Quest 150 not epic enough?

[ddaanniiellh]

The fact that they couldn't finish yet another piece of content "on time" is just ridiculous.

 

Your attitude = the reason BTS is gone.

 

 

 

Agreed. In HD I can barely read clan chat against some backgrounds, like green grass. A full screen low detail would solve this problem for me. I don't need all the effects, I just like the big [wagon] screen.

 

You can go into high detail and still turn all (or most, at least) of the effects off you know? :P

 

Unfortunately, on full screen, the text is still terrible for full screen...especially in areas like snow. You can't read a single thing unless you look really close.

 

~Dan

[OutwarDragon]

I am only mildly disappointed by "150" but more with how they handled the rewards. I am glad to know this was not the "epic quest with balance and coding issues" that had been mentioned in another Mod MMG quote somewhere here. And really is the C-bow that bad? it has a reasonable special for the effort of the quest.

[zeety]

 

You can go into high detail and still turn all (or most, at least) of the effects off you know? :P

 

 

 

Yup, that's how I run it, barebones minimized.

 

 

 

 

see what I mean?

[Forerunner]

Jagex could have released Sheep Shearer Part II & it would be epic enough.

 

Don't "expect" things, just be happy with what you get.

[Nenga]

I liked the chosen commander as quest 150. I play a game for the story, not the items you can get in the game.

[Chained_life]

The fact that they couldn't finish yet another piece of content "on time" is just ridiculous.

 

Your attitude = the reason BTS is gone.

 

 

 

I know, it's our fault they couldn't keep their word (update what they say they were gonna update)

 

This is the first month without BTS and we've gotten 2 updates... both nothing impressive. They got rid of BTS so they wouldn't be entitled to actually do their job. Now they can update whenever the hell they feel like it. And that's bad for the players who are bored with this game who have nothing to do. I've tried all the mini games, completed achievement diaries, completed quests, completed most of the skills in terms of items, monsters and other things you can achieve. But go on, keep telling me it's my fault BTS is gone :roll: Whether you like it or not, they could not complete it on time, the mods have said on the forums that they wanted the big quest to be the 150th. They failed to complete for whatever reasons. Maybe they're too talking to people in-game? Or maybe too busy creating content for f2pers?

 

 

 

 

 

It's nice to know this wasn't meant to be the real 150th quest. It sucked, I didn't care for the story, since I read books for stories, I play games for fun (not to say books aren't fun, I would skip rs any day for a book I really like). Rewards were for low levels, maul is bad, crossbow is another Pj weapon, nerfed course. Sure I give them credit for their work, just not a quest that appeals to me. Now that I know we have the real quest right around the corner, I probably won't let my membership expire. Or I may, until we see the actual update.

[Amundogus2]

I'm doing the quest right now, and it's definitely a worthy 150 for me :thumbsup

 

The "Throne of Bandos" music is so eerie and awesome :

[Racheya]

Now they can update whenever the hell they feel like it.

 

Yes, it's their game genius, of course they can update whenever the hell they feel like it.

 

 

 

And that's bad for the players who are bored with this game who have nothing to do. I've tried all the mini games, completed achievement diaries, completed quests, completed most of the skills in terms of items, monsters and other things you can achieve.

 

Fair enough for you, but thats a small percentage of the Runescape population and even when you've done all that there ARE still things you can do.

 

 

Or maybe too busy creating content for f2pers?

 

Because this is a bad thing? Since P2P can't use content they make for F2P right?

 

 

 

 

It's nice to know this wasn't meant to be the real 150th quest. It sucked, I didn't care for the story, since I read books for stories, I play games for fun (not to say books aren't fun, I would skip rs any day for a book I really like).

 

So something can't be fun and have a story too? This is an MMORPG, Role play. Role play usually involves some story if you like it or not.

[Kimberly]

Not to be one of the skeptics, but it would've been lovely to see more context to that picture. A line of text in the chatbox is rather easy to fake.

 

 

 

Still, if that's true...I personally find myself rather pleased with the storyline and the wrap-up to the Dorgeshuun storyline. Found it more interesting than the Recipe for Disaster quest to be honest--although RfD was very unique. But if there's another quest to be coming...that's considered "epic"...

 

 

 

Well hey! Better still for a quester like me ;D

[Seraphi]

I liked the quest, but thats beside the point I guess.

 

Mod mmg did mention something about a junk vacuum quest reward?

[Myweponsg00d]

Now they can update whenever the hell they feel like it.

 

Yes, it's their game genius, of course they can update whenever the hell they feel like it.

 

 

 

 

We are not saying that they CAN'T update whenever they feel like it. We are saying that we don't like the terrible and infrequent updates, and the fact that they are going to be coming out more sporadically is disheartening for many high level players. I've soloed the bosses in this game, I've done the quests, I've gotten all the drops, I've killed the KB, I've played the minigames, I've done so many TTrails that I have gotten 3rd age items, I've gotten most skills to nearly their highest "useful" level. The game is great but honestly, what I pay 5 bucks a month for is a continued assurance that there will be reliable NEW content that my membership fee paid to develop.

 

 

 

What have I paid for in the past month? A couple interface updates, an update to route-finding (both of these do not introduce any new CONTENT), and the fabled 150th quest which gave us no content that was going to be permanently used in the game at high levels, which means the only content my membership got me was a 90 minute quest to wrap up a storyline that I find boring. Also, I find out that I was SUPPOSED to recieve a truly great quest for the 150th, but the development team couldn't seem to get it right and they were forced to replace our 150th quest with a beginner level quest, or else they would go yet another week with no update.

 

 

 

They WANTED to release a huge quest for the 150th, but they COULDN'T. This is not the first time that the Jagex team just could not accomplish what they intended to do. In fact, I would guess that it is about the 50th time, if we count all the planned updates they shared with us which they abandoned, and all the updates that came out but were buggy, abused, or otherwise not used in the way that they thought it was going to be. This just gives me the feeling that the devs over at HQ just do not know what they are doing. They dont know how long their content is going to take, they don't know how to make it bug-free. These are reasons for concern when you are somebody who relies on devs to supply interesting content each month.

 

 

 

Awhile back they said theyd release a "headliner update" like a big mini game or big new quest every month. Everyone was thrilled at the idea. Then they realized they couldn't do it.

[khil01]

[hide=quotes]

Now they can update whenever the hell they feel like it.

 

Yes, it's their game genius, of course they can update whenever the hell they feel like it.

 

 

 

 

We are not saying that they CAN'T update whenever they feel like it. We are saying that we don't like the terrible and infrequent updates, and the fact that they are going to be coming out more sporadically is disheartening for many high level players. I've soloed the bosses in this game, I've done the quests, I've gotten all the drops, I've killed the KB, I've played the minigames, I've done so many TTrails that I have gotten 3rd age items, I've gotten most skills to nearly their highest "useful" level. The game is great but honestly, what I pay 5 bucks a month for is a continued assurance that there will be reliable NEW content that my membership fee paid to develop.

 

 

 

What have I paid for in the past month? A couple interface updates, an update to route-finding (both of these do not introduce any new CONTENT), and the fabled 150th quest which gave us no content that was going to be permanently used in the game at high levels, which means the only content my membership got me was a 90 minute quest to wrap up a storyline that I find boring. Also, I find out that I was SUPPOSED to recieve a truly great quest for the 150th, but the development team couldn't seem to get it right and they were forced to replace our 150th quest with a beginner level quest, or else they would go yet another week with no update.

 

 

 

They WANTED to release a huge quest for the 150th, but they COULDN'T. This is not the first time that the Jagex team just could not accomplish what they intended to do. In fact, I would guess that it is about the 50th time, if we count all the planned updates they shared with us which they abandoned, and all the updates that came out but were buggy, abused, or otherwise not used in the way that they thought it was going to be. This just gives me the feeling that the devs over at HQ just do not know what they are doing. They dont know how long their content is going to take, they don't know how to make it bug-free. These are reasons for concern when you are somebody who relies on devs to supply interesting content each month.

 

 

 

Awhile back they said theyd release a "headliner update" like a big mini game or big new quest every month. Everyone was thrilled at the idea. Then they realized they couldn't do it.

[/hide]

 

The whole reason they took the bts away is because of people like you. they didn't want to feel like they HAD to release a certain quest this month even if they ran into problems with it. Yes they had planned for a big special quest to be 150 but they ran into problems with it, instead of releasing a quest that wasn't ready, and instead of giving us a month without a quest, they gave us a fun quest that made the first ever completed storyline!

[Racheya]

Now they can update whenever the hell they feel like it.

 

Yes, it's their game genius, of course they can update whenever the hell they feel like it.

 

 

 

 

We are not saying that they CAN'T update whenever they feel like it. We are saying that we don't like the terrible and infrequent updates, and the fact that they are going to be coming out more sporadically is disheartening for many high level players. I've soloed the bosses in this game, I've done the quests, I've gotten all the drops, I've killed the KB, I've played the minigames, I've done so many TTrails that I have gotten 3rd age items, I've gotten most skills to nearly their highest "useful" level. The game is great but honestly, what I pay 5 bucks a month for is a continued assurance that there will be reliable NEW content that my membership fee paid to develop.

 

 

 

What have I paid for in the past month? A couple interface updates, an update to route-finding (both of these do not introduce any new CONTENT), and the fabled 150th quest which gave us no content that was going to be permanently used in the game at high levels, which means the only content my membership got me was a 90 minute quest to wrap up a storyline that I find boring. Also, I find out that I was SUPPOSED to recieve a truly great quest for the 150th, but the development team couldn't seem to get it right and they were forced to replace our 150th quest with a beginner level quest, or else they would go yet another week with no update.

 

 

 

They WANTED to release a huge quest for the 150th, but they COULDN'T. This is not the first time that the Jagex team just could not accomplish what they intended to do. In fact, I would guess that it is about the 50th time, if we count all the planned updates they shared with us which they abandoned, and all the updates that came out but were buggy, abused, or otherwise not used in the way that they thought it was going to be. This just gives me the feeling that the devs over at HQ just do not know what they are doing. They dont know how long their content is going to take, they don't know how to make it bug-free. These are reasons for concern when you are somebody who relies on devs to supply interesting content each month.

 

 

 

Awhile back they said theyd release a "headliner update" like a big mini game or big new quest every month. Everyone was thrilled at the idea. Then they realized they couldn't do it.

 

I do get what you mean and I can see how it's frustrating without new good content coming out as regularly, but since we've not been with the new CEO long and they've really just started this new way of putting out updates it's different to them too so it might take a while for them to get used to it.

 

 

 

Also a quest is a quest, sure you didn't get the massive bonanza of a Grandmaster quest. But what's better, waiting a little longer to have that quest a little better and bug free? Or having a quest put out too early because it's been pressured by a BTS. From what I've heard it's a decent quest with a good storyline and okay rewards.

 

 

 

Every quest can't keep topping the last one, there HAS to be content that caters to other people than the top for quests as well as skills and that. If Jagex made each quest harder and harder as some people seem to want then we'll end up with all 99 requirements next.

[Nenga]

Now they can update whenever the hell they feel like it.

 

Yes, it's their game genius, of course they can update whenever the hell they feel like it.

 

 

 

 

We are not saying that they CAN'T update whenever they feel like it. We are saying that we don't like the terrible and infrequent updates, and the fact that they are going to be coming out more sporadically is disheartening for many high level players. I've soloed the bosses in this game, I've done the quests, I've gotten all the drops, I've killed the KB, I've played the minigames, I've done so many TTrails that I have gotten 3rd age items, I've gotten most skills to nearly their highest "useful" level. The game is great but honestly, what I pay 5 bucks a month for is a continued assurance that there will be reliable NEW content that my membership fee paid to develop.

 

 

 

What have I paid for in the past month? A couple interface updates, an update to route-finding (both of these do not introduce any new CONTENT), and the fabled 150th quest which gave us no content that was going to be permanently used in the game at high levels, which means the only content my membership got me was a 90 minute quest to wrap up a storyline that I find boring. Also, I find out that I was SUPPOSED to recieve a truly great quest for the 150th, but the development team couldn't seem to get it right and they were forced to replace our 150th quest with a beginner level quest, or else they would go yet another week with no update.

 

 

 

They WANTED to release a huge quest for the 150th, but they COULDN'T. This is not the first time that the Jagex team just could not accomplish what they intended to do. In fact, I would guess that it is about the 50th time, if we count all the planned updates they shared with us which they abandoned, and all the updates that came out but were buggy, abused, or otherwise not used in the way that they thought it was going to be. This just gives me the feeling that the devs over at HQ just do not know what they are doing. They dont know how long their content is going to take, they don't know how to make it bug-free. These are reasons for concern when you are somebody who relies on devs to supply interesting content each month.

 

 

 

Awhile back they said theyd release a "headliner update" like a big mini game or big new quest every month. Everyone was thrilled at the idea. Then they realized they couldn't do it.

 

Well, this is the challenge that weve set ourselves: 2009 has become our official Upgrade Year!

So Jagex released that to say they will be focusing more on fixing old content instead of focusing on new content, then you complain that Jagex is doing exactly what they said? Really just because you don't like something Jagex has to ditch the whole idea and bring out the content you want? What a great mindset, i'm sure you'll have many jobs in the future.

[Ax600]

hopefully its the dang "junk quest" theyve been talking about... my banks about filled to the max...

[Myweponsg00d]

 

Well, this is the challenge that weve set ourselves: 2009 has become our official Upgrade Year!

So Jagex released that to say they will be focusing more on fixing old content instead of focusing on new content........

 

 

 

Before you TRY to use sarcastic rhetorical arguments, you should read the entirety of what Jagex has told us before further humiliating yourself. In that same post they say:

 

 

 

Of course, we don't want to JUST do upgrades, so we're planning to do a mix of upgrades and new content. To achieve this we are planning on going back to releasing approximately four updates per month, which will alternate between upgrades and new content.

 

 

 

Saying they want to focus more on upgrades instead of new content is just a complete lie and neglects most of what the BTS 2009 had to say.

 

 

 

Also, however, all of this is completely void by the, yet again, radical stance that has been taken by Jagex. Their new stance is that they don't want to tell us what kind of updates to be expecting, because it hinders their developmental "freedom". This new attitude, I am assuming, basically overrides their strategy in BTS 2009 because they have, in fact, NOT released content at a rate of 4 updates per month. Also, part of my aggrivation is about the sheerly confounding "stances" that they are trying to take. They lasted two months on their "one headliner" update system, they lasted a month on the "4 updates per month, alternating each week with content and upgrades", and now it has been about a month since MMG came around and got rid of our BTS, etc... How long is THIS phase going to last before it goes up in smoke and they decide again that they don't like the way they are doing things? This company has given us nearly 6 months of flip flopping on update/development style and frankly I just cannot stand this type of garbage anymore.

 

 

 

 

Also a quest is a quest, sure you didn't get the massive bonanza of a Grandmaster quest. But what's better, waiting a little longer to have that quest a little better and bug free? Or having a quest put out too early because it's been pressured by a BTS. From what I've heard it's a decent quest with a good storyline and okay rewards.

 

 

 

 

This is the point. The fact that I have to wait for the good content, and in the meantime have to suffer bored because they could not perform the way they want to. If the team was a good development team, they would set realistic goals, develop quality useful content, and have it be bug free when the expected date comes. Heres the thing: I know, every person makes mistakes. But, this isn't a rare mistake. Every time there is a big update coming it is either a.) late, b.) unfairly balanced, c.) glitched, d.) crashes the servers or disconnects people, or e.) not working "the way they intended it to". I would like to see ONE big update that has no glitches, no exploits, and everything works 100% the way they wanted it. They couldn't even get the damn agility course right. We have a mini game that is two months late now, and the "150th" quest was messed up so bad that they obviously feel that they can't have us wait any longer for it. Just think about it: they are developing a huge "big deal" quest that they wanted to be 150th...and have been working on it for months. Now...they are so far behind that they had time to create a wallpaper, create a hoodie...and then try to pass off this dumb goblin quest as our #150.

 

 

 

Think about that. A week+ ago, they had to have said "Well, our #150 development team, hows the quest going? Oh....not done yet? Oh...not going to be done for THAT LONG? Well, now lets take ALL THE TIME to make a new banner/wallpaper for this OTHER QUEST and DESIGN A HOODIE based around this OTHER QUEST. How long does it take to design these things???? For THAT long...they have known that the true #150 would just NOT BE READY! There wasn't a question of if it was going to be ready...there wasn't a CHANCE the team would be done...the team wasn't FORCED to work harder to get the update out in time to be #150 because THEY WERE JUST THAT FAR BEHIND ON IT

 

 

 

To me this is unbelieveable. Everyone says "This is their game!! They can do what they want!!!"

 

 

 

WELL....NOPE, they CAN'T even do what THEY WANT. What THEY WANTED was to release Mobilising Armies in January. What THEY WANTED was an EPIC quest for #150 but instead we waited two weeks for a filler quest that they tried to pull off as the 150th. What THEY WANTED was to release one "headline update" every month but they just COULDN'T DO IT. Not only this, but the whole damn company doesn't seem to KNOW what they even want. First we are told to expect one huge update every month, then we are told that instead of this strategy they want to do "upgrades" (what a cop-out), and now they are telling us that this game is going to be hugely directed at the player base and we are going to be more involved with the game planning and updates...etc.

 

 

 

And then what the hell happens? First...BTS goes away. Then, they try to decieve us by putting in some crummy filler quest instead of actually having the real one ready. They didn't tell us on the main page that there were troubles. We were all looking forward to this. They could have had a poll two weeks ago saying "We are way behind on quest 150....should we put more people on the job or just continue working on it and release it later than 150?" No...nothing happened like this. We have to see from in-game chat that this isn't what they wanted to do at all. Where was the community in this? Where was the development team in the WEEKS that they knew that this quest was falling behind? Instead of getting the job done the way they WANTED to...the order was given to completely abandon the idea that this quest would be #150 and a team was appointed to begin concept design on a replacement wallpaper/banner and a limited edition sweatshirt.

 

 

 

I refuse to have the wool pulled over my eyes like this again. The devs just are unable to perform and don't have what it takes to develop their original ideas. When you are creating a group project, the first thing you do is establish your goals and assess if you have what it takes to fulfill them. This team doesn't, and I am sick of it.

[murgatroid99]

[hide=long quote]

 

Well, this is the challenge that weve set ourselves: 2009 has become our official Upgrade Year!

So Jagex released that to say they will be focusing more on fixing old content instead of focusing on new content........

 

 

 

Before you TRY to use sarcastic rhetorical arguments, you should read the entirety of what Jagex has told us before further humiliating yourself. In that same post they say:

 

 

 

Of course, we don't want to JUST do upgrades, so we're planning to do a mix of upgrades and new content. To achieve this we are planning on going back to releasing approximately four updates per month, which will alternate between upgrades and new content.

 

 

 

Saying they want to focus more on upgrades instead of new content is just a complete lie and neglects most of what the BTS 2009 had to say.

 

 

 

Also, however, all of this is completely void by the, yet again, radical stance that has been taken by Jagex. Their new stance is that they don't want to tell us what kind of updates to be expecting, because it hinders their developmental "freedom". This new attitude, I am assuming, basically overrides their strategy in BTS 2009 because they have, in fact, NOT released content at a rate of 4 updates per month. Also, part of my aggrivation is about the sheerly confounding "stances" that they are trying to take. They lasted two months on their "one headliner" update system, they lasted a month on the "4 updates per month, alternating each week with content and upgrades", and now it has been about a month since MMG came around and got rid of our BTS, etc... How long is THIS phase going to last before it goes up in smoke and they decide again that they don't like the way they are doing things? This company has given us nearly 6 months of flip flopping on update/development style and frankly I just cannot stand this type of garbage anymore.

 

 

 

 

Also a quest is a quest, sure you didn't get the massive bonanza of a Grandmaster quest. But what's better, waiting a little longer to have that quest a little better and bug free? Or having a quest put out too early because it's been pressured by a BTS. From what I've heard it's a decent quest with a good storyline and okay rewards.

 

 

 

 

This is the point. The fact that I have to wait for the good content, and in the meantime have to suffer bored because they could not perform the way they want to. If the team was a good development team, they would set realistic goals, develop quality useful content, and have it be bug free when the expected date comes. Heres the thing: I know, every person makes mistakes. But, this isn't a rare mistake. Every time there is a big update coming it is either a.) late, b.) unfairly balanced, c.) glitched, d.) crashes the servers or disconnects people, or e.) not working "the way they intended it to". I would like to see ONE big update that has no glitches, no exploits, and everything works 100% the way they wanted it. They couldn't even get the damn agility course right. We have a mini game that is two months late now, and the "150th" quest was messed up so bad that they obviously feel that they can't have us wait any longer for it. Just think about it: they are developing a huge "big deal" quest that they wanted to be 150th...and have been working on it for months. Now...they are so far behind that they had time to create a wallpaper, create a hoodie...and then try to pass off this dumb goblin quest as our #150.

 

 

 

Think about that. A week+ ago, they had to have said "Well, our #150 development team, hows the quest going? Oh....not done yet? Oh...not going to be done for THAT LONG? Well, now lets take ALL THE TIME to make a new banner/wallpaper for this OTHER QUEST and DESIGN A HOODIE based around this OTHER QUEST. How long does it take to design these things???? For THAT long...they have known that the true #150 would just NOT BE READY! There wasn't a question of if it was going to be ready...there wasn't a CHANCE the team would be done...the team wasn't FORCED to work harder to get the update out in time to be #150 because THEY WERE JUST THAT FAR BEHIND ON IT

 

 

 

To me this is unbelieveable. Everyone says "This is their game!! They can do what they want!!!"

 

 

 

WELL....NOPE, they CAN'T even do what THEY WANT. What THEY WANTED was to release Mobilising Armies in January. What THEY WANTED was an EPIC quest for #150 but instead we waited two weeks for a filler quest that they tried to pull off as the 150th. What THEY WANTED was to release one "headline update" every month but they just COULDN'T DO IT. Not only this, but the whole damn company doesn't seem to KNOW what they even want. First we are told to expect one huge update every month, then we are told that instead of this strategy they want to do "upgrades" (what a cop-out), and now they are telling us that this game is going to be hugely directed at the player base and we are going to be more involved with the game planning and updates...etc.

 

 

 

And then what the hell happens? First...BTS goes away. Then, they try to decieve us by putting in some crummy filler quest instead of actually having the real one ready. They didn't tell us on the main page that there were troubles. We were all looking forward to this. They could have had a poll two weeks ago saying "We are way behind on quest 150....should we put more people on the job or just continue working on it and release it later than 150?" No...nothing happened like this. We have to see from in-game chat that this isn't what they wanted to do at all. Where was the community in this? Where was the development team in the WEEKS that they knew that this quest was falling behind? Instead of getting the job done the way they WANTED to...the order was given to completely abandon the idea that this quest would be #150 and a team was appointed to begin concept design on a replacement wallpaper/banner and a limited edition sweatshirt.

 

 

 

I refuse to have the wool pulled over my eyes like this again. The devs just are unable to perform and don't have what it takes to develop their original ideas. When you are creating a group project, the first thing you do is establish your goals and assess if you have what it takes to fulfill them. This team doesn't, and I am sick of it.

[/hide]

 

I have to assume that you have never been in video game development before. I am a Computer Science student and I was recently the head programmer on a school project to create a video game. Getting out all of the bugs simply that occured in normal operation of the game took months. None of these bugs is expected, and any good programmer knows that any project will take longer than you expect it to, even if you take that expectation into account. New quests, especially ones such as quest 150, will always require new code, sometimes in large amounts, and therefore will always have a lot of bugs. As a programmer, I think the best thing they can do is test every possible action in the quest to root out any bugs there. That can take a very long time, even before they start testing for things like difficulty and balancing. The list of code they must have added to the game engine to make this thing work is too long to try to put here, and having done the quest, I am glad that everything works perfectly.

 

 

 

The development team's inability to follow an artificially created schedule does not mean that they are not doing their jobs. If players demand one content filled update every week or two weeks, the dev team will release in that time what they know they can finish in two weeks, which severely limits the range of updates to small ones that can be completed and tested in that time. Now that they are removing this useless deadline, they will finally have a freedom to create any size update and test it for long enough to get rid of bug and balance issues. I think a food analogy works here. Lets say you order a cake and tell the chef that it needs to be done by a certain time. When they tell you that they need more time to make a good cake, you say that it doesn't matter, they need to finish the cake within a certain time. Would you rather they make the deadline and give you a half baked cake with most of the ingredients and sloppy icing, or that they give it to you an hour later but it is fully cooked, perfectly decorated, and delicious?

 

 

 

On a side note, I loved this quest. I thought it was one of the most emotional and story filled quests in the game, and for once they finally finished a quest line. I really hope that this will set a trend and they will start to finish more of the dangling quest lines. Just because you can only appreciate a quest for its rewards does not mean that everyone else feels the same way.

[Esper_Jones]

I have to assume that you have never been in video game development before. I am a Computer Science student and I was recently the head programmer on a school project to create a video game. Getting out all of the bugs simply that occured in normal operation of the game took months. None of these bugs is expected, and any good programmer knows that any project will take longer than you expect it to, even if you take that expectation into account. New quests, especially ones such as quest 150, will always require new code, sometimes in large amounts, and therefore will always have a lot of bugs. As a programmer, I think the best thing they can do is test every possible action in the quest to root out any bugs there. That can take a very long time, even before they start testing for things like difficulty and balancing. The list of code they must have added to the game engine to make this thing work is too long to try to put here, and having done the quest, I am glad that everything works perfectly.

 

 

 

The development team's inability to follow an artificially created schedule does not mean that they are not doing their jobs. If players demand one content filled update every week or two weeks, the dev team will release in that time what they know they can finish in two weeks, which severely limits the range of updates to small ones that can be completed and tested in that time. Now that they are removing this useless deadline, they will finally have a freedom to create any size update and test it for long enough to get rid of bug and balance issues. I think a food analogy works here. Lets say you order a cake and tell the chef that it needs to be done by a certain time. When they tell you that they need more time to make a good cake, you say that it doesn't matter, they need to finish the cake within a certain time. Would you rather they make the deadline and give you a half baked cake with most of the ingredients and sloppy icing, or that they give it to you an hour later but it is fully cooked, perfectly decorated, and delicious?

 

 

 

On a side note, I loved this quest. I thought it was one of the most emotional and story filled quests in the game, and for once they finally finished a quest line. I really hope that this will set a trend and they will start to finish more of the dangling quest lines. Just because you can only appreciate a quest for its rewards does not mean that everyone else feels the same way.

 

 

 

In a single team, your points are valid. Jagex, however, is a large company with many teams working on various content in parallel, frequently ignoring the other teams except closer to commit. A Runescape update, no matter how small, does not take one week to develop. There are just enough teams such that one team finishes each week or two, even if each piece of content took a few months to write.

 

 

 

If you want proof, read the developers listed under each quest, especially the earlier ones where more than one quest came out each month. Subsequent quests were nearly never created by the same team.

[Makoto_the_Phoenix]

I'm rather stunned at some folks. Jagex never said that they were delivering Quest #150 on any sort of time frame. This is why assuming things doesn't work so well; all it does is give anti-Jagex folk more fodder to work with.

 

 

 

In a single team, your points are valid. Jagex, however, is a large company with many teams working on various content in parallel, frequently ignoring the other teams except closer to commit. A Runescape update, no matter how small, does not take one week to develop. There are just enough teams such that one team finishes each week or two, even if each piece of content took a few months to write.

 

 

 

If you want proof, read the developers listed under each quest, especially the earlier ones where more than one quest came out each month. Subsequent quests were nearly never created by the same team.

 

It still applies in large teams. On a super-complicated piece of software such as RuneScape, one line can produce bugs that appear in the wildest of test cases (take the ? incident for instance). Hence, testing for absolutely every permeation of breakage, while not totally impossible on a large scale, is simply not feasible with a staff of 200, working on programming. Players, on the other hand, which outnumber the developers 6,250:1, can find more errors in programming in less time. But, that's really not the point here.

 

 

 

This is the point. The fact that I have to wait for the good content, and in the meantime have to suffer bored because they could not perform the way they want to. If the team was a good development team, they would set realistic goals, develop quality useful content, and have it be bug free when the expected date comes. Heres the thing: I know, every person makes mistakes. But, this isn't a rare mistake. Every time there is a big update coming it is either a.) late, b.) unfairly balanced, c.) glitched, d.) crashes the servers or disconnects people, or e.) not working "the way they intended it to". I would like to see ONE big update that has no glitches, no exploits, and everything works 100% the way they wanted it. They couldn't even get the damn agility course right. We have a mini game that is two months late now, and the "150th" quest was messed up so bad that they obviously feel that they can't have us wait any longer for it. Just think about it: they are developing a huge "big deal" quest that they wanted to be 150th...and have been working on it for months. Now...they are so far behind that they had time to create a wallpaper, create a hoodie...and then try to pass off this dumb goblin quest as our #150.

 

 

 

So, you've done absolutely every piece of content there is to do in RS? Done all the quests? Maxed out all the skills? Done (read: have a high ranking in) minigames such as Bounty Hunter, Duel Tournaments, and Fist of Guthix? You've literally played the game out to its maximum potential with existing content? If you have, then perhaps you have a reason to piss and moan like you've done. But, since you haven't, why don't you enjoy what you're got instead of whining every time an update comes out that you don't like?

[SkyarcherX]

the new crossbow is epic, bone crossbow on steroids :D

[Myweponsg00d]

 

I have to assume that you have never been in video game development before. I am a Computer Science student and I was recently the head programmer on a school project to create a video game. Getting out all of the bugs simply that occured in normal operation of the game took months.

 

I never said it didn't take a long time, I said they can't get it done on time. And when its finally done, it still has tons of flaws they somehow never catch. It happens yes. It happens in A PROJECT yes. But over and over again monthly, there is no reason for it to happen. I may not be a game designer, but I play tons of games, and have played a few other MMO's that don't seem to constantly have such problems.

 

 

None of these bugs is expected, and any good programmer knows that any project will take longer than you expect it to, even if you take that expectation into account. New quests, especially ones such as quest 150, will always require new code, sometimes in large amounts, and therefore will always have a lot of bugs. As a programmer, I think the best thing they can do is test every possible action in the quest to root out any bugs there. That can take a very long time, even before they start testing for things like difficulty and balancing. The list of code they must have added to the game engine to make this thing work is too long to try to put here, and having done the quest, I am glad that everything works perfectly.

 

This is irrelevent. They wanted it to be #150 and are so far off the mark that somebody even wanted to go through the trouble of making new homepage graphics and a new item at the store just to pretend this quest was the 150th. I am thinking that quest 150 is more than a month off its projected release. This could be understandable when making, as you stated, a VIDEO GAME, but not and UPDATE TO an existing game. Summoning was released a year ago, and they are still saying it isn't what they wanted it to be. Now we get quest 150 which is more of them releasing stuff that they didn't want it to be. Quest 150 should have been this epic quest they are still working on. Is it going to get a new homepage? Is it going to get a sweatshirt? Even if it does...It is very disheartening that the sweatshirt won't be able to have that #150 on it. They have robbed this epic quest of its potential glory. A lot was at stake here...they could have started off this new management with releasing the best ever one-of-a-kind #150 quest with matching wallpaper and a hugely collectible "150th quest" sweatshirt. Now some mediocre quest took its place.

 

 

The development team's inability to follow an artificially created schedule does not mean that they are not doing their jobs.

The schedule was not artificially created. They have said that the intended quest #150 is something that is still being worked on. Meaning that they INTENDED to do something, they WANTED to do something, but lacked the ability to. They continually misunderstand their abilities and constantly set unnattainable goals, leaving the community expecting much more than they can ever deliver. Not a first. (see: Mobilizing armies, player owned stores, encounters that are spawned for your adventuring group)

 

 

If players demand one content filled update every week or two weeks, the dev team will release in that time what they know they can finish in two weeks, which severely limits the range of updates to small ones that can be completed and tested in that time.

There are many development teams, and just because we would get weekly updates wouldn't mean that each update takes a week to develop.

 

 

Now that they are removing this useless deadline, they will finally have a freedom to create any size update and test it for long enough to get rid of bug and balance issues.

To you, it may be useless, but for myself, consistent good updates is what kept me playing Runescape for so long. Over the past year these have deteriorated much more noticeably than in the previous years. For awhile we were on such a roll. Runecrafting came with RS2...a challenging and hugely important skill. Barrows, slayer, farming, god wars, DKs, RFD....the list goes on and on. Maybe it isn't disappointing to you, but in all my years of RS, I have never seen such a poor period of development, and that really is the biggest issue here. Maybe what they are doing ISN'T that bad. Maybe there really isn't a problem with Jagex in relation to other companies. But, Jagex isn't just another company to me. They used to produce consistently spot-on material that had something for everybody. Now our player base...has grown IMMENSELY. Years ago, it seemed unthinkable that anyone would ever achieve 99s in ALL skills. Now we have a few more skills.....and the number of MAXED OUT players is into the hundreds. And where is the average level for content updates? Still below the 80s range. When nobody had over 90 herblore, it made sense to release a new potion that required only 83 to make it. Now we are getting extremely under-leveled content...and we aren't even getting it frequently or consistently...and it is always ridden with bugs. It never used to be like this, and most of my frustration comes from a time when the content updates were always a pleasure to read.

 

 

I think a food analogy works here. Lets say you order a cake and tell the chef that it needs to be done by a certain time. When they tell you that they need more time to make a good cake, you say that it doesn't matter, they need to finish the cake within a certain time. Would you rather they make the deadline and give you a half baked cake with most of the ingredients and sloppy icing, or that they give it to you an hour later but it is fully cooked, perfectly decorated, and delicious?

If the cake decorator was going to give me a double chocolate, chocolate filled, cookie filled cake on a golden platter with a big #150 on it, but got behind on his work and gave me a pistachio flavored cupcake and just threw #150 on it, I would say that the cake decorator wasn't doing his job.

 

 

 

They gotta give me a reason to pay my 5 bucks a month. So far, all theyve done is try to hide the fact that their 150th quest got extremely off schedule. Not the type of company I am interested in supporting.

 

 

 

So, you've done absolutely every piece of content there is to do in RS? Done all the quests? Maxed out all the skills? Done (read: have a high ranking in) minigames such as Bounty Hunter, Duel Tournaments, and Fist of Guthix? You've literally played the game out to its maximum potential with existing content? If you have, then perhaps you have a reason to piss and moan like you've done. But, since you haven't, why don't you enjoy what you're got instead of whining every time an update comes out that you don't like?

 

So lets just stop updating the game till everyone maxes all skills and attains the highest ranking in all mini games. Sounds logical according to your post. I've done every quest and played all of the game features enough to know what I liked and what I didn't. Obviously I don't play JUST the updates...I like SC, I do slayer even though I am past the highest usefull level, etc...but why can't I like good updates? Think about one of the main reasons you like this game.(not a specific thing such as doing clues, but a very broad aspect such as PvP or merchanting) Now, think about that feature suddenly becoming crappier. Thats how I feel about the updates. Telling me to max in old boring content is like telling a PvPer to go enjoy fishing while the BH craters are unavailable. It just isn't what he likes about the game. Maybe I'll renew my membership if I see them come out with huge good updates monthly or even MAYBE every other month...but based on three weeks of silence followed by this sham of a quest...I need to step out for now.

[@Dan3HitU]

Resizeable chat box and fullscreen low detail were also mentioned by Mmg.

 

Very good idea.

[whatisup618]

Well as an avid lover of quests i must say i was somewhat disappointed. But they did something revolutionary. They FINALLY finished a storyline!! But even this has some questions left, like what would the ramifications for defying the gods be and what do the gods have in store for me (us), as told by Juna.

 

 

 

 

 

Also this whole 150th quest let was in part caused by us the players. I mean Jagex never said that every 25th quest was going to be super awesome or world changing. Personally i fell we only have ourselves to blame for over-hyping this quest.

[stonewall337]

Well, I don't mind if the other quest doesn't come out for awhile, since I am working my tail off to get the skills for WGS and Rocking Out, the only two quests I need till cape. But I do want more quests with good rewards, maybe more monsters like TDS but with dragon drops, could be anything, IDK really.

[Nenga]

[hide=]

 

Well, this is the challenge that weve set ourselves: 2009 has become our official Upgrade Year!

So Jagex released that to say they will be focusing more on fixing old content instead of focusing on new content........

 

 

 

Before you TRY to use sarcastic rhetorical arguments, you should read the entirety of what Jagex has told us before further humiliating yourself. In that same post they say:

 

 

 

Of course, we don't want to JUST do upgrades, so we're planning to do a mix of upgrades and new content. To achieve this we are planning on going back to releasing approximately four updates per month, which will alternate between upgrades and new content.

 

 

 

Saying they want to focus more on upgrades instead of new content is just a complete lie and neglects most of what the BTS 2009 had to say.

 

 

 

Also, however, all of this is completely void by the, yet again, radical stance that has been taken by Jagex. Their new stance is that they don't want to tell us what kind of updates to be expecting, because it hinders their developmental "freedom". This new attitude, I am assuming, basically overrides their strategy in BTS 2009 because they have, in fact, NOT released content at a rate of 4 updates per month. Also, part of my aggrivation is about the sheerly confounding "stances" that they are trying to take. They lasted two months on their "one headliner" update system, they lasted a month on the "4 updates per month, alternating each week with content and upgrades", and now it has been about a month since MMG came around and got rid of our BTS, etc... How long is THIS phase going to last before it goes up in smoke and they decide again that they don't like the way they are doing things? This company has given us nearly 6 months of flip flopping on update/development style and frankly I just cannot stand this type of garbage anymore.

 

 

 

 

Also a quest is a quest, sure you didn't get the massive bonanza of a Grandmaster quest. But what's better, waiting a little longer to have that quest a little better and bug free? Or having a quest put out too early because it's been pressured by a BTS. From what I've heard it's a decent quest with a good storyline and okay rewards.

 

 

 

 

This is the point. The fact that I have to wait for the good content, and in the meantime have to suffer bored because they could not perform the way they want to. If the team was a good development team, they would set realistic goals, develop quality useful content, and have it be bug free when the expected date comes. Heres the thing: I know, every person makes mistakes. But, this isn't a rare mistake. Every time there is a big update coming it is either a.) late, b.) unfairly balanced, c.) glitched, d.) crashes the servers or disconnects people, or e.) not working "the way they intended it to". I would like to see ONE big update that has no glitches, no exploits, and everything works 100% the way they wanted it. They couldn't even get the damn agility course right. We have a mini game that is two months late now, and the "150th" quest was messed up so bad that they obviously feel that they can't have us wait any longer for it. Just think about it: they are developing a huge "big deal" quest that they wanted to be 150th...and have been working on it for months. Now...they are so far behind that they had time to create a wallpaper, create a hoodie...and then try to pass off this dumb goblin quest as our #150.

 

 

 

Think about that. A week+ ago, they had to have said "Well, our #150 development team, hows the quest going? Oh....not done yet? Oh...not going to be done for THAT LONG? Well, now lets take ALL THE TIME to make a new banner/wallpaper for this OTHER QUEST and DESIGN A HOODIE based around this OTHER QUEST. How long does it take to design these things???? For THAT long...they have known that the true #150 would just NOT BE READY! There wasn't a question of if it was going to be ready...there wasn't a CHANCE the team would be done...the team wasn't FORCED to work harder to get the update out in time to be #150 because THEY WERE JUST THAT FAR BEHIND ON IT

 

 

 

To me this is unbelieveable. Everyone says "This is their game!! They can do what they want!!!"

 

 

 

WELL....NOPE, they CAN'T even do what THEY WANT. What THEY WANTED was to release Mobilising Armies in January. What THEY WANTED was an EPIC quest for #150 but instead we waited two weeks for a filler quest that they tried to pull off as the 150th. What THEY WANTED was to release one "headline update" every month but they just COULDN'T DO IT. Not only this, but the whole damn company doesn't seem to KNOW what they even want. First we are told to expect one huge update every month, then we are told that instead of this strategy they want to do "upgrades" (what a cop-out), and now they are telling us that this game is going to be hugely directed at the player base and we are going to be more involved with the game planning and updates...etc.

 

 

 

And then what the hell happens? First...BTS goes away. Then, they try to decieve us by putting in some crummy filler quest instead of actually having the real one ready. They didn't tell us on the main page that there were troubles. We were all looking forward to this. They could have had a poll two weeks ago saying "We are way behind on quest 150....should we put more people on the job or just continue working on it and release it later than 150?" No...nothing happened like this. We have to see from in-game chat that this isn't what they wanted to do at all. Where was the community in this? Where was the development team in the WEEKS that they knew that this quest was falling behind? Instead of getting the job done the way they WANTED to...the order was given to completely abandon the idea that this quest would be #150 and a team was appointed to begin concept design on a replacement wallpaper/banner and a limited edition sweatshirt.

 

 

 

I refuse to have the wool pulled over my eyes like this again. The devs just are unable to perform and don't have what it takes to develop their original ideas. When you are creating a group project, the first thing you do is establish your goals and assess if you have what it takes to fulfill them. This team doesn't, and I am sick of it.

[/hide]Well Myweponsg00d maybe you'd like to step in and show Jagex how to do it? It's impossible to weed out every single bug, it just doesn't happen. I loved how you kept saying "What they want" but I think what you meant is "What I want". Jagex wants to make the game perfect, even if it takes a little more time than usual. However you want to push out updates fast so you can play them, and you want them to be perfect. The world doesn't work like that though. Things take time and you either need to wait or stop waiting and leave. If you just keep on complaining how updates don't fit your schedule then nobody wins and you are just one more whiner.