30-Apr-2013 - Instanced God Wars & EoC Updates

[Emaxganis]

On the surface, it LOOKS like drygores got nerfed A LOT, but they didn't really. Swapping to chaotics from drygore, I noticed a huge difference in damage I was doing.

I lol when people complaining about Drygores being nerfed switch to using Chaotics.

As if Chaotics were stronger than Drygores, lel.

 

Although... if whatever they were personally doing with Drygores was easily do-able with Chaotics, it would be understandable.

I considered selling Drygore rapier and getting Virtus wand, then Chaotic claws, but then I figured out I might as well get Chaotic staff instead, since Drygores are still better.

 

Good for drygore buyers so far, just paid a mainhand drygore rapier 63m

 

I wonder if they will go back up after some hotfix and the fact they're harder to obtain now :P

[Ammako]

On the surface, it LOOKS like drygores got nerfed A LOT, but they didn't really. Swapping to chaotics from drygore, I noticed a huge difference in damage I was doing.

I lol when people complaining about Drygores being nerfed switch to using Chaotics.

As if Chaotics were stronger than Drygores, lel.

 

Although... if whatever they were personally doing with Drygores was easily do-able with Chaotics, it would be understandable.

I considered selling Drygore rapier and getting Virtus wand, then Chaotic claws, but then I figured out I might as well get Chaotic staff instead, since Drygores are still better.

 

Good for drygore buyers so far, just paid a mainhand drygore rapier 63m

 

I wonder if they will go back up after some hotfix and the fact they're harder to obtain now :P

You just bought a main hand rapier for 63m?

Strange, they were kinda hard to buy for 73-74m only like 7-8 hours ago.

[Th e Doctor]

Just bought an offhand mace for 10 mil below exchange price.

 

EDIT

 

Just got a mithril dragon task, I'll edit this later with how drygore's fare.

[Emaxganis]

On the surface, it LOOKS like drygores got nerfed A LOT, but they didn't really. Swapping to chaotics from drygore, I noticed a huge difference in damage I was doing.

I lol when people complaining about Drygores being nerfed switch to using Chaotics.

As if Chaotics were stronger than Drygores, lel.

 

Although... if whatever they were personally doing with Drygores was easily do-able with Chaotics, it would be understandable.

I considered selling Drygore rapier and getting Virtus wand, then Chaotic claws, but then I figured out I might as well get Chaotic staff instead, since Drygores are still better.

 

Good for drygore buyers so far, just paid a mainhand drygore rapier 63m

 

I wonder if they will go back up after some hotfix and the fact they're harder to obtain now :P

You just bought a main hand rapier for 63m?

Strange, they were kinda hard to buy for 73-74m only like 7-8 hours ago.

I got lucky maybe? not 63 but 64.8 my bad :P

 

[Th e Doctor]

Drygores still tear mithril dragons apart, at least on task. Task of 26 dragons and I missed a total of 10 hits, needed nothing but soul split for hp in t7 armor. Managed to finish the task in 10:13 so ~150 kph.

[Yoko Kurama]

Well, guys, it looks like as if I was completely wrong with how they'd treat PoP and Nex. They totally didn't trash PoP, to my great surprise. Teams for Nex and KK on the forums, which prior to the update (when Nex was still superior with set effects) would still take PoP'ers, are totally not refusing to take PoP'ers for roles other than the 1 tanker. Jagex didn't totally ignore 4 months of feedback resulting in predictable consequences that everyone foresaw. I guess I'd better get ready to apologize.

 

Oh, wait ... I must have been dreaming or intoxicated when I wrote the above, because of course the opposite of that just happened.

[Miss Lioness]

so, they removed all prayer bonuses from armor that comes from the god wars dungeon

 

but they kept all of the prayer bonuses from ports armor originating from the eastern lands, which is totally atheist

 

Not the mention: religion =/= prayer!

I myself am an athiest (well not really, something else actually but for simplistic sake) and still think things like Jesus was actually here, but just did something amazing other then being the son of a God etc.

[Riqualyn]

Offensively, I like this update a lot. Level 80 weapons should hit 50% of the time against level 80 armor. That makes a lot of sense to me. I think the boosts due to weaknesses and strengths are fair.

 

"Put simply, higher levels will now enjoy greater accuracy from their attacks than even before, and those levelling will notice a bigger difference from level to level."

[Miss Lioness]

Just tried SGWD. This is not good =/ Even in Superior Sea Singers I get ripped apart by Zilyana's melee attack that hits quite frequently and hard. Next to that, the Ranged attack of the minion hit also quite hard and often. Up in the high 500s, low 600s. And he is 146 combat o.O...

 

Okay I understand we are not supposed to camp them till the end of time, but this is ridiculous! Only lasted 5 Zilyana kills with an entire inventory of food using Unicorn as well as Soul Split. Now that Soul Split took quite a nerf, I understand I should use food a bit more often, but with how hard these minions along with Zilyana hit, it's just not really feasible...

 

Just a reminder; this was while wearing T85 armour, Superior Sea Singers =C!

[BloodAngel]

For what it's worth, Nomad has suffered at the hands of this update. He takes longer to kill because of the whole accuracy thing, but his magic attack is woefully inaccurate against Barrows. He hits harder and more accurately with his melee attack but soul split can still just about keep up.

[Jeffery]

Tested out the update with a Dungeon. Saw a ram room and thought awwh crap. It seems rams didn't even get updated as well none of my friends and myself missed. Overall the dung was a 17 minute large 3 man which is somewhat slow but due to the amount of times you actually miss on monsters it didn't seem that bad, I think if they tweeted it a bit it'd be a decent system. Because even if I didn't like EOC and the combat system not going to lie, the fact you rarely missed was stupid.

[Quyneax]

@Bruno: I disagree, comboes failing call for more improvisation, which is good. Also fights lasting long doesn't really make sense unless you're bleeding your target dry (which, I imagine, is a fair strategy for something as big as corp, but that's not really how RS combat works). High hp/low defence makes for a boring meatsack, you want your boss to be a bit random, so one time your kill is 3 mins because you got a lucky combo, the other time it's 6 mins because they got a lucky combo.

Luck based combat sucks. I thought most of us agreed on that?

You want 100% accuracy everywhere? Without randomness, you can just math all pvp encounters, which makes the game kind of boring. If you put two people, equally skilled, equally levelled and equipped, in a fight, then what else but randomness is going to decide the victor? Are you going to get stalls where neither takes more damage than they heal, or are you going to get fights were both people die all the time?

[constrictor]

@Bruno: I disagree, comboes failing call for more improvisation, which is good. Also fights lasting long doesn't really make sense unless you're bleeding your target dry (which, I imagine, is a fair strategy for something as big as corp, but that's not really how RS combat works). High hp/low defence makes for a boring meatsack, you want your boss to be a bit random, so one time your kill is 3 mins because you got a lucky combo, the other time it's 6 mins because they got a lucky combo.

Luck based combat sucks. I thought most of us agreed on that?

You want 100% accuracy everywhere? Without randomness, you can just math all pvp encounters, which makes the game kind of boring. If you put two people, equally skilled, equally levelled and equipped, in a fight, then what else but randomness is going to decide the victor? Are you going to get stalls where neither takes more damage than they heal, or are you going to get fights were both people die all the time?

 

But is that probability high?

Not really..realistic? Not even close.

 

EDIT: Any ideas how the update effected boxing/staking? Might make staking predictable now.

[thejollyroger]

What a clusterf***.

 

I was really hoping to read some observations on how boosts from Herblore potions meant more again, but no, the EoC soap opera continues, with players continuing to [bleep] and whine and split hairs on how weapons and armors did or didn't get the all-mighty Nerf hammer. Glorious comments so far on realism... please.

 

This right after the underwhelming response on the Times articles, but I don't expect anyone to get creative roleplaying either, especially as Alg called it a "punishment" assignment. Oh gee. Kudos if you can wade through my explanation-- I formatted it hard although I admit the gist can't be gleaned at a glance.

 

I guess I shouldn't be too surprised; the arrogance of this community here continues although the intellect seems better than the RSOF typically has, maybe because fansites seem better at weeding out punkmouthed little brats. Still, I'm amazed at what can pass for arguments around here, and so much short-lived memory on its own player history, really. Would not be surprised at all if the non-combat skiller types went to "Old School" and are slowly fading away.

 

Keep dissing Jagex, y'all, as I doubt most of you could ever do better to code it yourself. I appreciate some of you understand the technical specs and code but it gets precious little mention past talk of the HTML5 switchover.

 

The only reason I keep hanging around is I think Tip still has potential, despite so many reminders seeming to the contrary.

 

The world does not revolve around players aged 18-25... granted, most players my age don't say very much at all. (They [bleep] to themselves. Remember that.)

[constrictor]

What a clusterf***.

 

I was really hoping to read some observations on how boosts from Herblore potions meant more again, but no, the EoC soap opera continues, with players continuing to [bleep] and whine and split hairs on how weapons and armors did or didn't get the all-mighty Nerf hammer. Glorious comments so far on realism... please.

 

This right after the underwhelming response on the Times articles, but I don't expect anyone to get creative roleplaying either, especially as Alg called it a "punishment" assignment. Oh gee. Kudos if you can wade through my explanation-- I formatted it hard although I admit the gist can't be gleaned at a glance.

 

I guess I shouldn't be too surprised; the arrogance of this community here continues although the intellect seems better than the RSOF typically has, maybe because fansites seem better at weeding out punkmouthed little brats. Still, I'm amazed at what can pass for arguments around here, and so much short-lived memory on its own player history, really. Would not be surprised at all if the non-combat skiller types went to "Old School" and are slowly fading away.

 

Keep dissing Jagex, y'all, as I doubt most of you could ever do better to code it yourself. I appreciate some of you understand the technical specs and code but it gets precious little mention past talk of the HTML5 switchover.

 

The only reason I keep hanging around is I think Tip still has potential, despite so many reminders seeming to the contrary.

 

The world does not revolve around players aged 18-25... granted, most players my age don't say very much at all. (They [bleep] to themselves. Remember that.)

 

..doesn't [bleep] about new update, but [bleep]es about community. Then claims that we are arrogant.

Good one.

 

Also, an additional thing to point out: no the world doesn't revolve around 18-25 year olds, but RuneScape, in some aspects/degreees) does. If that age group were to leave entirely I would predict a fall sharp in RS popularity, possibly even a complete fallout.

[Sy_Accursed]

Why exactly are we arrogant for having opinions on the update?

 

Especially when said opinions are perfectly valid considering regardless of how you spin it 'tank' armour, especially in upper tiers, is hardly better than 'power' armour in defence and lacks the damage boons. The numbers show this plain and simple: 'tank' armour got screwed and has almost no use inspite of Jagex toting it is required for bossing. Not to mention the fact hybrid got royally dumped on with it giving erratic bonuses that are not balanced across the classes, the exact opposite of what hybrid gear should do, not to mention it actually gives negatives to defence in many cases rendering it utterly useless.

 

The eoc whining seen in-game and on RSOF from people who can't find anything right - but tip.it is far from that, when we have negative views here (for the most part) it is based on what Jagex has actually done and it's direct impact on the usability of gears and tactics. None of us have claimed we could code it better or any such thing - but given that the armour stats has nothing to do with coding this is hardly relevant plus prior to this many of us expressly pointed out arbitarily assigning sets as off, def or hybrid would be hugely flawed and was counter to what most people suggested aka giving ALL sets an o, d and maybe h variant that are either separate items or switchable on 1 item OR making sure tiers alternated between o and d with o having larger defence limitations and d having bigger def boons to actually make a difference (opposed to like 300 defence diff between torva and tetsu, which is almost entirely negligible especially with torvas dmg boost).

 

Also why so surprised there's limited debate on how the pot/pray stuff works now, we have to figure out the base level of what armour and weps do vs monsters again before we can fathom what pots and prayers are actually doing.

[aerendil]

TBh, people bossing have always been ferguses (tans will get that), and the only way to get away with ports armour is with friends... or just learn to tank for nex/kk; honestly, its so much easier than attacking anyway....

 

 

 

Does anyone know how the (bleep) the accuracy shit works against hybrid/tribrid monsters.... Bceuase I really don't know what you'de call some of the gwd bosses, or, for that matter, nex. (especially nex)

[chenw]

@Bruno: I disagree, comboes failing call for more improvisation, which is good. Also fights lasting long doesn't really make sense unless you're bleeding your target dry (which, I imagine, is a fair strategy for something as big as corp, but that's not really how RS combat works). High hp/low defence makes for a boring meatsack, you want your boss to be a bit random, so one time your kill is 3 mins because you got a lucky combo, the other time it's 6 mins because they got a lucky combo.

Luck based combat sucks. I thought most of us agreed on that?

You want 100% accuracy everywhere? Without randomness, you can just math all pvp encounters, which makes the game kind of boring. If you put two people, equally skilled, equally levelled and equipped, in a fight, then what else but randomness is going to decide the victor? Are you going to get stalls where neither takes more damage than they heal, or are you going to get fights were both people die all the time?

 

The randomness will always be there, given current state of the game. No other game has damage variation as big as RS, EG Auto attacks range from 0 to its maximum hit, abilities have a higher minimum, but the range is still very large (the minimum hit is 1/3 of that of maximum), meaning RNG will always play a huge role in pvp in this game (it always has been, and probably will always be) The only thing you can really do is minimise the effect of RNG (which is why Multi-hit specials of the past were very popular, RNG played a relatively smaller role in the average damage you could do).

[Saradomin_Mage]

What a clusterf***.

 

I was really hoping to read some observations on how boosts from Herblore potions meant more again, but no, the EoC soap opera continues, with players continuing to [bleep] and whine and split hairs on how weapons and armors did or didn't get the all-mighty Nerf hammer. Glorious comments so far on realism... please.

Boosts from herblore potions mean slightly more than usual, because the extra attack and defence levels added each contribute exponentially more accuracy and defence points respectively. Besides that, other potion effects are pretty much still the same (+8 damage per strength level boosted).

 

As for your next point, when Jagex is constantly making changes to the system that fundamentally change how combat and all its extensions work, don't you think that players just grow weary of having to relearn how basic aspects of the game work? I put on my completionist cape this week and found that it's actually reducing my total armour value because one of the devs thought it'd be funny to change how "All" class armour contributes to total defence ratings. It is undeniably frustrating to have to relearn what works and what doesn't, only to worry that it's going to go to waste the next time a system update timer pops up.

 

This right after the underwhelming response on the Times articles, but I don't expect anyone to get creative roleplaying either, especially as Alg called it a "punishment" assignment. Oh gee. Kudos if you can wade through my explanation-- I formatted it hard although I admit the gist can't be gleaned at a glance.

Not sure how this relates to a mechanics update at all.

 

I guess I shouldn't be too surprised; the arrogance of this community here continues although the intellect seems better than the RSOF typically has, maybe because fansites seem better at weeding out punkmouthed little brats. Still, I'm amazed at what can pass for arguments around here, and so much short-lived memory on its own player history, really. Would not be surprised at all if the non-combat skiller types went to "Old School" and are slowly fading away.

Skillers still very much play the main version of RuneScape, and actually have benefitted from EoC content, such as the action bar for drop mining. If you're unhappy with the quality of arguments made, feel free to raise issues that you feel are the most important consequences of this update.

 

Keep dissing Jagex, y'all, as I doubt most of you could ever do better to code it yourself. I appreciate some of you understand the technical specs and code but it gets precious little mention past talk of the HTML5 switchover.

I can't renovate a house on my own, but if I give input and feedback to a contractor on how I'd like it done and he does a poor job of it, I have every right to point out the poor quality of his work.

 

The only reason I keep hanging around is I think Tip still has potential, despite so many reminders seeming to the contrary.

 

The world does not revolve around players aged 18-25...

Last I checked, we were on a fansite for RuneScape, a MMO that is specifically targetted towards a teenaged audience, and continues to draw from a mostly 18-25 university-going/graduate crowd, though it also boasts an older (though not necessarily more mature) player base, even including some 60 year olds as evidenced from a Runefest video.

 

granted, most players my age don't say very much at all. (They [bleep] to themselves. Remember that.)

Perhaps you would do better to follow their lead, instead of making posts like these which add to the ongoing soap opera. Alternatively, make some constructive posts that delve into the meat of an update, rather than a tangential whine about skilling that carries a thick stench of arrogance and disconnection.

[jayc3399]

Overloads are ~15% boost to accuracy at 97 attack. Not sure how that fans out for other levels.

[Artemis1330]

Just tried SGWD. This is not good =/ Even in Superior Sea Singers I get ripped apart by Zilyana's melee attack that hits quite frequently and hard. Next to that, the Ranged attack of the minion hit also quite hard and often. Up in the high 500s, low 600s. And he is 146 combat o.O...

 

Okay I understand we are not supposed to camp them till the end of time, but this is ridiculous! Only lasted 5 Zilyana kills with an entire inventory of food using Unicorn as well as Soul Split. Now that Soul Split took quite a nerf, I understand I should use food a bit more often, but with how hard these minions along with Zilyana hit, it's just not really feasible...

 

Just a reminder; this was while wearing T85 armour, Superior Sea Singers =C!

 

Did you try mage pray and not tanking her melee hits in mage gear?

[Den]

I'm confused. A friend was selling his torva earlier today and it was crashing pretty bad. Here it seems like everyone is saying "Torva is better than PoP Gear" so I'm confused what's going on. Is everything crashing?

[Saradomin_Mage]

I'm confused. A friend was selling his torva earlier today and it was crashing pretty bad. Here it seems like everyone is saying "Torva is better than PoP Gear" so I'm confused what's going on. Is everything crashing?

Numerically Tetsu is about 25% better than Torva, which is the basis of most comparisons I've seen on the RSOF, but after you add the defence stats the difference drops to about 10%. I think Bandos might be a close substitute to Torva though, and the loss of its set effect also hurts it as a DPS set. Gloves and boots have definitely gone down because of the loss of the set effect.

[Sy_Accursed]

I'm confused. A friend was selling his torva earlier today and it was crashing pretty bad. Here it seems like everyone is saying "Torva is better than PoP Gear" so I'm confused what's going on. Is everything crashing?

Numerically Tetsu is about 25% better than Torva, which is the basis of most comparisons I've seen on the RSOF, but after you add the defence stats the difference drops to about 10%. I think Bandos might be a close substitute to Torva though, and the loss of its set effect also hurts it as a DPS set. Gloves and boots have definitely gone down because of the loss of the set effect.

 

This pretty much in blind numerics Tetsu appears better but when you compare how close tetsu and torva are def wise it's kind negligible especially when torva has the nice damage booster strapped on for greater dps vs tetsu.

Looking at a larger scale outside bossing where you don't need quite so much defence even the GWD sets (bandos, arma, subj) work out as better than Pop for slaying as the def lose isn't big enough to really impact + again the damage booster makes them greater.

 

The things that really are crashing and have lost out as things stands (in the top end) are: Pop Armour, Glacor Boots, Automaton Gloves.

To a lesser extent barrows and ganodermic have also taken a hit, but they have the saving grace of being cheap in the first place vs GWD armours to make them the next best option (seeing as basically nothing of actual use seems to be offensive gear other than nex and gwd sets)

Subj, Arma and Bandos are all seeing spikes from this update.

Nex sets seem largely unaffected as they pretty much just stayed as top dog.

 

Just my obersvations.

[Fallstar]

The difference between Bandos and Torva's damage boost is trivial to the point of negligible. Other than cosmeticscape, there really isn't any point to owning nex sets right now.