An Intelligent Perspective On Botters

[Viv]

The problem for some people who rely on gathering skills for money is they simply don't know or understand other methods of money making. I don't know how many countless times i have seen people in the fishing guild begging for a new source of income. Then of course there are the people who are too lazy to utilize the known better methods, but there is no excuse for them.

 

Just because these may not be the most efficient methods, i don't think botting and the effects on these should be overlooked. But i do agree with people saying there should be other more creative options for these skills. I think the living rock caverns was a great step in the right direction.

 

Personally i have made over 600mil from fishing alone. And if do a skill with such low income you understand what the trade off is. These methods are lazy methods. You can play other games, watch tv, watch movies, browse the forums, play at work or school, or just chat while earning money. It may not be fast, but there is almost no effort involved. And with all the media and entertainment options we have available it makes these lazy methods popular.

i went to tormented demons today and another reason is competetion wiith other players at bandos too u have to hop worlds alot to find a world to solo in....

 

and need to pay attention to screen and risking items and if you dont have good luck can end up losing money and while bosshunting making little to no exp

 

with runecraf buy ess grahak dueling rings and just run to alter and to bank over and over only other peoples grahaks might interfere but can be fixed with call button. while rcing making around 25k/hr exp >.>

 

but with fishing u can just chat forum and youtube til 99 or higher and 90-99 in rocktails makes 40m with just a lil time imput..

with rocktail making 45k exp/hr

 

most of the time your not seriously making money and seriously making expirience at the same time.............

reason runite mining is profitable is competition with other playerssame with kingly implings

 

they made icestryke noncampable so they could stay profitabl if your slaying

 

and slayer is profitable even with extremes and turmoil but if u abuse the cannon it isnt to profitable anymore....

 

dragon bones and hides are profitable too when are slaying if have the 96 summoning...

 

anyway about bots......yes they are made for the task that low levels generally do but how can anyone suggest green dragons as a way to make money for a mid lvl player if they are packed with bots...

 

how can u suggest hunter as a way to make money when its packed with bots.....

 

sure it effects the high lvls that want pray/range exp cheap but it hurts the people that want to make money in legit ways...

[yuriqiu]

No, im saying that an already inferior way of making money should not be further devalued by the vast abundance of bots.

 

If you do not want bots to affect your way of making money, do not compete with bots. It is your choice that you rather make 100k/hr fishing sharks rather than 1m/hr killing Green Dragons or even PvP tricking.

 

Why isnt there a reason? Some of these skills are simply more relaxing than doing things like monster hunting, some people cannot monster hunt as effectively for reasons of there own (like having 1 defence :D), or skilling might simply be the best way of making money for them while also getting decent XP.

 

And why wouldnt it matter? If its such a bad money maker isnt it a slight indication that it should be improved somewhat, by either new updates, and/or the removal of bots?

 

The Opportunity cost for you to do a relazing skill or get decent xp is that you'd lose out on making millions doing another activity. It is your own choice and no one is forcing you to stay at that choice but yourself.

 

Bots hurt the people who like skilling for money.

 

Cutting yews is not me "hurting myself", its me getting money in a relatively relaxing way while also training magic at the same time, and yes i do believe i should get a bit more money for skilling, especially given how much the profit for monster hunting has shot up.

 

Not to mention that yews actually are one of the primary ways to make money in f2p.

Opportunity cost. You spent the time cutting yews and miss out on millions and wonder why you can't make money faster. No one is pointing a gun at your head saying leave the yew tree and I'll shoot.

[Sir_Kurity]

If you do not want bots to affect your way of making money, do not compete with bots.

 

Thats the thing though, if bots didnt exist, i would be making more profit, ive long accepted im not making optimal money, but thats no reason my work should be further devalued by an overabundance of botters.

 

"LULS JUST MAKE MONEY ANOTHER WAY!", is not a solution to botters. Botters have long gone into skills like hunting, fishing, runecrafting, mining, even killing green dragons, yes, they are a problem, and yes they need to be removed. If half the skills in the game are being devalued by bots, that doesnt give you a slight indication that they are a problem?

 

or even PvP tricking.

 

PVP tricking is a questionable way of making money, i consider it bug abuse and the more its abused the more likely it is that jagex will nerf it, and thus leave real PVPers in the dust.

 

Its kinda like bots, PVP trickers devaluing the work of people who actually PK.

 

You spent the time cutting yews and miss out on millions and wonder why you can't make money faster.

 

I know exactly why im not making money faster, its because ive picked an easy skill and thus it generally doesnt make as much money as monster hunting, infact im cutting yews as i reply to this message.

 

That being said, theres no reason for an already inferior skill to be further devauled by an overabundance of bots.

[hohto]

Opportunity cost. You spent the time cutting yews and miss out on millions and wonder why you can't make money faster. No one is pointing a gun at your head saying leave the yew tree and I'll shoot.

 

You do realize few things:

 

1. Bots are affecting to the supply of raw materials in a huge scale. This means the rigged supply drops the prices and forces legit people to either stick on inefficient methods (= compete with autoers) or just accept the fact that cheating has taken down one method. Basically by accepting botting you accept the fact that people are forced to get raw materials from botters, do non-buyables through non-profit methods and gain money from pvm/pvp/merchanting. If the market system worked perfectly, the supply wouldn't be rigged and the people in need of raw materials would have more choices: either get it by yourself (as it would be more efficient than now) or buy from a cast of people that basically doesn't exist at the moment. In other words: if there was no bots, people could actually get more for their yew logs and thus moneymaking and skilling methods wouldn't be so limited as they are now. Also removing bots would mean a fairer dividation between the ones who supply and the ones who are supplied.

 

2. Botting is away from skillers. Look at hunter for example. First of all their achievments are devalued as the levels are more common and there's in some cases (i.e. when you have mid levels in most of the skills and 99 hunter) a huge doubt casted over the methods you used. This doesn't exactly encourage people to train the skill: there are easier capes to get and as they are generally macrofree (compare the number of autocookers to autohunters for example), they don't give you the same judging. On the second thing: certain things have become more or less painful for legit players to do. As we used hunter as an example, lets stick on it. If you want to train your hunter, the actual skilling methods are really limited. The 2nd problem is that the most common hunter spot is crowded as the night club's toilet due autoers. In other words training certain skills is either really painful due artificial activity at the very few useable spots or you have to rely on secondary methods.

 

3. It rigs hiscores. Ok sure, basically hiscores are correctly showing the order of the people. However it fails in one thing: it doesn't tell you are you the one who has actually worked 1005065th hardest for mining for example: there are multiple accounts out there that have gained unfair advantage by using third party programs to boost their performance and thus appears to be higher on the lists. People actually do care about hiscores and the way how they've been jumping from "best of the server" and "top 1k" to "top millions" just shows it.

 

4. Autoing takes up server space and customer support resources. This means that productive hours and resources are being wasted on things that shouldn't be there in the first place. Sure it might sound "nothing" if few people waste in total ~10 working hours per day looking at macro reports and few people do fulltime antimacro programming. However all that time could be put on more productive things, such as game engine updates and other customer support related issues.

[yuriqiu]

Opportunity cost. You spent the time cutting yews and miss out on millions and wonder why you can't make money faster. No one is pointing a gun at your head saying leave the yew tree and I'll shoot.

 

You do realize few things:

 

1. Bots are affecting to the supply of raw materials in a huge scale. This means the rigged supply drops the prices and forces legit people to either stick on inefficient methods (= compete with autoers) or just accept the fact that cheating has taken down one method. Basically by accepting botting you accept the fact that people are forced to get raw materials from botters, do non-buyables through non-profit methods and gain money from pvm/pvp/merchanting. If the market system worked perfectly, the supply wouldn't be rigged and the people in need of raw materials would have more choices: either get it by yourself (as it would be more efficient than now) or buy from a cast of people that basically doesn't exist at the moment. In other words: if there was no bots, people could actually get more for their yew logs and thus moneymaking and skilling methods wouldn't be so limited as they are now. Also removing bots would mean a fairer dividation between the ones who supply and the ones who are supplied.

 

2. Botting is away from skillers. Look at hunter for example. First of all their achievments are devalued as the levels are more common and there's in some cases (i.e. when you have mid levels in most of the skills and 99 hunter) a huge doubt casted over the methods you used. This doesn't exactly encourage people to train the skill: there are easier capes to get and as they are generally macrofree (compare the number of autocookers to autohunters for example), they don't give you the same judging. On the second thing: certain things have become more or less painful for legit players to do. As we used hunter as an example, lets stick on it. If you want to train your hunter, the actual skilling methods are really limited. The 2nd problem is that the most common hunter spot is crowded as the night club's toilet due autoers. In other words training certain skills is either really painful due artificial activity at the very few useable spots or you have to rely on secondary methods.

 

3. It rigs hiscores. Ok sure, basically hiscores are correctly showing the order of the people. However it fails in one thing: it doesn't tell you are you the one who has actually worked 1005065th hardest for mining for example: there are multiple accounts out there that have gained unfair advantage by using third party programs to boost their performance and thus appears to be higher on the lists. People actually do care about hiscores and the way how they've been jumping from "best of the server" and "top 1k" to "top millions" just shows it.

 

4. Autoing takes up server space and customer support resources. This means that productive hours and resources are being wasted on things that shouldn't be there in the first place. Sure it might sound "nothing" if few people waste in total ~10 working hours per day looking at macro reports and few people do fulltime antimacro programming. However all that time could be put on more productive things, such as game engine updates and other customer support related issues.

1. Botting allows those who choose to be efficient to perform at a much higher level. It's the same in real life. Unless you pay $60 in real life for a T-Shirt you're probably wearing clothing from a sweat shop, our IRL "botters". You choose to be inefficient and afk train with the botters so you can only blame yourself on the tiny profit/hr you're making.

 

2. If you really care that much about the high scores I can't speak for you. I personally play the game for fun instead of for ranks so I probably don't understand how you feel.

 

3. Same as #2.

 

4. This is the point of this thread though. To see if Botters are actually worth the resources for Jagex to hunt down at their own expense. I personally report botters I see along my way while in RS but is it actually worth getting less updates and higher membership prices to combat the bots? I personally feel that it's not worth it cleaning up probably the small population of RS who bots in exchange for resources that Jagex can spend on improving Dungeoneering, releasing new quests, or developing new gameplay/graphic updates.

[Adellund]

Make membership 10-15$ a month.

 

Problem solved...

 

NO ONE in their right mind would waste 10-15$ and risk a ban if they're to nolife hunter for some claws on their pure, and if so, that's just more funds to Jagex....

[Sir_Kurity]

Why wouldnt they risk a ban? Its only 10-15 dollars.

 

Theres people who aimbot in MW2, that game costs 90 dollars, the hack is a monthly subscription. Whenever they get banned they just go out and buy the game again.

 

Some bots care about money, but a whole lot of them dont. (Also, what about f2p bots)

[hohto]

1. Botting allows those who choose to be efficient to perform at a much higher level. It's the same in real life. Unless you pay $60 in real life for a T-Shirt you're probably wearing clothing from a sweat shop, our IRL "botters". You choose to be inefficient and afk train with the botters so you can only blame yourself on the tiny profit/hr you're making.

 

In other words you're accepting something that shouldn't be there with the logic that it helps certain group of people. I personally see it as something that hurts one part of the people.

 

Lets think it like this. If the supply and demand were in balance, we'd have an equilibrium. That would benefit two parties: the ones who buy the raw materials and the ones who sell them. However when the supply is rigged by these "sweatshoppers", one side gets an unfair advantage. As you brought the sweatshops up, think it like this: an unfair method of competing gives an advantage to one supplier and thus taking out the local producers. This means that the customer gets a bit cheaper clothes, legit producers have to either go out of business, lack efficiency or start using similar methods. In my opinion the right answer would to weed the sweatshops and let the customers pay the "right" price that's a result of fair competition.

 

2. If you really care that much about the high scores I can't speak for you. I personally play the game for fun instead of for ranks so I probably don't understand how you feel.

 

Noticed you didn't either read the replies or put them wrong way. At #2 I was talking about training spots, not hiscores. However as you wanted to go with the hiscores first, lets do it.

 

I'm not talking about myself. If you look at the feedback that came when RSC never got the longwaited hiscores, you should realize one thing: they are wanted by multiple people. If you look at a huge number of suggestions from players and actions from Jagex, you can notice a trend of enlarging the hiscores (frequent updates to make them larger and to include more things, such as pvp activity and minigames) coming out. There are clear indicators that hiscores are needed and it's not my personal opinion. The public has voiced the opinion and Jagex has followed it.

 

3. Same as #2.

 

As you liked hiscores, here's the actual #2. Also when you compare leeching the training spots to the public opinion of hiscores, I don't really know what are you on about.

 

The only way to justify the ruining of training spots by bots is to accept botting. Basically what you're saying is that "people who hunt don't matter as long as I get my red chins a bit cheaper". Again you're putting the good of the few infront of the many. However the funniest part in my opinion is the fact that hunters have really limited methods to train hunting efficiently whereas rangers have multiple good choices for chinning. In other words you aren't just putting the two parties into different categories, you're now even more widening the cap between the two.

 

4. This is the point of this thread though. To see if Botters are actually worth the resources for Jagex to hunt down at their own expense. I personally report botters I see along my way while in RS but is it actually worth getting less updates and higher membership prices to combat the bots? I personally feel that it's not worth it cleaning up probably the small population of RS who bots in exchange for resources that Jagex can spend on improving Dungeoneering, releasing new quests, or developing new gameplay/graphic updates.

 

In my opinion any sane company follows the rules they've set to themselves and to their players, even if it forces them to put more effort on it. If the guidelines are something between "you can't bot but we won't really do anything", it will affect to the players who are more likely to be longtime customers. Why? Because they don't get the same benefits as people who get Mao Chi Pol to auto for them or sell them an autoed account. It devaluates your own effort and removes fun of it. The same thing happened already to RSC and autoing (despite being "illegal", being not punished actively) basically killed the game.

 

Also if you even passively accept autoing, you have to realize it brings up many other non-wanted phenomenas too as people auto for a reason.

* RWT trade - Selling the accounts that have been trained to you, selling their money (for example trading 1:1 to junk in a trade) and so on. Already similar things have caused Jagex serious problems from the CC companies.

* Damage done to the company image - The less Jagex cares about botting, the more popular it comes. RSC was a great example. The more advanced 3rd party programs people use, the higher chances there are for malicious softwares to spread. Again, seen in RSC and other games. It wouldn't help the company image at all if a large number of players got hacked "due RS", as kids would tell to their parents. A title "1000 webbanks hacked - RS bot to blame" wouldn't look too great.

* Customer support - Both of these things would cause more traffic to the CS than the current. The hacking and scamming situations would go up exponentially as the guidelines would make it so much easier. Same time the cases would be harder to hand than the current "player X is botting" or "player Y said this".

 

Also you do realize that Jagex is a limited company designed to make profit. I'm more than sure that a company with their revenue and employer rates have done enough calculations and "games" to figure out that their current guidelines are economically the best one for them. They don't have their guidelines just so it would be "fair and fun", they have the money at the backround too. Again, RSC was a good example. When RS2 came, it wasn't worth it to staff the customer support anymore in a large enough scale. Mod Mark and few randomers could do enough for them and even though botting was against the rules, the chances to get caught were so limited that people pulled out even maxed out accounts that were more or less 100% autoed. Why didn't Jagex hire more staff to stop autoing? Because even though it would have been "fair", it would have increased the costs and wouldn't have been economically justifiable.

[Sir_Kurity]

so you can only blame yourself on the tiny profit/hr you're making.

 

Yes, ive chosen a rather subpar way of making money, but as i also said, an already crap way of making money should not be further devalued by an overabundance of bots. Botters hurt lots of legitimate players, thats all there is too it.

 

This is really going around in circles so i guess we are just going to have to agree to disagree.

 

4. This is the point of this thread though. To see if Botters are actually worth the resources for Jagex to hunt down at their own expense.

 

What resources? Its really not that hard to cut down on botters.

 

Personally, i think something as simple as reinstating permanent bans for botters would go a long way. Its not a one off solution, but its simple, can be easily done without hurting the company in any way, while at the same time makes botting much less appealing, everyones happy! (except botters, and those people who like having cheap resources)

[Dacicus]

One thing I forgot to say in my previous post is that bots definitely hurt the people who skill because they enjoy the skills rather than skilling for money. For example, my goal is to get 99 smithing so that I can make myself full rune. I know that I can easily make the money to buy it in a few hours max, but I'd like the sense of accomplishment from making it myself. Furthermore, I am quite willing to give away full sets of armor or other things I make for free just to help other players, although the trade restrictions have greatly interfered with my original plans in this regard. The problem is that the mining guild has at least one bot on every world, so getting coal is a pain. I would much rather have all of those bots replaced by legit players. Then they would show some respect by not taking my rocks, and we might even have interesting conversations. Again, I don't care about making money via my skills, and I have no problem with the amounts that monster hunters make. I skill because I enjoy doing so. Why should I have to tolerate mindless programs that interfere with that?

[My_Eggs]

Make membership 10-15$ a month.

 

Problem solved...

 

NO ONE in their right mind would waste 10-15$ and risk a ban if they're to nolife hunter for some claws on their pure, and if so, that's just more funds to Jagex....

 

great idea except runescape isnt worth 10-15 a month. Theres so many better MMO's out there for that cost.

 

Runescapes niche is that its cheap and can be played on any computer anywhere

 

 

This. If Jagex were to raise their prices like that, I'd go back to WoW.

[pulli23]

One thing I forgot to say in my previous post is that bots definitely hurt the people who skill because they enjoy the skills rather than skilling for money. For example, my goal is to get 99 smithing so that I can make myself full rune. I know that I can easily make the money to buy it in a few hours max, but I'd like the sense of accomplishment from making it myself. Furthermore, I am quite willing to give away full sets of armor or other things I make for free just to help other players, although the trade restrictions have greatly interfered with my original plans in this regard. The problem is that the mining guild has at least one bot on every world, so getting coal is a pain. I would much rather have all of those bots replaced by legit players. Then they would show some respect by not taking my rocks, and we might even have interesting conversations. Again, I don't care about making money via my skills, and I have no problem with the amounts that monster hunters make. I skill because I enjoy doing so. Why should I have to tolerate mindless programs that interfere with that?

 

Players like you are inefficient and tend to have low leveled stats.

 

I dont pity your plight against bots, simply put minning your own coal (lol who trains smithing making bars that require coal anyways) and other ores is the worst way to get smithing up. Do yourself a favor and if your going to be inefficient with how you play at least do it the easy way. Get your mining to 77 (powermine iron, powermine granite do what it takes) then go to LRC and mine concentrated coal then gold. Mine to 99 then a little past 99 then get 99 smithing that way. Hell if you want you can even get 92 crafting if you decide to turn those bars into gold ammys.

 

Seriously thats stupid and inefficient but bots STILL are not a problem doing that way. Honestly people like you remind me of pures [bleep]ing up their accounts then blaming Jagex.

Wait a minute: so people who enjoy what jagex put in the game (a mining guild, coal ores, coal-based bars).. Are bad, and [bleep]ing up their account? - And should be doing something else since YOU think that is better?

 

Wow what a great community we have here ><

[Obtaurian]

so you can only blame yourself on the tiny profit/hr you're making.

 

Yes, ive chosen a rather subpar way of making money, but as i also said, an already crap way of making money should not be further devalued by an overabundance of bots. Botters hurt lots of legitimate players, thats all there is too it.

 

This is really going around in circles so i guess we are just going to have to agree to disagree.

 

4. This is the point of this thread though. To see if Botters are actually worth the resources for Jagex to hunt down at their own expense.

 

What resources? Its really not that hard to cut down on botters.

 

Personally, i think something as simple as reinstating permanent bans for botters would go a long way. Its not a one off solution, but its simple, can be easily done without hurting the company in any way, while at the same time makes botting much less appealing, everyones happy! (except botters, and those people who like having cheap resources)

 

Forgive me, but I don't believe that you know how difficult it may or may not be for Jagex to catch botters. If it was as easy as you claim, we probably would have been bot-free for the past few years. Perm bans are a hasty "bandaid" solution that will not deter goldselling bots in the slightest.

[Sir_Kurity]

Forgive me, but I don't believe that you know how difficult it may or may not be for Jagex to catch botters. If it was as easy as you claim, we probably would have been bot-free for the past few years. Perm bans are a hasty "bandaid" solution that will not deter goldselling bots in the slightest.

 

You need to stop putting words in my mouth.

 

I never said catching botters was easy, i even said in my post its not a one off solution, i said reinstating permanent bans is an easy solution which could be done without too much trouble and would severely discourage your average botter.

 

And a bandaid solution is much better than no solution.

[Obtaurian]

What resources? Its really not that hard to cut down on botters.

 

Here is the post in which you claim that it is "not that hard to cut down on botters," to which I responded by expressing my doubt that you know how difficult it may or may not be.

 

I didn't put words in your mouth.

[sammyboy894]

[hide]

One thing I forgot to say in my previous post is that bots definitely hurt the people who skill because they enjoy the skills rather than skilling for money. For example, my goal is to get 99 smithing so that I can make myself full rune. I know that I can easily make the money to buy it in a few hours max, but I'd like the sense of accomplishment from making it myself. Furthermore, I am quite willing to give away full sets of armor or other things I make for free just to help other players, although the trade restrictions have greatly interfered with my original plans in this regard. The problem is that the mining guild has at least one bot on every world, so getting coal is a pain. I would much rather have all of those bots replaced by legit players. Then they would show some respect by not taking my rocks, and we might even have interesting conversations. Again, I don't care about making money via my skills, and I have no problem with the amounts that monster hunters make. I skill because I enjoy doing so. Why should I have to tolerate mindless programs that interfere with that?

 

Players like you are inefficient and tend to have low leveled stats.

 

I dont pity your plight against bots, simply put minning your own coal (lol who trains smithing making bars that require coal anyways) and other ores is the worst way to get smithing up. Do yourself a favor and if your going to be inefficient with how you play at least do it the easy way. Get your mining to 77 (powermine iron, powermine granite do what it takes) then go to LRC and mine concentrated coal then gold. Mine to 99 then a little past 99 then get 99 smithing that way. Hell if you want you can even get 92 crafting if you decide to turn those bars into gold ammys.

 

Seriously thats stupid and inefficient but bots STILL are not a problem doing that way. Honestly people like you remind me of pures [bleep]ing up their accounts then blaming Jagex.

[/hide]

 

Did you even read his post, he enjoys mining and smithing properly rather than rushing through. He is playing the game how it was intended to be playe, botters are ruining the experience. Just cause he is doing something he enjoys which happens to be inefficent doesn't ruin his account. My smithing and mining levels where all self made. He isnt blaming jagex, he is scrutinizing them for not holding up there rules. Botters ruin the experience of the game. And its [wagon]s like you ruining this community.

[Obtaurian]

Did you even read his post, he enjoys mining and smithing properly rather than rushing through. He is playing the game how it was intended to be playe, botters are ruining the experience. Just cause he is doing something he enjoys which happens to be inefficent doesn't ruin his account. My smithing and mining levels where all self made. He isnt blaming jagex, he is scrutinizing them for not holding up there rules. Botters ruin the experience of the game. And its [wagon]s like you ruining this community.

 

>Implying that there is a "correct" way to play Runescape.

[My_Eggs]

Did you even read his post, he enjoys mining and smithing properly rather than rushing through. He is playing the game how it was intended to be playe, botters are ruining the experience. Just cause he is doing something he enjoys which happens to be inefficent doesn't ruin his account. My smithing and mining levels where all self made. He isnt blaming jagex, he is scrutinizing them for not holding up there rules. Botters ruin the experience of the game. And its [wagon]s like you ruining this community.

 

>Implying that there is a "correct" way to play Runescape.

 

 

Agreed. If Jagex wanted you to gather all the resources for yourself (aka "how it was intended to be played") then they wouldn't have put in a trade option or the G.E. They would have made it so that you had to do everything yourself and couldn't buy resources from other players to power through skills. Obviously that's not how the game is intended to be played, otherwise there wouldn't be very much social aspect to the game other than talking to people. Besides that there would be no interaction between players at all besides boss hunting.

[sammyboy894]

[hide]

Did you even read his post, he enjoys mining and smithing properly rather than rushing through. He is playing the game how it was intended to be playe, botters are ruining the experience. Just cause he is doing something he enjoys which happens to be inefficent doesn't ruin his account. My smithing and mining levels where all self made. He isnt blaming jagex, he is scrutinizing them for not holding up there rules. Botters ruin the experience of the game. And its [wagon]s like you ruining this community.

 

>Implying that there is a "correct" way to play Runescape.

 

 

Agreed. If Jagex wanted you to gather all the resources for yourself (aka "how it was intended to be played") then they wouldn't have put in a trade option or the G.E. They would have made it so that you had to do everything yourself and couldn't buy resources from other players to power through skills. Obviously that's not how the game is intended to be played, otherwise there wouldn't be very much social aspect to the game other than talking to people. Besides that there would be no interaction between players at all besides boss hunting.

[/hide]

 

sorry i should have made my self clearer. What i meant to say was that he is playing how he wants to. That was the intention of the game he shouldnt get slammed for that. I hope that clears it up :)

[pulli23]

Did you even read his post, he enjoys mining and smithing properly rather than rushing through. He is playing the game how it was intended to be playe, botters are ruining the experience. Just cause he is doing something he enjoys which happens to be inefficent doesn't ruin his account. My smithing and mining levels where all self made. He isnt blaming jagex, he is scrutinizing them for not holding up there rules. Botters ruin the experience of the game. And its [wagon]s like you ruining this community.

 

>Implying that there is a "correct" way to play Runescape.

 

 

Agreed. If Jagex wanted you to gather all the resources for yourself (aka "how it was intended to be played") then they wouldn't have put in a trade option or the G.E. They would have made it so that you had to do everything yourself and couldn't buy resources from other players to power through skills. Obviously that's not how the game is intended to be played, otherwise there wouldn't be very much social aspect to the game other than talking to people. Besides that there would be no interaction between players at all besides boss hunting.

 

 

Wow how ignorant is that, please read my previous post in this topic.. The spawns are there for a reason you know.

 

This game used to be pridefull as you could completely build your own character in a perfect way without help of others. And its very big number of skills with lots of ways to train them. (hence a class system was removed in the early days). Even zezima -who you guys still seem to adore as a half deity- once said when asked for what his secret was:

"I dont merchant...at all. I cant even say that issue really applies to me in any way. I have 7 party hats (a full set + an extra blue) but Id never sell them, so I cant say its an investment."

 

And really if you think runescape is only about getting levels as fast as possible and then do the most profitable action.. Why the hell aren't you angry at jagex? - They waste a lot of bandwidth on other not as fast resources like "coal", "mithril", "yew logs", "sharks". The way you're talking now it would be best if jagex would just remove those spots. Heck remove skilling altogether, everyone knows combat yields best money: and everyone should always take the fastest method for a skill. So jagex could just create their own supply of food & other materials. (You're literary saying to leave those spots for bots now).

God forbid you actually try to have fun with the game!- You're really talking as if the people who rush through the game have more right to speak than those who actually do what a game is meant for: have fun gaming!

[pulli23]

ARGH ring world, please read my post first before replying

 

 

I feel like i'm talking to a dead wall here. - If Jagex really wanted people to go as fast as possible through their game, they would simply remove all non-fast methods and provide the materials themself. You are really ignorant and really saying: hey if you don't do it my way you deserve to be punished!

 

Please get some social sense and learn that this is a game supposed to be fun, for everyone.. And not everyone likes what you like!

 

Really maybe I like the environment of the mining guild more, because I have some history there.. And hence would like to "quietly" mine there..

 

 

 

Since when has the community moved from a (mostly) DIY where people would help each other but respect the choices of others,

To a community all in a hurry for "200M xp in each stat as fast as possible" where you're flaming others and hoping life for them is as miserable as possible if they don't fit in your playing style?

Disgusting

[pulli23]

Ow and please, please tell me how dungeoneering shows that jagex wants you to rush lvls? - There is lots of stuff also at the lower levels, the rewards are also good for lower levels and there is no disadvantage there to being lower level. (monster & skilldoor lvl will adjust to the lvls you are).

 

This discussion is whether or not bots help us players, I say yes they help all the people who train efficiently. To the people that dont, you handicapped yourself to begin with.

Define: "help us players".. In my opinion "help us players" means helping achieving what they want to do.

Tell me if I'm dead wrong, but I believe everybody plays a game for fun right? (Otherwise you really should get some help from experts)

Thus bots would be good if they helped players achieving "fun" and "enjoyment".

Now what about those who like the mining guild, those who like doing things on their own, those who hate the new updates and prefer the old ways (yes whenever I said an update wasn't good I was told "don't use it", so here I am, still trying to train prayer through ecto functus as I believe the house update has made prayer training too cheap and should be removed.). That bots make those players have less fun (and thus not helping) isn't of any importance?

Sorry but if that is the case I think we're done talking.

 

If this is about having fun, You have to accept your method of training (mining at the mining guild, fishing sharks, catching red chins, cutting yews) will ALWAYS have bots in them till the day runescape closes down. Complaining about that is asinine to me.

 

If you enjoy those methods GREAT! more power too you, I myself spent a lot of time on each of those methods however I and most of us pre trade update players realize bots will always be part of the equation.

I'm from RSC still (yes the time where you went for miles to get some certs), so yes I know that removing bots is an utopia.. However jagex should always put a lot of effort on making the game so that bots have as little influence as possible. Pre GE update I myself could take an active role (if I went to W2 and saw someone with a dubious name I simply refused to trade, I want to have fair trade stuff, not botted stuff). However now we have no influence anymore (no1 reason I am DIY now). Another point is that their influence is getting stronger and stronger. (and since they couldn't trade gold 1 on 1 anymore, the bots simply responded to the GE updates by creating MORE bots).

Yet what we see is that jagex is taking a much more lax stance in their anti-bot behaviour, and thus "encouraging" mains to get bots.. (yes I see it happening already, people who bot all combat & skills to 99, not for money to sell, but to have a main).

 

I've seen an "obvious" bot who had a total level of 2k-something.

[Sir_Kurity]

What resources? Its really not that hard to cut down on botters.

 

Here is the post in which you claim that it is "not that hard to cut down on botters"

 

Yes, its not hard to cut down on botters.

 

As in, reduce there number, not "catch them", even if jagex didnt catch them any more effectively, the very fact of permanent bans would discourage many botters, and those that continue to bot will actually get banned instead of a half assed 14 day thing.

 

So yes, you need to stop putting words in my mouth.

 

If theres 1000's of bots there is a substantially larger supply making it easier for legit players to get levels.

 

I wasent aware that people who do gathering skills arent "legit" players.

[Assume Nothing]

The way I see it; The Dungeoneering updates may make for more legit players, since it requires some effort to get levels in Dungeoneering. Plus the fact that Frost Dragon bones will make less demand for Dragon Bones, hence less botters camped at CT Greens/ClanWars Greens

[Crit2h]

Ring World, If people had to high alch 100k times, it doesn't need skill, it needs patience. If they wanted to alch so much, be prepared for it.

 

Legit players fish, bots fish. Consider the duration. And in this sense, the bots are players who just can't be bothered to fish on their own, just wanting exp and extra $. Don't say the supply that bots bring in is insignificant to legit players.