handy, I love my macaw. (Double ranarr drop ftw!) I'm trying to get to 52 to see what all the fuss is about with terrorbirds, though I'm a little short on funding :(

 

 

 

OT : People generally regard anything they can't fully understand or obtain with disdain (Hey, that rhymes!). If I remember right, 1 to 16 Summoning costs close to 80k. Save Construction, I can't think of skill that costs that much to train.

 

 

 

There's a guide somewhere by this guy called Smavey, it shows how useful most familiars can be, but it probably got lost in the rollback.