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30-Apr-2013 - Instanced God Wars & EoC Updates


chenw

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K'ril's "slam through protection prayer" attack hits even if you don't use one. What? It hits about 1.5k every time and it's typeless, which means that K'ril is much harder than before. And yes, even the normal mode K'ril does this.

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Two things:

 

Solo dg appears unchanged, you can still easily kill a primal warrior (with kite, though I don't think that affects defence?) with ssb.

Anticipation and Freedom no longer keep you in combat - you can't stall adrenaline anymore.

 

The whole update is just horrible. Making combat tougher is fine, the high accuracy all-round was boring. But it is still impossible to actually tank something, as in, get 90%+ block chance, like you could pre-EoC. The low accuracy/high % health hit system is much more interesting than the high accuracy/low % health hit system. Look at M&B: most hits don't connect (fighting a decent player or fast AI) but when they do you will probably kill your target (or die, as appropriate). Like it is in real combat.

 

I don't know if Jagex realizes that in the pre-EoC combat system, Torag was actually superior to Bandos for pvp, because of the higher defence. They achieved that balance already. Just bringing back the whole old system would be best.

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Supporter of Zaros | Quest Cape owner since 22 may 2010 | No skills below 99 | Total level 2595 | Completionist Cape owner since 17th June 2013 | Suggestions

99 summoning (18th June 2011, previously untrimmed) | 99 farming (14th July 2011) | 99 prayer (8th September 2011) | 99 constitution (10th September 2011) | 99 dungeoneering (15th November 2011)

99 ranged (28th November 2011) | 99 attack, 99 defence, 99 strength (11th December 2011) | 99 slayer (18th December 2011) | 99 magic (22nd December 2011) | 99 construction (16th March 2012)

99 herblore (22nd March 2012) | 99 firemaking (26th March 2012) | 99 cooking (2nd July 2012) | 99 runecrafting (12th March 2012) | 99 crafting (26th August 2012) | 99 agility (19th November 2012)

99 woodcutting (22nd November 2012) | 99 fletching (31st December 2012) | 99 thieving (3rd January 2013) | 99 hunter (11th January 2013) | 99 mining (21st January 2013) | 99 fishing (21st January 2013)

99 smithing (21st January 2013) | 120 dungeoneering (17th June 2013) | 99 divination (24th November 2013)

Tormented demon drops: twenty effigies, nine pairs of claws, two dragon armour slices and one elite clue | Dagannoth king drops: two dragon hatchets, two elite clues, one archer ring and one warrior ring

Glacor drops: four pairs of ragefire boots, one pair of steadfast boots, six effigies, two hundred lots of Armadyl shards, three elite clues | Nex split: Torva boots | Kalphite King split: off-hand drygore mace

30/30 Shattered Heart statues completed | 16/16 Court Cases completed | 25/25 Choc Chimp Ices delivered | 500/500 Vyrewatch burned | 584/584 tasks completed | 4000/4000 chompies hunted

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Offensively, I like this update a lot. Level 80 weapons should hit 50% of the time against level 80 armor. That makes a lot of sense to me. I think the boosts due to weaknesses and strengths are fair.

 

I just wish that offensive armor was much weaker defensively. Nex armor should have the same defense as dragon, so that it can't be used by tanks or in most high-level pvm. Defensive armor should also be stronger, so that it's 20 levels higher than the base. Hybrid would be between the two.

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Look at M&B: most hits don't connect (fighting a decent player or fast AI) but when they do you will probably kill your target (or die, as appropriate). Like it is in real combat.

 

Massive hits in games like DS and M&B work because if you get hit it's your fault. If you get hit in runescape it's the RNG's fault. I don't think anyone would find Runescape fun if combat consisted of 3 minutes watching your character get hit 0s followed by being 1hkoed.

From the empty days of hope, deny the darkness
Follow my voice, we'll run far away from here

If only to hide, to escape this life
And live forever, forever in the sun

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Look at M&B: most hits don't connect (fighting a decent player or fast AI) but when they do you will probably kill your target (or die, as appropriate). Like it is in real combat.

Massive hits in games like DS and M&B work because if you get hit it's your fault. If you get hit in runescape it's the RNG's fault. I don't think anyone would find Runescape fun if combat consisted of 3 minutes watching your character get hit 0s followed by being 1hkoed.

Well not one-hit obviously, but don't forget that you can eat as well (doesn't work so well im M&B), so hits of 40% of your lp or so, with 20% hit chance, that allows for lucky comboes but almost all of the time you can out-eat them.

 

Pre-EoC PvP combat was much more interesting that way, imo. It'd be nice if abilities got less random and unbalanced, and adrenaline defaulted to 100% (rename fatigue, rsc reference ftw), and the old armour system returns. That would allow for some proper balancing.

 

 

Completely unrelated, instantly sold tetsu legs @ 11m and dl legs @ 6.7m.

Supporter of Zaros | Quest Cape owner since 22 may 2010 | No skills below 99 | Total level 2595 | Completionist Cape owner since 17th June 2013 | Suggestions

99 summoning (18th June 2011, previously untrimmed) | 99 farming (14th July 2011) | 99 prayer (8th September 2011) | 99 constitution (10th September 2011) | 99 dungeoneering (15th November 2011)

99 ranged (28th November 2011) | 99 attack, 99 defence, 99 strength (11th December 2011) | 99 slayer (18th December 2011) | 99 magic (22nd December 2011) | 99 construction (16th March 2012)

99 herblore (22nd March 2012) | 99 firemaking (26th March 2012) | 99 cooking (2nd July 2012) | 99 runecrafting (12th March 2012) | 99 crafting (26th August 2012) | 99 agility (19th November 2012)

99 woodcutting (22nd November 2012) | 99 fletching (31st December 2012) | 99 thieving (3rd January 2013) | 99 hunter (11th January 2013) | 99 mining (21st January 2013) | 99 fishing (21st January 2013)

99 smithing (21st January 2013) | 120 dungeoneering (17th June 2013) | 99 divination (24th November 2013)

Tormented demon drops: twenty effigies, nine pairs of claws, two dragon armour slices and one elite clue | Dagannoth king drops: two dragon hatchets, two elite clues, one archer ring and one warrior ring

Glacor drops: four pairs of ragefire boots, one pair of steadfast boots, six effigies, two hundred lots of Armadyl shards, three elite clues | Nex split: Torva boots | Kalphite King split: off-hand drygore mace

30/30 Shattered Heart statues completed | 16/16 Court Cases completed | 25/25 Choc Chimp Ices delivered | 500/500 Vyrewatch burned | 584/584 tasks completed | 4000/4000 chompies hunted

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Offensively, I like this update a lot. Level 80 weapons should hit 50% of the time against level 80 armor. That makes a lot of sense to me. I think the boosts due to weaknesses and strengths are fair.

 

I just wish that offensive armor was much weaker defensively. Nex armor should have the same defense as dragon, so that it can't be used by tanks or in most high-level pvm. Defensive armor should also be stronger, so that it's 20 levels higher than the base. Hybrid would be between the two.

 

I disagree.... the whole point of the update was to make our stats matter more... that we're hitting 50% of the time with 116/99 attack and strength is bloody ridiculous; we're 36 levels above it, and even if you use a bit of bronze, if you swing it hard enough, shit is going down.... Doesn't seem like they've fixed level boosts, just lowered everything.....

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When I saw the nerf to drygores, I was like "NOPENOPENOPENOPENOPE ;____;"

 

I mean, when they cost so much and I spend like... 70% of my bank on them, I expect something good.

Went out now before panicing and tested them on QBD. I was pleasantly surprised. :P

 

They aren't as god mode as before, but hit a bit less, but I compared them to my chaotics at QBD and I have to say, little under 3 min kill with drygores and no problem with health whatsoever vs a 5 minute kill where I had to eat, soul split wasn't healing enough and just a generally more stressful time. Happy to say I swapped some drygores so my setup should be better now as well. Cheap offhand ones right now from people who are panicselling.

 

On the surface, it LOOKS like drygores got nerfed A LOT, but they didn't really. Swapping to chaotics from drygore, I noticed a huge difference in damage I was doing.

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Offensively, I like this update a lot. Level 80 weapons should hit 50% of the time against level 80 armor. That makes a lot of sense to me. I think the boosts due to weaknesses and strengths are fair.

 

I just wish that offensive armor was much weaker defensively. Nex armor should have the same defense as dragon, so that it can't be used by tanks or in most high-level pvm. Defensive armor should also be stronger, so that it's 20 levels higher than the base. Hybrid would be between the two.

 

I disagree.... the whole point of the update was to make our stats matter more... that we're hitting 50% of the time with 116/99 attack and strength is bloody ridiculous; we're 36 levels above it, and even if you use a bit of bronze, if you swing it hard enough, shit is going down.... Doesn't seem like they've fixed level boosts, just lowered everything.....

I think it's stupid that stats matter outside of gear and abilities though. I understand why people would want that now, because there is little separating someone with 99 attack and 99 strength from someone with 80 attack and 80 strength, but making stats matter now is just digging a hole. They just need to fill out the gaps in tiers, it's been long enough.

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On the surface, it LOOKS like drygores got nerfed A LOT, but they didn't really. Swapping to chaotics from drygore, I noticed a huge difference in damage I was doing.

I lol when people complaining about Drygores being nerfed switch to using Chaotics.

As if Chaotics were stronger than Drygores, lel.

 

Although... if whatever they were personally doing with Drygores was easily do-able with Chaotics, it would be understandable.

I considered selling Drygore rapier and getting Virtus wand, then Chaotic claws, but then I figured out I might as well get Chaotic staff instead, since Drygores are still better.

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Offensively, I like this update a lot. Level 80 weapons should hit 50% of the time against level 80 armor. That makes a lot of sense to me. I think the boosts due to weaknesses and strengths are fair.

 

If you have a low hitrate like that then you cannot reliable pull off combo's and so forth. Imo that's very detrimental to especially PvP. If you want to extend a boss fight then increase it's hp, not defence. That's also a lot nicer to those without the best gear.

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I think it's stupid that stats matter outside of gear and abilities though. I understand why people would want that now, because there is little separating someone with 99 attack and 99 strength from someone with 80 attack and 80 strength, but making stats matter now is just digging a hole. They just need to fill out the gaps in tiers, it's been long enough.

Well, gear and abilities are boring, straight-up damage increase is fun. Besides, it's a nice parallel with gathering skills, where level also matters. Plus it's somewhat realistic (and yes, this does matter, stop mentioning it's a fantasy game, it's bloody obvious that basic assumptions about the laws of nature and human physiology hold) that you can kill someone no matter your weapon, even unarmed.

 

If you have the old system, where level 80 strength is about 11x the dps of level 0, and t80 weapons are about 2.5x the dps of unarmed (3-3.5x with armour bonusus), that seems about fair. You need both to get real dps though, a strong arm with a strong weapon - level 60 weapon at level 60 strength beats a level 80 unarmed or level 80 weapon with level 0 strength.

 

 

@Bruno: I disagree, comboes failing call for more improvisation, which is good. Also fights lasting long doesn't really make sense unless you're bleeding your target dry (which, I imagine, is a fair strategy for something as big as corp, but that's not really how RS combat works). High hp/low defence makes for a boring meatsack, you want your boss to be a bit random, so one time your kill is 3 mins because you got a lucky combo, the other time it's 6 mins because they got a lucky combo.

Supporter of Zaros | Quest Cape owner since 22 may 2010 | No skills below 99 | Total level 2595 | Completionist Cape owner since 17th June 2013 | Suggestions

99 summoning (18th June 2011, previously untrimmed) | 99 farming (14th July 2011) | 99 prayer (8th September 2011) | 99 constitution (10th September 2011) | 99 dungeoneering (15th November 2011)

99 ranged (28th November 2011) | 99 attack, 99 defence, 99 strength (11th December 2011) | 99 slayer (18th December 2011) | 99 magic (22nd December 2011) | 99 construction (16th March 2012)

99 herblore (22nd March 2012) | 99 firemaking (26th March 2012) | 99 cooking (2nd July 2012) | 99 runecrafting (12th March 2012) | 99 crafting (26th August 2012) | 99 agility (19th November 2012)

99 woodcutting (22nd November 2012) | 99 fletching (31st December 2012) | 99 thieving (3rd January 2013) | 99 hunter (11th January 2013) | 99 mining (21st January 2013) | 99 fishing (21st January 2013)

99 smithing (21st January 2013) | 120 dungeoneering (17th June 2013) | 99 divination (24th November 2013)

Tormented demon drops: twenty effigies, nine pairs of claws, two dragon armour slices and one elite clue | Dagannoth king drops: two dragon hatchets, two elite clues, one archer ring and one warrior ring

Glacor drops: four pairs of ragefire boots, one pair of steadfast boots, six effigies, two hundred lots of Armadyl shards, three elite clues | Nex split: Torva boots | Kalphite King split: off-hand drygore mace

30/30 Shattered Heart statues completed | 16/16 Court Cases completed | 25/25 Choc Chimp Ices delivered | 500/500 Vyrewatch burned | 584/584 tasks completed | 4000/4000 chompies hunted

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On the surface, it LOOKS like drygores got nerfed A LOT, but they didn't really. Swapping to chaotics from drygore, I noticed a huge difference in damage I was doing.

I lol when people complaining about Drygores being nerfed switch to using Chaotics.

As if Chaotics were stronger than Drygores, lel.

 

Although... if whatever they were personally doing with Drygores was easily do-able with Chaotics, it would be understandable.

I considered selling Drygore rapier and getting Virtus wand, then Chaotic claws, but then I figured out I might as well get Chaotic staff instead, since Drygores are still better.

Well the thought crossed my mind. Obviously chaotics arent better, but price-wise they might not be worth 80+25m for a set when chaotics are free to obtain. The difference between drygores and chaotics doesnt look like that much either. Happy to say they're still good enough to cost a bit even though I expect a little crash this week.

 

If KK stays more difficult they might rebound and stay around the price they are now. That's what I'm crossing my fingers for at least. :P

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Went KK...

 

We did a trio, I was lagging hard so I died quite often, also our voker kept getting minions to activate his res, so we died a lot.

 

5 minute kills or so, tribrid the whole way (voker was using shield all the time though), honestly I can say that I love way more the fight than it was before, it used to be drygorescape, all melee on all phases, no matter of weaknesses... Now you actually have to take advantage of the weaknesses, drygores won't hit as often when KK is using any other phase than ranged, yet on ranged it hits constantly and decent, problem is that magic doesn't hit that hard, but oh well, we're gonna need some tier 90 mage/ranged weapons to solved that I guess.

 

Honestly, I LOVE the update, it really feels like this is how EoC was meant to be, regardless; there is a lot that needs to be fixed in my opinion. Prayer bonuses were nerfed really hard, gwd armor no longer gives prayer, penance doesn't restore as much as it used to, I do find quite annoying the real fast prayer drain rates, maybe they could buff them a bit?.

 

I don't complain about drygore changes, it needed to be done, also I'd like to have a better explanation on how does the % dmg boots from power armor actually works, I read on rs official wiki that each part of the set gives a % of dmg of an average weapon of said tier, so bandos plate would give 3,5% of dmg of a tier 70 average speed weapon, this is what I understand, but I'm not sure if that's the actual case, because the dmg bonus on the plate, which is 23, doesn't match 3,5% of a tier 70 average speed weapon.

 

The obvious fixes need to be done, such as chompies not being able to be killed right now. And hybrid set really feel like they suck horribly, I mean, -15 tiers of def rate? that's waay too much, and how come obsidian equipment is tier 60? It really gives a pathetic defense/lp bonus, not even worth to wear it.

 

Overall, I really like this update, but I want to see what it'll end up doing after some tweaks, if they decide to do them

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I think it's stupid that stats matter outside of gear and abilities though. I understand why people would want that now, because there is little separating someone with 99 attack and 99 strength from someone with 80 attack and 80 strength, but making stats matter now is just digging a hole. They just need to fill out the gaps in tiers, it's been long enough.

Well, gear and abilities are boring, straight-up damage increase is fun. Besides, it's a nice parallel with gathering skills, where level also matters. Plus it's somewhat realistic (and yes, this does matter, stop mentioning it's a fantasy game, it's bloody obvious that basic assumptions about the laws of nature and human physiology hold) that you can kill someone no matter your weapon, even unarmed.

 

If you have the old system, where level 80 strength is about 11x the dps of level 0, and t80 weapons are about 2.5x the dps of unarmed (3-3.5x with armour bonusus), that seems about fair. You need both to get real dps though, a strong arm with a strong weapon - level 60 weapon at level 60 strength beats a level 80 unarmed or level 80 weapon with level 0 strength.

 

 

@Bruno: I disagree, comboes failing call for more improvisation, which is good. Also fights lasting long doesn't really make sense unless you're bleeding your target dry (which, I imagine, is a fair strategy for something as big as corp, but that's not really how RS combat works). High hp/low defence makes for a boring meatsack, you want your boss to be a bit random, so one time your kill is 3 mins because you got a lucky combo, the other time it's 6 mins because they got a lucky combo.

Don't get me started on how I would change how skills work :P

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...and even if you use a bit of bronze, if you swing it hard enough, shit is going down....

 

Lets all use wooden clubs.

From the empty days of hope, deny the darkness
Follow my voice, we'll run far away from here

If only to hide, to escape this life
And live forever, forever in the sun

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@Bruno: I disagree, comboes failing call for more improvisation, which is good. Also fights lasting long doesn't really make sense unless you're bleeding your target dry (which, I imagine, is a fair strategy for something as big as corp, but that's not really how RS combat works). High hp/low defence makes for a boring meatsack, you want your boss to be a bit random, so one time your kill is 3 mins because you got a lucky combo, the other time it's 6 mins because they got a lucky combo.

Luck based combat sucks. I thought most of us agreed on that?

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Note, some "Hybrid" items (Ring specifically) boosts Your defence ratings, while "Hybrid" armor (head, chest and legs) do not provide any blocking whatsoever. "All" Items (such as 99 capes and berserker) lower your chance to block under all circumstance

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6,924th to 30 hunting, 13,394th to 30 summoning, 52,993rd to 30 Divination

Kiln Record (Post-EoC): W 25 - L 0, 14 Uncut Onyx, 8 Jad hits received (Best record: Two in the same kiln)
Obby set renewed post update #2: 0

QBD drops: 21 crossbow parts, 3 Visages, 1 Kites, 2 Kits

Max Port Score [2205] Achieved: 27th April 2013 (World 2nd)

 

Farmyard Rampage ranking: 12th, 50,000 Kills.

 

Dragon Pickaxe Drops: 1 (Times after I first entered Battlefield: 2h)

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Yeah, Sixth-age circuit raised my Melee block chance by like 1%.

Although it also lowered my block chance vs RAnged by 7%, so I prefer not using it (using Warrior's ring instead.)

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%'s vary depending on what you wear, which is REALLY odd. I really hope that was not intended.

 

Like, the effect of wearing barrow gloves depends on what other armor I have on, sometimes it'll up some blocks and reduce others, while other times just up some

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